Prayers are ALWAYS answered!

[Malenfant]

By the way, you can't attempt to prove prayers don't work by using a study like that, anyong who thinks that is a moron

 

then what was the point of the study in the first place?

 

i thought the whole reason the study was done was to ascertain whether or not praying for another person works, and generally, it showed that it didnt.

 

it didnt determine anything about self prayer, but that would be pointless because with self prayer you've got to take mind over matter into consideration and this study wasnt looking at that, it was looking into prayer influencing divine intervention.

 

so if we're not allowed to use a scientific study as an argument, what are we allowed to use?

 

BTW calling people morons just because you dont like how they percieve things actually just makes you look ignorant and intollerant. theres no need to insult people and it doesnt make your argument any more credible.

[northstar1]

Lol well gosh, if the NY Times reported it, it must be a perfect argument.

 

I know eh? The studies reported at beliefnet and xenos christian fellowship are undoubtedly much more convincing and bias neutral!

[Eve]

I think it would be GREAT to test the attitude of those in prayer and then link it to Scripture/The Holy Spirit. I think the results would be highly telling. I wonder how many would be open enough to divulge such an intimate process?

 

I am truly, truly, truly interested.

 

I wonder how many would go beyond, 'I wanted this job and didnt get it', or 'I wanted this girl/guy (or both) and didnt get them'... or 'I asked god (really God) something specific and nothing happened'

 

I would absolutely LOVE to hear these stories. If nothing I would like to match them to the reality known in terms of what has been TRULY sought and left behind. Yep, in other words, I do think those who leave the Christian faith are lazy or self satisfied and stand as reasons/examples to stand in faith!..

 

Take care

Eve xx

[RA1]

An aquaintance of mine told me how he lacked the money to go on a trip but he trusted that the Lord would provide. Then his car was involved in an accident and he was paid more than was needed to fix his car by the exact same amount he needed for his trip. He said it was a miracle! He didn't see anything amiss with God participating in insurance fraud.

[Trimmer]

An aquaintance of mine told me how he lacked the money to go on a trip but he trusted that the Lord would provide. Then his car was involved in an accident and he was paid more than was needed to fix his car by the exact same amount he needed for his trip. He said it was a miracle! He didn't see anything amiss with God participating in insurance fraud.

ROFL!!

 

Gives a whole new texture to that auto insurance commercial where the deep-voiced narrator says, "You're in good hands...."

[disgracian]

He was probably lying through his front teeth too.

 

Cheers,

D.

[LucreziaBorgia]

I dunno, I'm a little burned on the praying thing. I prayed every day for my baby, and he died inside me anyway. A part of me died that night in the ER as well.

 

I had to revisit this thread. I took a pregnancy test last night after having a few days of being intensely sensitive to smell and it was positive. This time I have a much, much better chance at carrying to term, and with the right person this time.

 

I'm not saying anything one way or the other in terms of this thread and how I feel about prayer, but let's just say that when I saw that + pop up in that window this thread crossed my mind.

[theBrokenMuse]

Usually there are three outcomes:

 

1. Yes

2. No

3. Not yet

 

In His Infinite wisdom, and our finite minds can not comprehend His logic.

 

Only one thing is certain....all things happen according to His will.

 

Leaving things up to chance causes those same exact outcomes (which are really the only outcomes possible YES, NO OR WAIT) to happen in the same frequency. The only way to show prayer actually works is if people that were praying to one particular entity were to get the outcomes they desired more often then a person relying on chance or luck but that obviously is not the case or this thread wouldn't even exist.

[theBrokenMuse]

Yep, in other words, I do think those who leave the Christian faith are lazy or self satisfied and stand as reasons/examples to stand in faith!..

 

Take care

Eve xx

 

Um, no. Not everyone who leaves Christianity does so for the same reasons. Some of us come to feel that it's painfully obviously man made. I almost find it amusing that you think those of us that are ex-Christians who are of the skeptical atheistic variety to be intellectually lazy when it's the constant search for answers that led many away from Christianity to begin with. Intellectually lazy people tend not to search for any type of truth to begin with, just wallow in their content ignorance of the universe without ever so much as questioning a thing about what they are told.

[ADF]

Sorry, Tony, but the fact is you are a "religious nut," as you put it.

[Eve]

Um, no. Not everyone who leaves Christianity does so for the same reasons. Some of us come to feel that it's painfully obviously man made. I almost find it amusing that you think those of us that are ex-Christians who are of the skeptical atheistic variety to be intellectually lazy when it's the constant search for answers that led many away from Christianity to begin with. Intellectually lazy people tend not to search for any type of truth to begin with, just wallow in their content ignorance of the universe without ever so much as questioning a thing about what they are told.

 

Maybe I have met few of this variety? In fact, none. As I said, I do find it interesting that certain attitudes guarantee a lack of continuity with matters of faith. I do find it baffling why people argue against such an obvious point; In life, if you dont study, you wont qualify. There is no other option and one cannot be created. As such, I did ponder greatly this correlation in the early part of the development of my faith and I am glad that I continued with the little faith I had. Hence I do lean towards seeing Scripture as also able to directly reveal much when aligned to those who leave prayer and the faith. Absolutely so, in every instance.

 

So yes, this stands to me as a warning more than anything else because by and large those who I have observed (and in observing myself) I see a form of navel gazing that takes the place of prayer when faith is left, which in effect becomes like a form of undirected prayer, subconscious to subconscious to others.

 

 

Please understand that this does not mean that I believe that a person need have a well defined level of faith in order to believe that prayers are answered. Rather, I have come to the conclusion that true faith is believing (and living) like our prayers have been answered in a greater way rather than the individualised form. This is where one can meet with God in ways greater than I can express and is not limited to or by Scripture.

 

Anyhow thanks for not taking offence. I regretted the part about saying people can end up lazy and self satisfied, although I do believe it. At the end of the day I believe one can only meditate on the cautions and revelations for themselves and pray strength to allieviate it and not become consumed by its presence in others.

 

Therefore the stand point I am taking is that we are the uniquivocal evidence in regard to answered and unanswered prayer. Easily told within about two paragraphs methinks.

 

 

Take care,

Eve xx

[Moai]

When you pray you are talking to yourself. That is why the outcomes to prayer are the same as we would expect by chance.

 

Consider the family that has all of their things destroyed in a tornado, but survive. Nobody else on their block lived. Clearly, they say, it was an answer to their prayers. Yet their neighbors, as ardent believers as they, died. Their children died. Their infants died.

 

Imagine the blind person in New Orleans during Katrina, praying for someone to come and show them the way to safety, while the flood waters rose and drowned them. Or the old people, huddling in their attics, praying with all their might to be rescued or have the flood waters recede, all for naught.

 

These prayers, very serious and sincere prayers, I may add, were ignored. Yet, when one studies AND prays to pass a test and does, that is proof that prayer works.

 

Beyond that, if prayer is real, why not pray for whatever you want? Why is one prayer "trivial" and another not? To make that distinction are you not speaking for god--and one of the rationales for god answering prayer is that we cannot know his plans or his mind on certain matters? If prayer is real, it would be insane not to pray for everything you can think of.

 

There has never been a scientifically verifiable miracle, ever. Miracles, by definition, are impossible, as to be truly miraculous they would have to have occurred in spite of the laws of physics/chemistry etc. And this has not happened, nor will it ever happen. Too often, a new scientific breakthrough occurs and someone is saved and "it's a miracle!" but in reality it is men and women working hard to figure things out, and they got something right in a really big way.

 

Why do all believers, regardless of god worshiped, claim prayers are answered? If there is only one god, and the one you picked is it, why is he/she/it answering all these prayers for people who aren't even praying to him/her/it?

 

Children die every day from leukemia. They pray. Their parents pray. But a believer scores a touchdown and obviously that is proof that god blesses us and is good. There is an inherent incongruity there. That implies that god cares little for dying children, but cares deeply about the outcome of football games and the accumulated stats of those who believe in him.

 

To some who think it is wrong to be critical of such prayer statements: there are people who forego medical treatment because of prayer. A child in Atlanta was beaten and stuffed in a chest where he suffocated because of prayer. A Christian man in Nigeria threw acid in his own 9 year-old's face because of prayer. A child in Oregon was denied life-saving medicine and died because of prayer. For all that "faith" makes people feel better, IT KILLS PEOPLE.

 

Since the OP has claimed that his prayers are always answered: Why have you not prayed for an end to malaria? Certainly that is not a "trivial" prayer. Millions of people, mainly children, would be saved if malaria were eradicated. Surely you can work in a few moments in your next prayer session and ask for this, since you are on the fast-track and all.

 

I am sure others have prayed for an end to malaria--especially those families whose children have contracted it. Why does it still exist? If the answer is "No", why? Does god love the Plasmodium parasite more than human children? If it is "not yet" what is god waiting for? Already more people have died from malaria than every war that has ever happened on Earth COMBINED. 300 million in the 20th century alone. If there are prayers that are too small, are there also prayers that are too big?

Edited December 29, 2009 by Moai

[Rooster_DAR]

This reminds me of the idea of looking from a single point of view or advantage point.

 

From us living living on Earth, we can feel that we are somehow very special in the universe and were put here by some higher power. However, from the vantage point of the evolution of the universe which took many billions of years, the probability of life evolving over that enormous time span and with all the elements of life available was inevitable.

 

Cheers,

[Eve]

There has never been a scientifically verifiable miracle, ever. Miracles, by definition, are impossible, as to be truly miraculous they would have to have occurred in spite of the laws of physics/chemistry etc. And this has not happened, nor will it ever happen. Too often, a new scientific breakthrough occurs and someone is saved and "it's a miracle!" but in reality it is men and women working hard to figure things out, and they got something right in a really big way.

 

 

What explanation could be given for miracle? The fact that it is a miracle is a statement of its unexplainablility, is it not? In this sense, even the story in the link below can only be accepted by this thing called faith and answered prayer. The Doctors dont know why the man recovered. They could not help the man..

 

Thats it really. There are so may miracles, large and small that occur daily and throughout the ages but if you dont want to know, you dont want to know. You are what you put your energy into.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/6521361/Is-Jack-Sullivan-proof-that-miracles-really-can-happen.html ... but yeah, maybe this guy should have asked for the cure for malaria while he was at it though.. silly man!

 

Anyhow, I dont know how you missed all the medically recorded stuff via those Catholics. There are SO many recorded miracles! Where have you been? .. but you are a clever man, I am sure that you can find whatever you want. I just dont get why instead of trying to disregard faith, just say that you prefer other explanations..

 

There is no inbetween. Those who are interested in looking at aspects of prayer being answered/faith for themselves will do, those who are not interested will not do so beyond idiosyncratic musings... because it is actually impossible for them to do anything else. Those sorts of breakthroughs are often regarded as miracles too.

 

BTW, no animosity here from me. I realise that you are harmless and only speaking about your own interests.

 

I am a big fan of miracles because I am one!

 

Take care,

Eve xx

[Rooster_DAR]

What explanation could be given for miracle? The fact that it is a miracle is a statement of its unexplainablility, is it not? In this sense, even the story in the link below can only be accepted by this thing called faith and answered prayer. The Doctors dont know why the man recovered. They could not help the man..

 

Thats it really. There are so may miracles, large and small that occur daily and throughout the ages but if you dont want to know, you dont want to know. You are what you put your energy into.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/6521361/Is-Jack-Sullivan-proof-that-miracles-really-can-happen.html ... but yeah, maybe this guy should have asked for the cure for malaria while he was at it though.. silly man!

 

Anyhow, I dont know how you missed all the medically recorded stuff via those Catholics. There are SO many recorded miracles! Where have you been? .. but you are a clever man, I am sure that you can find whatever you want. I just dont get why instead of trying to disregard faith, just say that you prefer other explanations..

 

There is no inbetween. Those who are interested in looking at aspects of prayer being answered/faith for themselves will do, those who are not interested will not do so beyond idiosyncratic musings... because it is actually impossible for them to do anything else. Those sorts of breakthroughs are often regarded as miracles too.

 

BTW, no animosity here from me. I realise that you are harmless and only speaking about your own interests.

 

I am a big fan of miracles because I am one!

 

Take care,

Eve xx

 

There are things you could call miraculous, but are they really miracles? Many things happen like this sporadically, that doesn't make them some divine miracle. Life if very complex, sometimes things work in favor of the recipient, sometimes they don't.

 

It's not a matter of being skeptical either, it's just a intelligent deduction. For each seemingly miraculous event that takes place, there an exponential amount of tragedies that go unanswered.

 

I doubt MOAI would even respond to your post, there is just no intelligent argument there.

 

Cheers!

[Eve]

I doubt MOAI would even respond to your post, there is just no intelligent argument there.

 

Cheers!

 

 

How rude are you?

 

 

I will take it that no medical aspect is also viable.

 

Fair enough

 

Cheerio.

Eve xx

[Rooster_DAR]

I wasn't saying you weren't intelligent, I was just stating the explanation you gave just would not provide a good counterpoint. After re-reading it did sound rude, my apologies.

 

Regards,

[e.clipse]

An aquaintance of mine told me how he lacked the money to go on a trip but he trusted that the Lord would provide. Then his car was involved in an accident and he was paid more than was needed to fix his car by the exact same amount he needed for his trip. He said it was a miracle! He didn't see anything amiss with God participating in insurance fraud.

 

was he involved in the accident? if he was, he could have been injured and entered treatment. this would have caused the liable insurance to pay for special damages and general damages, not just reimburse him for his property damage.

 

just a thought.

 

anyway, as far as miracles go, i don't believe they exist. the theory, however, is inspirational. i just with that the more religious people had better answers...you know, more logical answers.

[Moose]

So what purpose does it serve to ask for anything from Him?

 

I get the idea of prayer as a way of meditating, communing with God, but from everything I'm seeing here, and on the topic of asking and answering, it seems there is general agreement that He will do what He will, in His time. I'm wondering what effect asking is expected to have?

Allow me to expand if you will....

 

There are "believers" and "followers"....

 

Alot of people "believe" in Christianity, and there are those that not only, "believe" they also "follow" Christianity....or should I say Christ Himself...

 

IF you are a follower EVERY prayer will be anserwed, AND the Holy Spirit reveals these answers whether it be a no, yes, or even not now.

 

THEN....(when and if you're still in God's will), most of the time the outcome of His Wisdom is never beyond our understanding, even as finite as we all are.

[ToBeFair]

IF you are a follower EVERY prayer will be anserwed, AND the Holy Spirit reveals these answers whether it be a no, yes, or even not now.

 

As many people have already said, this doesn't stack up. There are many followers (why would an omnipotent god imbibe free will and intellect in his creations then want them to blindly follow him like sheep ?) who have prayed for the poor of the world to be fed, prayed for justice, prayed for fairness, yet day in day out the poor starve, a painfull death, justice remains elusive, the inocent suffer, and the bad prosper. Sureley a god who answers the individual prayers of some 'nice' christian people and crushes the innocents mercilesly isn't a nice god??

[Moose]

Sureley a god who answers the individual prayers of some 'nice' christian people and crushes the innocents mercilesly isn't a nice god??

Never did I say that, "nice Christians" aren't crushed or suffer from their own prayers.

 

In fact, I'm a living testimony to the fact that many of my prayers, (as a follower) has cost me a great deal... not only emotionally, but financially and physically.

 

HOWEVER, because of this, I have learned a GREAT deal of God's Soverience.

[ToBeFair]

Okey dokey. Let's start at the start then. The OP states that God (god?) answers all prayers, so to keep it on topic lets do the usual thing and discuss the existence of god. When I was a child I used to believe in the tooth fairy, until my parents fessed up and told me it was them, I used to believe in Father Christmas, until I found my christmas presents hidden in my parents wardrobe (the lying b**tards!), so I stopped believeing in him. When I finished my indoctrination in a catholic grammer school and was allowed to start thinking for myself, I discovered that there is not one piece of evidence to support the existence of God, so I stopped believing in him (her?).

 

As to the original contention that 'God answers all their prayers' I must disagree. There is no god, thankfully. Imagine what a monster they would be if they did exist ? (how else could you describe an omnipotent being that allows all the horrors that prevail).

 

In the usual spirit (sic) of discussion, please provide a link to 1 piece of sound evidence for the existence of your god that is supposed to 'answer all prayers'.

[Moose]

As to the original contention that 'God answers all their prayers' I must disagree. There is no god, thankfully. and In the usual spirit (sic) of discussion, please provide a link to 1 piece of sound evidence for the existence of your god that is supposed to 'answer all prayers'.

First, it is your responsibilty to provide there is no, "god" since this is your claim.

 

Second, There isn't any need for me, (as a believer) to post a link that God exists. It is written that we had Moses, the Prophets and even Christ raising the dead. Yet some, (if not many) didn't believe then....

 

Finally, it is obvious that the OP believes in God, so your challenge is moot as far as the spirit of this thread.

[ToBeFair]

Finally, it is obvious that the OP believes in God, so your challenge is moot as far as the spirit of this thread.

 

It is partly because the OP believes in god, and puts forth his opinion that 'God answers all his prayers' with such certainty to an open forum, partly because the OP is the senior moderator on this site, thus giving his words more credability to those more vulnerable people less able to think for themselves, and partly because someone like yourself (who was once a moderator) back these words up, it is for these reasons that I and hopefully many more sensible people MUST challenge them. As people in positions of power and respect on this site, moderators must have a special responsibility to be impartial surely. ??

 

First, it is your responsibilty to provide there is no, "god" since this is your claim.[/Quote]

 

Nonsense, I was refuting a claim inherant in the original post, that you are backing up, namely that a God exists in the first place. The OP and yourself have made a claim, please substantiate it. The OP later clarifies this by saying that God answers all HIS prayers, again, what proof is there for this or even for the existence of this God ?

 

 

Second, There isn't any need for me, (as a believer) to post a link that God exists. It is written that we had Moses, the Prophets and even Christ raising the dead. Yet some, (if not many) didn't believe then....[/Quote]

 

It is also written that harry potter flies on broomsticks, Hobbits will save middle earth from the ultimate evil, that snowmen fly. I think we must all agree that a lot of stuff that is written is in actual fact not true, I believe it is called fiction.

[Moose]

It is partly because the OP believes in god, and puts forth his opinion that 'God answers all his prayers' with such certainty to an open forum, partly because the OP is the senior moderator on this site, thus giving his words more credability to those more vulnerable people less able to think for themselves, and partly because someone like yourself (who was once a moderator) back these words up, it is for these reasons that I and hopefully many more sensible people MUST challenge them. As people in positions of power and respect on this site, moderators must have a special responsibility to be impartial surely. ??

 

Not so. I'm not "backing" Tony. I am simply contributing to the spirit of the thread. Simply because all of my prayers have been answered as well...

 

Nonsense, I was refuting a claim inherant in the original post, that you are backing up, namely that a God exists in the first place. The OP and yourself have made a claim, please substantiate it. The OP later clarifies this by saying that God answers all HIS prayers, again, what proof is there for this or even for the existence of this God ?

 

I've clearly explained this, just who do you think is in control of our world right now? IF God was in total control, would He allow porn, murder, abuse? He's giving ALL of us a CHOICE to believe or follow. IF you follow, you will be blessed. "Seek Ye FIRST the Kingdom of God, and all these, (Prayer) will be added unto you".

 

It is also written that harry potter flies on broomsticks, Hobbits will save middle earth from the ultimate evil, that snowmen fly. I think we must all agree that a lot of stuff that is written is in actual fact not true, I believe it is called fiction.

Same with the constitution, or maps, or history books? How about archeology?

 

How about the inherit fact that if you put your hand on a hot stove it'll get burned?

 

You can confirm that God exists, you can deny that God exists. One thing you can not do is IGNORE Him