Maybe I really am so horrible with which to live?

[learnfrommymistakes]

Silic, bold but true, I do see validity in handling it like this, head on. She is mistreating you and you being nice has not seemed to work. I think this is a whole other approach that may help, it's direct as hell, but I completely see it as one possible way to deal with this.

Often being dead honest is helpful, especially when you are at the end of your rope. She is emasculating you, leading you to feel like less of a man, and walking all over you. There is some reason she is disrecting you, whether it stems from your relationship with her, or a past relationship that is being triggered.

 

Best of luck and stand up for yourself, she may fight back, but I would think she will learn to respect you if you say it like this. I WOULD...

lfmm

[mem11363]

1A,

How about I ask you: When was the last time you beat your children?

 

Hey I didn't say you were a bad mom, I just asked a question.

 

If you can't recognize this guy as the victim - you either didn't read the thread or ....???

 

 

Reread it. It wasn't a blame but a question. He's free to ignore or answer.

[prenus.]

To Nikki Sahagin:

 

"Respond to her actions rather than to 'I love you'," very interesting. I will keep this in mind.

 

As far as I can tell, she was never abused as a child. I have known her and her family since high school and have never seen anything to suggest abuse. The closest thing to abusive may be when her father took a job he absolutely hated. He would come home very angry every day and yell a lot. However, to my knowledge, he never hit her or anything like it.

 

Although, one day, when she was in middle school, he did make a comment to her about her weight which even he admits in retrospect was thoughtless and should have remained unspoken. I think this one moment of insensitivity on his part is responsible for her striving to stay fit. She says she is over her father's comments. Of course, who knows. Often times people convince themselves they are "over" something while it still leaves echoes and imprints upon their minds.

 

Thanks for the compliments.

[prenus.]

Believe me when I say I am not dismissing counseling. Quite frankly, these last few days posting to Loveshack.org have been extremely therapeutic for me. My dad once told me, "Yeah, in the 60s, I had a therapist. Only I called him a bartender." lol! Having someone to whom one can talk certainly can be great help. I suppose I have felt extremely lost in this situation because I have always thought a spouse is someone to whom one should be able to talk about any problem. I suppose I forgot to consider what happens when that spouse is the actual/perceived subject of that problem.

 

Individual therapy might be more affordable than couples therapy to the extent we may be able to find the money for it, upon which I would certainly be willing to spend. I don't know. However, I will look into it and see what I can work out.

 

It sounds like she has a lot she wants to say but can't say it for some reason to you. Does she have close friends that she confides things like this to?

 

She does, the ones I mentioned in my original post. They have told me at times, "We only put up with you to be able to see her. You know that right?" So, I suppose you can imagine what they think of me, whether justified or not. Is this because of what she has told them in private? I can't say because, being in private, I would never be present to any such conversation.

[prenus.]

To Phateless:

 

She is being a hanus bitch to you and you need to move on.

 

Please, she is my wife. However, I do understand the point you are trying to make.

[mem11363]

do you have a set of action steps to take

are you committed to doing this even if she doesn't want to answer your questions

are you willing to ask her how big a factor your weight is? I think you should.

 

You can make this really open ended -

What do you think we need to change in order for you to be comfortable hugging me - in private and in public.

 

What would need to change for her to engage with you in a respectful tone and bodylanguage

 

 

 

To Phateless:

 

 

 

Please, she is my wife. However, I do understand the point you are trying to make.

[prenus.]

To Crusoe:

 

Depression therapy, if she has depression, may be in order, provided the physician agreed. That sort of therapy may be covered under our medical insurance.

[prenus.]

To learnfrommymistakes:

 

Thanks.

[prenus.]

In 1956, the lower part of the Mona Lisa was severely damaged when a vandal went to the Louvre in Paris, Fance, and doused the painting with acid. On December 30th of that same year, a young Bolivian named Ugo Ungaza Villegas, threw a rock at da Vinci's masterpiece, damaging this priceless work of art. Despite these two attacks, as well as many others over the years, thefts, and general wear and tear, at no time have the custodians of this carefully constructed work ever considered anything so drastic as to risk its destruction. Meticulous and cautious approaches have always been used to preserve and restore this creation. I feel similar means must be applied to my marriage, which is infinitely more valuable to me than this 500 year old portrait.

 

A bit of insight into my name which I thought some might find interesting: The word "prenus." (yes, the '.' is included) roughly means "person". Her name is "pramis.", which roughly means "beloved". It is also no coincidence the fact her name is pronounced similar to the word "promise". She is the reason for my "promise" to make myself a better "person". Without her, I feel quite confident I would have wasted so many opportunities for improvement. She has helped me to stay focused on the larger goals in life while going through troubled times. That inspiration has kept me going even while the state of our relationship feels to me as if it has deteriorated.

 

For now, I will try The Love Dare and see how things are after the initial run of 40 days, which will put us close to Christmas. If matters have not improved by Christmas, I will sit down with her and (with no distractions available) explain to her something along the lines of, "Each Christmas I ask for nothing. This year, I would love if you would do one simple thing for me. For the next month, what say we spend 15 minutes a day with you communicating to me what you expect of me in terms of a husband and how I can make experiences happier for you. I am not saying you need to tell me what will make you happy; just happier. If you can tell me what will make you happy at any point in time, I want to know as soon as you can tell me. Everyday, 15 minutes. I will listen to everything you have to say. I will not argue. I will not debate. I will then take what you tell me and, together, maybe we can discuss what actions and habits upon which I should focus. Our marriage is decaying into a state of mutual suffering, which is unfair to both of us. If you tell me you expect 'nothing' or I can do 'nothing', I will still put forth my best effort to maintain and improve this marriage, using whatever information I have available to me. However, the more insight you can provide to me, the better informed I can be, the better husband I can be, and the easier a process of improvement this will be." At that point, I will go from there, following her lead.

 

I will also check into therapy options, seeing in what she is interested, what is applicable, and try to find a way to afford it.

 

If no one has any objection, I would like to report back after completing the 40 day run of the "Dare" with regards to progress and set-backs. I doubt I will be the last person with this problem and would like to document any lessons I learn about her, myself, and our marriage for anyone stumbling across these posts. Meanwhile, as always, if anyone thinks of any other suggestions or anything they think I am doing wrong, do let me know. As you may have guessed, I automatically subscribed to this thread. Thanks to everyone for everything you have said and will say.

[mrsT]

I just have to say I am agog, aghast, shocked and dumbfounded. Stupefied, flabberghasted and reeling with disbelief that nobody, NOBODY, not ONE SINGLE PERSON picked up on this. Or let me put it this way EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU MISSED IT. What kind of lives are you people living?

 

Sit down because you all have something to learn.

 

An open marriage. AN OPEN MARRIAGE. You don't have a problem with an OPEN MARRIAGE. Dude, prenus, get a clue. Everybody get a ccccccccccccccccccccclue.

 

Try talking to her about this, prenus. I think you will have found the source of your problem. And report back to us, PLEASE, before ONE MORE PERSON wastes ANOTHER breath trying to FIGURE this one out.

 

An open marriage. Married women, prenus, they don't dig that generally speaking. No wife I know wants to hear from her husband that he would be happy to have unemotional sex with other women. I would go cold instantly and take about 300 years to thaw out. My husband wouldn't even begin to comprehend the depth that my emotional punishment of him would go to if he ever intimated to me that he wanted anything like that outside of our marriage.

 

You want intimacy with your wife? Then it will only have to be only you and your wife. Trust me on this. You blew the brains out of your loving trusting respectful intimate exclusive marriage when you farted that idea out your mouth.

 

Seriously, I don't mean to make light or be disrespectful, but I am not sure how you got to be so clueless. Don't watch so much TV. Don't believe everything you read. Beware of pop culture. Above all don't take marriage advice from Hugh Hefner. I think you will see that I care or I wouldn't tell you this.

 

Please report back to us!

[prenus.]

I do think you care, yes. I do not watch much television as it is except for the evening news which I only watch via the website of whichever news station I am watching (e.g., cbsnews.com, msnbc.com, etc.)

 

As far as the bulk of your post (regarding the relevance of the idea of 'open marriage' to my marriage), I might be inclined to agree with you, were the following facts not true:

 

1. The fact I believe in an open marriage does not automatically translate into my acting upon that belief. As I mentioned in my original post,

I have never had sex with anyone outside our relationship. I have felt, until she says it is perfectly okay for me to do so, I would respect the more traditional monogomous approach to marriage and she knows this fact.

While I suppose I might not have made this point clear, I prefer to take a more cautious approach, waiting until such time as she says something along the lines of "Look, if you wanted to have sex with [insert name of woman here], I really am okay with it," before I even approach said woman about the idea. My preferred and more cautious approach to the matter is the "this fact" of which she knows. That moment has not arrived.

 

2. She holds similar views with respect to the separation of marriage and sex. She was even the one who broached the subject in our relationship. (Right up until the time she brought up the subject, I was anticipating, and still am, despite my belief, to have a traditionally monogamous marriage.) She has said to me, "Sex shouldn't be about love. It should be about the enjoyment of sex," and "Why do women think they have a duty to provide their husbands with sex? I used to think that but I am long since over that," as well as having made other statements to that effect. We even have discussed the matter explicitly many times over the 15+ years of our relationship (not just the last 4-5, when affection et al. have declined), establishing and reaffirming mutually acceptable guidelines with respect to such circumstances which would almost certainly require, in my opinion, the realization of the "preferred and more cautious approach" I mentioned. I have even gone so far as to insist upon more restrictive guidelines placed upon me than upon her, as a matter of extra emotional, social, and physical protection for her.

 

3. Well before we stopped having any degree of romantic/affectionate interaction (sex, kissing, handholding, etc.), she once told me how she knew I hadn't had sex with anyone else and how, if I were to ever try and fail, I shouldn't get discouraged. The degree of our romantic and affectionate interaction both before and after that time was as strong as other 'traditional marriages' of which I know.

 

Plus, if you reread each of my posts, you will be able to see the sex and romantic issues with our marriage are only part of my complaint.

[mem11363]

So instead of asking her what it is she really NEEDS from you and telling her what you really want and need from her - you are just going to try to be super nice for the next 40 days?

 

Bad idea. Radiating love at a frustrated person who has disengaged is a pointless waste of energy. And it will leave you frustrated at the end - and she will be puzzled and wondering - "why did he do all that?" that isn't what I want/need from him.

 

Why are you afraid to have a firm - conversation as equals?

 

 

I do think you care, yes. I do not watch much television as it is except for the evening news which I only watch via the website of whichever news station I am watching (e.g., cbsnews.com, msnbc.com, etc.)

 

As far as the bulk of your post (regarding the relevance of the idea of 'open marriage' to my marriage), I might be inclined to agree with you, were the following facts not true:

 

1. The fact I believe in an open marriage does not automatically translate into my acting upon that belief. As I mentioned in my original post, While I suppose I might not have made this point clear, I prefer to take a more cautious approach, waiting until such time as she says something along the lines of "Look, if you wanted to have sex with [insert name of woman here], I really am okay with it," before I even approach said woman about the idea. My preferred and more cautious approach to the matter is the "this fact" of which she knows. That moment has not arrived.

 

2. She holds similar views with respect to the separation of marriage and sex. She was even the one who broached the subject in our relationship. (Right up until the time she brought up the subject, I was anticipating, and still am, despite my belief, to have a traditionally monogamous marriage.) She has said to me, "Sex shouldn't be about love. It should be about the enjoyment of sex," and "Why do women think they have a duty to provide their husbands with sex? I used to think that but I am long since over that," as well as having made other statements to that effect. We even have discussed the matter explicitly many times over the 15+ years of our relationship (not just the last 4-5, when affection et al. have declined), establishing and reaffirming mutually acceptable guidelines with respect to such circumstances which would almost certainly require, in my opinion, the realization of the "preferred and more cautious approach" I mentioned. I have even gone so far as to insist upon more restrictive guidelines placed upon me than upon her, as a matter of extra emotional, social, and physical protection for her.

 

3. Well before we stopped having any degree of romantic/affectionate interaction (sex, kissing, handholding, etc.), she once told me how she knew I hadn't had sex with anyone else and how, if I were to ever try and fail, I shouldn't get discouraged. The degree of our romantic and affectionate interaction both before and after that time was as strong as other 'traditional marriages' of which I know.

 

Plus, if you reread each of my posts, you will be able to see the sex and romantic issues with our marriage are only part of my complaint.

[prenus.]

I suppose I am afraid to have a conversation with her as equals because I feel we are not equals. I feel as if I have let her down in some way everyday for a long time since before we were married. Perhaps, as Minnie09 said:

her prince did notdevelop into the great king she had hoped for.

 

She is also quite defensive. So, such a conversation would too easily transform into a full argument. And when it comes to arguments, heck, she is not a 'good loser' in games, much less so in arguments. When she feels she is losing so much as a hand of pinochle, she throws fits and yells some of the most hurtful things I have ever heard and the situation deteriorates into an extremely unpleasant moment for everyone around. As an example, one day, when we were engaged, I almost threw her out of the apartment in which I was living at the time because of some of the names she called me simply because I won a game of chess. The anger and seething rage in her expression I had never seen before. I thought to myself, "Why is she getting this angry? It's just a game of chess." The more I tried to calm her down, the longer the tirade went on. After a while, I started getting upset as well because it was just a game of chess. However, not wanting to risk doing something I would regret, I stopped, took a very deep breath, and calmly asked, "Okay, would you like to do something else, instead?" She settled down after that.

 

People (usually her mother or sister-in-law) have said to me, "You know these situations upset her. Why don't you just let her win so she is not upset?" It would seem I am expected to minimize confrontations with her which, in turn, will minimize her getting upset. (I should note, however, she will not behave this way in a confrontation if the confronting individual is her father or brother. Maybe I am just a special case?)

 

Furthermore, in the midst of an argument with her, I tend to lose a significant portion of rationality. The extreme stress of the situation causes me to stop thinking straight. I find myself twisted into such a confused and knotty mass of thought I sometimes find myself forgetting the beginning of a sentence by the time I have reached the end. The end result is a near chaotic line of reasoning which fails horribly to make my point.

 

I do not usually have this reaction in arguments with people. The only other time have this sort of experience is in confrontations with my supervisor. Stress levels are generally as high, since he has "final decision" authority over my employment and my income accounts for ~80% of that for the entire house. Yet, I am some how able to pull things together (mentally) in such a way as to think clearly. With the economy the way it is, I cannot afford to not. I cannot risk losing my job any more than I want to risk damaging my marriage to her. Also, I cannot avoid the confrontations with my supervisor. I can, however, avoid confrontations with my wife.

 

Lastly, I still have not ruled out the possibility I have been doing something incredibly, simply, and straight-forwardly obvious which is wrong. Sometimes the hardest things for me to see are those right in front of me. I don't want to upset her more if I am at fault and if I can figure this out.

[clv0116]

Maybe I really am so horrible with which to live?

 

If you talk like that in real life I'd say yes, you're a real pain in the ass.

[mem11363]

When I was in sales and sales management I would create a talking points script before my important meetings.

 

A good sales person asks questions more then they make statements. So my talking points included many questions. For the yes/no questions I had sub-questions. Meaning if I ask you, do you like it when I do this? And you say yes, then I ask one thing, if you say no, then I ask something different?

 

And I practice and I prepare. And it makes a world of difference.

 

Why are you afraid to have a short conversation with her about the fact that she is clearly very unhappy with you, and you want the short list of things you can do to improve? That is NOT being confrontational.

 

You do have to have some balls though. If she tries the everything is fine bit - you need to have the stones to say - no - everything is not fine when you don't even like me to touch/hug you. So help me understand how to make it fine. A good question is "do you not believe we can improve our marriage?"

 

From what you describe you are with someone who does not like or respect you. What do you have to lose?

 

By the way the chess game example is interesting. Why don't you just ignore her crazy emotion when she is being a sore loser? Why didn't you insist on an apology?

 

No one can really help you if you let her treat you this poorly and you find that acceptable.

 

But your story is not quite consistent. You say how much you want this all to work. You talk about the physical part being so bad. You admit that she found your weight gain a turn off. And yet that is something you totally control and have done nothing about. You seem to want to see yourself as totally at her mercy. It isn't quite like that though is it?

 

 

I suppose I am afraid to have a conversation with her as equals because I feel we are not equals. I feel as if I have let her down in some way everyday for a long time since before we were married. Perhaps, as Minnie09 said:

 

She is also quite defensive. So, such a conversation would too easily transform into a full argument. And when it comes to arguments, heck, she is not a 'good loser' in games, much less so in arguments. When she feels she is losing so much as a hand of pinochle, she throws fits and yells some of the most hurtful things I have ever heard and the situation deteriorates into an extremely unpleasant moment for everyone around. As an example, one day, when we were engaged, I almost threw her out of the apartment in which I was living at the time because of some of the names she called me simply because I won a game of chess. The anger and seething rage in her expression I had never seen before. I thought to myself, "Why is she getting this angry? It's just a game of chess." The more I tried to calm her down, the longer the tirade went on. After a while, I started getting upset as well because it was just a game of chess. However, not wanting to risk doing something I would regret, I stopped, took a very deep breath, and calmly asked, "Okay, would you like to do something else, instead?" She settled down after that.

 

People (usually her mother or sister-in-law) have said to me, "You know these situations upset her. Why don't you just let her win so she is not upset?" It would seem I am expected to minimize confrontations with her which, in turn, will minimize her getting upset. (I should note, however, she will not behave this way in a confrontation if the confronting individual is her father or brother. Maybe I am just a special case?)

 

Furthermore, in the midst of an argument with her, I tend to lose a significant portion of rationality. The extreme stress of the situation causes me to stop thinking straight. I find myself twisted into such a confused and knotty mass of thought I sometimes find myself forgetting the beginning of a sentence by the time I have reached the end. The end result is a near chaotic line of reasoning which fails horribly to make my point.

 

I do not usually have this reaction in arguments with people. The only other time have this sort of experience is in confrontations with my supervisor. Stress levels are generally as high, since he has "final decision" authority over my employment and my income accounts for ~80% of that for the entire house. Yet, I am some how able to pull things together (mentally) in such a way as to think clearly. With the economy the way it is, I cannot afford to not. I cannot risk losing my job any more than I want to risk damaging my marriage to her. Also, I cannot avoid the confrontations with my supervisor. I can, however, avoid confrontations with my wife.

 

Lastly, I still have not ruled out the possibility I have been doing something incredibly, simply, and straight-forwardly obvious which is wrong. Sometimes the hardest things for me to see are those right in front of me. I don't want to upset her more if I am at fault and if I can figure this out.

[mrsT]

It doesn't matter whether you have ever acted on it. She will never forget that you said it as long as she lives.

 

And she was fishing when she told you those were her beliefs, too.

 

 

She's punishing you for this desire of yours you mentioned and for your porn. And frankly, prenus, you deserve it. Marriage should be exclusive. To share her body and affection with you is a gift. You don't treat it like that when you look at porn and desire sex outside your marriage. True women aren't built to accomodate that way. Women who act differently are lying to themselves and to men. It is only an enterprise for them.

 

Also she can't tell you what for because that might endanger her next fishing expedition. She can't ever let you know how fragile she is when your hands are so clumsy. And she can't put herself into those hands. You might drop her. Hell, you already have. You have yet to discover the true beauty and devotion of a wife. She's made of a finer clay than you, bro.

 

Put the shoe on the other foot. Are you really OK with her wanting the same thing? Other men banging her brains out?

[clv0116]

However, I do not know what to do.

 

This one is broken, maybe you need a new one.

[cheergirl]

First I am sorry for you... You sound like you're in a world of hurt...

 

I can try to help by saying what I would be feeling if I were behaving like your wife... Maybe it can help....

 

Okay, take a deep breath..."I can't stand this guy..."

 

The disrespect, condescension are pretty strong pointers that she doesn't even like you as a person anymore...Sad to say, but I believe the more you try to "help" her and the relationship, the more turned off she will continue to be.

 

Whatever went wrong happened a long time ago I think...

You said you don't feel like you're equals... You feel beneath her for whatever reason and she has, let's face it, contempt for you... If you put up with this you feed it and it will carry on forever... I think you should stop trying to help/fix her, and do things that make you feel good about yourself...

 

Try to make yourself feel like "this woman is lucky to have me..." the whole dynamic of the relationship needs to change in order to have any chance of success... When you start respecting yourself more, (ie. stop caring so much about her when she treats you like a pile of doo-doo); you will become more worthy of respect in her eyes...

 

Put your energy where it is wanted, appreciated..How about the kids? It sounds like it's all about her with you. She seeems to have you like a puppet on a string, toying with you.

Would you let anyone else treat you like this? A workmate, sibling, friend?

I doubt it. Unless of course, maybe you secretly like it, in which case carry on...

 

Maybe you are horrible to live with, but as she doesn't even speak to you it'll be hard to know...

Maybe she's just a mean, spoilt, arrogant princess?

 

I won't automatically jump to the conclusion of depression etc. She doesn't sound depressed to me...just bored, disinterested and turned off...

 

Anyway hope this helps..good luck:)

[cheergirl]

• the inattention
  
• flitting from one thing to another
  
  
  

  
  

this sounds a bit like ADHD it won't help matters at all, but I have this and my boredom.tolerance threshold is extremely low... If she has your full attention all the time she might just be bored...

Try to hold back, not give away so much of yourself, make her miss/want you

[prenus.]

My apologies for not responding yesterday. Events were rather hectic, which not too coincidentally, I suppose, will segue nicely into answering your question later.

 

I could make a "talking points script", yes. I'll just need to make sure I keep the points organized within my head as much as possible. (Having a physical list for a discussion with my wife sounds, on the surface, rather strange; yet, if needed, I would have it.) I definitely appreciate the value of reviewing/rehearsing such points and remaining flexible in discussions while methodically proceeding thru each point.

 

I will work to find a way and a moment to 'probe' her mind and refuse to take "everything is fine" for an answer. My bigger concern is if, as happens from time to time, she agrees a problem exists but refuses to tell me. I simply don't have a clue how to proceed in that case.

 

I just had a thought. If she refuses to tell me what the problem is, I could ask, "Since you are clearly unhappy and you know why, don't you owe it to yourself, our marriage, and (most importantly) our children to tell me why so, if possible, I can do something to at least try to help?"

 

As far as what I have to lose, I was thinking about this last night. I don't want to be the man who drove his wife to seek a divorce because he wasn't smart enough to determine on his own where he had 'gone wrong'. So many of our friends have had marriages I felt were far stronger than ours; yet, I have found myself surprised with how many suddenly announced they were divorcing. I find myself wondering, as her affection and tolerance has waned, if we are not heading along that same path. So, what I have to lose is the hoped-for life with a woman I often describe as "causing my arms to ache every second I cannot hold" her.

 

By the way the chess game example is interesting. Why don't you just ignore her crazy emotion when she is being a sore loser? Why didn't you insist on an apology?

 

Have you ever seen someone transition from happy and loving into seething rage within seconds? The transformation is so terrifyingly surreal.

 

No one can really help you if you let her treat you this poorly and you find that acceptable.

 

You are right.

 

On the subject of my weight, as I mentioned, events were rather hectic yesterday. As such, I barely had time to eat, much less answer your question. (When asked questions, I like to provide answers as soon as possible; hence my apology.) In fact, an increasingly full schedule has coincided with a large portion of my weight gain. (I do not mean to imply the schedule is to blame. Schedules do not make decisions. People do.)

 

About 10 years ago, we had a membership to a local gym on the far side of town. While the exercise regimen helped keep the weight low for both of us, between travel to and from the gym and exercise time, we would need ~2.5 hours for each visit.

 

So, we eventually switched our membership from that gym to the local YMCA which was both cheaper and closer. While we were able to work-out almost as regularly, we still needed ~2 hours per visit. Couple with that fact the demands of time from both work and our daughter who was now in elementary school, and we concluded purchasing a home gym would make more sense economically and schedule-wise.

 

The home gym worked relatively well. I was definitely the primary user of it at the time. Yet, somehow my wife was able to maintain her weight while mine slowly ticked up at roughly one pound every three or four months. All this time I was continuing to reduce my caloric intake to account for the decreasing amounts of exercise I had time in which to engage.

 

As schedules continued to shift and time became less available, we discussed how we need to focus not so much on weight training but also cardiovascular activities. Consequently, we set aside the weight machine in favor of near daily walks, during which my weight gain slowed but did not stop.

 

Last Christmas, we decided to purchase a Nintendo Wii along with Wii Fit. Wii Fit I have found to be a delightfully exercising game. While using it, I was actually able to lose some weight in just a couple of weeks. Of course, at this point, I was quite overweight due to the incremental gains over the years.

 

The end of January changed all of that. One night, I experienced chest pains so intense I could barely stand. Both the family physician and EMS were called and recommended transportation to the hospital. Concerned for the possibility of a heart attack, the doctor's first instruction was, "Avoid any and all strenuous exercise for the next six weeks." Weight-wise, those six weeks were horrendous. While I had averaged on the order of one pound ever few months for roughly the last 10 years, those six weeks saw a gain of 10-15 pounds, depending on which scale one uses and the time of day my weight was measured.

 

Getting back into the exercise habit has been difficult as schedules continue to shift more and opportunities for exercise decrease. I have tried sneaking in little bursts of exercise when I can: pacing while on the phone, parking on the far side of the lot when grocery shopping, deliberately avoiding elevators, etc. I am determined to get this weight down if for no other reasons than (1) I will probably live longer and (2) if I can lose 30 pounds, I have 30 pounds less to carry, giving me more energy to do other things.

 

(My apologies for any decrease in readability due to typos or incorrect grammar. I am on my lunch break and do not have sufficient time to provide the proofreading this deserves.)

[The Collector]

First, where are all the people from the other 'overweight spouse can't get any' thread howling about how its her duty to f*ck, adore and respect him? Kinda different when the sexes are reversed I guess. Again. As usual. Anyway.

 

Prenus, sorry but your marriage is dead. She has one foot out of the door waiting for either Mr Better-Offer to come along, or for the children to grow up a bit, or maybe for you to divorce her/sleep with someone else so you can be the bad guy. In the meantime she's going to make you suffer.

 

You won't listen to me. You'll probably endure as much emotional abuse she can be bothered to inflict for as long as she has nothing better to do in the mistaken idea that you are 'not going to give up on your marriage without a fight.' We see that a lot here. Never works when one person has absolutely no desire to fix anything.

 

To you this marraige is worth more than the Mona Lisa. To her it's worth less than a postage stamp.

[hopeful1980]

First, where are all the people from the other 'overweight spouse can't get any' thread howling about how its her duty to f*ck, adore and respect him? Kinda different when the sexes are reversed I guess. Again. As usual. Anyway.

 

Prenus, sorry but your marriage is dead. She has one foot out of the door waiting for either Mr Better-Offer to come along, or for the children to grow up a bit, or maybe for you to divorce her/sleep with someone else so you can be the bad guy. In the meantime she's going to make you suffer.

 

You won't listen to me. You'll probably endure as much emotional abuse she can be bothered to inflict for as long as she has nothing better to do in the mistaken idea that you are 'not going to give up on your marriage without a fight.' We see that a lot here. Never works when one person has absolutely no desire to fix anything.

 

To you this marraige is worth more than the Mona Lisa. To her it's worth less than a postage stamp.

 

Are you serious? The very first post said she didn't respect him, as did the second.

 

Damn near everyone who has responded said he shouldn't have to take this abuse and that he's being way to nice to her.

[The Collector]

Are you serious? The very first post said she didn't respect him, as did the second.

 

Damn near everyone who has responded said he shouldn't have to take this abuse and that he's being way to nice to her.

 

It was the 'it's her wifely duty to f*ck him whenever he wants/withholding sex via ultimatums is always wrong' posts that were conspicuous by their absence.

[clv0116]

It was the 'it's her wifely duty to f*ck him whenever he wants/withholding sex via ultimatums is always wrong' posts that were conspicuous by their absence.

 

Well of course, she's a woman. It's a different standard, you silly fellow.

[prenus.]

With any and all due respect, I do not think you are listening. You have jumped to a conclusion without cause while simultaneously stereotyping all women. Your cultural interpretation of marriage may or may not coincide with ours in certain ways and by presuming the two views do, while I have no doubt you have wisdom to impart, you risk making your actions seem like those, not of an insightful individual, but of an ignorant fool.

 

I am positive your assertion the openness is to blame is so "un-right" it is not even wrong based upon information about my wife which I have deliberately withheld. This withholding comes not from any attempt to deceive or misdirect but from a desire to prevent the unjust criticism or condemnation of her which some people, in my experience, are only too eager, too excited, or too willing to supply.

 

While I do not know what the problem is, I do know for certain openness is not it and would greatly appreciate your dropping this line of argument right now. If left no alternative, I, begrudgingly, will provide such information and the erroneousness of your logic will be so visible, I cannot speculate what loss of credibility on this forum you might experience. That loss might be none; it might be total. Yet, you will be proven wrong. I would prefer, however, to give my wife an extra opportunity to avoid the chance of unwarranted attacks.

 

Regarding porn, you clearly have (I presume due to no fault of your own) failed either to utilize sufficient amounts of logic or to accurately read my posts. As those posts are part of the record which is this forum thread, I will not repeat them.

 

Concerning a "shoe on the other foot", such events wouldn't bother me in the slightest, so long as all of our agreed upon guidelines were followed.