KM366 Posted November 23, 2009 Posted November 23, 2009 Hello, I hope to keep this post as brief as I can but I'm afraid there are so many issues that it may take a bit to explain. I've been with my boyfriend for a couple years now and we've been essentially living together for the past 7 months or so (I have never officially moved in though). When we first met we were both just out of failed long-term relationships. Things were great then - we talked all the time, spent ever spare minute together and the sex was terrific. I couldn't believe my luck – he was interesting, good looking, good job and he seemed really into me (emotionally and physically). Strangely he told me early on that I might not be happy because of how he was – that he could be self-centered, unsympathetic and inconsiderate and that he wasn't into things like giving gifts and romantic gestures. I didn't really see any of what he was talking about. As time passed it started coming up though – he'd go along on unimportant things but overall everything needed to be his way, he was very protective of his stuff, not particularly trusting, almost everything needed to be his plan/his schedule and the no gift part was true too. This sounds really awful but he also wasn't possessive, mean or jealous and he didn't tell me what to do/influence my own business. His rule only extended to his own domain – his own time/person. Also, he may not have given gifts but he wasn't necessarily cheap. He'd pick up costs for meals, entertainment, etc. After about a year I started to first be concerned though that he hadn't told me he loved me. I knew he'd been hurt in the past and that he wasn't the emotional, touchy-feely type but I still thought after so much time together and how well it seemed like we got along that love might come up but it didn't. In fact, as time passed he seemed to be even less touchy-feely. He'd been very affectionate when we first started seeing each other (even in public) but after a year together he was much less exuberant. I tried to talk to him about it and it didn't go well. Turned out that trying to communicate about relationship issues fell into a category of requiring something from him (a response, his feelings, etc.) – it was me putting an emotional demand on him and he bristled. I told him I wasn't trying to force his hand or make him tell me anything he didn't want to - that I hoped he'd just talk to me about how he felt but he acted like I was attacking him. It really hurt to reach out and have him go cold and pull away. Soon after this I found out that I was very sick. He came to my side for tests and was supportive in general but when I tried to reach out again emotionally (how did he feel about my being sick? Could he get past my being scarred from surgery?) he again pulled away angry and cold. This time it hurt even more – when you may be dying all you want is the one you love to hold you and tell you everything will be okay but I didn't get that. I like to think that he was afraid too and that was why he acted the way he did – particularly since he was there, and supportive, for me through all the surgeries (and more) that I had to have. Unfortunately a year later and I still have no idea how really feels. Now it isn't just emotional but physical too. Right after I'd recovered from my last surgery we tried to have sex and he ended up stopping. I'm not sure if it's because I'm scarred or something else. I do remember when we first had sex he said something about it having been a long time (but I figured that happens sometimes at the end of troubled relationships). Whatever the reason he doesn't do more than kiss me hello and goodbye now (but he'll be sweet about that – like he cares). Where I am now is that I don't know what to do. I love him and enjoy being with him but I'm hurt and confused much of the time. I can only figure out that he wants me there to keep him company and doesn't want to have to go out and find someone new. I'm afraid to kid myself that if could be anything more than that. It seems that if he loved me he'd either tell me and/or show me. That he'd want to touch me. I tell myself all the time that if he doesn't love me then I should leave but I love him so much and wonder if anything could maybe change one day. I'm in my 40s and know how hard it is to find someone (particularly when you've been sick) – I wonder if I shouldn't just count myself lucky for having someone who cares about me at least a little and that I enjoy being around (and he's still fun and interesting). It's only really difficult during those times I reach out to him only to be brushed aside. I've asked him if we could talk about us and he puts me off or starts to get angry so I don't even think communication is an option. I'm posting here in the hope that someone might see something that I don't – particularly any of the guys. Maybe someone will have some idea that I haven't thought of. For me right now I just take it day by day – always thinking that it could be our last day together. I'm very tired all the time. It's very draining to love someone and be around them all the time and reminding yourself "he doesn't love me". I'm pretty down on myself because of it – you know, what's wrong with me? Why am I not good enough for him to love? I wonder all the time – what is worse, to not be with the one you love or to be with them but they don't love you back.
JaneDoe35 Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 Have you advised him that you are considering leaving this relationship because of your confusion & sadness? I think it would be almost impossible to live like this. You are not going to just walk away which I admire. But you will have to do something. You sound so down.
Author KM366 Posted November 24, 2009 Author Posted November 24, 2009 I haven't told him since he is so adverse to my bringing up anything relationship related. I feel though like he's making every effort to discourage me since he goes out of his way to not show any affection other than a kiss hello and goodbye (which oddly enough he makes a real point about - if I go to leave without kissing him he will say something). There have been a couple times I've got so frustrated and upset with how he acts that I've sort of pulled away from him and I've noticed he's responded by doing something for me or being a little nicer. This makes me think that he must not really want me to just go. All I can figure is that he wants me to be there (for company or housekeeping) but he doesn't want to make any effort at all. He's perfectly happy with everything being completely one-sided. I just can't imagine that he could be in love with me if he never says anything about it and doesn't try to touch me. I don't think he's happy either, he seems pretty down a lot of the time (but he just isn't an up-beat kind of person really). If he doesn't love me or want me I shouldn't be with him.
2sure Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 He probably does love you. Still , his love, what he gives and what he withholds...leaves you unfulfilled, unsatisfied, insecure, and unhappy. It isnt supposed to be that way. Are you lucky? Should you be accepting (which is way different than settling)...thats a tough call but one thing comes out strongly in your post: Your relationship is precarious in that , as you say, you have been living together 7 months but its not official. Its sounds like real commitment is being put off with an excuse about leases, mortgages, or something. Excuses. Your relationship has not been so long that it would withstand the crisis of illness easily. The history just isnt there. What is most worrying is that he is for whatever reason - not only unable but absolutely unwilling to communicate. I'm your age. We both know this lack of communication is a great big giant red flag. Stop second guessing yourself. At the least, if you are financially able - move out. Officially. Both he and you need to come to a turning point. Maybe he can, maybe he cant...but its time.
Author KM366 Posted November 24, 2009 Author Posted November 24, 2009 I think I'm going to have to make at least one more attempt at talking with him about everything. I don't want to say "talk to me about this or I'm leaving" because I don't like the idea of an "or else" scenario. Not only that but if we talk and he admits to not having the right feelings for me I'll probably leave (I suspect that could be one reason he doesn't want to talk - he knows what the outcome would be). Any ideas on what I should respond with when I say I want to talk and he tells me he doesn't feel like it or doesn't want to?? It's just so hard because the minute I start I know there will be this dark cloud that comes down over him...
Author KM366 Posted November 25, 2009 Author Posted November 25, 2009 Well I started to talk to say something last night and realized I don't even know where to begin. Somehow it just seemed ridiculous to say something like, "hey, do you love me or what? and by the way, what's up with the whole no sex thing?" Surely there has to be a tactful way to do this? I wonder if I should tell him that I love him and see where that goes? I have intentionally not actually said the words to him because 1. I think it's best that he said it first and 2. I don't think he wants me to. Even though I've never said the words I've essentially told him before though. If anyone has any ideas it would be a huge help. I've been in a good amount of pain about this for a long time now and I just don't know how much more I can take.
Author KM366 Posted November 30, 2009 Author Posted November 30, 2009 Well I did end up moving out over the weekend. I tried to talk to him - told him that if he didn't want me to be there then I didn't want to be there, that it didn't make any sense - and he definitely didn't want to talk but admitted that he didn't want a real living together situation. It took me over a day to get all my stuff together and leave. During that time he acted normal and I get the feeling that he expects everything to go back to like it was. I just don't see how or why though. I love him and so of course want to be with him but why when he doesn't appear to love or be attracted to me? Should I give it some time to see if my moving out makes any difference (and things improve) or does that seem hopeless and I should just save myself any further pain?
WalkInThePark Posted November 30, 2009 Posted November 30, 2009 I'm sorry that you have to go through this situation. I think you should give up on him. It seems to me that he has some problem with emotional intimacy. Guys are known not to like to talk about relationships as much as women do. Still a guy who wants to be with a woman should be prepared to do at least an effort. We all have flaws but it is important that you try to take a step in the direction of your partner. I have the feeling that this guy is very much "I am the way I am and I have no intention to change for someone else". That is a remedy against love. I know it is hard to leave a relationship if you are in your forties (I am there as well) because it is so hard to find someone good and normal. But a relationship should make you in general happy and not frustrated most of the time.
lboogie1118 Posted November 30, 2009 Posted November 30, 2009 you need to walk away, and its going to hurt. you deserve better and he is not taking care of you the way you deserve. there are so many fish in the sea....you will find the right one
Author KM366 Posted November 30, 2009 Author Posted November 30, 2009 It is very depressing. He is so good in so many other ways... What I just can't understand is why he stays with me. If he doesn't love me and isn't attracted to me why doesn't he try to find another girlfriend? Are there guys out there that only want a companion and maybe the other stuff isn't important (although he is getting love - just not returning it) - even sex?
WalkInThePark Posted December 1, 2009 Posted December 1, 2009 It is very depressing. He is so good in so many other ways... What I just can't understand is why he stays with me. If he doesn't love me and isn't attracted to me why doesn't he try to find another girlfriend? Are there guys out there that only want a companion and maybe the other stuff isn't important (although he is getting love - just not returning it) - even sex? I think that he - like a lot of men - does not like to be alone and you most probably are a good, attentive partner. If the relationship stops, he will be on his own again and will have to look for another partner. Too much hassle in the eyes of this man. What he does not get, is that a relationship is a reciprocal thing where you not only take but also give. This guy wants you to be together but it has to be on his own terms. As a result you are forced to ignore your needs. That's a recipe for unhappiness. I would tell him that you don't want to have a relationship like the one you have, that you want more. Maybe that will wake him up but don't go back to him unless he does serious efforts. I think he should see a therapist because it sounds to me that he has a serious problem with intimacy.
Tethys Posted December 1, 2009 Posted December 1, 2009 It is very depressing. He is so good in so many other ways... What I just can't understand is why he stays with me. If he doesn't love me and isn't attracted to me why doesn't he try to find another girlfriend? Are there guys out there that only want a companion and maybe the other stuff isn't important (although he is getting love - just not returning it) - even sex? Unfortunately I feel like I've acted very similarly to your boyfriend in many of my relationships. I often stayed in relationships despite not knowing how I felt--usually pretty indifferent. And I would often be asked how I really felt by the girl I was dating, but wouldn't be able to say (and wouldn't get angry, but would get really anxious about not having an answer, would be very vague, and then would feel guilty for not feeling more love towards them when they were obviously in love with me). There have to be thousands, if not millions, of men out there that need to learn how to get in touch with their emotions and be real men/adults (ie honest, deliberate, etc) about their relationships, including me.
Author KM366 Posted December 1, 2009 Author Posted December 1, 2009 Well I didn't hear from him at all yesterday. Not a call, not an email, not a text - nothing since I left Sunday with all my things. If I didn't know him as well as I do I'd figure there's no need to worry about what to say to him because we're already over. However I'm certain that either tonight or sometime this week I'll hear from him and he'll act perfectly normal, like nothing has happened. I'm wondering - has anyone out there ever realized (too late) that they really did love someone that they pushed away? If so, did you get them to come back - for it to work out or only to have your love vanish again? Just curious if anyone has had that experience...
2sure Posted December 1, 2009 Posted December 1, 2009 [QUOTE=KM366;2514783]Well I didn't hear from him at all yesterday. Not a call, not an email, not a text - nothing since I left Sunday with all my things.....However I'm certain that either tonight or sometime this week I'll hear from him and he'll act perfectly normal, like nothing has happened. " See, thats just it. Something DID happen. Something traumatic, something big. A turning point. But to him, its NOTHING. Its NORMAL. You have not pushed him away, you left because he was already away. "Away" may be the only mode he has...and it is not enough for normal healthy people. Not enough for you, even if you love him and miss him..this is not the stuff a life long relationship is made of.
Author KM366 Posted December 3, 2009 Author Posted December 3, 2009 So, wow, even after all I've gone through so far with this man I'm still a little surprised. I've heard nothing from him at all since Sunday (the last thing we talked about when I left was mabye getting together sometime this week with a friend of his so it isn't like I left under a cloud). I guess he's decided he doesn't even want to do me the courtesy of an official break-up - just an "if I never talk to her again I guess she'll get the message that we're done." It's just so unbelievably insulting considering how easy going I was about everything... All the time we've spent together and I don't even rate a legitimate goodbye.
Author KM366 Posted December 4, 2009 Author Posted December 4, 2009 Well I'm stumped. I guess this falls into the what-is-he-thinking category... I've spent the past week in agony. I mean really hurting - if I'm awake I'm trying not to cry or crying. It's just been incredibly painful that he wouldn't even bother to try to call me or anything all week. He knows how much it hurt me when he told me he didn't want me staying with him anymore and how he said he didn't want to say how he felt because it would hurt me (which saying that is going to hurt because you know what they aren't saying). So I just got an email from him wondering why he hasn't heard from me since Sunday. He isn't stupid. Is this his way of manipulating me? Making me hurt even more so that he can make sure I stay in line and don't trouble him with things like emotions and affection?
You Go Girl Posted December 5, 2009 Posted December 5, 2009 Well I'm stumped. I guess this falls into the what-is-he-thinking category... I've spent the past week in agony. I mean really hurting - if I'm awake I'm trying not to cry or crying. It's just been incredibly painful that he wouldn't even bother to try to call me or anything all week. He knows how much it hurt me when he told me he didn't want me staying with him anymore and how he said he didn't want to say how he felt because it would hurt me (which saying that is going to hurt because you know what they aren't saying). So I just got an email from him wondering why he hasn't heard from me since Sunday. He isn't stupid. Is this his way of manipulating me? Making me hurt even more so that he can make sure I stay in line and don't trouble him with things like emotions and affection? He's a classic example of the emotionally unavailable. Read up on it! He views needs to talk, discuss the relationship, say I love you, etc., as needy people. For the first year, you weren't needy in his eyes because you were going along with his map of how he wanted a relationship to be. He starting viewing you as needy the second you asked a question about the relationship. Questions are a big no-no in the emotionally unavailable types. You will not get anymore from this person than you already have. Either you play by his rules, or you leave. As for the email, yes, he's a manipulator, but doesn't even know it. He's curious. He still has emotions, even though he has a wall built up around protecting them that is made of steel. Some of his emotions right now are--is she thinking of me? does she not need me? will she play by my rules? has the separation taught her to not mess with my rules? has she replaced me, or has she had few or no emotions this past week about me, thereby being perhaps a perfect match for me, as also not the type to need another? He was hurt a long time ago, and he's never going to allow anyone to hurt him again. That's why the wall.
Samantha0905 Posted December 5, 2009 Posted December 5, 2009 He sounds pretty effortless. You obviously aren't interested in effortless, so move on to someone else. I know it hurts, but he has his own issues with which to deal. Don't turn it around on yourself.
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