Ross PK Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 A fascinating parallel - when BS on here claim that they "would never cheat," they are sometimes told "never say never - you can't predict, you don't know how you will feel or react when presented with a given emotionally intense situation..." or something to that effect. I know you believe the revenge fantasy would somehow take away your pain and make you "feel better," and it's not at all hard to understand why you would feel that way. However, that's such an emotionally twisted time, that I believe there's no way you can predict, in advance, just how that scenario would affect you, and it's such a complex dynamic that I don't believe the probability of a healthy, "feel better" outcome is very much assured. On the other hand, maybe I have to grant that if the depth of one's emotional investment is so shallow that after being hurt by the worst imaginable betrayal one can suffer in a relationship, all it takes to "feel better" is to quickly strike back in-kind, then maybe you've got a point - for a shallow relationship. Whether that's true for "the majority" of relationships out there, I don't know; I don't presume that my opinion is in the majority, but I don't believe that yours is, either. Well, I've never been in a relationship so to be honest I really don't know exactly how it'd feel to cheat back, even if it does make you feel better though, I'm sure you're still going to be in loads of pain, so I'm not saying you'd feel okay afterwards. And to clarify I'm not saying you should cheat back, or that not cheating back is being a doormat (when I was talking about being a doormat I was just thinking about other scenarios where you should stick up for yourself/get revenge, if you can do), I'm just saying there is nothing wrong with cheating back.
realworldexplorer Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I never considered it prior to wifes affair, and would never consider it as a solution to the already horrible mess. I just did as I always would and did nothing to hurt WS. Her remorse and guilt seem like punishment enough. Cheating is a pandoras box of hurtful behaviours that needs to be visited as infrequently as possible. Tempting as revenge might be it always backfires in some way so is best avoided. "He who chooses revenge as an option is in need of digging two graves"
hopeless4u Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I haven't had a chance to read all the posts and maybe I'm speaking out of line but isn't a revenge affair just messing with even more minds. What about the OW/OM that are being dragged into this, Im sure many BS would say we deserve the pain but wouldn't that make the BS as bad as the WS or are you all planning on telling the OW/OM that its just for revenge? I'm not looking to be shot down here, just curious.
soserious1 Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 Couple small problems with your plan.. Your revenge options all involve using a 3rd party as an instrument of revenge, an innocent 3rd party who never did any harm to you. No matter what you do.. there will always come the cold light of day, that minute you look i the mirror and realize that your cheating spouse thought so little of you that they'd risk the entire marriage by cheating. Revenge humiliates you and just delays the pain we need to feel in order to fully recover and reclaim our lives.
NoIDidn't Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 For me, I decided it would probably f*** me up even more than I already was, and I eventually got myself back, and my life back, without having to destroy something else to do it. It wasn't about holding the "I'm superior" card - although I do understand what you are saying about that - it was about not turning myself into a reaction of her bad decisions, but deciding who I wanted to be as an individual on my own terms. I agree. I considered the Revenge Card. In fact, he gave me One year to do it - but said that I couldn't have sex just like he didn't. LOL. I didn't give him permission, but he felt that he could do it to me? I laughed and then started crying. He looked confused until he realized what he was saying. I wouldn't have done it to get back at him. I had no desire to get back at him. We had struggled so much before and during the EA that I would have done anything to feel attractive, loved, and desired again like his AP made him feel. I didn't do it for two reasons: 1.) couldn't control it, and 2)no one deserved to be put in that position by me, I couldn't just use another person like that to get those feelings that just felt wrong. I didn't want a simple roll in the hay for revenge. I wanted the whole shabang. And I knew the whole shabang would compromise the marriage that I wanted to keep. I didn't want to use another person to make myself feel better knowing that I wouldn't be offering them anything of substance. I would be using them, plain and simple. I decided to look inside to feel alive again. I didn't need to get back at him, but I can certainly understand why some would feel that way. Its a matter of principle for some to make sure that the other knows what it felt like. But it wouldn't be the same IMO, unless you got the whole thing.
Lizzie60 Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I don't see anything wrong with cheating back.. BUT... most people who are cheated on .. are so devastated that the last thing on their mind is to even kiss or sleep with another human being.. they are totally disgusted. I've never been cheated on.. (although I told my first ex he could, but he didn't).. anyway... but if I were cheated on .. I think, in my case, NOW (I know I think differently now that I'm older), I would cheat back.. and make sure that he finds out.. just to give him a taste of his own medicine.
eeyore1981 Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 Couple small problems with your plan.. Your revenge options all involve using a 3rd party as an instrument of revenge, an innocent 3rd party who never did any harm to you. No matter what you do.. there will always come the cold light of day, that minute you look i the mirror and realize that your cheating spouse thought so little of you that they'd risk the entire marriage by cheating. Revenge humiliates you and just delays the pain we need to feel in order to fully recover and reclaim our lives. Everyone knows I am married. If some guy wanted to hook up with me, knowing full well I was married, then IMO that doesn't make him all that innocent. I don't even think in my case it would be revenge. I'm not wanting to go out and do something and then rub his face in it. I don't even know if I would ever be able to do it, this is just something I do think about. As far as delaying the pain we need to feel, I don't agree, as I don't think I needed to feel any pain. That implies I deserved to be punished, and I did not. I had a life before my H chose, behind my back, to be with someone else. That life is now gone, and it isn't because of anything horrible I did, it is because of him, his cheating, and all his freaking lies. This isn't some philosophy course, this is real life.
GorillaTheater Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I must admit that I find it somewhat troubling to be on the same side of this debate as Ross and Samsung.
eeyore1981 Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I must admit that I find it somewhat troubling to be on the same side of this debate as Ross and Samsung. :p:p:p That's funny!
bentnotbroken Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I'd feel like I'd have lowered myself and showed no dignity or respect for myself by being a doormat. Not that I'm saying that you'd be a doormat to not cheat on your partner back, but I'm just talking about in general. But keep on thinking that way, if that's what you need to do to make yourself feel better. It's well known that not standing up for yourself lowers your self esteem, confidence, and it makes it hard for people to have as much respect for you. I'm sorry but people like you who have those opinions may be in the majority on here (so I don't even know why I'm bothering arguing), but you're in the minority in the real world. I was in the minority when I was born, so that's not a problem for me. And as far as the respect of others....well, I don't have to look them in the mirror, I do myself and my kids.
NoIDidn't Posted November 25, 2009 Posted November 25, 2009 I must admit that I find it somewhat troubling to be on the same side of this debate as Ross and Samsung. :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
Author samsungxoxo Posted November 26, 2009 Author Posted November 26, 2009 I haven't had a chance to read all the posts and maybe I'm speaking out of line but isn't a revenge affair just messing with even more minds. What about the OW/OM that are being dragged into this, Im sure many BS would say we deserve the pain but wouldn't that make the BS as bad as the WS or are you all planning on telling the OW/OM that its just for revenge? Not really because I would never mess with another woman's b/f or husband. It would be a single guy online that's up to a hook-up and there would not be any emotional attachments whatsoever...
Author samsungxoxo Posted November 26, 2009 Author Posted November 26, 2009 Revenge humiliates you and just delays the pain we need to feel in order to fully recover and reclaim our lives. But for those that decide to work it out with the cheating, all those couple therapies, infidelity books, worrying about them giving you your accounts and emails, bills, etc.... doesn't that also delay the emotional burden too?? All those sessions and extra rules.. another person has to actually be introduce in the therapy sessions for what, one's lousy behavior?? That IMO would be consider waste of time, waste of money... but ok there are some that will take it the long way without evening the score.... As for walking away with your head up but yet still hurt, it still doesn't change the fact that they made a fool out of you when they were stating how much they love/care about you... while they were out looking for outside pleasure. You were the one taken for a fool. Ok so you break up... sort of like saying ''Well you cheat and I'm leaving you''.. but they still took you for a that big fool... while you were so unaware of it, thinking they were just into you, not realizing you have been replaced. Their response can be something like ''Ok leave me all you want to but I used you all along, took you so long to figured out, all that investment you took in me while I was out messing with X...
2.50 a gallon Posted November 26, 2009 Posted November 26, 2009 (edited) In my case there was no lowering of my moral values. The second I caught her cheating the marriage was over. I did not need a piece of paper to tell me I was free. Life is too short and there is no way that I was going to go a year or more without sex, waiting for that piece of paper. Fight fire with fire. I have known of other cases were the BS began their own affair, and the WS came rushing back, as did my XW. Also the OM got off lucky bentbutnotbroken: You mention stealing from the thief who robbed you. Where I grew up, you dare not let any body walk on you. About 10 years after I moved out on my own somebody stole my dads lawn mower. In my youth, I and my circle of friends had a bad rep. In this case I found out who the head punk of the neighborhood was. I paid him a friendly visit, and told him what the problem was, and he should fix it. If not I would come back in a week and pay him another not so friendly visit, and then he could in turn repay the non friendly visit to whom ever stole the mower. The mower came back in four days. My parents lived there another quarter of a century. In the following years every house around my parents were broken into, some more than once. But never my parents. Some times you have to fight fire with fire. Edited November 26, 2009 by 2.50 a gallon
bentnotbroken Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 In my case there was no lowering of my moral values. The second I caught her cheating the marriage was over. I did not need a piece of paper to tell me I was free. Life is too short and there is no way that I was going to go a year or more without sex, waiting for that piece of paper. Fight fire with fire. I have known of other cases were the BS began their own affair, and the WS came rushing back, as did my XW. Also the OM got off lucky bentbutnotbroken: You mention stealing from the thief who robbed you. Where I grew up, you dare not let any body walk on you. About 10 years after I moved out on my own somebody stole my dads lawn mower. In my youth, I and my circle of friends had a bad rep. In this case I found out who the head punk of the neighborhood was. I paid him a friendly visit, and told him what the problem was, and he should fix it. If not I would come back in a week and pay him another not so friendly visit, and then he could in turn repay the non friendly visit to whom ever stole the mower. The mower came back in four days. My parents lived there another quarter of a century. In the following years every house around my parents were broken into, some more than once. But never my parents. Some times you have to fight fire with fire. I completely agree that sometimes you do. Cheating isn't one of them for me, nor stealing. Now my children and parent are a different story. "F" with them, and whatever you get from me would only be a portion of what I have dreamed of doing to you.
Ross PK Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 (edited) I completely agree that sometimes you do. Cheating isn't one of them for me, nor stealing. Now my children and parent are a different story. "F" with them, and whatever you get from me would only be a portion of what I have dreamed of doing to you. That is totally hypocrytical. To you if anyone get's revenge they've lowered their personal standards, they're showing no dignity and respect for theirself, it would hurt their family and thier reputation, and they deserve to be spoken down to. But if you get revenge under your standards, that's okay. Edited November 29, 2009 by Ross PK
bentnotbroken Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 That is totally hypocrytical. To you if anyone get's revenge they've lowered their personal standards, they're showing no dignity and respect for theirself, it would hurt their family and thier reputation, and they deserve to be spoken down to. But if you get revenge under your standards, that's okay. I said cheating. It isn't a weakness for me. My anger is. Nothing hypocritical about saying that I wouldn't lower my standards for a cheater by doing the same thing. Would I go after someone who hurt my kids or parent. You betcha and I would expect God to do what he must to deal with me taking matters into my own hand instead of waiting for him to deal with it. The OP question had to do with cheating....is this not correct? I never said anyone deserved to be spoken down to in any of my post. I don't know what you are smoking, but get a grip.
Ross PK Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 (edited) I said cheating. It isn't a weakness for me. My anger is. Nothing hypocritical about saying that I wouldn't lower my standards for a cheater by doing the same thing. Would I go after someone who hurt my kids or parent. You betcha and I would expect God to do what he must to deal with me taking matters into my own hand instead of waiting for him to deal with it. The OP question had to do with cheating....is this not correct? I never said anyone deserved to be spoken down to in any of my post. I don't know what you are smoking, but get a grip. You are being hypocritial, you think it's wrong for someone to get a cheater back by cheating on them, or to steal something from someone who steals from you, yet you're now saying there'd be hell to pay if anyone ever touched your kids and you'd go after them. It seems more like it's you who needs to get a grip as you obviously don't know what you're talking about. Anyway, some people in this topic have been quite condescending, and I guess I assumed you were probably being the same. Edited November 29, 2009 by Ross PK
ADF Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 The best thing is just not to take the cheater back. Op, what you describe is not a way to lay the groundwork for a happy, healthy relationship. It is a way to lay the groundwork for a nasty, suspicious, hostile relationship. Don't take the cheater. Move on.
Ross PK Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 The best thing is just not to take the cheater back. Op, what you describe is not a way to lay the groundwork for a happy, healthy relationship. It is a way to lay the groundwork for a nasty, suspicious, hostile relationship. Don't take the cheater. Move on. Careful, some people on here might not like the fact that the cheater could be hurt by not being taken back.
bentnotbroken Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 You are being hypocritial, you think it's wrong for someone to get a cheater back by cheating on them, or to steal something from someone who steals from you, yet you're now saying there'd be hell to pay if anyone ever touched your kids and you'd go after them. It seems more like it's you who needs to get a grip as you obviously don't know what you're talking about. Anyway, some people in this topic have been quite condescending, and I guess I assumed you were probably being the same. I have a grip. I am flesh and blood, I live in the real world. I have weaknesses just like the next person. I think it would be wrong for me to beat the hell out of someone who messes with my family. Let me rephrase that...."I KNOW " it would be wrong to pay someone back for injuring my family. I would be prepared to take whatever God had to do to me. Vengeance is HIS. I know exactly what I am talking about. I don't operate in your mindset, I don't need to. I am not someone who says something I don't mean. Your assumptions about other people and how they view the world is indeed your problem, not mine. You came after me, for whatever reason, that's good. I am a big girl, but make no mistake, my feelings on the subject will not change. Our ideas on what is right and wrong are different and from the vehemence that you put behind response to a post that wasn't directed at you, tells me that you are as happy and comfortable with your opinion as I am mine. So I would say this has been laid to rest for me.
ADF Posted November 29, 2009 Posted November 29, 2009 Careful, some people on here might not like the fact that the cheater could be hurt by not being taken back. Well, what I would say to those people is that second chances are a gift. People who cheat don't deserve second chances as a matter of right. If you cheat on someone and they are willing to work through it, that is generous of them.
Author samsungxoxo Posted November 30, 2009 Author Posted November 30, 2009 (edited) If you cheat on someone and they are willing to work through it, that is generous of them. Please, I would call that stupidity and immaturity IMO. Like I recall another poster either from here or elsewhere stated, there is nothing adult or mature about forgiving and accepting getting treated like garbage. And if you got children, then you're setting a bad example for them. You're teaching them that it's ok to tolerate being treated with such disrespect. They will grow up and won't function good with relationships as a result... By just deciding to work it out, that I see as actually lowering yourself. It's sort of like telling to yourself ''This is the way a relationship is like, I have to accept this poor treatment without any retribution in return''. In this case the cheater is the winner, he got away with it while you're still sorting out your ''victimhood'' stage as well as still do an effort in helping them out. By going to worthless couple counseling sessions, buying books on infidelity, etc. you're in a way helping the cheater. It's not just the cheater doing the work but you too, no fair... Edited November 30, 2009 by samsungxoxo
ADF Posted November 30, 2009 Posted November 30, 2009 Please, I would call that stupidity and immaturity IMO. Like I recall another poster either from here or elsewhere stated, there is nothing adult or mature about forgiving and accepting getting treated like garbage. And if you got children, then you're setting a bad example for them. You're teaching them that it's ok to tolerate being treated with such disrespect. They will grow up and won't function good with relationships as a result... By just deciding to work it out, that I see as actually lowering yourself. It's sort of like telling to yourself ''This is the way a relationship is like, I have to accept this poor treatment without any retribution in return''. In this case the cheater is the winner, he got away with it while you're still sorting out your ''victimhood'' stage as well as still do an effort in helping them out. By going to worthless couple counseling sessions, buying books on infidelity, etc. you're in a way helping the cheater. It's not just the cheater doing the work but you too, no fair... I agree with everything you've said. I would never take a cheater back. I just meant that cheaters shouldn't act like they have a right at a second chance. They don't.
bentnotbroken Posted November 30, 2009 Posted November 30, 2009 I agree with everything you've said. I would never take a cheater back. I just meant that cheaters shouldn't act like they have a right at a second chance. They don't. They sure in the hell don't. That choice should be solely the BS. If they want to stay.
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