jennie-jennie Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Get out before you get a baby with him and feel obliged to stay. He is not going to change his ways. You are going to have an unhappy sex life with him for as long as the marriage lasts. Some guys actually prefer masturbating instead of intercourse with women. I spent 25 years with such a man. Get out and get a more compatible man while you are still young.
Author SarahRose Posted February 7, 2010 Author Posted February 7, 2010 See...my husband was clueless that I was that miserable over the sex things that he also said that I made a big deal out of nothing. I did the same thing you did last week too (declined him for sex though he probably secretly relieved ). I had 4 times last year(excluding the month of december which I had tiny meltdowns and he used a few make up sex to appease me) and he also thought this is no big deal. He only realized how big this was for me until I said counseling or move out. I don't understand how men think sometimes, they seem to be wired differently like some sensitivity chip missing or something. I don't know what is behind that kind of thinking but it seems rather common. Has he gone to the counseling yet and how is it going? He tried to initiate again Saturday and once again I turned him down. I'm on my period and he doesn't want to do it then and so what he really was asking for was me to relieve him with a hand job or bj. Nope, I don't think so. Maybe I should approach him with the wonderful offer of getting me off but he gets nothing out of it and see how well that goes over for him?
Author SarahRose Posted February 7, 2010 Author Posted February 7, 2010 I just stumbled upon this thread--and thought rut roh, here I go--because I know I can't avoid this subject as it has affected me personally to the point of destroying my marriage. Mine also has an alcohol problem. We were married 3 months (long distance relationship) when I discovered that things just weren't right. Now I was the most willing partner I could imagine. If he approached me when the apartment was burning below us--I would have said ok, but perhaps we should make it a quicky? He had no reason for porn. Except...it was an old habit of his. Now I married him for one reason and one reason only--that our intimacy was complete and open. I had no other reason to marry him whatsoever, and would not have married him if I thought our intimacy was only sometimes--as in sometimes when it's convenient and other times no as he liked a private sex life with porn women, or any other time he felt convenient to lie instead of the truth, such as was he drinking before work that day. I really like that idea of first refusal. I wasn't given that choice either. When we went two weeks w/o sex and he was positioning his monitor so that I couldn't see what he was doing, I became suspicious. He had also looked through every file of mine soon after marrying me. I had never spied on him. To make a long story short, it's 5 years later, I've been angry for 5 years, and nothing has been resolved. Please don't let yourself go 5 years with this unhappiness and anger. It has aged me 10 years. Rocked me to the core, as I had never loved this passionately before. What I have learned is that there are a lot of men out there that take their women for granted. I believe 80% of married men use porn to imagine variety in partners. What this statistic says is that men know they can get away with it and still find a woman. What it also says is that women don't realize how much they are taken for granted, and continue to be naive. Cultural conditioning trains men to view women as an object without any earning of that right to enjoy a woman's sexuality. Hence the laziness. The point to drive him to your husband is this-- lying and deceptive behavior have no place in a loving relationship. Debates about porn in your marriage can only take place if he is willing to discuss honestly--and getting him there is like pulling wisdom teeth. Those men that know they will lose the debate will sacrifice the marriage. Is it addiction? Or is it simply--this is who I am, this is what I like to do, and you aren't worth changing for. Trying to keep tabs on a man's porn collection is impossible. It will turn up on thumb drives, ipods, cell phones, burned dvd's, partitioned hard drives, etc. I know! I'm married to a security IT professional--and chasing his habit was ridiculous...except that they are always sloppy. Give up trying to keep tabs on him, just as one would give up trying to keep track of somebody else's alcohol intake. It's a waste of your time, and will only frustrate you. Bottom line is that he still isn't mature enough to understand what intimacy is. I wish you the best in counseling. Mine has decided not to pursue counseling, even after me on the couch for six months--so it's over. I get what you mean about being angry about it. I found out his porn habit about 3 weeks after we got married and it has really marred and damaged our marriage. I keep thinking about how blissfully happy we were on our wedding day and how enthusiastic I was about starting our lives together. When I first confronted him about it and he promised to stop, I was ok and could forgive and forget but the 2nd and 3rd time I caught him and he lied and was being deceptive, it just broke something in me. I still can't shake the image of knowing I offered it to him and he turns me down with some excuse and not 20 minutes after I walk out the door he was online looking for porn and wanking. It is such a hurtful rejecting feeling.
tommyr Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 (edited) The original post says The problem is our sex life has dwindled away to almost nothing. and then later He tried to initiate again Saturday and once again I turned him down. I get the fact your H has a porn issue. In addition, he sounds like a selfish and/or lazy lover. Beyond that, it seems both of you have serious communication issues. You asked him for more sex - but then why turn him down? If your reason for refusal was an anticipated selfish performance from him, I would think it better to have that discussion rather than just saying NO. Edited February 7, 2010 by tommyr
Author SarahRose Posted February 8, 2010 Author Posted February 8, 2010 The original post says and then later I get the fact your H has a porn issue. In addition, he sounds like a selfish and/or lazy lover. Beyond that, it seems both of you have serious communication issues. You asked him for more sex - but then why turn him down? If your reason for refusal was an anticipated selfish performance from him, I would think it better to have that discussion rather than just saying NO. yes that is exactly why I turned him down. Most of the time I accept when he wants a quickie n he is done in 5 minutes n I'm left high n dry. Why would I keep subjecting myself to that rudeness? What am I supposed to say to him when he hardly wantssex w me? I finally got an appt for counseling tonight so well see how that goes.
tommyr Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 What am I supposed to say to him when he hardly wantssex w me? Seems like you have 2 independent goals- 1) more frequent sex 2) better sex for you So on those rare occasions that he initiates, say YES with the condition that you be satisfied before he finishes. Say this in your most playful, frisky voice. Doesn't this seem better than you refusing his advance?
Author SarahRose Posted February 8, 2010 Author Posted February 8, 2010 Seems like you have 2 independent goals- 1) more frequent sex 2) better sex for you So on those rare occasions that he initiates, say YES with the condition that you be satisfied before he finishes. Say this in your most playful, frisky voice. Doesn't this seem better than you refusing his advance? I can't guarantee that I be satisfied before he finishes. Besides even if we do have a good time, it will be another 2-3 weeks before I get any more and I guess I would rather do without than put up with that. Besides, knowing I'm second choice to porn doesn't endear me to him. I did go to marriage counseling last night and it is good. The counselor is an older grandfatherly type guy which I like that. We have homework to do for next time and it is mostly evaluating our needs and values with regards to marriage.
mem11363 Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 SR, I wish you luck with this. IMO you communicate in a sane, rational and clear manner. I think your H understands you perfectly. I completely agree that the idea you will please him in quickies/one way sexual encounters is total crap. Why should you. This needs to be a marriage of mutual respect and clearly he is ignoring your core needs and has been for a while. AND he is trying to bind you to him financially via a house which is a bit scary. Might I suggest something along the following lines - by the way while this will get you a clear answer I am fairly sure it will result in a divorce. You simply say to him: - Clearly our desire levels differ. I need to know what frequency of sex you are willing to commit to having with me. - And whatever you commit to needs to start happening in the real world this week. - And before you answer lets define sex as "an interaction where you, my husband make sure that I come too." So it is - not a quickie - not a one way bj/hj during my period. - Whatever you are willing to commit to - YOU are responsible for initiating. It is not fair to put that on me, since I am the high drive spouse. So if you say twice a week - YOU pick two times a week that are good for you. But don't play games with me - don't wait until I am falling asleep at 11 pm to initiate. In fact - if you want - we can define ground rules for what is fair for initiation. Either that or we can select specific nights/times for sex - and just have it scheduled. Just keep in mind that like you - I am a real flesh and blood person and for this to work I need to feel desired and loved. If you cannot/will not make the effort to make me feel desired/loved in an acceptable manner - we should stop tormenting each other and part ways. SR, If you don't do this, he is going to try to get you to focus on the porn topic which is just a distraction from this - which is the REAL problem. I can't guarantee that I be satisfied before he finishes. Besides even if we do have a good time, it will be another 2-3 weeks before I get any more and I guess I would rather do without than put up with that. Besides, knowing I'm second choice to porn doesn't endear me to him. I did go to marriage counseling last night and it is good. The counselor is an older grandfatherly type guy which I like that. We have homework to do for next time and it is mostly evaluating our needs and values with regards to marriage.
Author SarahRose Posted February 8, 2010 Author Posted February 8, 2010 Thanks for your detailed thoughtful reply. Two suggestions the counselor made for me to do if the sex topic came up again was to make sex dates with him like making a date for any other plan of movies, dinner, or whatever. The other suggestion would be to express my need for regular sex again and ask him in what ways can he help me meet that need.
mem11363 Posted February 9, 2010 Posted February 9, 2010 SR, For you to feel desired HE needs to initiate the sex dates. If you have to feel like you are begging - defeats the purpose. As for regular sex he fully understands your needs/wants. He is just hoping you will gradually accept him and his porn addiction. The reason for pressing for a sexual commitment is it will give you some sense of where his head is at balancing his desire to keep feeding his porn addiction vs his desire to avoid you divorcing him. I think he will try really hard to avoid answering/giving you a commitment. And the commitment is for HIM to initiate. Otherwise he will always claim you picked the wrong day/time/way to approach him. Because he really does prefer the porn. This is NOT about you. It is about his addiction. Still - he hid it - he lied - he basically tricked you into marrying him which is abusive. Thanks for your detailed thoughtful reply. Two suggestions the counselor made for me to do if the sex topic came up again was to make sex dates with him like making a date for any other plan of movies, dinner, or whatever. The other suggestion would be to express my need for regular sex again and ask him in what ways can he help me meet that need.
Author SarahRose Posted February 19, 2010 Author Posted February 19, 2010 Yeah the getting turned down got old really fast. Had 2nd session of marriage counseling and we went over the homework. The therapist thinks he may have some deep seated block about sex being dirty from his childhood. The therapist gave us two assignments to do. We pick 4 of our top rated things we like from the 5 languages of love inventory and the other person has to do them. The 2nd was to agree to have sex 2 times a week for the next 4 weeks. These assignments seem fairly simple to do. The sex has an end point so it isn't like the lower drive person would think great I have to this forever. The problem is this, he won't do either one until my family leave. My kids are here visiting for 3 weeks and all he has done is hide in the bedroom and he told me no sex until they leave. I said so you decided this for me without my consent or asking me? I said so after they are gone you'll do something? To me it just looks like another excuse not to do something as we've only had sex 5 times this year anyway when nobody is at the house. I did do as the counselor said and asked him what I was supposed to do about my sexual needs and he said I just have to wait. I said I do have sexual needs and you are supposed to be helping me meet them and how can you help me meet them and he wouldn't answer. I am really really beginning to wonder if he is passive aggressive about withholding sex from me as a means of anger and control. He said he was fine with my adult kids visiting but maybe this is passive aggressive behavior. I did get angry and tell him that I am tired of begging for it and it is really near the point where I don't want it at all from him ever. He moved his computer into the bedroom so I know he isn't looking at porn either at least for awhile. Today I am going to buy some power tools and dirty magazines of men and leave it all by the bed.
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