Polyamory

[crazycatlady]

Reading here about the various WS and their AP and the BS, along with my starting point of being in an open marriage, but also a BS with a WH (I'm loving all these acronyms ) who has deep feelings for at least two women, and hearing Doushenka (I hope I got your name right) talk about being part of a vee triad, it makes me wonder if a few of the WS wouldn't be so confused if they were open to the idea of being in a polyamorous relationship.

 

I do not know of any successful working triads, I know a few successful open marriages - and even with the betrayal, I would consider our M to be successful because the love is there between us, and the betrayal one that it would't have happened had it been any other person because any other person he could have told me about.

 

I have questions about how it all works -

 

-Is it open to the extended family of all involved - meaning, do the parents, siblings of all three know about all three involved?

 

-Are children involved?

 

-If there is a conflict between two, does the third stay out of it?

 

-Do you worry about one being loved more, like children worry their parents love one child more then the other?

 

-Is there a heiriarchy (I mangled that word) in the relationship?

 

-Assuming seperate houses, who how are special occassions handled?

 

It seems like it would take very special people to make it work. While I think people can love more then one person, and that is why most WS are so conflicted because while they aren't admitting it to either the BS or the AP, they really care for both. But I think its also human nature to want to make sure they are first in their love's heart.

 

CCL

[TaraMaiden]

 

I have questions about how it all works -

 

-Is it open to the extended family of all involved - meaning, do the parents, siblings of all three know about all three involved?

That would depend on those involved, and how open their own families are to a polyamorous relationship.

No matter how liberal some people are, their families may not follow. so it's an individual situation....

 

-Are children involved?

In what way?

You'll have to be more specific...

 

-If there is a conflict between two, does the third stay out of it?

generally, if people are sexually liberal enough to be involved in a relationship of this kind, they'd be mature enough to deal with any arising issues.

but as in any relationship where more than two people interact - things aren't always rosy, happy-ever-after.... Emotions see... they're a crock....

 

-Do you worry about one being loved more, like children worry their parents love one child more then the other?

No, because as people are different, you love people in different ways....and remember that if a guy has two women partners, these women can have other male partners too...

-Is there a heiriarchy (I mangled that word) in the relationship?

Strictly speaking, there shouldn't be. That's the whole point.... isn't it?

 

-Assuming seperate houses, who how are special occassions handled?

in most polyamorous relationships, people live together....

 

It seems like it would take very special people to make it work. While I think people can love more then one person, and that is why most WS are so conflicted because while they aren't admitting it to either the BS or the AP, they really care for both. But I think its also human nature to want to make sure they are first in their love's heart.

I watched a lengthy documentary, in the UK, about polyamorous relationships.

I was astonished to discover that the most insecure people were actually the men.

Women seemed to ease into a polyamorous relationship more easily.

One difficulty between two women was that the male (who loved them both) not only objected greatly to either of them having another male partner, but clearly showed favouritism towards one woman, over the other.

The interviewer tried to point out that in fact, all he was practising was bigamy, but he got quite annoyed at this....

Other examples showed again, that the women seemed to be quite comfortable with more than one suitor, but the males were uncomfortable in situations where they had to share the woman....

[dazzle22]

The only way I can fathom this working is if you weren't "in love" with one person. Then partners are more interchangeable.

[doushenka]

...it makes me wonder if a few of the WS wouldn't be so confused if they were open to the idea of being in a polyamorous relationship.

 

I think for such a solution to work, both BS and WS need to be almost healed from the betrayal. "Relationship broke, add more people" is a bit of a jokey catchphrase to describe what not to do, but it's exactly what not to do. Traditional relationship-building tools become so much more important, as does self-knowledge and knowing (and trusting!) your partner.

 

I do not know of any successful working triads

 

Look up polyamory resources in your area sometime. In my circle of friends, we have a quad, two triads counting ours, and couples who are opening their marriages with plenty of support. I would not have known they existed if I hadn't reached out.

 

-Is it open to the extended family of all involved - meaning, do the parents, siblings of all three know about all three involved?

 

For some families, very much yes; for others, telling would only complicate matters. My family knows, but neither of theirs do, and I completely get why.

 

-Are children involved?

 

Both the quad and the other triad are raising children, and those children understand what their parents have deemed age-appropriate. The quad's offspring have all come to love and accept each other as well as these other adults hanging around the place.

 

-If there is a conflict between two, does the third stay out of it?

 

For us, for the most part, yes. We're adults. We deal with each other directly, no middleman involved.

 

-Do you worry about one being loved more, like children worry their parents love one child more then the other?

 

On some level, I think everyone has that worry, but mostly I trust that since I can love two people the same, so can my beloved. Mono/poly pairings work this out for themselves; some take it on faith and some... well, this is answered in the next question, too.

 

-Is there a heiriarchy (I mangled that word) in the relationship?

 

Our relationship is functionally hierarchical (you weren't far off!) because I live apart and don't deal with their finances, housework, etc. but emotionally quite egalitarian. We use the terms primary, secondary, tertiary, and so on -- first, second, third.

 

Some couples, when they open their relationships, might find that it helps to keep the original relationship primary until whoever's least secure catches up, so to speak. A mono person in a poly configuration takes a lot more on faith and trust; s/he must be assured s/he is still important and still loved.

 

-Assuming seperate houses, who how are special occassions handled?

 

Each of us has our special occasions, and we've all agreed that New Year's is just for us. The rest of the year, if nobody has any plans, we might do something; she is very close with her family, so more often than not, they will have plans. (Which isn't to say I'm distant with my family, but they're mostly overseas.) We see each other for birthdays if it's possible.

 

Cancellations happen for practical reasons, not because someone's in a snit. Illness has done it; snow certainly may, as my love and I are both Pisces babies and the white stuff flies well into Taurus territory.

 

It seems like it would take very special people to make it work. While I think people can love more then one person, and that is why most WS are so conflicted because while they aren't admitting it to either the BS or the AP, they really care for both.

 

Hence why I place special emphasis on self-knowledge, communication, and honesty. This will not work for someone who gets off on drama or deception. This will not work for someone who can't own his or her sh*t.

 

So that's my take on things. The most amazing online compendium of poly information belongs to Franklin Veaux; look up his name or "xeromag" and it should come up.

[crazycatlady]

I mean if children are born into the relationship or were there before hand, how is that handled.

 

And is not bigomy a form of polyamory? Yes bigomy has a negative connotation, but it simply means a man with two wives.

 

I was trying to be non gender specific in my inquiries.

 

CCL

[TaraMaiden]

Darn it, I think you're right.

I may be confusing it with PolyANDRY......

 

EDIT...

No I'm not.

Polyamory is a multiple thing, for all concerned....

[crazycatlady]

Tara - I meant in that the bigamist would be loving two people, wouldn't that be a form of polyamory. If the other two involved were content with the situation, wouldn't it be both?

 

Doushenka - you said I could ask away so I'm asking .

 

- Do you do things with all three of you or does he split his time between the two of you? I know you said you have your seperate place and finances.

 

- the children you know, where they part of a triad or a quad before children or did they form afterwards?

 

I found the guy online, and the first thing I opened is giving me some of the information I needed. Thanks.

 

CCL

 

I've been reading and WOW. So much wonderful information. Thank you for this resource Doushenka. It has answered a number of questions and hey, showed me I were I was right in where I screwed up, showed me where we were wrong in how we were doing things, and been a real eye opener. I'm going to have to bookmark and share with H. I might use this as a way to open up about my own snooping and what I found so we can get everything out, in the open, and start the new year (a little late, maybe we are going by the chinese calander) on the right foot. I can't tell you how pleased I am with this resource!

Edited January 10, 2010 by crazycatlady
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[doushenka]

Doushenka - you said I could ask away so I'm asking .

 

And I'm happy to help.

 

- Do you do things with all three of you or does he split his time between the two of you? I know you said you have your seperate place and finances.

 

Both, believe it or not. Sometimes I pop over for a day or two (until I live closer/am more mobile, that's the way of things) and he makes sure to see me weekly when the weather permits. He and I will do indulgent little weekends together maybe twice a year. When I am better with travel, he would like to take me and/or us to see the wonders.

 

- the children you know, where they part of a triad or a quad before children or did they form afterwards?

 

The adults had children before they had multiple partners -- with one exception, a woman who got custody of her grandkids while in a relationship, and the grandkids have adapted just fine.

 

Best of luck to you, CCL. *big hugs*

[greengoddess]

Oh I love learning things like this.

 

How did you get involved with them to begin with?

You were not the first in the triad correct? Did she/the first have to approve you?

Are you trying to live closer and if you do may that cause jealousy problems?

[crazycatlady]

I see now after having read pretty much everything on the recommended site where it fits for him. I'm not sure if he knows what he is, or where he's wanting to lead us. I know now that in my insecurities, and with neither of us knowing enough, how I've hampered him, and us actually. I see how how much more we need to communicate more fully about this and he needs to actually talk to me and not just try and subtlely hope that I make my way there. Which is kinda what I think he's been doing, and most likely without really knowing it. I think he needs to learn to be a better communicator and not just assume as much as he does.

 

However, I also feel reall strong in my M even more so now after reading all of that and gaining a better understanding of him. I think he needs to read it too because I am emotionally mono. I can care deeply for others besides him, but I don't think I'll love anyone else. But I can see how it works even with that.

 

I can also see how without meaning to, I hurt him too during the betrayal, before I even knew about it. And how I probably have hurt him in the past without even meaning to because we did not discuss this better. It does not excuse the hurt he did to me. But its eye opening and reassuring in a warped kind of way.

 

We need to have a discussion. I'm going to have to suck it up and admit I snooped. Gosh darn it. And I'm going to have to suck it up and admit how much he freaking hurt me too. But I honestly think now that I can do it without bitterness and anger.

 

I must say I am very glad that I found this place. It was needed. And I don't know if I would have been in the right frame of mind without having found things out, whether it hurt so bad or not. So like many other really crappy things I've had to deal with, its been a wonderful awesome learning experience and I've grown a great deal for it.

 

Some of the most wonderful things in life come with pain, every mother knows that

 

CCL

 

Edit:

Doushenka **HUG** Thank you for your time, consideration and everything. I'm sure I'm not done with questions either. Partly because I'm nosy and curious lol and partly because I do think this is the way we are moving.

[doushenka]

Oh I love learning things like this.

 

As I am happy to educate upon the subject!

 

How did you get involved with them to begin with?

 

We met at a dinner for like-minded people; I sat next to him, across from her, and we discovered that we had so very much in common. So much for not going fishing for a mate, eh? We wrote to each other for a week or two -- I would have to check my email archive, as I have saved each one -- before I put the question to him: would he, perhaps, be interested in me as more than a friend? And he said yes.

 

You were not the first in the triad correct? Did she/the first have to approve you?

 

I was not first, by a good twenty years, and so I felt it only proper that she have a say in my involvement. The last thing I wanted, and want, is for her to feel as if she is not part of this. I have the greatest respect for the journey she has taken to get where she is, and I love her very like a relative.

 

What she cannot do, without just cause, is declare us null and void. That is part of my "secondary's bill of rights", as Mr Veaux describes his document.

 

Are you trying to live closer and if you do may that cause jealousy problems?

 

Once I am able, I will move closer, but not into the same house; goodness me, I'm an independent little thing and she's quite used to running her own house. She is also averse to cats, and I'm so fond of them that I couldn't do without.

 

As long as the balance does not suddenly shift away from equality (or, indeed, ever shift away from equality), I see no reason for fear -- but I will anticipate that when the time comes to discuss moving, and she will be a part of the process at each step. I hope to go apartment hunting with her; she has such a wonderful eye for housing.

 

For CCL, now:

 

I think he needs to read it too because I am emotionally mono. I can care deeply for others besides him, but I don't think I'll love anyone else. But I can see how it works even with that.

 

That's a step not many women can take; my mother couldn't, so my father never pressed the matter. She is learning how I love, but it is not something with which she would be comfortable in her own marriage, and I understand.

 

I wish you best of luck if you do embark on such a venture with your husband. You are not imposing on me at all; what I give is freely offered, in hopes that your confusion will come clear again and that your relationship will survive and flourish.