Arguments with gf and her attitude

[icecubee]

Hi all,

 

My girlfriend and I have been together for 2 years. I love my girlfriend and I know that she loves me too. I do plan to marry her in the near future(but I have doubts because of our problems below)

 

 

The problem/problems that we have is that we have been arguing a lot since last July(most of them seem to be ridiculous things in my opinion). These arguments seem to happen a lot. At least once a week, and sometimes 2-3 times/week. To make matters worse my girlfriend seem to get mad very easily.

 

 

Examples of ridiculous things:

i) She is picking me up, I stepped into her car and she started to hit the gas pedal before I closed the door. I was a bit mad with her since I thought that was dangerous. Instead she gets mad at me and asking me why I was mad at her in the first place. We got into a big argument after.

 

ii) I was waiting at the gas station to fill up gas for my car(this was when oil prices were above $120). The gas station is packed with lineups everywhere spilling out onto the street. While waiting in line, I had my ignition turned off but turned it on while the car ahead of me moved forward(since I saw a lot of cars were blocking the street I thought it would be considerate to move forward). My girlfriend asked me why I had to move and that I was wasting gas I told her it was considerate to move my car, but she was mad because I don’t listen to her. Another long argument after.

 

iii) She was talking she saw on the news that eating ketchup with shrimp can cause cancer and that I should not eat it(I have had shrimp with ketchup quite a few times since it's a classic asian dish). I told her it's better to do more research and that I was skeptical about this. She was mad because I wasn't listening to her and have to "argue"(I didn't raise my voice at all) with her. Another big argument after.

 

 

There are many other of these arguments. She is a hard-headed type and will almost never admit that she did anything wrong. Her attitude is pretty bad when she gets mad(i.e., she completely ignores you; and the way that she talks is very cold ) and I am someone who tends to be calm and never wants to argue. I am almost always the one(almost 95% of the time) that get back to her or say sorry to her after these arguments. I don’t mind that too much(women are never wrong anyways =) ), but what I can’t stand is that sometimes these arguments never gets resolved until she gives me a big lecture(3-4 hours...many times going into 3-4am at night) of how wrong I am even if it was clearly her fault in the first place(It doesn’t even get resolved even if I sincerely say sorry to her…it never is that easy). I thought it was a big waste of time and it puts a lot of stress in our relationship. I have spoken to her a couple of times about it but she never seems to understand.

 

 

Of course there are times when I was clearly wrong and I always say sorry to her and get back with her after.

 

 

We have broken up once before but she wanted to get back together a few days later. After two months I gave in because she treated me so well and seem like she had changed. But after about month of getting back together the arguments started again.

 

 

Tonight, we have another one of these arguments: We were at a restaurant and as she was talking about her family the server came by and I asked my girlfriend if she wanted plain rice. After that, my girlfriend completely ignores me in the restaurant. I asked her what’s going on and what I did wrong repeatedly. She was very cold towards me during the whole 2 hours at dinner. After dinner, we had a small talk and she told me that she was mad because I ignored her and seem disinterested by trying to change topic(to her: asking her if she wanted plain rice is a change of topic) when she was talking about her family. I explained that I wasn’t ignoring her and I wasn’t disinterested with her topic. But she doesn't seem to understand.

 

 

I am getting a bit tired of the arguments and her attitude. I have talked to her time and time again about our problems. I have told her I have doubts about our relationship because of the arguments and I feel even if we get marry there is a good chance of divorce(which I certainly don’t want and neither does she). She always just tells me if I listen to her these arguments won’t happen. But I know it’s not as simple as just listening to her.

 

 

I don’t know what to do. I love her very much and we are very happy together when things go well with no arguments. She is a wonderful person when everything goes well. I want to work with her and our relationship. I have even made a task list to improve our shortcomings. I work on my listening skills and she works on her attitude(which she had a hard time of accepting this task when I told her about it). I don’t know what to do. Help is needed!

Edited November 30, 2009 by icecubee

[Malenfant]

OK, so i'm feeling that you're the one who usually keeps his cool, the one who apologies etc.

 

It may be that your GF doesnt realise what a b*tch she's being and that its hurting you when she has these long goes at you.

She's coming over as a bit spoilt with regard to arguments, shes never wrong, you have to do the apologising etc.

 

Its all very tiresome for you, and although she may think it, being nice when you're not arguing does not make up for her attitude.

 

She needs to grow up a bit, and TBH i'd advise you to not back down to her, if you're angry when she's having a go and lecturing you, then show it, and dont apologise unless you are actually in the wrong.

 

Sometimes people go off on one and are so stubborn they cant back down or admit they're wrong, even though they know deep inside that they are being unreasonable.

 

try not backing down for a change. try not taking her sh*t. tell her that lecturing you for hours is demeaning to you, that you're a grown man and you're not going to put up with it. tell her its making you unhappy, and tell her this when you're not arguing, so she's more likely to take you seriously.

Just say you need to talk about stuff and be ready for yet another argument, its inevitable, but this time its you that has brought it up, its a shift in attitude that may just snap her out of her unreasonable behaviour

 

One of two things will happen:-

She'll realise she has to swallow her pride, and it'll be a wake up call

she'll be so angry she'll never speak to you again (at least you'll totally know what sort of person she is)

She deserves to be given a chance to change, but that wont happen without a bit of tough love.

[SoulSearch_CO]

Your GF sounds very controlling and demanding (i.e., if you just do what I tell you, if you just listen, etc, we wouldn't have these problems) without any "give."

 

When it gets to the point where you guys are at - one person trying to point something out and the other person ignoring it - I think is when a counselor is a good idea. Obviously, she's not taking the feedback seriously. Sometimes it takes a third party pointing out the issue before we can really SEE it. This seems to happen a lot in romantic relationships. I really don't see how this can get resolved without a counselor because she's not even being fair.

[icecubee]

Thanks for the replies for far!

 

 

Your GF sounds very controlling and demanding (i.e., if you just do what I tell you, if you just listen, etc, we wouldn't have these problems) without any "give."

 

When it gets to the point where you guys are at - one person trying to point something out and the other person ignoring it - I think is when a counselor is a good idea. Obviously, she's not taking the feedback seriously. Sometimes it takes a third party pointing out the issue before we can really SEE it. This seems to happen a lot in romantic relationships. I really don't see how this can get resolved without a counselor because she's not even being fair.

 

I have brought up the the controlling part about her but that got into a serious argument. She told me that she can't believe I would think that she is controlling. Sometimes I feel like I don't know how to talk to her about these problems of hers without getting into an argument or her getting mad/giving me attitude(i.e., ignoring me). I always try to speak to her calmly about it.

 

I have also brought up the topic of her not being fair. All she did is tell me nothing is fair in life:(

 

I think counselling is a good idea. I'm going to look into it. Thanks!

 

OK, so i'm feeling that you're the one who usually keeps his cool, the one who apologies etc.

 

It may be that your GF doesnt realise what a b*tch she's being and that its hurting you when she has these long goes at you.

She's coming over as a bit spoilt with regard to arguments, shes never wrong, you have to do the apologising etc.

 

Its all very tiresome for you, and although she may think it, being nice when you're not arguing does not make up for her attitude.

 

She needs to grow up a bit, and TBH i'd advise you to not back down to her, if you're angry when she's having a go and lecturing you, then show it, and dont apologise unless you are actually in the wrong.

 

Sometimes people go off on one and are so stubborn they cant back down or admit they're wrong, even though they know deep inside that they are being unreasonable.

 

try not backing down for a change. try not taking her sh*t. tell her that lecturing you for hours is demeaning to you, that you're a grown man and you're not going to put up with it. tell her its making you unhappy, and tell her this when you're not arguing, so she's more likely to take you seriously.

Just say you need to talk about stuff and be ready for yet another argument, its inevitable, but this time its you that has brought it up, its a shift in attitude that may just snap her out of her unreasonable behaviour

 

One of two things will happen:-

She'll realise she has to swallow her pride, and it'll be a wake up call

she'll be so angry she'll never speak to you again (at least you'll totally know what sort of person she is)

She deserves to be given a chance to change, but that wont happen without a bit of tough love.

 

I haven't apolgized and did not call/find her first the last few times there was an argument(when I don't feel I did anything wrong). It worked somewhat. She would find me first and asked me If I wanted to talk. We would discuss our problem but then she would give me a lecture again telling me what I did wrong, how I don't listen to her/don't know how to listen and it goes on for hours.

 

I think I'm going to try your advice and talk to her about the unreasonable behavior when we are not arguing. I feel like it's going to get into a big argument..but I'll try. Thanks!

[espec10001]

I dated a girl like this once for WAY too long. She would punch holes in the wall and break things when she got mad. I got two words of advice for you dude: RUN AWAY. Run far far away from this chick and don't look back!

[New Again]

Hm I also dated someone like this for way too long.

 

Actually, I was just thinking this morning about some of the things he used to do that were completely silly.

 

For example: he would start a 3 hour fight because he thought I closed the car door too hard.

 

Or he would give me the cold shoulder for 4 days, then pick a huge fight with me that would last 6 hours because instead of responding to a question with a yes/no I would give a more detailed answer that implied yes/no.

 

(Example: Q:"Should I go with you to pick up the pizza?" A: "I ordered delivery.")

 

Glad that's over.

 

Trust me, it doesn't have to be so hard.

[Malenfant]

Thanks for the replies for far!

 

 

 

 

I have brought up the the controlling part about her but that got into a serious argument. She told me that she can't believe I would think that she is controlling. Sometimes I feel like I don't know how to talk to her about these problems of hers without getting into an argument or her getting mad/giving me attitude(i.e., ignoring me). I always try to speak to her calmly about it.

 

I have also brought up the topic of her not being fair. All she did is tell me nothing is fair in life:(

 

I think counselling is a good idea. I'm going to look into it. Thanks!

 

 

 

I haven't apolgized and did not call/find her first the last few times there was an argument(when I don't feel I did anything wrong). It worked somewhat. She would find me first and asked me If I wanted to talk. We would discuss our problem but then she would give me a lecture again telling me what I did wrong, how I don't listen to her/don't know how to listen and it goes on for hours.

 

I think I'm going to try your advice and talk to her about the unreasonable behavior when we are not arguing. I feel like it's going to get into a big argument..but I'll try. Thanks!

 

ok, so thats a bit of progress. she came to you to talk.

then it escalated into what it had before.

I wonder if you can be some place where as soon as she starts with the lecturing you can just end the conversation by removing yourself from her vicinity.

 

So it shuts her down, and she knows you wont carry on the discussion until she's being reasonable again.

As soon as she starts, calmly say 'you're lecturing me again, and i cant carry on with this until you stop'

or something like that. as long as you're reasonable and maintain not talking until she's being reasonable I think it will eventually diffuse the situation.

 

she's a bit of hard work, but i think that she feels the need to swing it back her way because you've made her come to you, she now needs to get something back on her own terms, if you know what I mean.

 

But well done you for having a go.

 

I myself must confess to being somewhat of a nagger in previous relationships, and TBH i didnt realise how nasty i was sometimes until my ex snapped one day and told me how much i'd hurt him. I felt very bad and i wished he had said so sooner. But it took years for him to say anything. so I know kind of how it might be from her POV.

[Bejita463]

but then she would give me a lecture again telling me what I did wrong, how I don't listen to her/don't know how to listen and it goes on for hours.

 

If you were on the phone:

*click*

*dust hands off*

 

If not:

*dust hands off*

*walk away*

[icecubee]

Update: So I spoke to my gf about our problem at her home.

 

I told her about our arguments and why we have to argue on the tinniest things all the time. I told her the arguments are wearing me out. I told her I feel she is being unreasonable and very demanding when she lectures me. I also told her again that just “listening to her” doesn’t really solve our problem.

 

She did not say too much and was quiet most of the time(I felt like she was listening to me and taking this seriously…hope I’m not wrong on this). I was pretty much doing most of the talking. At one point, she asked me why I have to do this? I told her that we have a problem and I want us to work together to make this relationship better. I also told her that I feel she is not giving enough of an effort to work on our problem.

 

During the conversation, she told me that I should apologize whenever I did something wrong. I told her that I always do that if I did do something wrong but I will not apologize anymore if I feel I did not do anything wrong from now on.

 

At several points during the conversation, she asked me why I don’t end the relationship if I have so many doubts. I told her if we can both work on the relationship I can see us being happy together.

 

I left her house saying goodnight(she did not reply). We haven’t spoken since the conversation( it’s been one day).

 

 

I don't expect her to completely change but I hope she understands my intention. I think counselling is a good idea as mentioned by one of the posters above.

Edited December 5, 2009 by icecubee

[Malenfant]

Update: So I spoke to my gf about our problem at her home.

 

I told her about our arguments and why we have to argue on the tinniest things all the time. I told her the arguments are wearing me out. I told her I feel she is being unreasonable and very demanding when she lectures me. I also told her again that just “listening to her” doesn’t really solve our problem.

 

She did not say too much and was quiet most of the time(I felt like she was listening to me and taking this seriously…hope I’m not wrong on this). I was pretty much doing most of the talking. At one point, she asked me why I have to do this? I told her that we have a problem and I want us to work together to make this relationship better. I also told her that I feel she is not giving enough of an effort to work on our problem.

 

During the conversation, she told me that I should apologize whenever I did something wrong. I told her that I always do that if I did do something wrong but I will not apologize anymore if I feel I did not do anything wrong from now on.

 

At several points during the conversation, she asked me why I don’t end the relationship if I have so many doubts. I told her if we can both work on the relationship I can see us being happy together.

 

I left her house saying goodnight(she did not reply). We haven’t spoken since the conversation( it’s been one day).

 

 

I don't expect her to completely change but I hope she understands my intention. I think counselling is a good idea as mentioned by one of the posters above.

 

good for you. its very very difficult in a situation like this.

this time will give her a chance to think about what you've said. in your next conversation, if she asks again 'why dont you end it'? tell her its because you love her, and that when you're getting on well she's a lovely person.

she may be feeling like you see her as a bad GF, but really she's only like that some of the time, and she may need assurances that you feel deep down she's a great person.

that may help her to see that you're trying to be supportive, and not just having a go at her and trying to get her to change.

after all, these arguments must be wearing her out as well, if she's sensible at all she'll realise what you're trying to do.

good luck, you've done the right thing.

[New_Life08]

Hello, in relationships we always have pet peeves about the other person, or sometimes there is a major issue to get resolved. If your relationship is just how you say it is she sounds a bit controlling. In fact it reminds me of how my mom was with my dad at times and he let most of it roll off.

 

The thing she might be struggling with is accepting that everyone does things differently, and usually there is no right or wrong moral dilemma...it's just different than we would do it. I'll bet she's young. For example, in my 20's one of my biggest pet peeves with a man was in a parking lot when I clearly see a parking space, point it out, and it seems he blatantly drives past it for whatever reason. That was enough to bring out the gloves. In my 30's there might have been an eye-roll and a "whatever!" "Today (in my 40's), I just smile to myself and think: "Isn't that precious." LOL.

 

You know the saying "Don't sweat the small stuff" sometimes it takes some years of growing to learn that, usually it's after we have kids.

 

As for you, I think it would be a good idea to sit down and have a serious talk about appreciating the differences in whom we love. If you love her I would recommend couples counseling, if you cannot do that, I would recommend the book: "What Women Want" and "What Men Want". It is good to find books that both of you can read regarding the needs of each other. That way she wont feel picked on, like you are suggesting she has a problem and you are Mr. Perfect.

 

If she is not willing work on the relationship, then you need to work on yourself. Get a book about "dealing with a controlling partner". You can order any book pretty cheap on Amazon. Anyway, best of luck to you. Relationships are a lot of work, but with enough love and respect it will all work out.

 

All my best friend.

[Angel1111]

The short answer: you need to get out of this relationship. You're with a verbally abusive person and this is exactly how they act. They start up totally irrational arguments out of the blue and leave you feeling completely blindsided. And that's only the beginning.

 

Once I was in a restaurant with my now ex and the waitress was walking us to a table. It doesn't usually matter to me where I sit in a restaurant and he was very picky about pretty much everything - including where to sit in a restaurant - so when the waitress asked us where we wanted to sit, I politely asked him where he'd like to be. He immediately got really angry and told me to pick. And when I did, he didn't like it, got even madder and we switched tables. And there was no rhyme or reason as to why that table was better than the other. My whole meal was ruined after that and I left - taking a taxi home. To say that I hate these people is to put it mildly. They are SO friggin' screwed up, it's unreal, and they will take you down with them if you let them.

 

So, here's the pattern - they're pretty nice to be with in the beginning and after they've got some history established, they start showing you their real colors. Also, they almost always pick calm and rational people to be in relationships with. Don't kid yourself into thinking that she can change because she won't. Not because she can't change but because she won't. Abusers literally get a high off of this kind of power, just like druggies get high on drugs (abusing, manipulating, and controlling people is 'power' to them). The only time people like this are nice is when you're no longer with them, as you experienced when the two of you broke up. Then you get back together and it's all the same stuff again - except they amp it up. There is no way to win - you can fight back, you can stop fighting back, you can scream, you can go silent. Nothing works except leaving.

 

And, here's the really confusing part - sex with people like this is usually great because it's the one place where you can have a real connection with them. That's why so many people get trapped in these relationships - the good seems real and good. The problem is, the good stuff is also abuse. It's part of the cycle because they know they can't abuse a person all the time and keep them around. So they mix it up. Your gf is amping up the abuse and seeing how far she can push you. And because you have stayed up until this point, and because you're starting to rationalize - i.e., 'women are never wrong are they' - then you're getting slowly sucked in. Kind of like a frog that is slowly boiled to death - if you turn up the heat ever so slowly, then he never notices. The more you stay, the more she knows she can get away with this behavior.

 

If you marry this woman, I promise you it will end in divorce. But not until she traps you with a few kids so that she'll be tied to you forever and so that she can continue to dish out her crap for many years to come. I thank God that I had the good sense to never have children with my abusive ex. When I left him, he was out of my life forever, which is exactly what I wanted.

 

Do yourself a favor and try to see beyond your feelings for this person. She will bring your life to its knees if you let her. Get out. She's going to act really surprised and put on the best act you've ever seen when you leave her, but ignore it. It's all crap. Everything that she says and does is designed to control and manipulate you. Just walk...and keep on walking. And thank God that you dodged this bullet.

 

As far as the update you wrote about and the conversation you had with her - the reason she didn't say much is because she's in fear that the game is up and she's trying to figure out a way to manipulate you back into seeing her viewpoint. Do not be surprised if she ends the relationship, or goes out and cheats on you because for people like this, their biggest fear is being abandoned. I know, funny, right? When they do everything to push people away. Do not be surprised by anything she does - you have amped things up with this conversation.

 

I can't even tell you what a waste of life and time these people are. I know you're emotionally attached now but please don't let that sway you. You're on the right track with talking to her but I hate to tell you that she won't change. I hope you're prepared for that.

[icecubee]

My gf phoned me today. She wants to talk and we are meeting up tomorrow. I don't know what she is going to say and I'm afraid she is going to lecture me again and the pattern continues.

 

I'm really a bit tired...I'm not exactly sure what I'm going to do or say tomorrow...I feel like I don't want to say anything to her unless something positive comes out from her first.

 

good for you. its very very difficult in a situation like this.

this time will give her a chance to think about what you've said. in your next conversation, if she asks again 'why dont you end it'? tell her its because you love her, and that when you're getting on well she's a lovely person.

she may be feeling like you see her as a bad GF, but really she's only like that some of the time, and she may need assurances that you feel deep down she's a great person.

that may help her to see that you're trying to be supportive, and not just having a go at her and trying to get her to change.

after all, these arguments must be wearing her out as well, if she's sensible at all she'll realise what you're trying to do.

good luck, you've done the right thing.

 

Thank you for your help in this thread Malenfant!

 

Hello, in relationships we always have pet peeves about the other person, or sometimes there is a major issue to get resolved. If your relationship is just how you say it is she sounds a bit controlling. In fact it reminds me of how my mom was with my dad at times and he let most of it roll off.

 

The thing she might be struggling with is accepting that everyone does things differently, and usually there is no right or wrong moral dilemma...it's just different than we would do it. I'll bet she's young. For example, in my 20's one of my biggest pet peeves with a man was in a parking lot when I clearly see a parking space, point it out, and it seems he blatantly drives past it for whatever reason. That was enough to bring out the gloves. In my 30's there might have been an eye-roll and a "whatever!" "Today (in my 40's), I just smile to myself and think: "Isn't that precious." LOL.

 

You know the saying "Don't sweat the small stuff" sometimes it takes some years of growing to learn that, usually it's after we have kids.

 

As for you, I think it would be a good idea to sit down and have a serious talk about appreciating the differences in whom we love. If you love her I would recommend couples counseling, if you cannot do that, I would recommend the book: "What Women Want" and "What Men Want". It is good to find books that both of you can read regarding the needs of each other. That way she wont feel picked on, like you are suggesting she has a problem and you are Mr. Perfect.

 

If she is not willing work on the relationship, then you need to work on yourself. Get a book about "dealing with a controlling partner". You can order any book pretty cheap on Amazon. Anyway, best of luck to you. Relationships are a lot of work, but with enough love and respect it will all work out.

 

All my best friend.

 

I think you are defintely right in that she is having a hard time accepting that everyone does things differently. I remember when I first helped her doing chores she would tell me how I should wash the dishes and sweep the floor the "correct" way. She failed to realize people does things in different ways because people are brought up differently. Talking to her about these issues would lead to argument because she thinks her way is almost always the better way.

 

Some times I bring up that there is no right or wrong and that there is a grey area. But she seems to be a black/white person(i.e., I'm right, you are wrong) It's so hard to explain this to her!

 

I have actually brought up the idea of reading a book together before (Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus) to look at the differences between how men and women do things/think/react differently. She is not willing to read the book herself but asks me to read(I actually have read most of the book) or read together when she has time. But it's so hard to find time to read together sometimes because she is either too busy or we are having arguments.

 

But thanks for your book suggestions and your support!

 

 

 

The short answer: you need to get out of this relationship. You're with a verbally abusive person and this is exactly how they act. They start up totally irrational arguments out of the blue and leave you feeling completely blindsided. And that's only the beginning.

 

Once I was in a restaurant with my now ex and the waitress was walking us to a table. It doesn't usually matter to me where I sit in a restaurant and he was very picky about pretty much everything - including where to sit in a restaurant - so when the waitress asked us where we wanted to sit, I politely asked him where he'd like to be. He immediately got really angry and told me to pick. And when I did, he didn't like it, got even madder and we switched tables. And there was no rhyme or reason as to why that table was better than the other. My whole meal was ruined after that and I left - taking a taxi home. To say that I hate these people is to put it mildly. They are SO friggin' screwed up, it's unreal, and they will take you down with them if you let them.

 

So, here's the pattern - they're pretty nice to be with in the beginning and after they've got some history established, they start showing you their real colors. Also, they almost always pick calm and rational people to be in relationships with. Don't kid yourself into thinking that she can change because she won't. Not because she can't change but because she won't. Abusers literally get a high off of this kind of power, just like druggies get high on drugs (abusing, manipulating, and controlling people is 'power' to them). The only time people like this are nice is when you're no longer with them, as you experienced when the two of you broke up. Then you get back together and it's all the same stuff again - except they amp it up. There is no way to win - you can fight back, you can stop fighting back, you can scream, you can go silent. Nothing works except leaving.

 

And, here's the really confusing part - sex with people like this is usually great because it's the one place where you can have a real connection with them. That's why so many people get trapped in these relationships - the good seems real and good. The problem is, the good stuff is also abuse. It's part of the cycle because they know they can't abuse a person all the time and keep them around. So they mix it up. Your gf is amping up the abuse and seeing how far she can push you. And because you have stayed up until this point, and because you're starting to rationalize - i.e., 'women are never wrong are they' - then you're getting slowly sucked in. Kind of like a frog that is slowly boiled to death - if you turn up the heat ever so slowly, then he never notices. The more you stay, the more she knows she can get away with this behavior.

 

If you marry this woman, I promise you it will end in divorce. But not until she traps you with a few kids so that she'll be tied to you forever and so that she can continue to dish out her crap for many years to come. I thank God that I had the good sense to never have children with my abusive ex. When I left him, he was out of my life forever, which is exactly what I wanted.

 

Do yourself a favor and try to see beyond your feelings for this person. She will bring your life to its knees if you let her. Get out. She's going to act really surprised and put on the best act you've ever seen when you leave her, but ignore it. It's all crap. Everything that she says and does is designed to control and manipulate you. Just walk...and keep on walking. And thank God that you dodged this bullet.

 

As far as the update you wrote about and the conversation you had with her - the reason she didn't say much is because she's in fear that the game is up and she's trying to figure out a way to manipulate you back into seeing her viewpoint. Do not be surprised if she ends the relationship, or goes out and cheats on you because for people like this, their biggest fear is being abandoned. I know, funny, right? When they do everything to push people away. Do not be surprised by anything she does - you have amped things up with this conversation.

 

I can't even tell you what a waste of life and time these people are. I know you're emotionally attached now but please don't let that sway you. You're on the right track with talking to her but I hate to tell you that she won't change. I hope you're prepared for that.

 

Thank you for your suggestions. You do have some good points--Mainly the good is so wonderful but the bad is like a nightmare. Also, you are right in that I'm emotionally attached and because of that I can't really see things clearly about this relationship. I know there is a good chance she is not going to change. I will keep your points in mind.

 

 

 

I will see what happens tomorrow....

Edited December 6, 2009 by icecubee

[Angel1111]

I think you are defintely right in that she is having a hard time accepting that everyone does things differently. I remember when I first helped her doing chores she would tell me how I should wash the dishes and sweep the floor the "correct" way. She failed to realize people does things in different ways because people are brought up differently. Talking to her about these issues would lead to argument because she thinks her way is almost always the better way.

 

This is called control. A 'my way or the highway' attitude. Again, these people never change because they see no reason to. You are dealing with divorce material here. I guarantee it.

[icecubee]

We talked.

 

She is very stubborn is all I can say and I'm on the brink of ending this relationship.

 

 

I asked her how we can make this relationship work and solve our problem. She bascially replied with if I can meet all her needs, listen to her then the arguments won't happen and we will be happy. LOL...I laughed and told her it's just basically me working on the relationship instead of working together.

 

She just don't see it and think she has no problems and won't change. All the problems are on me.

 

 

I think counselling is the only way now.....it's getting really tiring...

[Angel1111]

If counseling helps you to get closure then do it. As far as fixing things with her, it's a waste of time. I've learned to not even give people like this 2 seconds worth of my time because they will only waste it. What she was saying is that all the problems in the relationship are your fault. Your instincts are dead on - walk away from her and don't ever put up with this kind of thing from anyone again.

[JustLooking123]

You seem like a reasonable and kind man. She will leave you a bitter shell if you don't run. Hate to sound harsh, but if you're not married and have no kids together...the relationship is broken. Although you see counselling as the only possible hope, you're probably better off saving your time and money and just walking away. Do not expect her to change; she thinks she is doing nothing wrong.

 

It shouldn't be this hard. There are other women out there who will not do this.

[dopusmax]

I know I'm late to this but dated a woman like this years ago and seeing signs of this in a new relationship. Exactly the same as you. This book helped me sooooo much and kept me from going insane. Angel1111 is completly right from start to finish.

http://www.bpdcentral.com/bks/swoe.php

[counterman]

I dated a girl similar to your current girlfriend. There would be times where we would fight everyday and that was hell. She would NEVER admit she was wrong and when she yelled at me and I yelled back, it would escalate. She would give me the silent treatment and not call me or answer my calls. Every time I brought something up, it would redirect at me and she would mention one of my flaws as though it's a competition and we were both blaming each other. Every time I brought up an issue with us, she would never admit to her contribution to the issue. When she was hurt, it will always be about how I hurt her and why did I do that? Needless to say, I was suffering for a LONG time. I swallowed my pride way too many times and took on the blame way too much just so that we could have one peaceful day without any arguments. It was never going to work out and I should have ended it ages ago.

 

Yes, she was really nice and angel like at the beginning. Red flags were waving everywhere when the first time we had an argument, she was absolutely vicious and we weren't even together yet! I spoke to her about this and she was very open to working on this really aggressive nature of hers at first. Then, when it came to the tougher times, she exploded. Basically, I was the blame for everything that when wrong in her life. Thing is I let her to that to me, I let her treat me that way and, when I stood up for myself, she could not handle it. There was nothing I could do anymore because I tried to work with her and all she wanted to do was be angry at me. Her idealogy was that if things aren't working, why try any more? Things are just always going to get worse. She was never 100% with me from the start.

 

Counselling is probably the best and definitely try the book!

[meerkat stew]

Counseling won't help. Your GF has lost attraction for you for some reason, probably nothing you did or didn't do. This is causing her to build resentment towards you that comes out in her verbal harangues. When women are in love, highly attracted, they don't stir up petty arguments and belittle their SO unless they are emotionally or personality disordered. Once their attraction level slides, they start acting disrespectfully and doing the things your GF does. She may not even realize herself the root of her issues with you and the relationship, but there's a large chance it's related to her attraction for you. Perhaps you have been too available or too easy to deal with and she has become bored, just one possibility of many.

 

Please reconsider marrying this woman. Her behavior is just going to get worse and worse, not better, and there is no solution other than many months of NC and apart. After that, there is a small chance she will realize what she lost and change herself, but change takes lots of time and the chance she will realize her error is quite small.

[Angel1111]

Counseling won't help. Your GF has lost attraction for you for some reason, probably nothing you did or didn't do.

 

Based on the way he described her, she has all the signs of someone with an abusive personality and these people don't fall under normal categories. Actually, the more they care about someone, the worse they behave. They're driven by intense anger, an unstoppable need to control, and huge fears of abandonment. In brief, they're nuts. Irreversably nuts. And there's no way to get them to stop behaving that way. The only winning move is to leave. But most people have to go through all the steps of trying to fix it, though, because most normal people can't fathom that there are people like this in the world.

 

We can only pray that he has changed his plans about marrying her.

[cybersister]

Counselling is a waste of time as she is so clear she has no intention of changing- her response to the Mars and Venus book is such a clear example that you have to do all the work in this relationship.

And it is work that is never done- she has to be in control and to show that control she has to find fault.

You sound such a caring person rtying every you an to make this work- you deserve someone who appreciates you. She never will.

[paddington bear]

Icecubee, you're not going to like me for this, but consider it tough love. Big, waving, red flags flying around all over the place here.

 

Since I got my life destroyed by a woman (and I'm a girl, I wasn't even dating her) with the same the behaviour of your girlfriend I can see some pretty bad warning signs here.

 

First off, sounds like you are in an emotionally abusive relationship. People who are emotionally abusive do it to nice girls and guys who don't really like arguing, who will always back down and are generally sensitive. No one else would have them.

 

These arguments seem to happen a lot. At least once a week, and sometimes 2-3 times/week.

 

This degree of arguing in any relationship is a very, very bad sign. However, when relationships are breaking down it is usually due to arguments about each other, your feelings within the relationship. Arguments do not blossom out of the blue over irrational, ridiculous things from one party alone.

 

 

To make matters worse my girlfriend seem to get mad very easily.

 

Getting mad this easily and over nothing is not normal. If you stay with her, what it will lead to is you walking on eggshells (there's a book by that name) during the nice times with her, worried about when she's going to explode again. It's called the cycle of abuse. You relax thinking everything's ok, but then the fear creeps in that there's going to be another explosion of anger, then there is another explosion, and then you go back to relaxing and around and around it goes until you chose to stop partaking.

 

 

I was a bit mad with her since I thought that was dangerous. Instead she gets mad at me and asking me why I was mad at her in the first place.

 

This is exactly the behaviour of the crazy lady in my life. When anything went wrong, when she caused a problem, it was always, ALWAYS someone else's fault, not hers. Black and white thinking with no grey area.

 

I told her it was considerate to move my car, but she was mad because I don’t listen to her.

 

The reason she gets mad is because she wants constant attention. She wants so much that she will be a black hole and suck everything you have to give and it will never be enough. What has someone who explodes into a rage over every minor thing got to say of value? Why would anyone want to listen to opions that make no sense in the first place?

 

She was mad because I wasn't listening to her and have to "argue"(I didn't raise my voice at all) with her.

 

No point remaining quiet, no point raising your voice. Both will just add fuel to the fire, neither will prevent her from having her rages. All your being quiet does is get you more and more into the mode where her rages control you, control what you say, control how you feel you should react, all based on 'not getting her angry' or 'not keeping her angry' instead of like a normal person, being able to speak your mind. But you are not in a relationship with a normal person.

 

She is a hard-headed type and will almost never admit that she did anything wrong. Her attitude is pretty bad when she gets mad(i.e., she completely ignores you; and the way that she talks is very cold ) and I am someone who tends to be calm and never wants to argue.

 

This again, is the most powerful weapon in the emotional abusers weaponry. I'm telling you now, she will never, ever, ever admit she's wrong, because I'm pretty sure she has some mental issues, even if everything else about her appears normal.

 

I am almost always the one(almost 95% of the time) that get back to her or say sorry to her after these arguments.

 

Just for some peace and quiet. Just to make the punishment of her being silent stop. Again, she's controlling you, forcing you to do something with her abnormal behaviour.

 

she gives me a big lecture(3-4 hours...many times going into 3-4am at night) of how wrong I am even if it was clearly her fault in the first place

 

My crazy lady did this as well, because of course, it was and never will be her fault, so she would resort to simply brainwashing you over and over again with how it is your fault. These hour long 'mature discussions' as she liked to see them, were another form of gaining attention, all the attention on her and what she had to say about you, while never, ever listening to kindly put, rational reminders of her own behaviour.

 

(It doesn’t even get resolved even if I sincerely say sorry to her…it never is that easy).

 

This is important. It will never get resolved. That is the sad thing. You think if I could just do this, or act like that then it will get resolved, but it never, ever will. You can't win.

 

I have spoken to her a couple of times about it but she never seems to understand.

 

She doesn't understand because she is lacking the empathy quotient, because she has mental issues. Normal rational people, while making getting annoyed that they've been critisised usually have the ability to afterwards question 'was I right or wrong there, should I apologise'. People with mental issues lack this ability and so therefore cannot understand where you are coming from. You are dealing with your girlfriend as if she is rational and normal, when she is not. Behaving like a rational human being some of the times and totally irrational at others, is abnormal.

 

We have broken up once before but she wanted to get back together a few days later. After two months I gave in because she treated me so well and seem like she had changed. But after about month of getting back together the arguments started again.

 

I really love her, and I'm hoping she can change! I bet when you met her, she was sweetness and light and then this other side of her emerged only when she knew you'd developed strong feelings for her. When you split up due to her behaviour, she merely repeated that pattern. Behaving the way she should all the time, only initially to again control you, and to control getting you back, and then once she had you back, the bad behaviour resumes. If you do split up with her, do not be lured in by this promise that she has changed, this pattern will only continue over and over again.

 

But I know it’s not as simple as just listening to her.

 

You have listened to her, you have argued with her, you have apologised, you have rationalised, you've listened to how you are always in the wrong over and over again. You've now tried talking to her, but that's not going down well either, because the poor girl is not rational and there is something missing in her mental makeup that makes her incapable of dealing with you as someone without issues would be.

 

we are very happy together when things go well with no arguments.

 

But there will always, always, always be the arguments. Once you recognise that and stop thinking that she's going to change, you will be better able to decide what to do regarding your relationship to her.

 

Go to councelling, you alone to figure out how to deal with her and to see your therapist's take on your relationship. Going together will mean that she controls what you say, how you say it and there will be constant arguments afterwards and you will never be given the space to simply speak to get to the heart of the issue. Please do not even think of marrying her until you've gone to some kind of therapy.

 

Sorry if I'm coming across harshly, no one wants to hear stuff like this about the person they love. However, I've seen too many lives damaged irreprably from this kind of behaviour and I don't want to see another nice, sensitive guy get used and abused and begin to start believing that actually it is all his fault.

 

"Narcissistic Personality Disorder is a long-term pattern of abnormal thinking, feeling, and behavior in many different situations. The traits on this page will seem peculiar or disturbing when someone acts this way -- i.e., you will know that something is not right, and contact with narcissists may make you feel bad about yourself."

 

http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/dsm-iv.html#npd

 

"Borderline Personality Disorder: "Relationships with others are intense but stormy and unstable with marked shifts of feelings and difficulties in maintaining intimate, close connections. The person may manipulate others and often has difficulty with trusting others. There is also emotional instability with marked and frequent shifts to an empty lonely depression or to irritability and anxiety.... The person may show inappropriate and intense anger or rage with temper tantrums, constant brooding and resentment, feelings of deprivation, and a loss of control or fear of loss of control over angry feelings."

 

http://www.stanford.edu/~corelli/borderline.html

 

 

 

[boogieboy]

You guys realize IceCube hasnt been here in 2 over months right?

[meerkat stew]

You guys realize IceCube hasnt been here in 2 over months right?

 

Haha dopus necroed us right in!