InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 (edited) Complimenting someone on something actually compliment-worthy, is different than patronizing someone. My cousin has a disfigured face from a premature birth, yet all the women in my family patronize him, tell him he is attractive, he is handsome "in his own way", and that there are girls out there just waiting for him. Personally I would rather know the truth, over having people convince me one thing and finding out the hard way (as my cousin has unfortunately) what the reality is. Knowing the truth can give people realistic goals (such as losing weight, etc) rather than chasing pipe dreams. . Really? And what exactly do you do to bring your cousin back to reality at these family functions? Since you are so honest and all. When was the last time you stepped in and told him in front everyone "listen bud, what these women are saying is so far and removed from reality that I need to clue you in on how things actually are. You look like a bit of a monster and the reality is that you will never be with a woman or have love in your life." The end. When was the last time you told him that? Furthermore, don't you think your cousin knows what he looks like already? And did it even occur to you that perhaps the women in the room see something in him that you fail to see? Edited December 9, 2009 by InspiredbyYou
silic0ntoad Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 When was the last time you told him that? Furthermore, don't you think your cousin knows what he looks like already? And did it even occur to you that perhaps the women in the room see something in him that you fail to see? As I understand it, while everyone is shallow, women play off the inner workings of their chosen intimate partner more so then men do. In this case, iby might be right. I don't however think initial attraction is geared by the inner workings of either male or female. There has to be a quality physically that attracts both male or female partners to prospective dates. IDK about this whole creepy guy thing- I've never been called creepy or thought I acted creepy, even when turned down. Maybe when I was completely hammered and couldn't remember, but then again, everyone acts weird when completely hammered. But I digress. Back on the point, I think attraction DOES have to do with wether you would consider someone elses actions as creepy or not. I know myself I've had women do things that I considered creepy when I wasn't attracted to them, but I've also had attractive women do the same type of thing and I wasn't made to feel creeped out. Although, I think my latest "compliment" was that I had "Nice facial lines" by a girl at a local pub. I have no clue what that even means, but I was told it was a compliment. I wasn't creeped out.
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Gees some of you men make is sound like these women are blind and stupid. Do you honestly thin that at 300lbs a person would not have a very clear idea of what the repercussions of being that big are? Do you not think they understand how limited they are socially being that big? You are completely clueless if you think that by telling someone who looks like that "you look cute in that picture" is going to make them think their life will be just fine if they continue on the path they are on. What some of you who are going down so hard on this fail to realize is that we ALL have formed our perceptions of ourselves based on what we have experienced in relationships with others. We all form our self esteem based on the potentials others spot in us, combined with the personal accomplishments we achieve in life. Why should we deprive those who have shortcomings from getting the same thing? Do you all not think you have shortcomings? Do all not think you also fail miserably in certain aspects of your personalities or bodies or life? We all do, you do too even if you don't weigh 300lbs yet there was someone along the way in your life who was able to overlook your shortcomings and see the potentian in you instead and they chose to play on that. If something in the way you are conducting your life (be it overindulging in food consumption, or substance abuse, or emotional abuse of others, or sexual promiscuity whatever it is that we take on to an extreme that ultimately harms us) is clearly getting in the way of you achieving your personal goals, no amount of praise from others going to change the effects of that self-mutilating act But what it will do is make use believe in ourselves enough to want to do good things for ourselves instead of digging ourselves deeper into abandon. Yes they do know.. but that doesn't mean they will change. I'm not talking about pictures or comments about pictures.. so don't bring that up. I'm talking in general... I dunno about anyone else but when I was on the larger side.. anytime someone told me I looked handsome or good.. I'd smile and say thanks.. while internally saying "Oh please, what a crock of ****.." As unintentional as it may be.. complimenting someone can be more detrimental then you may think
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Really? And what exactly do you do to bring your cousin back to reality at these family functions? Since you are so honest and all. When was the last time you stepped in and told him in front everyone "listen bud, what these women are saying is so far and removed from reality that I need to clue you in on how things actually are. You look like a bit of a monster and the reality is that you will never be with a woman or have love in your life." The end. @cognac Honestly I don't think this particular example is valid.. an overweight person can loose the weight.. a disfiguring birth defect isn't the same.
donnamaybe Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 So I think the answer to the OP is that creeps aka ugly guys (lets call a spade a spade) will hit on you if he thinks you're average or bellow average and he stands a chance with you. I'm sorry, but I think the bolded part is correct based on the fact that the OP said it would help if they didn't have a creepy face. I know there are lots of good looking creeps, but from what I read the OP came across as meaning not very good looking men.
FeelingLonely98 Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Maybe the "perfectly normal men" already have so many women throwing themselves at them no, they don't!!!
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Yes they do know.. but that doesn't mean they will change. I'm not talking about pictures or comments about pictures.. so don't bring that up. I'm talking in general... I dunno about anyone else but when I was on the larger side.. anytime someone told me I looked handsome or good.. I'd smile and say thanks.. while internally saying "Oh please, what a crock of ****.." As unintentional as it may be.. complimenting someone can be more detrimental then you may think It's not your job to change someone else, it is each individual's responsibility to change themselves. It is however your job to be a decent human being. You decide what that means to you. An admin that has a cubicle right outside my office at work who is probably only 5 yrs older than me but looks a lot older because she is considerably overweight and really doesn't do much with her appearance, came in to work one day with her hair all pulled up and with some make-up. I came in that morning and told her "wow you look so pretty today I really like your hair pulled back like that it looks great!" She said "well I see how you young women dress and look so good everyday I think I should try to look good too now" I said "I am not young you you know....;)" She said well you still look very good every day. That day two of our young and good looking sales guys came over to her cubicle to compliment her. One said "wow you look so different I thought we hired someone new in your position that looks good" She has since been putting a real effort into her appearance and she later shared with me she is on a diet. Never underestimate what your words can to do to another human being. Do you think if we said to her "yeah great you wore your hair up and makeup but you are still so overweight you should really lose weight" Do you honestly think that is what a person needs as motivation?
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 It's not your job to change someone else, it is each individual's responsibility to change themselves. It is however your job to be a decent human being. You decide what that means to you. Do you think if we said to her "yeah great you wore your hair up and makeup but you are still so overweight you should really lose weight" Do you honestly think that is what a person needs as motivation? Nope you are correct.. changing others isn't my job. If they care to change.. they can.. not my problem if they don't. Dosen't mean I can't suggest to them to improve themselves to achieve the goals they want. They want constructive criticism.. not platitudes. Give them the tips to change.. still their choice if they do so or not. In this example its all about her hair.. her weight or body isn't the target of the compliment. So yea.. telling her she is overweight in this example would be out of context. As she is making the change herself.. no need to prod or push her.. you and the ladies she mentioned did that unconsciously by being around. So I don't believe this situation fits the ongoing debate. I think this is more along the lines of those that don't actually make an effort to change themselves...
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 (edited) In this example its all about her hair.. her weight or body isn't the target of the compliment. So yea.. telling her she is overweight in this example would be out of context. As she is making the change herself.. no need to prod or push her.. you and the ladies she mentioned did that unconsciously by being around. So I don't believe this situation fits the ongoing debate. First you tell me stop talking about complimenting a picture of a 300lbs woman, when that was the concrete example sited here. Then, I change to a true live example of the exact same thing, people complimenting someone who clearly needs to change their body image because it is hindering them one way or another, and you say that it's about hair and my example is not fitting. It is the exact same thing. In one, people are complimenting a woman's photo on facebook in my example we did it face to face. In both cases the women had less than ideal beauty by social standards, yet people managed to see them looking good anyway, and consequently complimented them. At this point I think it's best you just admit that for some people it is just easier to give people rude and ignorant comments because they have an extreme dissatisfaction with themselves. The more dissatisfaction a person projects onto others the more it screams "I can't possibly hate someone else more than I hate myself but I'll die trying to fool you that it's the other way around." Being a creep or an internet troll takes no effort whatsoever. Being a conscious human being does. It builds character and self-confidence and at the end of the day it makes you feel really damn good. Edited December 9, 2009 by InspiredbyYou
boogieboy Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 At this point I think it's best you just admit that for some people it is just easier to give people rude and ignorant comments because they have an extreme dissatisfaction with themselves. The more dissatisfaction a person projects onto others the more it screams "I can't possibly hate someone else more than I hate myself but I'll die trying to fool you that it's the other way around." This is completely false with no valid merit whatsoever. You can be a concious human being and feel good when you tell someone something that HELPS them improve their life rather than blowing smoke up their asses.
PJKino Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 I dont think we should blame it all on these womens friends Men are half to blame We hit on anytihng that looks halfway decent espeically with some alcohol we help inflate these girls egos.. Were partly to blame for these average or below average women thinking therye better looking then they actually are and waiting for a 10 to approach thme while they think theyre above these "creepy" guys who are actually on their level
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 First you tell me stop talking about complimenting a picture of a 300lbs woman, when that was the concrete example sited here. Then, I change to a true live example of the exact same thing, people complimenting someone who clearly needs to change their body image because it is hindering them one way or another, and you say that it's about hair and my example is not fitting. It is the exact same thing. In one, people are complimenting a woman's photo on facebook in my example we did it face to face. In both cases the women had less than ideal beauty by social standards, yet people managed to see them looking good anyway, and consequently complimented them. I didn't bring up pics nor did I mention them other then to say my post didn't concern pictures. Yes people were complimenting her.. were these friends of hers that she hangs out with or mere co-workers? Do you think I'm saying to not compliment anyone? Not at all.. compliment away.. but don't give overly false/fake compliments. I am saying that a good friend will be honest. From my reading, the debate was about a heavyset woman regarding her weight.. not her hair. If someone changes their hair why would I compliment them or give them criticism on their weight when it has nothing to do with it. "Hey beth.. your hair looks great today" boom done.. no need to falsly compliment her on her overall look if that wouldn't be honest." Why would I criticize someone about something they are already in the process of changing on their own? As I posted before.. I was overweight myself.. I no longer am. The more compliments you get, the more you believe them.. OR the more cynical about people making those comments are cause you know the writing on the wall. At this point I think it's best you just admit that for some people it is just easier to give people rude and ignorant comments because they have an extreme dissatisfaction with themselves. The more dissatisfaction a person projects onto others the more it screams "I can't possibly hate someone else more than I hate myself but I'll die trying to fool you that it's the other way around." For some people yes it is easier.. they are called pricks, *******s, jerks.. etc. But we aren't talking about outright insulting someone or making rude comments.. I am talking about constructive criticism to a friend that needs it more then false compliments that could do nothing more then make things worse since they most likely know the compliment is hollow w/o sentiment behind it. Being a creep or an internet troll takes no effort whatsoever. Being a conscious human being does. It builds character and self-confidence and at the end of the day it makes you feel really damn good. Being a conscious human takes effort?? comes pretty easy to me.. be polite and treat people fairly. This is perhaps how you personally feel.. not necessarily how everyone feels.
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 I wonder if this whole thing could get boiled down to the most wellknown and common version... "Do these pants make me look fat?" So the guy has to make a choice... Fluff her ego and lie.. or be honest. I would rather someone be honest so they can make an informed choice rather then basing it off a false compliment.
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 This is completely false with no valid merit whatsoever. You can be a concious human being and feel good when you tell someone something that HELPS them improve their life rather than blowing smoke up their asses. A child molester is conscious of what he is doing, he feels good and I bet in some sick twisted way he actually believes he is doing some child some form of good. Try again, very weak. No valid merit? Read on http://www.ultimate-self.com/dealing-with-insults-put-downs-and-criticism/ http://blogs.news.com.au/news/splat/index.php/news/comments/insulting_other_people/ Yaaaah ok! I don't have more time now otherwise I would find more literature to give even more merit to my opinion.
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 I didn't bring up pics nor did I mention them other then to say my post didn't concern pictures. someone else did earlier in the thread that's how the whole 300lb topic came up, go back and read the post and then please stop telling me to not make reference to the facebook picture, that was the topic/situation proposed If you don't read the posts you shouldn't comment. Yes people were complimenting her.. were these friends of hers that she hangs out with or mere co-workers? Do you think I'm saying to not compliment anyone? Not at all.. compliment away.. but don't give overly false/fake compliments. Co-workers that never even talk other than work related stuff. Irrelevant anyway you are nit-picking now. Who are you or who is any of us really to to tell others what is a false compliment? If we felt this woman looked good that day when clearly she is not an attractive woman overall because of the state she is generally in, who are you or any of the men who have called me a "liar" to tell me what a fake compliment is?
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 A child molester is conscious of what he is doing, he feels good and I bet in some sick twisted way he actually believes he is doing some child some form of good. Try again, very weak. Are you seriously comparing child molestation to being painfully honest to someone?
Johnny M Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 She completely outsmarted Johnny M. I can not believe some of what you post . Don't you have ANY respect for others? Awww, moose, you are such a sweet, caring guy. If I was a chick, I would totally go out with you....as friends
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Are you seriously comparing child molestation to being painfully honest to someone? No I am not comparing the end result I am comparing the same intention of the acts vs a negative outcome. It's an extreme example but in both cases you are doing something for self-serving reasons. You can give someone constructive criticism provided you balance it out with positive feedback or compliments. Criticism alone is really no different than a person who chooses to inflict pain onto a child via molestation. So how do you know if those comments in Facebook were not because face to face these friends had already shared some constructive criticism with them? At any rate I gave the example because he said a person can be consciously doing something that feels good to them and in the interim be helping others. I just wanted to illustrate that not all the times where that combination is in place, the outcome will be to the benefit of others.
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 At any rate I gave the example because he said a person can be consciously doing something that feels good to them and in the interim be helping others. I just wanted to illustrate that not all the times where that combination is in place, the outcome will be to the benefit of others. Hmm maybe the "Kill 1 to save 1000" quandry would have been the better choice..
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 This thread has gone COMPLETELY OT! It's not off topic it's evolved from the first post. Some men think that women see men as creeps, when they really aren't, because they have false ideas of themselves due to lies their girlfriends feed them on their looks.
callingyouuu Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Some of us want friends who tell us when we're doing something wrong so we can improve ourselves. Some of us want friends who ignore our flaws so we don't have to think about them, either. Neither way is necessarily wrong; one is just productive, while the other is blissful ignorance. Pick whichever one makes you happy!
Yukikazi Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Some of us want friends who tell us when we're doing something wrong so we can improve ourselves. Some of us want friends who ignore our flaws so we don't have to think about them, either. Neither way is necessarily wrong; one is just productive, while the other is blissful ignorance. Pick whichever one makes you happy! Well said.. Basically "do you want the truth or just what you want to hear?"
InspiredbyYou Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 Some of us want friends who tell us when we're doing something wrong so we can improve ourselves. Some of us want friends who ignore our flaws so we don't have to think about them, either. Neither way is necessarily wrong; one is just productive, while the other is blissful ignorance. Pick whichever one makes you happy! True some of us prefer a balance of the two, both giving and receiving.
donnamaybe Posted December 9, 2009 Posted December 9, 2009 It's not off topic it's evolved from the first post. Some men think that women see men as creeps, when they really aren't, because they have false ideas of themselves due to lies their girlfriends feed them on their looks. Anyone could say that about ANY thread. I think it evolved that way because the OP refused to admit she only wants to get hit on by guys she deems good looking enough for her when she herself said that not having a "creepy face" would help. In THAT sense, I can understand why some of the males here would be put off.
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