meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Personally, I don't contact women early on other than to ask them out. No texts, no IMs, no phone until there are either several dates under the bridge or she has shown many heavy buying signals on a few dates. Have been doing this forever, and it keeps me sane. Assuming you are still interested, you keep asking them out until they say no. If they say no twice without proposing a definite raincheck alternative, then move right on to next. The best early measure of a woman's interest is whether she will go out with you. Sounds stupidly obvious, but it seems many guys get bogged down in mixed signals somewhere along the way.
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Personally, I don't contact women early on other than to ask them out. No texts, no IMs, no phone until there are either several dates under the bridge or she has shown many heavy buying signals on a few dates. Have been doing this forever, and it keeps me sane. Assuming you are still interested, you keep asking them out until they say no. If they say no twice without proposing a definite raincheck alternative, then move right on to next. The best early measure of a woman's interest is whether she will go out with you. Sounds stupidly obvious, but it seems many guys get bogged down in mixed signals somewhere along the way. Yes, but, what if you want to date a girl more than once a week early on and see can't find the time? Is this me being too needy? Do people often date only once a week? If so, for how long until you can have more dates a week? I'm so sorry for all the questions, but I'm really interested in this obviously...
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 (edited) Yes, but, what if you want to date a girl more than once a week early on and see can't find the time? Is this me being too needy? Do people often date only once a week? If so, for how long until you can have more dates a week? OK, well first, I'm not a dating pro, just have made some of the mistakes enough to finally learn from them, and enjoy sharing because there was no one to help me learn this stuff for myself, no internet to speak of back then even. Men didn't talk about relationships. Most of what I will tell you is just common sense. That said, once a week for the first couple of months is ideal. It allows you to date 2-4 (4 is pushing it, hard to keep facts straight for me at that level) women simultaneously and just have fun. Instead of adding more dates with the same woman, add more women into the mix. Bad apples will cull out, good ones will rise to the top, and with all the dating, over time, you will become a deadly charming man who is as they say "comfortable in his own skin." I don't date more than once a week until there is an exclusivity talk OR if the women start asking me out. If they want to see me more, I tell them straight up in a flirtatious way, "ask me out if you want more of my time." They are used to guys pressuring them, always pressing, for more of their time that you win by default just by keeping things cool and to once a week. Wait for them to bring up exclusivity after a couple of months (One mistake I make is giving in too soon here, messed up again this year even... couple of months before exclusivity), and if it feels right with that one, go for it, then cut any others loose as gracefully as possible. Never lie to or manipulate them and make it clear that you are playing the field and it's perfectly fine for them to do so as well. Make dating more about having fun with someone than working a process towards some goal or vetting someone. Don't focus on building the relationship until there's exclusivity, just have more fun. Disengage your left brain a bit and don't worry about step by step progressions. If they can't handle that and freak out with jealousy or insecurity, that's not a good one. Turn her loose. More than you asked, but in the same vein. Hope it helps. Edited December 31, 2009 by meerkat stew
Lovelybird Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Wait for them to bring up exclusivity after a couple of months (One mistake I make is giving in too soon here, messed up again this year even... couple of months before exclusivity), and if it feels right with that one, go for it, then cut any others loose as gracefully as possible. Are there any reason that wait for women to bring up exclusivity? or just a personal thing? Why didn't you bring it up first?
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Are there any reason that wait for women to bring up exclusivity? or just a personal thing? Why didn't you bring it up first? It's a way to screen out passive women who aren't willing to put any work into the relationship. Usually, I'm doing all the asking out and date planning, all the physical advances, paying for most if not everything. Expecting her to bring up exclusivity allows her to contribute something to moving the relationship forward. If she thinks she is too good for that, or just isn't enthusiastic about us enough to contribute to the relationship in this way, time to move on to next.
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Wow, MONTHS of only dating once a week? That seems like so little to me... I can't grasp it... Aren't you afraid that at that pace that your moving too slowly, not having enough time to get to know each other and she may walk?
trueblue72ny Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 I wouldn’t ask her whats the deal. Now just turn and walk. Agree 100% with what these guys are telling you here. Just had a very similar experience myself – says one thing, acts another. Blah blah blah. Its all bs. If she is that interested you will hear from her again. the rest is just noise And I wouldn’t take it personally either. Actions, Not Words, that’s what counts! Mine said she was getting off the dating site – well she did…I cancelled too – the same day. A few weeks later I was curious because I was getting this weird feeling that something didn’t add up – overly busy, not-available, etc…. I wound up googling her screen name out of curiousity – guess what…. showed her as active on another dating site. So I confronted her. Of course she was a little – exasperated? O well. claimed she told me about it. I didn’t make a big deal out of it I just said that’s cool if we are keeping our options open. I just wanted to know. her add promptly disappeared. Than she accused me of having trust issues. O well. gotta look out for myself. I think I embarrassed her a little but hey, she should have let me known whats up. if we are keeping our options open let me know. don’t act like your not and keep me from looking if you are too. wtf. Its so simple catching them just by googling their screen name because they usually use the same name on different sites. since then her add is still not showing, but I don’t buy it for one second that it was deleted. Call me paranoid but I think she just hide her profile and is still on there. that’s my gut feelings. Whatever your gut feelings are about the situation – they are probably correct.
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 When people instantly "shack up" and start dating 3-5 times a week right off the bat, they aren't "getting to know each other," but rather indulging their hormones. Nothing wrong with some hormone indulging , and it's fun to just dive in every now and then, but mistaking it for building a real connection is the same as mistaking sexual attraction for love. So, my philosophy is that the first couple of months of dating are just for fun, and to screen out deal-killers. It's just two months, not two years. Truthfully, I usually "give in" near the end of the second month if a really good connection is forming, but two months is the goal I'm striving for. Now sex can certainly happen during this time, I'm just not conditioning anything on how fast we are getting physical. Sex is about 20% of a relationship for me, shacking up too fast over-emphasizes the importance of sex. Lots of serious flaws can be hidden by lust. This is strong "wacko" repellent also. There's a pretty high percentage of people out there who will freak out totally if you aren't instantly settling into a full blown relationship. They will start putting real pressure on you around the third date. These are never good candidates for me, they have no cool, no ability to savor life, tend to be agenda focused and manipulative. Are not secure with themselves enough to be single, and will invariably make any relationship they are in a drama-laden nightmare. Sound like the type you want to spend lots of time and effort on? My method weeds em right out of the picture fast.
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 When people instantly "shack up" and start dating 3-5 times a week right off the bat, they aren't "getting to know each other," but rather indulging their hormones. Nothing wrong with some hormone indulging , and it's fun to just dive in every now and then, but mistaking it for building a real connection is the same as mistaking sexual attraction for love. So, my philosophy is that the first couple of months of dating are just for fun, and to screen out deal-killers. It's just two months, not two years. Truthfully, I usually "give in" near the end of the second month if a really good connection is forming, but two months is the goal I'm striving for. Now sex can certainly happen during this time, I'm just not conditioning anything on how fast we are getting physical. Sex is about 20% of a relationship for me, shacking up too fast over-emphasizes the importance of sex. Lots of serious flaws can be hidden by lust. This is strong "wacko" repellent also. There's a pretty high percentage of people out there who will freak out totally if you aren't instantly settling into a full blown relationship. They will start putting real pressure on you around the third date. These are never good candidates for me, they have no cool, no ability to savor life, tend to be agenda focused and manipulative. Are not secure with themselves enough to be single, and will invariably make any relationship they are in a drama-laden nightmare. Sound like the type you want to spend lots of time and effort on? My method weeds em right out of the picture fast. Although you may have more experience than me, I disagree with a couple things your saying. First of all, spending more than once a week with a girl doesn’t mean we are having sex. Secondly, I don't think spending 2 maybe even three (maybe too much) days a week the first couple of months together is being insecure and labels you as that. Heck, I don't even want to spend more than 3 days a week with someone unless I'm living with them! I just see spending more than one day a week as fine; just trying to get to know them... So with that regard, I suppose if a girl only has time for once a week it'd probably just be a good idea to play by her pace? What if I want two days a week? What your basically saying is I'm going to scare them off by trying to date twice a week early on? The only reason I can see why someone would want to date once a week is if indeed they are dating 3+ weekly. I would only want to date once a week too if that was the case… In either case, I understand what your telling me and it’s well taken. Thanks:)
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 First of all, spending more than once a week with a girl doesn’t mean we are having sex. I understand this, but most times these days, and in my age range and culture (35-45), people who start dating several times a week are having sex. Not sleeping together would be the exception rather than the rule. Secondly, I don't think spending 2 maybe even three (maybe too much) days a week the first couple of months together is being insecure and labels you as that. Heck, I don't even want to spend more than 3 days a week with someone unless I'm living with them! I just see spending more than one day a week as fine; just trying to get to know them... Did not mean to state or imply that spending more than one date a week was insecure, but that keeping dates to once per week in the first two months will screen out lots of desperate, insecure types, quite a different statement than what you attribute to me. Up to you how you handle your dating frequency, different strokes and all. I didnt say you will scare anyone off. Please watch putting words in poster's mouths, you did it before when you said I was giving you contradictory advice. NBD, but please read more carefully . Remember, it's only for the first two months of dating, not forever.
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 I totally get your notion referring to "weeding out" the whack-jobs early on by keeping dating at a one day, one week thing. I think that makes a lot of sense, so I can't argue with what your saying about that. Whether your intentional about it or not, I can see why that is effective... However, I see it a little differently (and I'm not arguing -- just giving me two cents). Let's say someone is insecure about dating and calls me everyday, tries to always make plans in a short time frame of knowing each other... wouldn't it be the right thing to tell someone to chill out and to take it slower rather than assume they have major issues and just bail out on them? Given, I realize that many people do bail out without even attempting to tell the person, which is sad. If I'm doing something out of line or that makes her uncomfortable I guess I expect a girl to tell me that and I'd stop doing it because I may not understand... Haha, but even with that stuff said, I realize that many won't give you any hints...
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Let's say someone is insecure about dating and calls me everyday, tries to always make plans in a short time frame of knowing each other... wouldn't it be the right thing to tell someone to chill out and to take it slower rather than assume they have major issues and just bail out on them? Excellent question, usually with a healthy person, a simple "I have plans then" will suffice. I'm talking about the many out there who start in with heavy-handed tactics and games to try to bully you. It can come in the form of gushy, over the top texts, loaded questions like "you don't seem to really be into me" (usually in the middle of a great date where we are dancing, having a blast and I am paying ), several phone calls a day and prying to find out what I'm up to when we aren't together. Some of that stuff is ok... some. But with many, a pattern of "I must have a relationship this instant" emerges, and it's not hard at all to spot. Keep in mind, it's just a couple of months, and that sounds long written out, but isn't really. It's not at all uncommon for their to be 10 days or so between the first and second dates, and sometimes there are only 3-4 dates in the first entire month. I'm basically taking 8 dates to get to where lots of folks rush to in 3. Again, just what I do, modify accordingly depending on what feels right for you.
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 I will admit one thing, I am guilty of being way too pushy last night as i semi-flipped out on this girl last night because I was trying to talk to her through text and she took forever (I was impatient because we were making plans to do something). I felt like by the time our conversation was over the night was going to be over so I got upset and impatient with her... Long story short, she got upset, I got upset. I told her if I am going to talk to her in the future I am just going to call her from now on . So it is better off this way because if she doesn’t pick up I'll leave a message about seeing if she wants to hang out one day and if she doesn’t respond back reasonably I'll just move on. SCREW TEXTING THIS CHICK, REALLY...
meerkat stew Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 (edited) I will admit one thing, I am guilty of being way too pushy last night as i semi-flipped out on this girl last night because I was trying to talk to her through text and she took forever (I was impatient because we were making plans to do something). I felt like by the time our conversation was over the night was going to be over so I got upset and impatient with her... Long story short, she got upset, I got upset. I told her if I am going to talk to her in the future I am just going to call her from now on . So it is better off this way because if she doesn’t pick up I'll leave a message about seeing if she wants to hang out one day and if she doesn’t respond back reasonably I'll just move on. SCREW TEXTING THIS CHICK, REALLY... OK, this is a great example. Let's say I am also dating this girl while you are. You are texting her back and forth, letting her know you are focused on her, getting in silly arguments based on why she didn't text back fast enough. OTOH, I am calling her once a week, asking her out, then getting off the phone. I take her out, we have a blast (because I focus on dates, and not long phone convo and text, my dating skills are very polished), we part company. She wonders what I am up to in the interim, "will he call again?" "what does he do with his time while we are apart?" She has time to think about what we did face to face, whether it turned her on, if it did, the feelings grow naturally. I'm not dissipating the anticipation with lots of texting. If she decides she likes you better, good, no one wastes each other's time, and I move cheerfully on to the other two women I'm dating, and start looking for a replacement for her. If she decides she likes me better, good, but you wasted some time bickering with her and worrying about silly things, and also you spent time calling and texting her that you could have used to line up other prospects. If she decides she likes both of us equally, if she is emotionally healthy, she is more likely to choose me, because of the -lack- of texting drama, despite the fact that I have put in less phone/text time. If she is an emotionally unhealthy drama queen, she will choose you, because you provide more drama. I dodge a bullet, move to the next option, and you are stuck with the bad apple Edited December 31, 2009 by meerkat stew
Author DietDrPepper Posted December 31, 2009 Author Posted December 31, 2009 OK, this is a great example. Let's say I am also dating this girl while you are. You are texting her back and forth, letting her know you are focused on her, getting in silly arguments based on why she didn't text back fast enough. OTOH, I am calling her once a week, asking her out, then getting off the phone. I take her out, we have a blast (because I focus on dates, and not long phone convo and text, my dating skills are very polished), we part company. She wonders what I am up to in the interim, "will he call again?" "what does he do with his time while we are apart?" She has time to think about what we did face to face, whether it turned her on, if it did, the feelings grow naturally. I'm not dissipating the anticipation with lots of texting. If she decides she likes you better, good, no one wastes each other's time, and I move cheerfully on to the other two women I'm dating, and start looking for a replacement for her. If she decides she likes me better, good, but you wasted some time bickering with her and worrying about silly things, and also you spent time calling and texting her that you could have used to line up other prospects. If she decides she likes both of us equally, if she is emotionally healthy, she is more likely to choose me, because of the -lack- of texting drama, despite the fact that I have put in less phone/text time. If she is an emotionally unhealthy drama queen, she will choose you, because you provide more drama. I dodge a bullet, move to the next option, and you are stuck with the bad apple Good point, very good point! Great thinking... I think i'm gonna try this!
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 (edited) OK, this is a great example. Let's say I am also dating this girl while you are. You are texting her back and forth, letting her know you are focused on her, getting in silly arguments based on why she didn't text back fast enough. OTOH, I am calling her once a week, asking her out, then getting off the phone. I take her out, we have a blast (because I focus on dates, and not long phone convo and text, my dating skills are very polished), we part company. She wonders what I am up to in the interim, "will he call again?" "what does he do with his time while we are apart?" She has time to think about what we did face to face, whether it turned her on, if it did, the feelings grow naturally. I'm not dissipating the anticipation with lots of texting. If she decides she likes you better, good, no one wastes each other's time, and I move cheerfully on to the other two women I'm dating, and start looking for a replacement for her. If she decides she likes me better, good, but you wasted some time bickering with her and worrying about silly things, and also you spent time calling and texting her that you could have used to line up other prospects. If she decides she likes both of us equally, if she is emotionally healthy, she is more likely to choose me, because of the -lack- of texting drama, despite the fact that I have put in less phone/text time. If she is an emotionally unhealthy drama queen, she will choose you, because you provide more drama. I dodge a bullet, move to the next option, and you are stuck with the bad apple Your right. I screwed up, but I don't text her everyday and talk to her on the phone for long period of time. The only reason I got upset last night was because she said she contact me when she got home, which she did, and we were trying to set up plans and she did something rude which was basically put the phone down in the middle of us trying to figure something out. So yeah, that pissed me off, and if that screwed up my chances so be it because she shouldn't take all night to text me if we are making plans that night! You may say that I'm being too needy but it's rude to walk away from a conversation when we are making plans, so I just got frustrated with her and told her if we speak again I'll just call because I find it too difficult to text her on the phone. Besides that, I don't text and call her everyday expecting to talk... I'm going to think about what I want to do with this girl because things have been pushed to the point where I honestly don't even want to try and set anything up with ehr right now. I think I'll just call her up on Sunday and see if I can make plans for a day next week. I don't plan nor do I have the desire to talk to her till then because, I agree, it's too much already. Btw, I got another date scheduled for Sunday anyways so I'm good for the week Edited December 31, 2009 by bwidger
bwidger Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 (edited) Still, you give good insight meerkat, and it's heeded indefinitely. I really like your third-person view on this and I'm going to try and remember this in the future, especially when you said she is forced to think about the time spent together because that's all you give her. Very insightful... I also like the logic that it is a waste of time bickering over stupid stuff like texting, etc. So maybe I should just call women from now on because texting has a way of prolonging the conversation, and that really irritates me. I would like to have a quick thing to say, make plans, end it and move on but it get prolonged usually. Edited December 31, 2009 by bwidger
Lovelybird Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 It's a way to screen out passive women who aren't willing to put any work into the relationship. Usually, I'm doing all the asking out and date planning, all the physical advances, paying for most if not everything. Expecting her to bring up exclusivity allows her to contribute something to moving the relationship forward. If she thinks she is too good for that, or just isn't enthusiastic about us enough to contribute to the relationship in this way, time to move on to next. Thanks for clearify. What other things does a man like you expect from a woman you date?
meerkat stew Posted January 4, 2010 Posted January 4, 2010 Thanks for clearify. What other things does a man like you expect from a woman you date? Will assume you are talking in the early going, since it's the thread topic. I expect her to be good company, physically attractive (in shape) and flirtatious, witty or at least intelligent, honest, prompt, respectful, courteous, warm and flexible early on, and leave the "big stuff" (emotional health, consistency, security, self-respect, spirituality, kindness, financially responsible, craving for me, sexually exciting, etc.) for down the road.
Recommended Posts