dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Mainly for the men. Since men's brains don't react to Oxytocin and get emotionally attached in the same way women do. A player can have sex with a woman again and again with zero emotional attachment. Ugh, I've had guys get emotional attached to me after sex, and I was in a phase that I didn't want an emotional attachment. I wanted fun. I wanted to enjoy someone's company, have my cake and eat it too. Not just guys do that Not mature of me at all. But at that point in my life I didn't care. Men get emotionally attached when they build a fantasy around the women and perceive the woman as high value. That's not linked to the sex in the same way. Then when the day comes, and it's not as explosive as you had been fantasizing about... then what? You're let down. Now, you could have sex earlier on. You can have an understanding of the person in that sense. You can fantasize based off of that, and have a lesser chance of being let down. Sex is not good when so much is built up around it, about it, about the person, and how it will be, and then it's not all that and a bag of flipping chips. Sorry, but some people just aren't sexually compatible. And that can be a real effin' let down.. especially months into a relationship. Why can't more men value a women with a sex drive who knows what she wants in bed. A woman who wants a sex life to be just as alive and exciting as the rest of the relationship? Since you're such a nice guy, waiting to go exlusive before having sex with you is no problem right? Or do you have sex with women then walk off? No one has to walk off. If the relationship isn't going anywhere, then fine, break it off. But just because you have sex, doesn't mean someone has to walk off. Again, if both parties can be honest, communicate, and be forthcoming with what they want, there's no reason why there can't be sex. The "3 to 5 dates" rule or whatever is why I went for guys in my college classes and had crushes at work - I need to truly get to know a guy on a platonic level before I would even consider something romantic with him. If I haven't built an attraction yet, I'm not itching to jump in the sack. Have you ever just had a good two or three weeks of dating, the chemistry is off the wall, you get along well, and you just have that feeling where you can tell it's a good thing? I have. It was the best relationship of my life. I don't regret a thing about it. And I don't regret having sex that night. I think a lot of ladies get swept away by some guys, and they think they have to bend over backwards to get him to like her. There are SO MANY PEOPLE out there in this world that if a guy wants something and you want something else, there are tons more fish in the sea that are on your level. That is why communication is important. Sex early on doesn't change everything for the bad. You just have to be able to read people, or learn to read people. If a person really looks at the dates, you can tell if it was about sex. Yeah, sometimes women get swept off. Men do too though. There are guys out there who do the exact same thing you are saying women do. The real key is keeping busy and having enough hobbies and interests that if it doesn't work out, you're not in pieces because you don't need him to be happy with yourself. I'd rather be single than but up with fwb nonsense. The key is to let things happen naturally. If a guy needs to wait for months to find out someone won't have sex with him then he's got to be as naive as a woman that has sex with a player on the first night then cries when he walks off later on. People don't talk, ask or use their heads these days? Just as there are male players, there are female players who will do the same, only in a different manner. Sorry, but it's the truth. Waiting won't promise you a better relationship. It definitely reduces the chances of getting played. That was the point of the OP. You could get played in a few weeks, or you could waste months of your life on a person who has no real intention.
Johnny M Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Or maybe she's waiting for you to commit to an exclusive relationship and if you'd do that you'd be getting some. I think if you can have sex with someone you're dating then you should be able to commit to them, just my opinion. What do you mean by being exclusive? Is it just a mutual agreement to stop seeing other people? In that case, than I have no problem with exclusivity. But if exclusivity implies some kind of a trial period, as Booker T is suggesting, and is measured in months, I have no interest in playing that game.
Author BookerT Posted October 29, 2009 Author Posted October 29, 2009 (edited) Dreamgirl, you keep point to the minority or the exceptions to the rule. Like if you've had guys get emotionally attached from sex then that's the rule. I'm pointing to the general trends that's all, which is why in my OP I specifically didn't say it's 100% foolproof, but will help in over 50% of the case. I could find loads of exceptions to the rule in life, I even know a dog that likes cat food. Most dogs however like dog food. I like your point about the female players though. Deadly, that requires a different thread though. Edited October 29, 2009 by BookerT
dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 How did I know you would react badly? Because your an older poster who got kicked off, and likes to rattle up people. But that's not on topic, so back to the topic. And you know it is a public forum, so you can address it to whoever, but you know very well anyone can give their opinion. Anyways... Like you said it's a public forum. You disagree with me, I disagree with you. Don't need to get the blood pressure boiling buddy. Moral stances differ greatly between individuals. I respect the fact you want sex without commitment. That's cool. I'm just suggesting girls avoid you. I don't recall him saying he wants sex without commitment. I think it was that it is very possible to have sex prior to commitment. So should guys avoid me because I don't believe you have to have a title to your relationship before sex?
Johnny M Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 How did I know you would react badly? Like you said it's a public forum. You disagree with me, I disagree with you. Don't need to get the blood pressure boiling buddy. Moral stances differ greatly between individuals. I respect the fact you want sex without commitment. That's cool. I'm just suggesting girls avoid you. Buddy, you have no idea what it's like when I'm "reacting badly" . Don't get too excited. As for your public service announcement to the girls, I'm sure it will fall on receptive ears, coming from a self-professed Mr. Nice Guy, the defender of women, like yourself...
aerogurl87 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 What do you mean by being exclusive? Is it just a mutual agreement to stop seeing other people? In that case, than I have no problem with exclusivity. But if exclusivity implies some kind of a trial period, as Booker T is suggesting, and is measured in months, I have no interest in playing that game. To me exclusivity implies that we are only interested in each other and agree to make things official as a couple (hence the terms of endearment such as "boyfriend" and "girlfriend"). I don't have a trial period, I just ask that my guy be in an exclusive relationship with me before we have sex, although there have been exceptions to this that have resulted in FWB and usually the guy getting hurt when I tell him he's just a f**k buddy and never will be anything more to me.
dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 What do you mean by being exclusive? Is it just a mutual agreement to stop seeing other people? In that case, than I have no problem with exclusivity. But if exclusivity implies some kind of a trial period, as Booker T is suggesting, and is measured in months, I have no interest in playing that game. Heck, I have no interest in waiting months to find out a guy is full of crap and is playing some ego feeding game. Dreamgirl, you keep point to the minority or the exceptions to the rule. Like if you've had guys get emotionally attached from sex then that's the rule. I'm pointing to the general trends that's all, which is why in my OP I specifically didn't say it's 100% foolproof, but will help in over 50% of the case. Okay, so were is your proof that it will easy 50% of the cases? Is 50% of the population the same? Probably not. And how do you know I'm pointing to the minority? Based off of a few thousands on LS? Of how many people IRL? I could find loads of exceptions to the rule in life, I even know a dog that likes cat food. Most dogs however like dog food. Wonderful, let me take advice from a guy who is comparing sex to dog food. That reminds me... I had a lab who loved my cats food. I like your point about the female players though. Deadly, that requires a different thread though. Would you like me to start it?
dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 To me exclusivity implies that we are only interested in each other and agree to make things official as a couple (hence the terms of endearment such as "boyfriend" and "girlfriend"). I don't have a trial period, I just ask that my guy be in an exclusive relationship with me before we have sex, although there have been exceptions to this that have resulted in FWB and usually the guy getting hurt when I tell him he's just a f**k buddy and never will be anything more to me. And I'm not alone
Awesome Username Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Sounds like either way, someone in a FWB gets hurt.
dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Sounds like either way, someone in a FWB gets hurt. But just because you are having sex before an official commitment doesn't mean you are in FWB relationship. That is where communication comes in. Are you sleeping with someone else? Are you seeing someone else? Do we have the same goals (do we both want a relationship, or are we seeking something else)?
littlewhiterose Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 I see where everyone so far who’s posted is coming from. Although the majority of the problem when it comes to sex, can be boiled down to a few basic things. Some people have sex to connect with another person, some have sex as a form of validation. I think where things get screwy, is where the other person is coming from and what their motivation is on a subconscious level. That and gender specific sexuality differences. I’m not sure it’s a fair assessment to say whether having sex is or isn’t a big deal. For example, if a guy found out the girl he was dating was previously raped in the past (which I think has been a post on LS); in good conscious, would he be still able to tell her it’s not a big deal to “lose it” by date number whatever, just because he’s ready? Sometimes sex can be a big deal. Or maybe not a big deal, but an important decision to weigh. But again, it depends on where the person is coming from. Not everyone is emotionally healthy. And if you’re waiting months, then there’s deffo a lack of communication, so really any prospect of a healthy relationship had little chance anyway.
Author BookerT Posted October 29, 2009 Author Posted October 29, 2009 And I'm not alone How you not alone? She just said her criteria is that a couple declares themselves boyfriend and girlfriend, ie EXCLUSIVE before sex. Otherwise just go completely casual sex with no expectations. That's what I said! That's not having sex with a guy on the first night and then assuming it will become exlusive. The timeline I gave was simply for reference since most people take a month or two to become exclusive. Heck EXCLUSIVE is in the title....
aerogurl87 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 How you not alone? She just said her criteria is that a couple declares themselves boyfriend and girlfriend, ie EXCLUSIVE before sex. Otherwise just go completely casual sex with no expectations. That's what I said! That's not having sex with a guy on the first night and then assuming it will become exlusive. The timeline I gave was simply for reference since most people take a month or two to become exclusive. Heck EXCLUSIVE is in the title.... Well I have a short attention span 90% of the time so I can tell after a week of dating what a guy is going to be to me. He'll usually fall into one of three categories: friend, FWB, or boyfriend material. If he's boyfriend material then I try to see where he's at in the dating process and go from there. With my current boyfriend I was upfront and told him we weren't having sex till we were in a committed relationship. So one month after dating there we were in a committed and EXCLUSIVE relationship and happily having sex. I know he would've waited longer if I needed more time but I had needs and I wanted him then and there so I had enough time waiting, lol.
Author BookerT Posted October 29, 2009 Author Posted October 29, 2009 Well I have a short attention span 90% of the time so I can tell after a week of dating what a guy is going to be to me. He'll usually fall into one of three categories: friend, FWB, or boyfriend material. If he's boyfriend material then I try to see where he's at in the dating process and go from there. With my current boyfriend I was upfront and told him we weren't having sex till we were in a committed relationship. So one month after dating there we were in a committed and EXCLUSIVE relationship and happily having sex. I know he would've waited longer if I needed more time but I had needs and I wanted him then and there so I had enough time waiting, lol. That's basically the exact game plan I was refering to.....
Johnny M Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 To me exclusivity implies that we are only interested in each other and agree to make things official as a couple (hence the terms of endearment such as "boyfriend" and "girlfriend"). I don't have a trial period, I just ask that my guy be in an exclusive relationship with me before we have sex, although there have been exceptions to this that have resulted in FWB and usually the guy getting hurt when I tell him he's just a f**k buddy and never will be anything more to me. The way I see it, if you have strong feelings for someone, than yes, you'd want to become exclusive as a precondition to further dating, not just sex. It's the emotions that you invest in the relationship that make you feel like sh*t when it doesn't work out, not the fact that you had sex. On the other hand, if you are just taking it slow and trying to figure out how you feel about the other person, there is really no reason to hold off sex until you become exclusive (I believe dreamergrl is also talking about this scenario).
aerogurl87 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 The way I see it, if you have strong feelings for someone, than yes, you'd want to become exclusive as a precondition to further dating, not just sex. It's the emotions that you invest in the relationship that make you feel like sh*t when it doesn't work out, not the fact that you had sex. On the other hand, if you are just taking it slow and trying to figure out how you feel about the other person, there is really no reason to hold off sex until you become exclusive (I believe dreamergrl is also talking about this scenario). Well some people, and especially alot of women I've noticed, don't know how to separate emotions from sex. So when they have sex with someone and it doesn't lead to a relationship, their emotions get involved and things get really messy from there on out. So I think that's why some people choose to wait I guess. Then as you said some people want to take things slow to figure out how they feel about the other person and that may also be a reason why they want to wait. Maybe they don't want to have sex with a jerk or bitch. I know I wouldn't want to, unless of course he was strictly a f**k buddy and then my only criteria are that we get it on at least twice a day and he be hot and really good in bed with no STDs.
threebyfate Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Well some people, and especially alot of women I've noticed, don't know how to separate emotions from sex.It's not that we don't know how since when you have sex it releases bonding chemicals, in case you weren't aware of that, it's that we can't and truth be told, don't have any desire to do so. Fighting your natural body instincts for something like this, makes no sense to me whatsoever.
dreamergrl Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 The way I see it, if you have strong feelings for someone, than yes, you'd want to become exclusive as a precondition to further dating, not just sex. It's the emotions that you invest in the relationship that make you feel like sh*t when it doesn't work out, not the fact that you had sex. Agreed. Which is why communication is important. On the other hand, if you are just taking it slow and trying to figure out how you feel about the other person, there is really no reason to hold off sex until you become exclusive (I believe dreamergrl is also talking about this scenario). Maybe I'm just speaking just for me, however... as long as it's communicated that we are taking things slow, learning, experiencing, and the guy isn't screwing other people, I don't have an issue with early on sex.
aerogurl87 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 It's not that we don't know how since when you have sex it releases bonding chemicals, in case you weren't aware of that, it's that we can't and truth be told, don't have any desire to do so. Fighting your natural body instincts for something like this, makes no sense to me whatsoever. Ok umm I'm a woman and I can separate my emotions from sex just fine. I think it's possible, but as you said some people just can't do it for some reason which isn't there fault, like it isn't my fault I can have sex with a guy and have no urge to see him again until I feel like I'm in the mood.
threebyfate Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Ok umm I'm a woman and I can separate my emotions from sex just fine. I think it's possible, but as you said some people just can't do it for some reason which isn't there fault, like it isn't my fault I can have sex with a guy and have no urge to see him again until I feel like I'm in the mood.You make it sound like it's a wonderful thing to be able to differentiate. I firmly disagree. This is what you're capable of doing and see it as a positive for you. Good for you. I have no desire to be this way, so my perception of it is that it's a negative but solely for me. As the French say, Live the difference!
Johnny M Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 It's not that we don't know how since when you have sex it releases bonding chemicals No pseudoscience please. There is no such thing as "bonding chemicals". Otherwise, a woman who got raped would instantly fall in love with the rapist. Bonding is a purely psychological process that can easily happen without any sex taking place.
aerogurl87 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 You make it sound like it's a wonderful thing to be able to differentiate. I firmly disagree. This is what you're capable of doing and see it as a positive for you. Good for you. I have no desire to be this way, so my perception of it is that it's a negative but solely for me. As the French say, Live the difference! I don't think it's wonderful or horrible, but it's just how my mind works. My body can be all over a guy and the sexual tension and chemistry can be great, but at the same time if he's not stimulating my mind and soul I will have no desire to pursue a relationship with him. I used to not be able to do that until I met an old friend of mine who I became the greatest of friends with after pursuing a FWB relationship for awhile. I then realized that it was possible for me to separate sex from love and all it's emotional attachments. Sometimes you just have to live and learn as you go along.
littlewhiterose Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 No pseudoscience please. There is no such thing as "bonding chemicals". Otherwise, a woman who got raped would instantly fall in love with the rapist. Bonding is a purely psychological process that can easily happen without any sex taking place. Woooooooow. DUDE. Based on what you've just stated, you've just rendered semen to basically a placebo or water. Semen is full of testosterone, which we all know drives the male do to what he does. Estrogen (in women) drives women to do what they do. I won't even touch the rape comment.
threebyfate Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 No pseudoscience please. There is no such thing as "bonding chemicals". Otherwise, a woman who got raped would instantly fall in love with the rapist. Bonding is a purely psychological process that can easily happen without any sex taking place.Don't even get into rape with me, since I have experienced an attempted rape. There are many other factors involved in that scenario, including adrenaline and all kinds of fight/flight instincts. As for bonding hormones, do the research on oxytocin. It might help to illuminate your mind...
threebyfate Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 I don't think it's wonderful or horrible, but it's just how my mind works. My body can be all over a guy and the sexual tension and chemistry can be great, but at the same time if he's not stimulating my mind and soul I will have no desire to pursue a relationship with him. I used to not be able to do that until I met an old friend of mine who I became the greatest of friends with after pursuing a FWB relationship for awhile. I then realized that it was possible for me to separate sex from love and all it's emotional attachments. Sometimes you just have to live and learn as you go along. Where with me, I have no desire to hop into the sack with a man I don't have all three, emotional, intellectual and physical cylinders firing. As previously stated, each individual is different. Women who can differentiate, all the power to them. Women who can't, don't even bother. No amount of experimenting, will change your natural inclinations, if your core values also align with them.
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