I admit it! I'm drowning here! I don't know how to date!

[Els]

I can fully admit that when I am in a relationship (I've had two so far), I am a great boyfriend. But dating itself I have *never* done. I've almost always met women "naturally" and have had attraction form as a result of our interactions.

 

Sounds like you have it made. I'm exactly like you, never 'dated around' in the stereotypical sense, and never plan to. Too superficial IMHO. I've only had 3 relationships at the age of 23 due to this, but I had the sort of connection with all 3 that some couples (especially those that hook up on 'blind dates', or the 'wow she's hot I'm gonna ask her out' way) have never even dreamed of.

 

Why do you think you even need help? Why not just continue on the way you are?

[EnglishMuffin]

To be fair, she is more likely to be as nervous as you are

 

Since it's the beginning of a New Year, it may not be a bad idea to start with wishing a happy New Year, and ask her about how she spent the holidays as an opening.

 

From your past threads, I take it you recently moved to Austin? Perhaps you could give her a bit of story about your newly moving to the city, and relate your newness to some interesting factors written on her profile (if the shared interests/activities involve the city that is). While you shouldn't make it all about yourself, you need to make it personable too. Add one or two lines about why you found her interesting and that you would like to meet her in person.

 

Suggesting a non-pressure coffee meeting is a good start. Make it sound casual, and it wouldn't hurt to reassure her that you two will have a great conversation even if there is no romantic connection. Do some research on yelp and find a local spot, not a Starbucks. By doing so, you can also ask her "I saw this place on yelp, it looks cool, have you tried it before?"

 

Giving out a personal email/phone number shows you are interested (and willing to risk your privacy/you are not going to flake out easily). You may or may not want to give out the email that is associated with facebook or other social networks. If you feel comfortable her finding you, then do it. Sometimes people want to do background check in that way to make sure they are not meeting a weirdo.

 

If the conversation goes well, then send out another email in a day or so that you enjoyed spending time with her and would like to see her again, etc.

 

I am sure you'll do fine. If this is any consolation, my first eharmony email to my now boyfriend was pretty much of "I did not think you'd respond (I initiated the contact), thought you'd drop off from the communication any moment so I already made overseas plans ahead. If you are up for a nonpressure coffee date, that is cool, if not, I understand and I wish you luck." You cannot do worse than this

 

Good Luck!

[Vertex]

Sounds like you have it made. I'm exactly like you, never 'dated around' in the stereotypical sense, and never plan to. Too superficial IMHO. I've only had 3 relationships at the age of 23 due to this, but I had the sort of connection with all 3 that some couples (especially those that hook up on 'blind dates', or the 'wow she's hot I'm gonna ask her out' way) have never even dreamed of.

 

Why do you think you even need help? Why not just continue on the way you are?

 

I am very bad at meeting people, I think. Or, at the very least, not good at it. I'm either too quiet, or if I'm not quiet, I'm too awkward. It's just a result of having no idea how to act around someone new. I'm not even sure how to be myself naturally around someone new because I think I'm too worried about doing/saying something that'll be considered a turnoff. Or I might just not know what to say at all. It's just an issue I've always had with introductory stages. It ALL goes away once I'm comfortable around someone. I've got many friends that I laugh and joke with like any other normal 23-year-old, but when it comes to "dates," I fall apart.

 

 

To be fair, she is more likely to be as nervous as you are

 

Since it's the beginning of a New Year, it may not be a bad idea to start with wishing a happy New Year, and ask her about how she spent the holidays as an opening.

 

From your past threads, I take it you recently moved to Austin? Perhaps you could give her a bit of story about your newly moving to the city, and relate your newness to some interesting factors written on her profile (if the shared interests/activities involve the city that is). While you shouldn't make it all about yourself, you need to make it personable too. Add one or two lines about why you found her interesting and that you would like to meet her in person.

 

Suggesting a non-pressure coffee meeting is a good start. Make it sound casual, and it wouldn't hurt to reassure her that you two will have a great conversation even if there is no romantic connection. Do some research on yelp and find a local spot, not a Starbucks. By doing so, you can also ask her "I saw this place on yelp, it looks cool, have you tried it before?"

 

Giving out a personal email/phone number shows you are interested (and willing to risk your privacy/you are not going to flake out easily). You may or may not want to give out the email that is associated with facebook or other social networks. If you feel comfortable her finding you, then do it. Sometimes people want to do background check in that way to make sure they are not meeting a weirdo.

 

If the conversation goes well, then send out another email in a day or so that you enjoyed spending time with her and would like to see her again, etc.

 

I am sure you'll do fine. If this is any consolation, my first eharmony email to my now boyfriend was pretty much of "I did not think you'd respond (I initiated the contact), thought you'd drop off from the communication any moment so I already made overseas plans ahead. If you are up for a nonpressure coffee date, that is cool, if not, I understand and I wish you luck." You cannot do worse than this

 

Good Luck!

 

Thanks for the advice!

[Vertex]

Just a little thought experiment here -- maybe it'll be easier for me to understand if I pretend it's someone else I am giving advice to:

 

I am very bad at meeting people, I think. Or, at the very least, not good at it. I'm either too quiet, or if I'm not quiet, I'm too awkward. It's just a result of having no idea how to act around someone new. I'm not even sure how to be myself naturally around someone new because I think I'm too worried about doing/saying something that'll be considered a turnoff. Or I might just not know what to say at all. It's just an issue I've always had with introductory stages. It ALL goes away once I'm comfortable around someone. I've got many friends that I laugh and joke with like any other normal 23-year-old, but when it comes to "dates," I fall apart.

 

Hey Vertex! What's goin' on in your neighborhood, you sexy thing, you?

 

Sucks to hear that you have trouble meeting new people. You should definitely just be yourself. There's no point in trying to act differently than how you are, because that type of personality will come out in the end anyway! If it's in your nature to do something, then do just that. If the girl isn't receptive to a given facet of your personality, then c'est la vie. You should try to assess the compatibility around yourself and not try to "fit" yourself to the compatibility (which is, admittedly, an inherently flawed concept, since natural compatibility isn't something you can necessarily force).

 

Maybe you just feel that you don't have much common ground with other people if your interests lie in things that most girls aren't necessarily into (math, science, finance, technology). It can surely be hard to talk about ANYTHING if you have no idea where to even begin. But you enjoy art and music, don't you? Foreign languages? Maybe start there. Even if you only have a faint interest in something like football (which is huge in Texas), it might help to check out college football so you can better understand what on earth everyone else seems to be talking about. Seems logical, no?

 

You and this girl have the same blasted major, for God's sake! How does this not give you something to launch into? Stop worrying so much about things that don't matter and start worrying about more important things -- like the fact that you're replying to your own post at 5:30 in the morning.

 

You're a good guy who treats women well, Vertex -- just be confident in who you are and don't worry so much about what others think of you on first impression! Most of your friends are very close friends for a reason. True confidence will have a better effect on people, moreso than whatever you can force out under a veil of uncertainty and lack of confidence.

 

Stay sexy, Vertex.

[nddb]

First date:

 

pick an activity/place that both of she will be somewhat interested in so that if things are awkward, there are other things to focus on. Lunch/coffee at a cool artsy place (museum eateries tend to be very good) have worked great for me. You'll pick up these clues during your email bantering phase.

 

One of the tricks is don't wait until she starts getting bored with glazed-over eyes wondering when the hell can she go home. Set a time limit so you can dismiss yourself. You want to give off the vibe that you are very glad to be with her but you have other things going on in your life. On subsequent dates, if things go well, you can always "go make the call" to cancel existing appointments to extend the date.

[Vertex]

First date:

 

pick an activity/place that both of she will be somewhat interested in so that if things are awkward, there are other things to focus on. Lunch/coffee at a cool artsy place (museum eateries tend to be very good) have worked great for me. You'll pick up these clues during your email bantering phase.

 

One of the tricks is don't wait until she starts getting bored with glazed-over eyes wondering when the hell can she go home. Set a time limit so you can dismiss yourself. You want to give off the vibe that you are very glad to be with her but you have other things going on in your life. On subsequent dates, if things go well, you can always "go make the call" to cancel existing appointments to extend the date.

 

Very good/useful advice, thanks. She's into art and museums (as am I) so I think that's probably a good starting point.

[nddb]

Very good/useful advice, thanks. She's into art and museums (as am I) so I think that's probably a good starting point.

 

Saturday brunch would be good. See if you can schedule in another hour or so for museum viewing if she's available.

 

Do a recon of the place. This is important. You want to come across confident--where to park, which way to the entrance, play tour guide for the available exhibits (read up a bit on some of the painters/paintings). Come across at ease and confident and with gentle humor--and it'll be fine.

[lucy9216]

But I mean, even the little things... I am totally clueless.

 

Do you hug someone you're meeting for a first date when you meet? Handshake? What on earth do you guys do/say to get things rolling? It's this first-time-meeting transition stuff that murders me.

 

I have been on line dating for about 6 months now and have had several first meets and it is always best to start with coffee or a drink, something casual and that you can easily finish up quickly if you want too.

 

The first meets I have been on I have always given the guy a hug, not sure if they like this or not but I just felt a handshake was way tooo formal.

 

When it comes to first questions start with simple questions about some things that are listed on her profile such as any hobbies or interests she may have. Some people make the mistake of venting about their personal problems and bad dating experiences on their first meet DONT EVER DO THIS!! that is such a huge turn off and I have never progressed to an official date with a guy when he has done this.

 

Good luck to ya and just be urself it will be fun

[flc]

As many have said get past the electronic and get to a meeting as soon as possible. Until you actually meet you really have no idea if you will go further and why prolong the decision on whether this is someone you like.

 

When you setup a meeting I prefer to keep it informal and something easy and short, for me meeting for coffee worked every time. The first few minutes is always awkward but then just start normal conversation and see how things out. I think you can generally tell within the first 30min if there is some mutual interest and if not meeting informally let's you both end it quickly with less awkwardness.

 

After that it is pretty easy, the meetings that last an hour or less are generally the ones that don't work out the ones that last longer generally turn into additional dates.

 

Last thing if you want to see her again ask her before she leaves. I always found it best to let her know right away I was interested and setting up the next date is the easiest way to do this. As for for handshake or hug the handshake is a safe bet, go for the hug and you may be left in a funny position.

[Vertex]

It's just a skill I need to hone, I think. Striking up conversations with strangers is something I am just so inadequate at -- there are things that we do have in common, but I'm not sure how I'd turn those commonalities into fun conversation. Art, perhaps, but it's not like I'm an art buff -- I just like to draw/create things, but I haven't really done it for a long time with school and everything. I know this all makes me sound like a social tard, but I swear I don't run into these problems with people I've known naturally, haha. I admit I'm an awkward guy at times (story of my life). At college I felt more comfortable being a nerd because everyone else was a nerd on some level, too. My interests in tech/finance/computers/science/language/philosophy/writing/culture etc was more "acceptable."

 

On the plus side, it would seem that she's not really into the sports scene here, which is all the better for me, since I know little about it aside from megabasic things.

 

I know that most people develop these types of social skills from just doing them over and over until it becomes second nature, but I've been meeting new people all my life, and it's always awkward and I always leave things shaking my head because I know I haven't represented myself properly. I feel like I'm bad at identifying common ground while introducing new ground in an interesting way.

Edited January 5, 2010 by Vertex

[jerbear]

Hey Vertex,

 

Have you heard of Toastmasters? They help you do public speaking and presentations. It sounds like you might have problems with speaking and approach. That group helps members grow and be more presentable.

 

One thing they do is they have homework. A new member under an mentor, would research a topic and present it to the group.

 

It is good networking and it helps you get an more global view on things.

[Vertex]

Hey Vertex,

 

Have you heard of Toastmasters? They help you do public speaking and presentations. It sounds like you might have problems with speaking and approach. That group helps members grow and be more presentable.

 

One thing they do is they have homework. A new member under an mentor, would research a topic and present it to the group.

 

It is good networking and it helps you get an more global view on things.

 

I have, in fact, done Toastmasters before. I can deliver speeches and present myself well when it's a topic I'm comfortable speaking about -- where the "goal" is simply to speak effectively. I still fumble with new conversation in a dating capacity.

[jerbear]

I have, in fact, done Toastmasters before. I can deliver speeches and present myself well when it's a topic I'm comfortable speaking about -- where the "goal" is simply to speak effectively. I still fumble with new conversation in a dating capacity.

You know what, I used to be like that. The best way from "school" is to read alot and be able to strike a conversation easily.

 

Think about a politician or CEO; they know their numbers and can recover from a fumble. Can you recover from an fumble? Maybe you can laugh from a Freudian slip. The key is to be able to recover, laugh, and sometimes make a quick exit by using a friend/cell/appointment/etc...

[threebyfate]

Current events and pop culture, are two ways to stimulate conversation, if you don't know the other person. If you get intense into more intellectual topics, it tends to make people uncomfortable, especially if they don't share your interests or feel you're posturing, regardless if you are or not.

[jerbear]

Have you done a "elevator speech" in the past?

 

Think about refining your pitch which can last 1-3 minutes. It is your intro and way in. Start with current events, pop culture (TBF's post) and start with an one sentence "What do you think of XYZ?" "The Phillies did a great job last year" etc...

[Vertex]

You know what, I used to be like that. The best way from "school" is to read alot and be able to strike a conversation easily.

 

Think about a politician or CEO; they know their numbers and can recover from a fumble. Can you recover from an fumble? Maybe you can laugh from a Freudian slip. The key is to be able to recover, laugh, and sometimes make a quick exit by using a friend/cell/appointment/etc...

 

I can recover if it's one or two fumbles. But fumbling multiple times is another story.

 

Current events and pop culture, are two ways to stimulate conversation, if you don't know the other person. If you get intense into more intellectual topics, it tends to make people uncomfortable, especially if they don't share your interests or feel you're posturing, regardless if you are or not.

 

I've discovered this too -- most people don't like to discuss anything "heavy" right off the bat, but then again, neither do I. I like discussing more "intellectual" topics when I get to know someone a bit better. The problem is that I'm left not knowing what to talk about when I meet someone new. My musical tastes aren't even really very "mainstream" but rather more European in nature (trance/techno/dance/foreign stuff/etc, although there's still a fair amount of American stuff I enjoy). It's just tough... I'm not sure how much non-intellectual "normal" common ground I can really cut into before I run out of fuel.

[Vertex]

Have you done a "elevator speech" in the past?

 

Think about refining your pitch which can last 1-3 minutes. It is your intro and way in. Start with current events, pop culture (TBF's post) and start with an one sentence "What do you think of XYZ?" "The Phillies did a great job last year" etc...

 

Yep, I've done elevator pitches plenty.

 

I guess my problem here is that I don't really know how to start a conversation about something pop-culture related. I watch certain TV shows (most of the USA-channel cannon like House, Monk, etc, in addition to Lost and so forth), and have seen almost any movie you could throw at me, read plenty of books, but I don't really know how to do much here instead of just asking "What kind of shows/books/music do you like?" and hoping that they mention something I can branch off of. Either way, though, it feels so contrived to me, I guess. I tend to find that I have little in common with people, and it just makes everything that much harder to find things to talk about.

 

And of course I am worrying about all this over nothing -- so far, everything this girl has said to me has been ideal in terms of background demographic/education/goals/etc. I just worry that I'll meet up in person and bomb an otherwise good opportunity... a debacle I could have avoided had I not been a nervous trainwreck trying to find common ground or simply having SOMETHING to talk about.

Edited January 5, 2010 by Vertex

[Crazy Magnet]

I think you have some excellent starter points here. I think since you also have the same major, you can ask questions along the lines of what classes she is taking, what is her favorite aspect of the major, what led her to choose that area to study, etc.

 

Other questions I have asked/been asked: What are your favorite places around town (this will work for you since you're new to the area), What do you like best about the city? What brought you here? Stuff like that.

[Crazy Magnet]

Yep, I've done elevator pitches plenty.

 

I guess my problem here is that I don't really know how to start a conversation about something pop-culture related. I watch certain TV shows (most of the USA-channel cannon like House, Monk, etc, in addition to Lost and so forth), and have seen almost any movie you could throw at me, read plenty of books, but I don't really know how to do much here instead of just asking "What kind of shows/books/music do you like?" and hoping that they mention something I can branch off of. Either way, though, it feels so contrived to me, I guess. I tend to find that I have little in common with people, and it just makes everything that much harder to find things to talk about.

 

And of course I am worrying about all this over nothing -- so far, everything this girl has said to me has been ideal in terms of background demographic/education/goals/etc. I just worry that I'll meet up in person and bomb an otherwise good opportunity... a debacle I could have avoided had I not been a nervous trainwreck trying to find common ground or simply having SOMETHING to talk about.

 

Just an FYI.....if I tried to discuss pop culture on a first date I would personally bomb. It's not something I'm into.

 

I do hear Austin has a good music scene, you can always take off down that path. What venue do you like? What's the best band that you've seen? What are some good local bands? The best date I've been on in years involved me (lamely) admitting that my favorite kind of music is bluegrass (so not normal! And in that moment I desperately wanted to be normal) and the next date, the guy took me to see an amazing bluegrass band.

 

The moral of that story, don't be afraid of what you like. The right person will still like you!

[stevejohnson1976]

 

- 1st plateau is getting her attention - i.e. establishing any contact

- 2nd plateau is exchanging a couple of emails - casual banter;

- the 3rd plateau is getting her phone number and asking her out on a date

etc. you can extend this logic to all the steps in a progression of a relationship.

Politely thank for date #1 by email, and within a week or so suggest a 2nd date (don't make any plans for 2nd date during the 1st date; also, there are differing schools of thought on that, but my personal policy is no kissing on 1st date)

 

the 2nd plateau is usually the trickiest one since it is easy to ask her out too soon or spend too much time there (and let things die out). In my experience up to 2-3 weeks of casual, not too frequent, email contact is ideal

 

I have found that, for men anyway, its better to let the GIRL decide when its time for the phone number and asking out. I have made it to step 2 with about 12 girls in the month I have been 'online dating' and everyone of those gave me their phone number. If they are interested, they will give it. If not, you know its time to move on. There is very little risk this way - and you will never have to worry about if its too soon. Let them decide when they are comfortable enough and again, you know they are interested that way'!

[jerbear]

To find common ground, you'll need to TALK to her!

 

Remember to smile when you talk to her, the best ones are those that are unconsciously done and make you feel giddy.

 

Since you know her a little, maybe talk about her pin or her clothing accessories. While you're at it, compliment her purse shoes, pin, hair, etc... some women get giddy when you compliment their shoes.

 

They'll start with I got them at DSW, took 4 hours, got them on sale, it was a steal, blah blah blah for easily 5 minutes. You get the point. You might get points for knowing Manolo Blaniks, Jimmy Choo, Jimmy Choo Couture, etc...

 

Ask her questions, you'll learn about her that way; if you don't know what it is, ask or ask the all knowing search engine.

[Crazy Magnet]

Since you know her a little, maybe talk about her pin or her clothing accessories. While you're at it, compliment her purse shoes, pin, hair, etc... some women get giddy when you compliment their shoes.

 

They'll start with I got them at DSW, took 4 hours, got them on sale, it was a steal, blah blah blah for easily 5 minutes. You get the point. You might get points for knowing Manolo Blaniks, Jimmy Choo, Jimmy Choo Couture, etc...

 

Perhaps a truer statement has not been made on LS....

 

I laugh because some dude said something about my shoes and you practically quoted what I started blurting out! Oh a woman and her shoes!!!

 

And yes, they did in fact come from DSW!

[Vertex]

Perhaps a truer statement has not been made on LS....

 

I laugh because some dude said something about my shoes and you practically quoted what I started blurting out! Oh a woman and her shoes!!!

 

And yes, they did in fact come from DSW!

 

Hmmmm... duly noted. XD

[jerbear]

Perhaps a truer statement has not been made on LS....

 

I laugh because some dude said something about my shoes and you practically quoted what I started blurting out! Oh a woman and her shoes!!!

 

And yes, they did in fact come from DSW!

 

Vertex, see what I mean! :lmao:

 

Oh Vertex, whatever you do, DO NOT GO shoe shopping with her! You'll be holding the purse, be there for HOURS, she'll ignore you, DSW is an candy store for them. All for a pair of shoes that she already has an outfit for.

[Vertex]

Vertex, see what I mean! :lmao:

 

Oh Vertex, whatever you do, DO NOT GO shoe shopping with her! You'll be holding the purse, be there for HOURS, she'll ignore you, DSW is an candy store for them. All for a pair of shoes that she already has an outfit for.

 

Trust me, I've learned that lesson well empirically (I have had two girlfriends before, each about 2 years long), haha. Shoes are like crack or something. I have, what, two pairs of shoes.