Author tami-chan Posted November 18, 2009 Author Posted November 18, 2009 Tami, You have a lot going on right now. Even though things are amicable with you and your H right now, facing divorce still represents a big change in your life. I think perhaps being overly emotional about some things would be normal (it was for me that first year). Also, the angst you feel about dating and contact and all that is pretty normal for someone you like. You will get better support about that on datingwithoutdrama.com. Oh sadintexas...how are you? thank you so much for your response. Yes, divorce is a huge change and very sad. Despite the fact that my marriage was only a partnership in parenting and economics--it was a good partnership. I am so glad you get what I am feeling...like I said, I am just so new in the dating scene-as a matter of fact, I have never been in the dating scene so naturally I am a bit clumsy about it ! It is also the first time I am with a guy who is actually YOUNGER than me...not by much (2 years)..still a far cry from my stbxh and xOM-who are way older than me! Very exciting!
Trimmer Posted November 18, 2009 Posted November 18, 2009 Who are you calling "textbook psychologist"..I hope you are not referring to me..because taking an "Intro to Psych" course is just that-never claimed to be anything more than that...stop being so condescending I'm sorry. I wish I had said "textbook psychology" instead. I didn't mean to make it sound so personally directed. I consider myself an example of a one-semester textbook psychologist myself, but I shouldn't have put it that way. Self-esteem? who is talking about self-esteem...all I said was that as social beings we need to be emotionally vested to other people...now, there is a huge difference to being NEEDY...I am sure you can figure that out.. Well, I suppose since I started out with a condescending-sounding turn of phrase, I deserve one in return, eh? now that I mentioned "ice princess"-you are going to come up with another thing seriously wrong with me. Can't win...lol.. No, I'm not going to do that, and I'm not trying to win anything, or make you lose. Look, are you going to tell me that we do not need to be emotionally vested to/with another human being( be it family, friends, lovers, etc.)? are you going to tell me that a mature person who has never had sexual intimacy is ok? No, you've stretched my point way beyond my intent. My point was in reference to your "I believe in Maslow's hierarchy of needs..." statement, which came out of an exchange specifically related to the wisdom of getting into another romantic relationship when your divorce is still pending: Wrong. A normal person at most "WANTS" to be emotionally invested, but doesn't NEED to. I agree with this. "Needing" to be in a relationship is probably not the safest path to happiness. well...we disagree...I believe in Maslow's hierarchy of needs....<shrug>... In that context, I opined that the delineations between the needs that are higher up in Maslow's hierarchy are more hazy and interactive with each other than they are lower down. And that I believe (and of course I accept that you may disagree) that after a failed relationship, some time spent working on one's foundation as an individual, before getting into another romantic partnership, is time well spent, which tends to go against a literal reading of Maslow's hierarchy as a clearly defined stair-step where interpersonal intimacy and sex comes before individualization. If none of this applies to you, or if you already feel sufficiently confident as an individual outside of your current relationship, and ready to enter into another, then you have my best wishes. Again, I'm not trying to win anything or convince you that anything is wrong with you. Can you explain what ""feeling of inward competence" is vis-a-vis "feeling of competence"? is there an "outward competence? Yes - if one is told from the outside: "You are good, you are great, you are fine..." if one relies primarily upon that external validation to assure one that everything is working OK, then if one ceases receiving that external validation (or begins to question it) then one's view of oneself as a competent, confident person is shaken. (I can't help thinking of the various rises and falls of Britney Spears, specifically the head-shaving period, not that I'm trying to draw an analogy with you.) On the other hand, if you have an internal foundation of confidence and competence as an individual, then the outside validation is nice icing on the cake - don't get me wrong - but you don't depend upon it for your fundamental view of yourself. Sometimes - and just be clear that I realize this may not be you - I hear people who exit one relationship and feel the "need" to enter another relationship to fill the hole, the void, the empty space. To complete their "hierarchy of needs." That's the situation where I suggest some time and energy "finding oneself" as an individual before seeking out that partnership again. It can actually be a wonderful and transformative process, not some indicator of pathology...
torranceshipman Posted November 18, 2009 Posted November 18, 2009 In Maslow's Hierarchy, the meaning isn't as literal as some posters are interpreting it to be. I actualy lecture this theory in some of my organizational theory classes. For example, Maslow's observation of humans have led him to theorize that we have a need for love (relationships with friends, family, love of pets, love of nature, romantic relationships, etc), and a ove for belonging (feeling part of a group - e.g. a sports team, a company, a social group). A need for love and belonginess can include romantic relationships, but that is just one part of a huge list of competing alternatives that should be providing love in your life. The way that a romantic relationship differs from the other sources of love, is that it also potentially offers more security, a way to counter insecurity or bolster an ego that needs bolstering, a way to avoid negative feelings about yourself that you should be facing alone, an dealing with healthily, a crutch (if used in an unhealth way)...IMO it is a bit unhealthy that someone would assume 'love and belongingness' automatically equates to 'needing to be in a romantic relationship'. Needing to be in a romantic relationship is very unhealthy. Thus, you can see how 'needing to be in a relationship' is a far cry from Maslow's 'love and belongingness'....just wanted to clear that up! Being single is really a fun thing I think, and if you spend most of your life with a partner, you'll never be able to explore the other avenues for love and belongingness, or discover lots of the cool things about yourself that you would have discovered had you been single. I think lots of people just want to rely on a person there for back up, rather than face the scary but cool road of being alone, until the genuinely wonderful, right romantic partner comes along - then they'll add to your 'love and belonging' needs as 30% or so of those needs, because the other 70% will already be coming from a love of friends, family, pets, travel, religion, nature, self love, whatever....
Trimmer Posted November 18, 2009 Posted November 18, 2009 Thus, you can see how 'needing to be in a relationship' is a far cry from Maslow's 'love and belongingness'....just wanted to clear that up! Being single is really a fun thing I think, and if you spend most of your life with a partner, you'll never be able to explore the other avenues for love and belongingness, or discover lots of the cool things about yourself that you would have discovered had you been single. I think lots of people just want to rely on a person there for back up, rather than face the scary but cool road of being alone, until the genuinely wonderful, right romantic partner comes along - then they'll add to your 'love and belonging' needs as 30% or so of those needs, because the other 70% will already be coming from a love of friends, family, pets, travel, religion, nature, self love, whatever.... Nicely put. I always like it when someone can put something much better than I am able to, especially when I'm struggling to get it right.
RedDevil66 Posted November 19, 2009 Posted November 19, 2009 In Maslow's Hierarchy, the meaning isn't as literal as some posters are interpreting it to be. I actualy lecture this theory in some of my organizational theory classes. For example, Maslow's observation of humans have led him to theorize that we have a need for love (relationships with friends, family, love of pets, love of nature, romantic relationships, etc), and a ove for belonging (feeling part of a group - e.g. a sports team, a company, a social group). A need for love and belonginess can include romantic relationships, but that is just one part of a huge list of competing alternatives that should be providing love in your life. The way that a romantic relationship differs from the other sources of love, is that it also potentially offers more security, a way to counter insecurity or bolster an ego that needs bolstering, a way to avoid negative feelings about yourself that you should be facing alone, an dealing with healthily, a crutch (if used in an unhealth way)...IMO it is a bit unhealthy that someone would assume 'love and belongingness' automatically equates to 'needing to be in a romantic relationship'. Needing to be in a romantic relationship is very unhealthy. Thus, you can see how 'needing to be in a relationship' is a far cry from Maslow's 'love and belongingness'....just wanted to clear that up! Being single is really a fun thing I think, and if you spend most of your life with a partner, you'll never be able to explore the other avenues for love and belongingness, or discover lots of the cool things about yourself that you would have discovered had you been single. I think lots of people just want to rely on a person there for back up, rather than face the scary but cool road of being alone, until the genuinely wonderful, right romantic partner comes along - then they'll add to your 'love and belonging' needs as 30% or so of those needs, because the other 70% will already be coming from a love of friends, family, pets, travel, religion, nature, self love, whatever.... Great post and so very true. Being single and having time to explore yourself and your world brings a freedom that never comes when one is in a relationship with someone else. Only people who've expierienced enough "alone time" can truly understand this. People who've never been alone wil try to disprove this point because it will make them feel like they've not grown. But there is a grown when being alone that can NEVER come with being with another. As hard as being single was, I was truly grateful for those years.
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