Maya-Mia Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 What do you do??? My story ( a synopsis): Husband and I been together for 17 years, (since I was 18), married for 9. Have 2 kids 14, 8. Through marital counseling was able to admit that I married more for emotional security than for love. We had one child before marriage and he has always been dedicated to me. Never doubted his love, just could never reciprocate it to the same degree as him. I realized this many years ago but decided to suppress my personal need for happiness and fulfillment to maintain the family unit. I was able to do this for many years but last year it all came to a head. Through a series of many individual events, the cons began to outweigh the pros and I finally came clean with him and told him how I feel inside. I told him I'm not in love with him and this has affected our sex life for many years. THis was very liberating. He is not a bad person, just not the right person for me. I COULD continue in this situation if I had to, but I could never have real joy and fulfillment. Our sex life is abysmal. Even our counselor recommended a divorce or at the very least, a trial separation. Because neither one of us is getting what we want nor deserve. She believes we are just co-dependent on each other because we're both afraid to leave (though for different reasons). He even acknowledges that nothing about our relationship resembles a healthy, happy marriage, but he says he will accept anything I give him as long as we could stay together. Ever since the counselor said this, he has been resistant to continue counseling because he doesn't like her point of view. THe thing is I agree with her, we do need time apart. And if we were meant to be, we will find our way back to each other. Now,he refuses to separate. We have gone thru every emotion possible, first he agrees and appears defeated, then he gets angry, calling me selfish, then he begs and pleads for me not to leave him because he can't live without me, then we go through the whole range of emotions again. My responsibility here is that I just go along with whatever he says, because I do feel guilty hurting his feelings. So while I made a little headway by finally being honest about my feelings, I've gone backwards by giving in the minute I see that he is hurting. I believe he is sincere, but at times I wonder if I'm being manipulated. He just won't let us separate. I am the sole breadwinner in the family, so I can't just up and leave. Lastly, there is one way that I know will make him leave me in a heartbeat (his words not mine). If he ever found out I had an affair, he said he could never look at me again. Well I havent, but sometimes I'm tempted to make one up just to end this drama, but I know that would be opening a whole other can of worms. How do I move forward??
Passion4Life Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 What do you do??? My story ( a synopsis): Husband and I been together for 17 years, (since I was 18), married for 9. Have 2 kids 14, 8. Through marital counseling was able to admit that I married more for emotional security than for love. We had one child before marriage and he has always been dedicated to me. Never doubted his love, just could never reciprocate it to the same degree as him. I realized this many years ago but decided to suppress my personal need for happiness and fulfillment to maintain the family unit. I was able to do this for many years but last year it all came to a head. Through a series of many individual events, the cons began to outweigh the pros and I finally came clean with him and told him how I feel inside. I told him I'm not in love with him and this has affected our sex life for many years. THis was very liberating. He is not a bad person, just not the right person for me. I COULD continue in this situation if I had to, but I could never have real joy and fulfillment. Our sex life is abysmal. Even our counselor recommended a divorce or at the very least, a trial separation. Because neither one of us is getting what we want nor deserve. She believes we are just co-dependent on each other because we're both afraid to leave (though for different reasons). He even acknowledges that nothing about our relationship resembles a healthy, happy marriage, but he says he will accept anything I give him as long as we could stay together. Ever since the counselor said this, he has been resistant to continue counseling because he doesn't like her point of view. THe thing is I agree with her, we do need time apart. And if we were meant to be, we will find our way back to each other. Now,he refuses to separate. We have gone thru every emotion possible, first he agrees and appears defeated, then he gets angry, calling me selfish, then he begs and pleads for me not to leave him because he can't live without me, then we go through the whole range of emotions again. My responsibility here is that I just go along with whatever he says, because I do feel guilty hurting his feelings. So while I made a little headway by finally being honest about my feelings, I've gone backwards by giving in the minute I see that he is hurting. I believe he is sincere, but at times I wonder if I'm being manipulated. He just won't let us separate. I am the sole breadwinner in the family, so I can't just up and leave. Lastly, there is one way that I know will make him leave me in a heartbeat (his words not mine). If he ever found out I had an affair, he said he could never look at me again. Well I havent, but sometimes I'm tempted to make one up just to end this drama, but I know that would be opening a whole other can of worms. How do I move forward?? i think ur affair will certainly make him let u go & end this one-sided relationship . .
soserious1 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 This is actually pretty easy You are the one who is unhappy and wants to end the marriage? He has been at home with the children and you the sole breadwinner? You need to be the one to leave, without the children and you need to put on your big girl panties and prepare to pay alimony and child support. Why should the kids or your husband be the ones to pay in this situation? You basically married the man under false pretenses, you not being happy now shouldn't mean they have to suffer. Your husband is quite correct in his refusal to leave.. you aren't happy? you leave.
KikiW Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 This is actually pretty easy You are the one who is unhappy and wants to end the marriage? He has been at home with the children and you the sole breadwinner? You need to be the one to leave, without the children and you need to put on your big girl panties and prepare to pay alimony and child support. Why should the kids or your husband be the ones to pay in this situation? You basically married the man under false pretenses, you not being happy now shouldn't mean they have to suffer. Your husband is quite correct in his refusal to leave.. you aren't happy? you leave. I don't believe she married him under "false pretenses" - it sounds like they both had their hand in the failure of the marriage, hence the therapist using the term co-dependency. There are two ways you can handle this - the harsh way (which soserious1 mentioned) of simply picking up and leaving, or the longer way which has the potential to be MORE painful or LESS painful, factors depending on which way it goes. By that I mean continue with joint and individual counseling. Continue going over the way things are and eventually your husband will see how unhealthy the relationship is for the both of you and that you both deserve better. Either he will come around and you can move forward as friends, or he will simply become bitter and more angry and make life that much more miserable for you. I can't say for sure which way it would go because this depends on your husband's personality. One thing you may want to try and point out to him is that your children see you both as role models. Do you want them growing up modeling THEIR relationships against YOURS? Do you think they have seen a healthy relationship between you two? Do you think it's time they see what real happiness is? Don't they deserve that?
jwi71 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 What do you do??? JWI's 3 step program: 1) Call lawyer 2) File D 3) Move out Done. Yeah...its that simple. No more MC, no more bullshyte...just do it already.
soserious1 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 (edited) I don't believe she married him under "false pretenses" - it sounds like they both had their hand in the failure of the marriage, hence the therapist using the term co-dependency. There are two ways you can handle this - the harsh way (which soserious1 mentioned) of simply picking up and leaving, or the longer way which has the potential to be MORE painful or LESS painful, factors depending on which way it goes. By that I mean continue with joint and individual counseling. Continue going over the way things are and eventually your husband will see how unhealthy the relationship is for the both of you and that you both deserve better. Either he will come around and you can move forward as friends, or he will simply become bitter and more angry and make life that much more miserable for you. I can't say for sure which way it would go because this depends on your husband's personality. One thing you may want to try and point out to him is that your children see you both as role models. Do you want them growing up modeling THEIR relationships against YOURS? Do you think they have seen a healthy relationship between you two? Do you think it's time they see what real happiness is? Don't they deserve that? Sorry but I disagree... if this were a man posting, asking for advice on how to get a faithful, loving stay at home mother to move out of the house he'd be burned at the stake here. This man isn't unfaithful, he's not abusive, his only fault is that he doesn't turn the OP on enough and she isn't interested in having sex with him... and now he's refusing to load his things into garbage bags and move himself out to the street to make life easier on the OP. This, IMHO is utter and total bullshiat, if the OP cannot find it within herself to try to make a go of the marriage for at least another 10 yrs, then the OP should be the one to pack up and move out of the marital home and leave the children in the custody of their stay at home Father. Sorry OP, but you are the one who is unhappy, you are the one wanting this huge life change, barring gross misconduct on the part of your husband, why should he and the kids bear the brunt of the cost of your choices? Seeking advice on how to best get him out of the house as if he was an unwanted piece of furniture screams volumes about the selfish nature of your current thought process. You want out? you think you've done all you can to salvage the marriage ? that's fine.. then YOU pay the price, you move out. Edited January 23, 2010 by soserious1
Samantha0905 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Why don't you sit down with a lawyer and see what options are available to you? It does seem you need to legally separate, but I don't know how the law goes as far as who moves out first. Perhaps once you get the legal separation, it won't reflect badly on you -- from a legal sense, I mean. I also don't think you married under "false pretenses." It's a ridiculous assumption indicating you thought this all out in advance with plans to sabotage the marriage later. I do NOT think you should go the affair option -- or the making up an affair option. It's cruel and would be intentional on your part. I do think if you want to move out and your husband does not, it falls on you to move out. I would not do anything like that, however, without consulting a lawyer. Perhaps you can work out a joint custody situation. Since you are the sole breadwinner, you also need to accept you will probably be paying alimony and child support. Is he a stay at home dad? It's just as important as being a stay at home mom and we (I'm a S.A.H.M.) expect an equal distribution of assets/alimony if we end up divorced.....
carhill Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 OP, say you rented a house or apartment next week and moved a few essentials in there. That's separation. How do you think you'd feel about that? You've said here you don't love your H any more, so you really wouldn't miss him. Say you saw the kids every day. How would you feel about that? Talk about that with your counselor. Good luck
KikiW Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Sorry but I disagree... if this were a man posting, asking for advice on how to get a faithful, loving stay at home mother to move out of the house he'd be burned at the stake here. This man isn't unfaithful, he's not abusive, his only fault is that he doesn't turn the OP on enough and she isn't interested in having sex with him... and now he's refusing to load his things into garbage bags and move himself out to the street to make life easier on the OP. This, IMHO is utter and total bullshiat, if the OP cannot find it within herself to try to make a go of the marriage for at least another 10 yrs, then the OP should be the one to pack up and move out of the marital home and leave the children in the custody of their stay at home Father. Sorry OP, but you are the one who is unhappy, you are the one wanting this huge life change, barring gross misconduct on the part of your husband, why should he and the kids bear the brunt of the cost of your choices? Seeking advice on how to best get him out of the house as if he was an unwanted piece of furniture screams volumes about the selfish nature of your current thought process. You want out? you think you've done all you can to salvage the marriage ? that's fine.. then YOU pay the price, you move out. Unless I missed it, I didn't see anything in her post about making HIM move out and she stays in the house. Her question is how does she move forward when her husband wants things to stay as they are even though they both agree it's not healthy. I think this has less to do with who moves out and who stays than it does with how can she make him see that separating is the right way to go for now, not the same ol' same ol'. Just because a relationship isn't "abusive" doesn't mean that a couple are right for each other or should stay together.
Author Maya-Mia Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 Thank you for all the responses, good and bad. I just have to mention that I am / was willing to move out. I told him I would rent a room close to our home. I even said I would continue to come to the family home every day after work and take care of the kids as always and just leave at bedtime and sleep in my rented room somewhere else. We have a large home and also offered to move out of our bedroom and into one of the 2 spare bedrooms. He said he could never tolerate that because he's concerned that our families would think he chased me out of our house that I paid for. I told him to never mind what others think, this is bout you and me. He then agreed that he would move out into a rented room nearby. I said I would pay for it, because one of the issues is that he needs to work on himself and gain confidence. He has dropped out of school 4x and hasn't held a job in 5 years (he's in his 40's). The counselor thought he needs to learn how to be a man and stand on his own first. He just started real estate school. I have no problem continuing the financial support if he is working on bettering himself. At first he agreed to this plan, then 8 hours later he's against it, pleading that I stay and we not separtate. Lastly, there is no way I am leaving my kids. He is a decent father but doesnt have that much patience for children. If we did end up in divorce, I doubt custody would be an issue. He does have an adult child that he wasnt very emotionally involved in as a child. His mother raised her and he sent her money. He has said that if we broke up he would probrably go live with his brother on the west coast ( we're on the east coast). So while I am willing to move out and get a room for myself while seeing and taking care of my kids in the family home, I can't afford to move them out with me into another house and pay double for mortgage and utilities. And he won't move out into a room or small apt, even if I paid for it. So, now what do I do. Right now there is no animosity between us, so I dont want to go the forcible route, but my options seem exhausted.
carhill Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 He even acknowledges that nothing about our relationship resembles a healthy, happy marriage, but he says he will accept anything I give him as long as we could stay together. Ever since the counselor said this, he has been resistant to continue counseling because he doesn't like her point of view. To me, this is a pivotal revelation. This tells me that he will make no changes to the status quo and will defend it. If correct, this means that all positive change will have to come from you. That sucks, IMO, but life isn't always fair. TBH, if affordable, I'd suggest that you continue IC to help you with tools to manage the separation and possible divorce in a healthy way. I'm thinking of the children here and the impact of the changes on them. You're making a really important life decision here. I've been there and am going through it now. Think it through.
soserious1 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Thank you for all the responses, good and bad. I just have to mention that I am / was willing to move out. I told him I would rent a room close to our home. I even said I would continue to come to the family home every day after work and take care of the kids as always and just leave at bedtime and sleep in my rented room somewhere else. We have a large home and also offered to move out of our bedroom and into one of the 2 spare bedrooms. He said he could never tolerate that because he's concerned that our families would think he chased me out of our house that I paid for. I told him to never mind what others think, this is bout you and me. He then agreed that he would move out into a rented room nearby. I said I would pay for it, because one of the issues is that he needs to work on himself and gain confidence. He has dropped out of school 4x and hasn't held a job in 5 years (he's in his 40's). The counselor thought he needs to learn how to be a man and stand on his own first. He just started real estate school. I have no problem continuing the financial support if he is working on bettering himself. At first he agreed to this plan, then 8 hours later he's against it, pleading that I stay and we not separtate. Lastly, there is no way I am leaving my kids. He is a decent father but doesnt have that much patience for children. If we did end up in divorce, I doubt custody would be an issue. He does have an adult child that he wasnt very emotionally involved in as a child. His mother raised her and he sent her money. He has said that if we broke up he would probrably go live with his brother on the west coast ( we're on the east coast). So while I am willing to move out and get a room for myself while seeing and taking care of my kids in the family home, I can't afford to move them out with me into another house and pay double for mortgage and utilities. And he won't move out into a room or small apt, even if I paid for it. So, now what do I do. Right now there is no animosity between us, so I dont want to go the forcible route, but my options seem exhausted. He's smart to not move out, why should he? you after all are the one that is unhappy. since you are the one who wants this separation, I'd suggest that it be you who moves out into the small rented room.. while continuing to pay all the bills and maintaining the standard of living of your husband and your dependent minor children. Btw, you can't cry about how he didn't work or didn't stick with this or that, it won't fly in divorce court and it won't lessen your alimony obligation as you've tolerated the situation for so many years that it can easily be argued that you were okay with this and it was status quo of the marriage. Chances are good that a judge will hold your feet to the fire and legally compel you to keep doing what you have been doing, working, earning and providing. Your husband sounds smart, intelligent enough to know that if he stays put you will be forced to move out.. he can then change the locks and file for divorce with full alimony and child support, knowing that a few weeks or months in your tiny rented room might well increase your interest in remaining married.
Ronni_W Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Maya-Mia, At the end of the day, it is that YOU won't separate. Whether that's coming from a mix of guilt, fear, etc., your individual therapist can help you sort out. If you were really serious about separating / moving forward, you'd just move yourself into one of those spare bedrooms. You don't need his permission, for goodness' sake! You're a grown-up. Just go and sleep in another room. you could start off slowly...two nights a week...4...7. The first few times are the most difficult. If you really want to move the situation forward, then you are going to have to do something different on your side.
whichwayisup Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Whatever you do, do NOT go have an affair or tell him you 'had' one to get him off your back. He is hurting and there's no point in making him feel worse and end up HATING you. Sadly, once one person wants out of the marriage, there's not alot the other person can do to make the other one want to stay and work it out. Continue to be honest. No games, no bullcrap. This guy IS STILL your kids father so there's no need to let it get petty and mean. Respect him, and he'll respect you. I agree with Ronnie W, if you want out, YOU move out. Have shared custody of the kids. You are the one who wants to end it, separate, so why should HE have to move out of the family home? Or do what Ronnie has suggested, sleep in different bedrooms.. Or even if you move out, you and your H can work out an arrangement on who's turn it is with the kids, that parent gets to be in the house, while the other stays somewhere else. I am the sole breadwinner in the family, so I can't just up and leave. Yes you can. You will be like another other sole breadwinner in the family and PAY CHILD SUPPORT/spousal support. Just because you are a woman doesn't get you off the hook. How many cases are there that the sole breadwinner has to MOVE OUT (man) and the woman gets the house. Why should he have to move out?
Passion4Life Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Thank you for all the responses, good and bad. I just have to mention that I am / was willing to move out. I told him I would rent a room close to our home. I even said I would continue to come to the family home every day after work and take care of the kids as always and just leave at bedtime and sleep in my rented room somewhere else. We have a large home and also offered to move out of our bedroom and into one of the 2 spare bedrooms. He said he could never tolerate that because he's concerned that our families would think he chased me out of our house that I paid for. I told him to never mind what others think, this is bout you and me. He then agreed that he would move out into a rented room nearby. I said I would pay for it, because one of the issues is that he needs to work on himself and gain confidence. He has dropped out of school 4x and hasn't held a job in 5 years (he's in his 40's). The counselor thought he needs to learn how to be a man and stand on his own first. He just started real estate school. I have no problem continuing the financial support if he is working on bettering himself. At first he agreed to this plan, then 8 hours later he's against it, pleading that I stay and we not separtate. Lastly, there is no way I am leaving my kids. He is a decent father but doesnt have that much patience for children. If we did end up in divorce, I doubt custody would be an issue. He does have an adult child that he wasnt very emotionally involved in as a child. His mother raised her and he sent her money. He has said that if we broke up he would probrably go live with his brother on the west coast ( we're on the east coast). So while I am willing to move out and get a room for myself while seeing and taking care of my kids in the family home, I can't afford to move them out with me into another house and pay double for mortgage and utilities. And he won't move out into a room or small apt, even if I paid for it. So, now what do I do. Right now there is no animosity between us, so I dont want to go the forcible route, but my options seem exhausted. honestly the best thing would be to have an affair & he will certainly let u go
SimplyBeingLoved Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Your husband sounds smart, intelligent enough to know that if he stays put you will be forced to move out.. he can then change the locks and file for divorce with full alimony and child support, knowing that a few weeks or months in your tiny rented room might well increase your interest in remaining married. Is that what a marriage should be about: a way to get out of a tiny rented room? Rather dismal view, in my opinion. And in response to 1000's post. What does it matter who's fault it is? And yes he may want to be married to her, but sounds like he doesn't want the same type of relationship she does. That is the situation I found myself in with my husband. He was happy with the status quo: going days or weeks on end without really interacting, much less engaging in any intimacy. He was HAPPY with that. I was not.
Enema Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 I'm surprised... usually this type of post contains the sentence: "....and I met this guy".
soserious1 Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Is that what a marriage should be about: a way to get out of a tiny rented room? Rather dismal view, in my opinion. And in response to 1000's post. What does it matter who's fault it is? And yes he may want to be married to her, but sounds like he doesn't want the same type of relationship she does. That is the situation I found myself in with my husband. He was happy with the status quo: going days or weeks on end without really interacting, much less engaging in any intimacy. He was HAPPY with that. I was not. Sorry but these people have 2 kids, this woman has enabled and allowed a situation where 3 people are dependent on her. Now she's "not in love" ie: she's most likely met some guy who makes her panties damp and she wants to bail, but she doesn't want to bail honestly. No she wants to find a way to force her husband to move out, even if she's got to cheat or lie to do so. I'm sorry but it's total BS, she wants out ? Fine, it should be her living in the tiny room, paying the price for her choices, not her husband and not the kids.
soserious1 Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Thank you for all the responses, good and bad. I just have to mention that I am / was willing to move out. I told him I would rent a room close to our home. I even said I would continue to come to the family home every day after work and take care of the kids as always and just leave at bedtime and sleep in my rented room somewhere else. We have a large home and also offered to move out of our bedroom and into one of the 2 spare bedrooms. He said he could never tolerate that because he's concerned that our families would think he chased me out of our house that I paid for. I told him to never mind what others think, this is bout you and me. He then agreed that he would move out into a rented room nearby. I said I would pay for it, because one of the issues is that he needs to work on himself and gain confidence. He has dropped out of school 4x and hasn't held a job in 5 years (he's in his 40's). The counselor thought he needs to learn how to be a man and stand on his own first. He just started real estate school. I have no problem continuing the financial support if he is working on bettering himself. At first he agreed to this plan, then 8 hours later he's against it, pleading that I stay and we not separtate. Lastly, there is no way I am leaving my kids. He is a decent father but doesnt have that much patience for children. If we did end up in divorce, I doubt custody would be an issue. He does have an adult child that he wasnt very emotionally involved in as a child. His mother raised her and he sent her money. He has said that if we broke up he would probrably go live with his brother on the west coast ( we're on the east coast). So while I am willing to move out and get a room for myself while seeing and taking care of my kids in the family home, I can't afford to move them out with me into another house and pay double for mortgage and utilities. And he won't move out into a room or small apt, even if I paid for it. So, now what do I do. Right now there is no animosity between us, so I dont want to go the forcible route, but my options seem exhausted. I want you to imagine that the roles are reversed here.. you are a stay at home mother, your husband posts on a message board stating that you're a good woman, a good mother but that he's just not in love anymore and he would like some suggestions about how to force you to move out. Imagine him saying that he's tempted to have an affair because he knows that will hurt you enough to force you out. Do you have any idea what kind of a roasting such a post from a man would get here? Also you wrote that your husband is afraid that people will speak badly about him for staying in a house that YOU paid for, this suggests to me that your family and friends have most likely been been giving you the "oh you poor dear, out there struggling to support the family alone while the deadbeat does nothing" and down talking your husband for years chances are good you've done nothing to discourage such talk and in basking in the kudo's been disloyal to your spouse and in so doing formed a view of him that is less than flattering. You also write that he hasn't enough patience with the children... easy to write from the POV of a parent who's at work for much of the day. Family, friends, all get the view of mommy as long suffering saint, even the children get to view Dad as some sort of incompetent dolt. Here are my suggestions to you 1. Put on your big girl panties.. this isn't just about you, your feelings or your lack of feelings, you've created a home and have 3 dependents. You helped bring this family into being. Your feelings come dead last. The future emotional well being of your children and their ability to form solid relationships comes first. 2. Move yourself into a spare bedroom.. you don't need permission to do this 3. get the services of an individual therapist ASAP.. how could you marry and have 2 kids with somebody you never loved? this situation screams issues that likely started long ago and having nothing to do with your husband. 4. Really look at how your attitudes and the things you've said have contributed to a social climate where your husband is afraid of being viewed as a horrible person for remaining in the marital home.. how is it "your" house and not "our " house. I'd say a solid apology to this man and a willingness to raise the issue of how emasculated this man has come to feel over the years and your role in that might bear a lot of fruit.
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