foxyroxy_msu83 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 i need some advice. i met my hubby 6 years ago when my daughter was 9 months old. we fell hopelessly in love and have been very very happy in our marriage. we now have a 3 year old daughter together and over the past 3 years or so, i have noticed that he treats my oldest daughter so much different than our youngest. my oldest thinks of my hubby as her daddy and does not know any different. to be quite honest i am at the point of divorce over this. i have some other issues in our marriage but this is just the worst part of it. he is very rude to her, will not play with her, talks to her like she is stupid, and doesnt let her do anything. she can ask for a snack and he will say no, or she can ask to play a game and he will say no. he is in no way affectionate to either of them really, but he doesnt treat the little one like this. he is not physically abusive as he never even disciplines them humself. he plays with our younger child and tells her he loves her and stuff like that but doesnt do it very often at all with the older one. i do not know what to do. i have talked to him about this on dozens of ocassions and this happens on a daily basis, so i am constantly having to stand up for her and go behind his back to treat her fairly and he gets mad about it. he doesnt see what he is doing is wrong and just thinks hes teaching her how to act. i cry all the time about it and strongly disagree. he knows this. do not get me wrong, he is a really good guy but he is just a crappy father. any advice would be wonderful. i do not want my daughter to be corrupted and think that her daddy doesnt love her. i know he does, but hes terrible at showing it. on numerous ocassions she has asked if she can live with grandma and it just breaks my heart. i love my kids to death and want them to be happy!
Holding-On Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 Could you video tape them playing together and him interacting with the older one and show it to him -if necessary in a counselor's office. Sometimes we just don't "see" ourselves. Do his parents/friends of his see this? Maybe he needs to here it from someone else to really get it. However, it is entirely possible that he won't. Beyond that I can only suggest a separation to get him to see how serious this is. I applaud your decision to stand up for your eldest. By standing by you end up condoning his favoritism even if though you clearly don't want to. Many many hugs to you. This must be so hard.
whichwayisup Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 I think you just nailed it. He's a crappy father. Sure he treats his own flesh and blood abit better than this step daughter, but he STILL isn't acting like a loving doting, affectionate father. What HE needs to understand is, how HIS behaviour is moulding your girls. And from what you've said so far, sorry but it isn't good. He has no idea the long term affects this will have, let alone possibly as the girls get older they will notice the difference in how they each are treated. This has to get fixed NOW..And if he isn't willing to change his ways, then out he goes. Maybe he needs to be alone, see how life is without you and the kids for a while so he can figure out how to be a better father. It's a package deal, he can't love one and not the other. That's just plain cruel.
Pleco Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 Grr...This makes me mad. My mom met my step father when I was 7 years old, and he is my dad. I call him dad, whereas I call my "real" dad by his first name. I could not imagine what life would have been like if he had shown favoritism towards my little brother, his biological son! He is my dad and I am such a daddy's girl. And he adopted me when I was 7! I don't see how your husband can be like this considering he has been with your daughter since she was only 9 months old. I'm not gonna tell you what to do, just wanted to give the insight of someone who was in your daughter's shoes not long ago. I would have been hurt and crushed if my dad had been the way your husband is!
Econ_Dagney Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 I just wanted to comment here and not really to offer any advice if that's okay --because I am definitely not in a position to offer advice on this particular issue. foxyroxy I feel your pain, and I understand how difficult a situation like this can be. I am currently involved in a somewhat related situation...only the biological child will be mine and my husband's and he has left his step-daughter from previous marriage in the lurch. There are a lot of other issues and things going on between him, his ex, and her daughter (e.g. anger, resentment, jealousy), and I don't know how to make things better. I don't know if it's better for him to keep disappointing ex's daughter, or for her to grow resentful towards his biological daughter once she is born and the ex's daughter sees how differently they are treated since his priorities have changed. What I want to ask you is this: How will you take it when you leave him and your oldest daughter still grows up with daddy issues? I mean if she still thinks of him as her father 10 years down the line, and sees that he treats her and her sister differently...what then? Due to a lot of relationship issues with his ex, my husband was forced to put his relationship with her daughter on hold when he left her mother. Now that I am pregnant with his biological daughter, the ex's daughter is lashing out at him and having a really rough time of things. What I'm saying in my long-winded way is that it's going to be a difficult situation no matter what you decide because unless you can get him to see the error of his ways your daughter is going to end up being the one to feel the brunt of his rejection. And, the longer you stay and allow his behaviour the more attached she will become towards him...even if he continues to treat her like crap.
BlueeyedJonesy Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 What does your H's family history look like? Were his mother and father affectionate? Affection/nurturing from your parents is like food and water. You have to have it, if not you'll have problems with it in the future. We are going through this with my H right now. You need to see a counselor NOW!
hopeful1980 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 This is tough. It has to be tough for him too. I am in a similar situation as your husband. When my DH and I got engaged, my stepson was 5 months old. I was very excited about being his stepmom and I wanted to treat him like my own. Then I had my own son. Nothing prepared me for the instant bond I would have with him - one I did not have with my stepson. I've tried to force myself to feel the same way about my stepson as I do my own son, but I just don't. Unlike your husband I'm not rude to my stepson, but I do not consider him my own son and I know that I treat him differently than I do my own because of this. I would never exclude my stepson and I am fair when it comes to discipline, but I just do not have that "motherly" feeling towards him as I do my son. I would compare the feeling I have for him to what I feel towards my friend's children. I just don't show SS as much affection because it feels forced and fake. I think you should accept the fact that your husband may never feel towards his stepdaughter the way he feels towards his bio daughter, but he can get to a place where he is fair and shows your daughter respect and does not resent her.
hopeful1980 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 Also, I think you should work it out because divorce is most likely going to make it worse. Considering your husband is the only father your daughter has ever known (my SS still has his mom), what if your husband only wants to take his bio daughter when he has custody? That will leave your daughter without a father completely.
mem11363 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 The data below is truly frightening. It is from the link below. But just read the excerpt first. His mindset is very common and it is also dangerous. If he has any anger or impulse control problems you need to be careful. http://dangerousbehaviour.wordpress.com/2009/04/19/step-fathers-who-kill/ >>>>>>>>>>>>. In 1988, US data showed that children aged up to two are at about 100 times greater risk of being killed by their stepfather than their biological father. Psychologists call this the Cinderella effect. The research went on to look at British data, concluding that it indicated “considerable excess risk at the hands of stepfathers”. With the rates of remarriage, divorce and cohabitation steadily increasing, giving rise to more stepfamilies, this is a disturbing thought. According to the Office of National Statistics, in 2006 84% of stepfamilies consisted of a stepfather and biological mother living with children from her previous relationship. Research suggests that whereas genetic fathers often kill their children “more in sorrow than in anger”, out of perceived necessity and/or as part of a suicide, homicides committed by stepfathers tend to be more rage driven, impulsive acts motivated by hostility towards the child and characterised by violently beating or shaking them. i need some advice. i met my hubby 6 years ago when my daughter was 9 months old. we fell hopelessly in love and have been very very happy in our marriage. we now have a 3 year old daughter together and over the past 3 years or so, i have noticed that he treats my oldest daughter so much different than our youngest. my oldest thinks of my hubby as her daddy and does not know any different. to be quite honest i am at the point of divorce over this. i have some other issues in our marriage but this is just the worst part of it. he is very rude to her, will not play with her, talks to her like she is stupid, and doesnt let her do anything. she can ask for a snack and he will say no, or she can ask to play a game and he will say no. he is in no way affectionate to either of them really, but he doesnt treat the little one like this. he is not physically abusive as he never even disciplines them humself. he plays with our younger child and tells her he loves her and stuff like that but doesnt do it very often at all with the older one. i do not know what to do. i have talked to him about this on dozens of ocassions and this happens on a daily basis, so i am constantly having to stand up for her and go behind his back to treat her fairly and he gets mad about it. he doesnt see what he is doing is wrong and just thinks hes teaching her how to act. i cry all the time about it and strongly disagree. he knows this. do not get me wrong, he is a really good guy but he is just a crappy father. any advice would be wonderful. i do not want my daughter to be corrupted and think that her daddy doesnt love her. i know he does, but hes terrible at showing it. on numerous ocassions she has asked if she can live with grandma and it just breaks my heart. i love my kids to death and want them to be happy!
mem11363 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 First and most important the data below pertains to children 2 and under. This is critically important because children that age have minimal control over their own behavior and no real grasp that they could be at serious risk of harm from an adult. As children age they become: - More cautious/careful about antagonizing large, hostile males - this is simply hardwired survival instinct AND - They are harder to kill - meaning you don't kill a 12 year old by shaking them but you CAN kill a 1 year old by shaking it. So these stats drop markedly over time - but they still remain way higher for step fathers. The behavior pattern described by the OP is worth focus and concern. She knows him the best - and his family history can also be helpful is assessing this. I am personally familiar with this type behavior. I NEVER knew my maternal grandfather. My mother disowned him because he refused to acknowledge my adopted sister as his grandchild. So when she was 3, and I was 2 Mom told him not to come back if he couldn't treat sis the same as me. She never spoke to him again - and he died 18 years later. The biological imperative. The stepchild harbors alien DNA, and the new "alpha male" is programmed to favor its own DNA and possibly destroy the alien DNA. When new alpha male lions take over a pride of lions, it is not common for them to slaughter any cubs that have been fathered by the previous alpha male. Hopefully as human beings we are more civilized than this.
Ronni_W Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 I tend to agree with whichwayisup: it sounds as if his general parenting skills are somewhat lacking. It's quite possible that he has more patience with, and gives more leeway to, kids up to age 3 (or thereabouts), and then doesn't know how to parent them after that -- the youngest might be in for exactly the same treatment as the oldest, sooner than later. i have noticed that he treats my oldest daughter so much different than our youngest. On the other side, your mind is also treating them differently by making distinctions based on each of them having different fathers. Having you considered parenting classes and/or consulting with a professional about how you both can uncover and overcome what's going on in below the surface?
mem11363 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 When she was the same age as your youngest? Meaning - age adjust his behavior and compare it. I bet he is treating his biological daughter differently/better then he treated his step daughter at the same age. And that is a huge red flag. I am also very close to a situation that is the opposite. My brother in law treated my sisters two kids from her first marriage exactly the same as he treats his own 2 children. And I mean exactly. He is a great father and totally consistent. Pretty amazing really. I tend to agree with whichwayisup: it sounds as if his general parenting skills are somewhat lacking. It's quite possible that he has more patience with, and gives more leeway to, kids up to age 3 (or thereabouts), and then doesn't know how to parent them after that -- the youngest might be in for exactly the same treatment as the oldest, sooner than later. On the other side, your mind is also treating them differently by making distinctions based on each of them having different fathers. Having you considered parenting classes and/or consulting with a professional about how you both can uncover and overcome what's going on in below the surface?
Author foxyroxy_msu83 Posted January 15, 2010 Author Posted January 15, 2010 When she was the same age as your youngest? Meaning - age adjust his behavior and compare it. I bet he is treating his biological daughter differently/better then he treated his step daughter at the same age. And that is a huge red flag. yes he treated her differently when she was 3 than he does our current 3 year old. this did not start to surface until the little one was born. i love him dearly as a husband but i HATE him as a father. we used to NEVER fight but it is all we do anymore. and one person above noted that i should just accept the fact that he will never feel the same way about my child as his own....well, you are a woman, and women feel very differently about their children than men do! think about that one. a mothers love is instinctual and strong, and ive noticed or seen that a lot of men kinda have to learn to love their children, not that they dont in the beginning, but it gets stronger over time. a new mother couldnt love her baby more from first sight!
mem11363 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 I always wondered WHY there was such a profound difference in emotional strength between the average man and the average woman. What you say about men/women and kids is correct. The average woman is way way more nurturing / loving to kids. And emotionally strong enough to keep the male in line. Your daughter deserves to be well treated in her home. The outside world can be a scary place. You HAVE to have a place (your home) where you feel safe and loved. This is a must. I think you need to take all the emotion OUT of it and tell him that you are done. That he has insisted you choose between your wants as an adult (you wish to be with him because you love him) and your childs needs to feel safe and loved by both her parents. And that you have chosen. And then just start the divorce process. Tell him you are sad - and you will miss him - but this is what you have to do as part of being a good mother. My guess - he will break - and he will beg. And that is when you need to put him on probation and lay down the law and make sure he is really really scared of you - like truly afraid. Frankly I would force him to go to counseling until you are satisfied with how he is behaving with her. See the counseling commitment shows that he is truly going to put EFFORT into this and it is not just words. And part of counseling will be for him to understand that part of him being a good person is helping this child who did not choose for her bio father to leave her mom. She is just as much an unwilling player in this mess as he is. And if he says - ok then goodbye well you are doing the right thing for your girl. Allowing a grown male to mistreat a 6 year old is just wrong in every sense of the word. When she was the same age as your youngest? Meaning - age adjust his behavior and compare it. I bet he is treating his biological daughter differently/better then he treated his step daughter at the same age. And that is a huge red flag. yes he treated her differently when she was 3 than he does our current 3 year old. this did not start to surface until the little one was born. i love him dearly as a husband but i HATE him as a father. we used to NEVER fight but it is all we do anymore. and one person above noted that i should just accept the fact that he will never feel the same way about my child as his own....well, you are a woman, and women feel very differently about their children than men do! think about that one. a mothers love is instinctual and strong, and ive noticed or seen that a lot of men kinda have to learn to love their children, not that they dont in the beginning, but it gets stronger over time. a new mother couldnt love her baby more from first sight!
hopeful1980 Posted January 15, 2010 Posted January 15, 2010 When she was the same age as your youngest? Meaning - age adjust his behavior and compare it. I bet he is treating his biological daughter differently/better then he treated his step daughter at the same age. And that is a huge red flag. yes he treated her differently when she was 3 than he does our current 3 year old. this did not start to surface until the little one was born. i love him dearly as a husband but i HATE him as a father. we used to NEVER fight but it is all we do anymore. and one person above noted that i should just accept the fact that he will never feel the same way about my child as his own....well, you are a woman, and women feel very differently about their children than men do! think about that one. a mothers love is instinctual and strong, and ive noticed or seen that a lot of men kinda have to learn to love their children, not that they dont in the beginning, but it gets stronger over time. a new mother couldnt love her baby more from first sight! You don't know how it feels to be responsible for a child who does not carry your DNA. It is not easy. While I do not agree with the way he treats his stepdaughter, I think the goal should be realistic. The image of "one big happy family" may never materialize. Would you be satisfied if he were to just not treat her with so much contempt? Take baby steps. I do not think men have to learn to love their children, they just show their love differently than mothers. I show my children love through affection, cooking, teaching them, etc etc. My husband shows his love for the kids through providing for them and doing shared activites like playing sports. He doesn't hug and kiss them as much as I do, but he still loves them just as much from the day they were born.
Jeff1962 Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 This would break my heart for my child. You have to talk to your husband and get to the bottom of this. Girls bond with fathers, they make choices about future men over this bond to a degree. You owe this to your daughter to get this straight. It's not her fault that she has a different father. Your husband needs to get over this.
mem11363 Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 Hopeful, This is NOT about daddy treating kids as well as mommy does. I agree that is never going to happen. This is about daddy blatently favoring his blood child over his stepchild. This is wrong and toxic and if her mother doesn't protect her who the hell willl? You don't know how it feels to be responsible for a child who does not carry your DNA. It is not easy. While I do not agree with the way he treats his stepdaughter, I think the goal should be realistic. The image of "one big happy family" may never materialize. Would you be satisfied if he were to just not treat her with so much contempt? Take baby steps. I do not think men have to learn to love their children, they just show their love differently than mothers. I show my children love through affection, cooking, teaching them, etc etc. My husband shows his love for the kids through providing for them and doing shared activites like playing sports. He doesn't hug and kiss them as much as I do, but he still loves them just as much from the day they were born.
threebyfate Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 When new alpha male lions take over a pride of lions, it is not common for them to slaughter any cubs that have been fathered by the previous alpha male.I suspect you intended to say that it's common, rather than not common. For that matter, even male lions who aren't taking over a pride, possibly just wandering by, will kill another male's cubs, if they find them. foxy, I feel for your older daughter and agree that family counseling is a good idea.
Jeff1962 Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 On a second note; you mistreat my daughter and you will answer to me over it. If you cannot get beyond this, get out. I owe my children the best life that I can provide for them and for some a**hat to mistreat her is a done deal. Get it right, change it or get the **** out.
Author foxyroxy_msu83 Posted January 16, 2010 Author Posted January 16, 2010 I think you need to take all the emotion OUT of it and tell him that you are done. That he has insisted you choose between your wants as an adult (you wish to be with him because you love him) and your childs needs to feel safe and loved by both her parents. And that you have chosen. And then just start the divorce process. Tell him you are sad - and you will miss him - but this is what you have to do as part of being a good mother. My guess - he will break - and he will beg. And that is when you need to put him on probation and lay down the law and make sure he is really really scared of you - like truly afraid. Frankly I would force him to go to counseling until you are satisfied with how he is behaving with her. See the counseling commitment shows that he is truly going to put EFFORT into this and it is not just words. And part of counseling will be for him to understand that part of him being a good person is helping this child who did not choose for her bio father to leave her mom. She is just as much an unwilling player in this mess as he is. ....i totally agree with you and im almost positive this is what i need to do, not that it will work, but hey, im gonna give it a shot!!! and just to say this to add to the mess, my 6 year old has recently been going through some very difficult things in her life. a person we know sexually assaulted her over christmas this last year. we and the state are taking care of that, but my job for her during this is to treat her a little more tenderly, not like she is broken, but just put the effort to be a little more lineant with her. i know shes having a hard time and is in counseling for that. problem is, my husband thinks she is not exactly telling the truth about everything here. i despise him for that, and frankly the last month or so, cannot even stand to be in the same room with him. i was thinking lately that maybe he was only so nice to her when she was a baby so that he could get a chance with me! i know its far fetched, but its possible. we will give therapy a shot, but its almost certain it will not change who he is. he was raised this way by his own parents and promised me he would never do that to us but studies show that how you were raised tells a lot about how you will treat your own children. we are a family with proof of that!
Author foxyroxy_msu83 Posted January 16, 2010 Author Posted January 16, 2010 [hopeful1980 Would you be satisfied if he were to just not treat her with so much contempt? absolutely not. would your husband not hate you if his child went up to you and tried to give you a hug and you rarely even acknowledged that they were standing there, much less give them a hug. DAMN, im really starting to see all the fault in his ways, i really think its over for us! he doesnt even want the responsibility of his own daughter either. he wants to play video games all day and not have to do anything else. at least hes a hard worker though, what can i say, i guess i married a total loser!
mem11363 Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 He needs to learn that when he sees her - he is seeing a variation of you the woman he loves. If he cannot make the effort to love her - then he does not belong in her life. I DO think that if you tell him that the life/death of your marriage is in his hands and he can either choose to be a true adult or not. And that if he does not change dramatically and permanently you two are DONE. This may - may jolt him into changing. But don't be mean to him - don't be hateful or angry - just be firm. It is best to tell him you deeply love him - you simply love her more. And that it is that simple. And if he isn't 100 percent committed to acknowledging he is in the wrong and needs to fix himself that there is no point in even wasting your time or his. [hopeful1980 absolutely not. would your husband not hate you if his child went up to you and tried to give you a hug and you rarely even acknowledged that they were standing there, much less give them a hug. DAMN, im really starting to see all the fault in his ways, i really think its over for us! he doesnt even want the responsibility of his own daughter either. he wants to play video games all day and not have to do anything else. at least hes a hard worker though, what can i say, i guess i married a total loser!
threebyfate Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 The more I read of his actions, the more I feel you should get out of this marriage. The emotional health and future of your children, is far more important than staying with this man and trying to "fix" the unfixable. But one thing's for certain, I sincerely hope you learned something from this experience. The next partner you pick, should be one who makes a great father. Don't expose your children to any future men until you know for almost certainty, that he's father-material. Children need continuity that's emotionally healthy. This man would have shown his real colours in tell-tale ways, since your daughter was 9 months when you got involved with him.
Author foxyroxy_msu83 Posted January 16, 2010 Author Posted January 16, 2010 The more I read of his actions, the more I feel you should get out of this marriage. The emotional health and future of your children, is far more important than staying with this man and trying to "fix" the unfixable. But one thing's for certain, I sincerely hope you learned something from this experience. The next partner you pick, should be one who makes a great father. Don't expose your children to any future men until you know for almost certainty, that he's father-material. Children need continuity that's emotionally healthy. This man would have shown his real colours in tell-tale ways, since your daughter was 9 months when you got involved with him. at first things were fine, he was an amazing boyfriend and husband up until the point we had our youngest. i love them both just the same so i dont see how he cannot. what gets me is i almost on a daily basis have to threaten to divorce him and tell him he is mean to her and that it hurts me when hes an *******. but telling him this only gets him mad so he gets up and goes into another room leaving me broken and not knowing what to do. we have also spoken on dozens of ocassions when i wasnt mad about the way he was treating her, i was just simply trying to get him to see what he was doing, and he gets mad then too. i will bring up the therapy idea to him and if that doesnt work, then i guess i will make other plans.
threebyfate Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 at first things were fine, he was an amazing boyfriend and husband up until the point we had our youngest. i love them both just the same so i dont see how he cannot. what gets me is i almost on a daily basis have to threaten to divorce him and tell him he is mean to her and that it hurts me when hes an *******. but telling him this only gets him mad so he gets up and goes into another room leaving me broken and not knowing what to do. we have also spoken on dozens of ocassions when i wasnt mad about the way he was treating her, i was just simply trying to get him to see what he was doing, and he gets mad then too. i will bring up the therapy idea to him and if that doesnt work, then i guess i will make other plans.If you insist on fixing him, for the interim, let your oldest daughter live with her grandmother. Knowing that he's abusive to your daughter, do you feel she should continue to suffer, while you try to fix him?
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