paddington bear Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 I agree with Paddington that there is absolutely a friendzone for women as well as men. Its very different for women to get out of though...more so I would say....as men will be, lets say, more vulnerable to 'advances' from a so called female friend, than a woman would be from a male friend. This often turns into a FWB situation for the woman and rarely becomes anything more than that...I wouldn't bother trying TBH. Yup, you might get the sex, but you won't get the love and commitment you want. Itzo, somewhere on this forum is a list of abbreviations and their meanings. And I'm not sure I understand your theory can you clarify please?: I tend to believe that we are reverse beings, everything we understand about the world around us is in exactly the opposite way. So turn the cards on the opposite site & you will begin to see things that work & weird (non-intuitive).
Awesome Username Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Okay, now I'm realizing that my above post was more of a fear of marriage sort of thing. But regarding dating, I have a REAL fear of guys that are talking to me and who I know are planning out how many dates it might take to get me in the sack. There is nothing more uncomfortable then a man who touches you when you don't want it. I just don't want to be in a situation where I'm either rushed emotionally or physically, and that has made me avoid dating for most of my life. I get asked out and I lie and say that I'm already taken, even if the guy seems sweet and handsome. Sometimes I wear my grandmother's wedding ring out because of this. If I know a guy from school or if I used to work with him then I'm more likely to actually develop feelings. I think that this is because their goal while I get to know them is to get something done, not get into my pants. The problem is that when you get to know a guy like that, they're already used to treating you like one of the guys so when you enter datingville it doesn't change. They also are always pining over an ex, for some reason. But with all of this lying and telling people I'm taken, and the complete lone wolf lifestyle I live, sometimes I do get a little bit lonely. My hardest part is letting someone get far enough in to even consider dating. I'm just really scared of being taken advantage of, and sort of have to work through the being scared when guys touch me thing. I'm oldschool and it takes me too long to warm up and get hearts over my head, I think. Too long for most men to wait around for it.
Awesome Username Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Thanks for sharing. Actually this is inevitable not the situation you've described, but the fact that people change over time. Life is a dynamic process, so that's why people have to know well their partners, in order to get involved in a long-term commitment, that eventually comes with the bigger responsibilities Yeah, I would definitely want to find someone who I could still be in love with, even if we were broke or times were tough.
Awesome Username Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Yup, you might get the sex, but you won't get the love and commitment you want. Itzo, somewhere on this forum is a list of abbreviations and their meanings. And I'm not sure I understand your theory can you clarify please?: I tend to believe that we are reverse beings, everything we understand about the world around us is in exactly the opposite way. So turn the cards on the opposite site & you will begin to see things that work & weird (non-intuitive). I think that FWB seems like the most awful experience ever.
ella23 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 I think that FWB seems like the most awful experience ever. I've never done it myself, but I've noticed that the woman in such an arrangement often gets hurt. My friend is in such an arrangement. The guy is in love with some other girl who doesn't feel the same way about him and he is not interested in my friend for a relationship, but she likes him so much that she's continuing despite the broken heart.
Awesome Username Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 I've never done it myself, but I've noticed that the woman in such an arrangement often gets hurt. My friend is in such an arrangement. The guy is in love with some other girl who doesn't feel the same way about him and he is not interested in my friend for a relationship, but she likes him so much that she's continuing despite the broken heart. And as stupid as that sounds, the heart will blind people in situations that are not favorable to them at all. Sometimes being in love sucks, doesn't it?
ella23 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 And as stupid as that sounds, the heart will blind people in situations that are not favorable to them at all. Sometimes being in love sucks, doesn't it? Sure does. The guy loves someone else, he told her this and yet she continues to hope that he'll love her back one day. FWB arrangements are mostly a bad idea imo.
paddington bear Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Okay, now I'm realizing that my above post was more of a fear of marriage sort of thing. But regarding dating, I have a REAL fear of guys that are talking to me and who I know are planning out how many dates it might take to get me in the sack. There is nothing more uncomfortable then a man who touches you when you don't want it. I just don't want to be in a situation where I'm either rushed emotionally or physically, and that has made me avoid dating for most of my life. I get asked out and I lie and say that I'm already taken, even if the guy seems sweet and handsome. Sometimes I wear my grandmother's wedding ring out because of this. If I know a guy from school or if I used to work with him then I'm more likely to actually develop feelings. I think that this is because their goal while I get to know them is to get something done, not get into my pants. The problem is that when you get to know a guy like that, they're already used to treating you like one of the guys so when you enter datingville it doesn't change. They also are always pining over an ex, for some reason. But with all of this lying and telling people I'm taken, and the complete lone wolf lifestyle I live, sometimes I do get a little bit lonely. My hardest part is letting someone get far enough in to even consider dating. I'm just really scared of being taken advantage of, and sort of have to work through the being scared when guys touch me thing. I'm oldschool and it takes me too long to warm up and get hearts over my head, I think. Too long for most men to wait around for it. Gosh, you've kind of cornered yourself into well, a corner there. Most men of course want to have sex with you, otherwise they'd just want to be friends with all women. To have a relationship with a man you have to acknowledge and accept that, and that there is nothing wrong with being sexually desired as well as desired for your other qualities, the two come bound together, you don't get one without the other. I'm big into gut instinct these days. My advice to you (because your post made me feel sad, because you are so over-protective of yourself and fearful that you are blocking any form of relationship happiness from your life) is to: Stop wearing the fake wedding ring and go out and about as normal. If a guy chats you up or hits on you, notice you immediate reaction in your head, what thoughts pop up? Just because you think them, doesn't mean they are valid or true (I've learned this in therapy). What you then do is distance yourself from your own automatic thoughts 'oh look, there I go again thinking what I always think' - this enables you not attach emotions to those thoughts and then act upon them. Repeat over and over until you can weed out those automatic and unhelpful thoughts. Next, go with your gut. Do you genuinely feel guy A is just after sex, or are you making the assumption just because he touches you physically? If you've got a bad gut, go with that. If you don't have a bad gut instinct, but assume he's only after sex, ignore your thoughts and go with your gut. Spend time alone, relaxing and imagining scenarios involving men hitting on you, invading your personal space and imagine you reacting to it in a healthy way (instead of using the fake ring as a way of not dealing with the situation appropriately). That way, you fool your brain into thinking that it has already dealt with these encounters in the right way and is thus easier to do in reality. Bad gut instinct - have some actions and lines all practised out. 'I'm sorry, I'm not comfortable being touched in that way' 'I'm not looking to get into anything right now, but my friend over there is' whatever. The more you practice the easier it is. Gut gut instinct - again practice how you would ideally like it to go and some lines to go with it 'I'm an old-fashioned kind of girl and I'd like to take it slowly' and so on. Go rent a bunch of movies with female movie characters that you admire or feel have an attitude that you admire and steal some of their lines or moves. It helps sometimes to play a role 'how would 'name of person you admire' handle this situation? And act that way, not the way you would normally act. If you don't change something you'll always get the same result over and over. Why are you so afraid of letting someone in? Were you hurt in the past? I would read Marie Forleo's 'Make Every Man Want You' - ignore the tacky title, the book is about living in the now and not allowing fears from what happened in the past to affect your life now, nor allowing fears of what could potentially happen in the futre affect your life now.
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 Yup, you might get the sex, but you won't get the love and commitment you want. Itzo, somewhere on this forum is a list of abbreviations and their meanings. And I'm not sure I understand your theory can you clarify please?: I tend to believe that we are reverse beings, everything we understand about the world around us is in exactly the opposite way. So turn the cards on the opposite site & you will begin to see things that work & weird (non-intuitive). Reverse Beings theory ... this is my own theory, based on observations & research. Sounds interesting isnt's it? Ok, the reason why I think we are reverse beings, in other words, everything we THINK we understand is exactly in an opposite order. This is OUR TRUE nature. Have you studied psychology? Do you know how our eyes work? How we see objects? In case you do not ... our eyes see the world upsite down. Our brain knows which is up and which is down ... and inverts the image for us. Is that mean we all see up-side down? Well, I am not going to make it more compicated as it is. If you study the anathomy & the functions of the human brain you will find out that the LEFT hemisphere is responsible for the RIGHT side of the body, & the RIGHT hemisphere of the brain is associated or responsible for the left side of the body. I tend to think the same thing occurs with our thoughts. Whatever we THINK is the right thing to do ... mostly is exactly the opposite. Have you had any insights about this before, personal experience that you may relate to what I am saying here? Since you wanted me to explain further, you may ... We percieve the world in the opposite way. Just as our functionalities & processes that take place in the body and the way they work. People do all the counter-intuitive stuff, in order to understand something. But there is an old saying ... "Life is lived forward, but understood backwards." http://www.ru.nl/aspx/download.aspx?File=/contents/pages/517562/lifeislivedforwardbutunderstoodbackwards.pdf&structuur=fgw
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 I think that FWB seems like the most awful experience ever. What do you mean?
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 And as stupid as that sounds, the heart will blind people in situations that are not favorable to them at all. Sometimes being in love sucks, doesn't it? We all have to make sacrifices!
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 Sure does. The guy loves someone else, he told her this and yet she continues to hope that he'll love her back one day. FWB arrangements are mostly a bad idea imo. I do not know if the problem here is the FWB, but if she acts needy ... this is very unattractive, despite the idea of FWB.
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 Gosh, you've kind of cornered yourself into well, a corner there. Most men of course want to have sex with you, otherwise they'd just want to be friends with all women. To have a relationship with a man you have to acknowledge and accept that, and that there is nothing wrong with being sexually desired as well as desired for your other qualities, the two come bound together, you don't get one without the other. I'm big into gut instinct these days. My advice to you (because your post made me feel sad, because you are so over-protective of yourself and fearful that you are blocking any form of relationship happiness from your life) is to: Stop wearing the fake wedding ring and go out and about as normal. If a guy chats you up or hits on you, notice you immediate reaction in your head, what thoughts pop up? Just because you think them, doesn't mean they are valid or true (I've learned this in therapy). What you then do is distance yourself from your own automatic thoughts 'oh look, there I go again thinking what I always think' - this enables you not attach emotions to those thoughts and then act upon them. Repeat over and over until you can weed out those automatic and unhelpful thoughts. Next, go with your gut. Do you genuinely feel guy A is just after sex, or are you making the assumption just because he touches you physically? If you've got a bad gut, go with that. If you don't have a bad gut instinct, but assume he's only after sex, ignore your thoughts and go with your gut. Spend time alone, relaxing and imagining scenarios involving men hitting on you, invading your personal space and imagine you reacting to it in a healthy way (instead of using the fake ring as a way of not dealing with the situation appropriately). That way, you fool your brain into thinking that it has already dealt with these encounters in the right way and is thus easier to do in reality. Bad gut instinct - have some actions and lines all practised out. 'I'm sorry, I'm not comfortable being touched in that way' 'I'm not looking to get into anything right now, but my friend over there is' whatever. The more you practice the easier it is. Gut gut instinct - again practice how you would ideally like it to go and some lines to go with it 'I'm an old-fashioned kind of girl and I'd like to take it slowly' and so on. Go rent a bunch of movies with female movie characters that you admire or feel have an attitude that you admire and steal some of their lines or moves. It helps sometimes to play a role 'how would 'name of person you admire' handle this situation? And act that way, not the way you would normally act. If you don't change something you'll always get the same result over and over. Why are you so afraid of letting someone in? Were you hurt in the past? I would read Marie Forleo's 'Make Every Man Want You' - ignore the tacky title, the book is about living in the now and not allowing fears from what happened in the past to affect your life now, nor allowing fears of what could potentially happen in the futre affect your life now. Wow, you've done some research in the area, I can tell ... Good work! You mentioned therapy ... were you the participant or the fascilitator?
ella23 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 I do not know if the problem here is the FWB, but if she acts needy ... this is very unattractive, despite the idea of FWB. She doesn't act needy. She's continuing with this arrangement hoping that he'll get over the other girl who doesn't reciprocate his feelings and will fall for her.
Author Itzo Posted January 23, 2010 Author Posted January 23, 2010 She doesn't act needy. She's continuing with this arrangement hoping that he'll get over the other girl who doesn't reciprocate his feelings and will fall for her. A-a okey, I know what you mean. This is called, obsession But do you think while she's acting like FWB, what are the actualy benefits to it? She's only an obstacle in this case, because she has hidden intentions. I do not know, I am not a woman, so I have no idea what she trying to achieve here .. it is a non-sense to me.
ella23 Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 A-a okey, I know what you mean. This is called, obsession But do you think while she's acting like FWB, what are the actualy benefits to it? She's only an obstacle in this case, because she has hidden intentions. I do not know, I am not a woman, so I have no idea what she trying to achieve here .. it is a non-sense to me. I agree, she's just wasting her time. He's hoping the other woman will change her mind, just like she's hoping he will. I (and her other friends) have tried to knock some sense into her but she doesn't listen.
Author Itzo Posted January 24, 2010 Author Posted January 24, 2010 I agree, she's just wasting her time. He's hoping the other woman will change her mind, just like she's hoping he will. I (and her other friends) have tried to knock some sense into her but she doesn't listen. This is a good time to bring this up. Have you watched the movie, Obsessed with Beyonce Knowles & Ali Larter. The movie is about the exact same thing you are talkig about. She likes a man that is already involved in a relationship ... and she's going even further trying to test HIS loyality & steal him. Great Stuff I love when women fight over a man It is a great freak show I do not think I will get some credit for this 'advertisement' of the movie anyway
ella23 Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 This is a good time to bring this up. Have you watched the movie, Obsessed with Beyonce Knowles & Ali Larter. The movie is about the exact same thing you are talkig about. She likes a man that is already involved in a relationship ... and she's going even further trying to test HIS loyality & steal him. Great Stuff I love when women fight over a man It is a great freak show I do not think I will get some credit for this 'advertisement' of the movie anyway Nobody's fighting over him though. The girl that my friend's **** buddy is after turned him down. This guy is not in a relationship.
Author Itzo Posted January 24, 2010 Author Posted January 24, 2010 Nobody's fighting over him though. The girl that my friend's **** buddy is after turned him down. This guy is not in a relationship. Ok so it is a different scenario ... it sounds great to make a movie about iT!
Author Itzo Posted January 30, 2010 Author Posted January 30, 2010 What's your biggest fear or frustrations related to dating? What is the thing that most challenges you ... frightens you?
ella23 Posted January 30, 2010 Posted January 30, 2010 Ok so it is a different scenario ... it sounds great to make a movie about iT! lol, I'm sure it would. It's kind of sad to see a friend go through something like that, though.
Author Itzo Posted January 30, 2010 Author Posted January 30, 2010 I think what is a big frustration for me is that men just want sex on dates....all the time.....and that just turns me off. Just when I think I am going out with a good guy who respects me and then bam!!! He is stuck to me like glue. I don't dress overly sexy. I don't give out signals that I just want to get naked and not get to know him....so what gives???? I know men think about sex every hour of the day. What would make you fulfilled in the relationship, if not sex? Men are fulfilled by having sex, most of the time.
skydiveaddict Posted January 30, 2010 Posted January 30, 2010 What's Your Biggest FEAR or FRUSTRATION related to DATING? Rejection
Author Itzo Posted January 30, 2010 Author Posted January 30, 2010 What's Your Biggest FEAR or FRUSTRATION related to DATING? Rejection Can you be a little more specific? Afraid to approach women? or you avoid intentionally approaching women, for some reason?
Author Itzo Posted January 30, 2010 Author Posted January 30, 2010 I think # 5 is a good point. We are all socialized from the time we are little to think that Mr. Right will sweep us off our feet. It just doesn't happen like the movies or in some cases, books. I remember when I was 16 or so, all of my friends use to cut out wedding dresses and etc...Not me....I was not concerned with that idea at the time. Now, I am. I spent my 20's being a committment phobe and now that I am older I'm ready. But most of the men I meet are jerks. I believe I will meet the right one, though. I am glad girls get this Ok, that's the thing ... men just have these hormones and we produce SPERM like crazy every ****in' day ... so the tank has to get empty, if you know what I mean ... IT IS JUST OUR NATURE. After sex, I feel relief ... especially then I can relate to my loved ones, otherwise all chemicals in my body are tunning up my system again ... until I explode again ... The problem is that most men are not open with their women very often, so women have no idea what's going on in man's hormonal system. I've met a girl 5 months ago, she said, "MEN are incapable of an EMOTION." lol OMG!!! This is not true, just our biological drives get dominant sometimes ... this is what it takes for being a man. Men experience emotion, like women ... but men do not know how to use them. I do not even know how to do it, cuz sometimes they trip me out in the most inappropriate moments, so the emotions are being suppressed. A very wise man once said, "Emotions can be suppressed, but cannot be eliminated." Sooner or later they will emerge again.
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