Sam Spade Posted October 28, 2009 Posted October 28, 2009 Well, as a woman I have to say that we plot more than men. We may want to do something, but we take our time doing it. If I decided to leave my husband, I wouldn't do it this year. I'd wait until the kids were out of the house. Basically, I'd plan my exit strategy years in advance and just grin and bear my unhappiness for the sake my children. It doesn't seem that men have that much patience. well, you just proved the conclusion that you tried to refute earlier - the dissapearance of sex - since it is accompanied with the above-referenced "plotting" - is a legit and smart ground for divorce, after all. Why be patient with someone who has already checked out? I'd strike first, so you don't have any exit strategy .
hopeful1980 Posted October 28, 2009 Posted October 28, 2009 well, you just proved the conclusion that you tried to refute earlier - the dissapearance of sex - since it is accompanied with the above-referenced "plotting" - is a legit and smart ground for divorce, after all. Why be patient with someone who has already checked out? I'd strike first, so you don't have any exit strategy . But most men don't. Women are the ones who file for divorce far more often than men.
mem11363 Posted October 28, 2009 Posted October 28, 2009 My wife does all those things. And she also connects in the literal sexual sense with me twice a week or so. However if you eliminate the sex and just leave all that affection - it is like an icy hot. The affection feels great - but without a moderate amount of sex - it leaves the man feeling even MORE sexually frustrated. So it is good and bad in equal amounts when without sex. If however the sex part is good then the affection is pure added joy. For me - sex about 2/week plus 5 nights of pure affection is heaven. That is what we both strive for. Right now I am in a rare state of mild deprivation - today is day 8. My eldest daughter - 19 - has managed to greatly preturb my lovely wife - which has caused sadness/angst/depression which has breached the stainless steel door of our bedroom and caused her to temporarily shut down. This is part of life - I am just being kind and supportive and loving because sad - is just sad. And it is hard to be very sad and at all aroused for anyone. Even a guy gets that. During this deprivation I am a little less affectionate - which is not nice to wife - so I will make more effort tonight to just suppress my overflowing testosterone and be a nice spooner.... I do not spoon my BFF. I don't stroke their hair or rub their knees. I don't give them back massages or foot rubs. It's not patronizing because there is plenty of sexual affection that goes no between a husband and wife that is NOT intercourse. You can give love without giving sex. It's unfortunate that you can't FEEL it without having sex, but it's most certainly given.
hopeful1980 Posted October 28, 2009 Posted October 28, 2009 My wife does all those things. And she also connects in the literal sexual sense with me twice a week or so. However if you eliminate the sex and just leave all that affection - it is like an icy hot. The affection feels great - but without a moderate amount of sex - it leaves the man feeling even MORE sexually frustrated. So it is good and bad in equal amounts when without sex. If however the sex part is good then the affection is pure added joy. For me - sex about 2/week plus 5 nights of pure affection is heaven. That is what we both strive for. Right now I am in a rare state of mild deprivation - today is day 8. My eldest daughter - 19 - has managed to greatly preturb my lovely wife - which has caused sadness/angst/depression which has breached the stainless steel door of our bedroom and caused her to temporarily shut down. This is part of life - I am just being kind and supportive and loving because sad - is just sad. And it is hard to be very sad and at all aroused for anyone. Even a guy gets that. During this deprivation I am a little less affectionate - which is not nice to wife - so I will make more effort tonight to just suppress my overflowing testosterone and be a nice spooner.... That's very nice of you. I hope she appreciates it. My brother was murdered a few years ago and my mom confided in me that my dad tried to have sex with her about a week after and she felt as if she would vomit.
EnigmasMuse Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 (edited) Maybe she was having sex in hopes he would help with the kids/house/chores..... Interesting that it didn't work either.... Nope I divorced him, I don't put up with crap. I also didn't have sex with him IN HOPES he would do chores or help with the kids etc. Sorry! And if you're a man ( or a woman) in a sexless marriage and things are not working for you and you've tried ALL and EVERYTHING you know to do, then yeah maybe its time to move on. Don't settle for less than you deserve, I sure didn't. Edited October 29, 2009 by EnigmasMuse
mem11363 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 That is such an awful story about your brother. I truly think everyone reacts differently to death. The day I learned my father died - I had an intense desire to connect with my wife. I truly loved my father - don't know why his passing effected me that way. I read that in WW2 - after a city was bombed people would make love like crazy amid the ruins. I agree that in some marriages the wife only shuts down in bedroom after getting frustrated to the point of giving up about stuff that she has asked/begged/pleaded with her man to fix. The irony is that in lots of sexless/low sex marriages it is NOT about the man being helpful etc. And in fact their are LEGIONS of men who have turned themselves into the perfect househelper - they do way more then half - and nothing changes because the issue never was their level of helpfulness. The issue in those cases is sexual aversion and no amount of housework is going to put a dent in that. That's very nice of you. I hope she appreciates it. My brother was murdered a few years ago and my mom confided in me that my dad tried to have sex with her about a week after and she felt as if she would vomit.
blair08 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 I think in sexless marriage threads and porn threads, its one of those situations where you're damned if you do and damned if you don't kind of things. In other words, no matter what kinds of answers or replies you get on the subject, someone at some point will make fun of, call you out on, bash you about etc, for your views/opinons on the matter. Its a rather touchy subject, and I would imagine more so for the ones that may be in that situation. And with that being said, IMO I think if a person is truly unhappy, and they know things are not going to change after trying many things, then go on about your life, and hopefully you'll find someone who matches what you want/need.
itmustbeme Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Oh yes I agree. And no one should have to put up with a spouse who wont to their share of helping out around the house or kids, acting like a child and that they are entitled to do something or have something just because they think they deserve it. Abuse of any kind, physical, mental/verbal/emotional etc. A spouse who wants sex or expects it ALL the time no matter how they might treat their partner etc. you know things like that is just plain inexcusable too, and should be brought up in a court of law as well, during a divorce or whatever, just a person who isn't getting any sex from their partner no matter the reason. I agree with what you wrote. And I would add that if a spouse will not meet your needs and it has been adressed then stop expecting change and do something about it. Every man should meet his wifes needs but a man should expect his wife to meet his needs also. This is the reason why I divorced my wife. She was happy as heck and she did not want to have to bother with sex. I tried for a long time and I heard every excuse. She got very angry with me when I tried to talk to her. She had every excuse so I tried to overcome all of her excuses. I am the same weight I was when I was in college and I was an athlete on a wrestling scholarship in college. I keep in good shape and I look much younger than my age. So it was not like I let myself go. My wife said I was very attractive so I have no idea why she just did not want to have sex. There were so many excuses and she just said she did not know. I tried everything. She had every excuse so I tried to lighten her load. Too tired (give her time to nap). Too busy (I did more of the chores). It went on and on. I recommend to all men to confront the problem and if she does not respond then take action. After my wife did not want to go to a marriage counselor and did not want to meet my needs I had enough and I stopped making her life comfortable. I stopped meeting any of her needs. Boy she did not like it when I stopped meeting her needs. I told her since she did not meet my needs I would no longer meet any of her needs. I told her that I wanted to show her what it was like being me. So I would no longer fund any of her shopping. I also told her that I really had no need to talk with her anymore since I knew it was important to her. Anyway she was livid after one week. She was crabby and she did not like it at all. To make a long story short I decided I would rather be single than lonely. I filed for divorce and my wife then said she would try and change but I just did not want to go through it anymore with her. What did I learn through it all? Confront and try to make thing better but expect your wife to meet your needs. If you have a wife that does not want to meet your needs then take action and if you need to be prepared to move on. Now divorced she has to work more hours and she is unhappy. I am much happier even though I use to love my now XW. If a person does nothing then there will be no change.
Sam Spade Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 ^ F*ck yeah! As any failed marriage - a sad story, but also reassuring that having and upholding boundaries is a lifeline connection to sanity.
hopeful1980 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 ITA. The night my bro died, I had sex with my husband. He looked at me like I was crazy when I started kissing him. I just wanted to be close to him in that moment and have some joy without thinking about what the days ahead would be like. But I'm not sure I could do that if it had been my son and I'm hoping my husband would understand. That is such an awful story about your brother. I truly think everyone reacts differently to death. The day I learned my father died - I had an intense desire to connect with my wife. I truly loved my father - don't know why his passing effected me that way. I read that in WW2 - after a city was bombed people would make love like crazy amid the ruins. I agree that in some marriages the wife only shuts down in bedroom after getting frustrated to the point of giving up about stuff that she has asked/begged/pleaded with her man to fix. The irony is that in lots of sexless/low sex marriages it is NOT about the man being helpful etc. And in fact their are LEGIONS of men who have turned themselves into the perfect househelper - they do way more then half - and nothing changes because the issue never was their level of helpfulness. The issue in those cases is sexual aversion and no amount of housework is going to put a dent in that.
kevinconner Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Right on itmustbeme. I'm new to LS and was thinking about common traits I've seen the other day. For some reason, I think too many men ( including me ) are just not wired to step in, rock the boat, cut bait and move on. It is so odd. I think men of the 50's and 60's were actually stronger willed (had less taste for sexless acts in a marriage ) than they are now. Women were not as near strong willed in the 50's as they are now. What has happened is that in the wake of women taking up arms and sticking up for themselves ( rightfully so ), somehow men have backed off a bit. And here we are. Complaining about sexless marriages and being paralzyed on what to do. I remember a comment my father made one day when I was describing my wife's mother to him. I noted that she had been divorced twice. He said, "...I would have divorced her more than that." I was surprised at how he stepped in and just laid it out b/c I am SO not like that. What the hell happened? Are all the strong men out there NOT on LS not taking crap and just hitting the court house while we're in here, trying to care too much and making sense out of it all?
Sam Spade Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Right on itmustbeme. I'm new to LS and was thinking about common traits I've seen the other day. For some reason, I think too many men ( including me ) are just not wired to step in, rock the boat, cut bait and move on. It is so odd. I think men of the 50's and 60's were actually stronger willed (had less taste for sexless acts in a marriage ) than they are now. Women were not as near strong willed in the 50's as they are now. What has happened is that in the wake of women taking up arms and sticking up for themselves ( rightfully so ), somehow men have backed off a bit. And here we are. Complaining about sexless marriages and being paralzyed on what to do. I remember a comment my father made one day when I was describing my wife's mother to him. I noted that she had been divorced twice. He said, "...I would have divorced her more than that." I was surprised at how he stepped in and just laid it out b/c I am SO not like that. What the hell happened? Are all the strong men out there NOT on LS not taking crap and just hitting the court house while we're in here, trying to care too much and making sense out of it all? We've probably gotten brainwashed into the notion that a marriage is more than what it really is - a partnership. Once the terms of the partnership are violated, then of course you should leave. the idea that it is more than that could easily enslave people into a hopeless battle to salvage a relationship with someone who no longer gives a crap about them.
Juniper22 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 I agree with the fact that I see some people tell others to just leave if they are not happy. However, there have been many times where I've seen others suggest to people to leave ONLY after ALL things have been exhausted first. I also see where there are many times a person will say they have tried ALL things and nothing has helped. That's because possibly trying to change the other spouse has not and will not work. Unfortuneatly I guess some are with spouses who do not want to change. That's when its time to make a decision on things. I doesn't mean you don't love or care for your spouse, but it does mean you have respect enough for yourself to move on if you're not happy. I see to, where a person will say they have tried ALL things, but yet will remain in the situation regardless. Then after that, it makes me wonder well, exactly how unhappy are they? I mean they are staying and putting up with it.
Sam Spade Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 I agree with the fact that I see some people tell others to just leave if they are not happy. However, there have been many times where I've seen others suggest to people to leave ONLY after ALL things have been exhausted first. I also see where there are many times a person will say they have tried ALL things and nothing has helped. That's because possibly trying to change the other spouse has not and will not work. Unfortuneatly I guess some are with spouses who do not want to change. That's when its time to make a decision on things. I doesn't mean you don't love or care for your spouse, but it does mean you have respect enough for yourself to move on if you're not happy. I see to, where a person will say they have tried ALL things, but yet will remain in the situation regardless. Then after that, it makes me wonder well, exactly how unhappy are they? I mean they are staying and putting up with it. Trying everything before leaving should be a given. Staying after that, IMO should not be an option. In the case of sex, even if it actually turns out not to be such a big deal eventually (e.g. I turn 50/60 and say, eh, what the hell), the issue still boils down to being rejected in your own marriage, and that is unacceptable, even if you can actually get by with the no sex thing... Staying under those circumstances could basically mean completely giving up, throwing the towel, possibly with shredded self-esteem etc.
Juniper22 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 (edited) Trying everything before leaving should be a given. Staying after that, IMO should not be an option. In the case of sex, even if it actually turns out not to be such a big deal eventually (e.g. I turn 50/60 and say, eh, what the hell), the issue still boils down to being rejected in your own marriage, and that is unacceptable, even if you can actually get by with the no sex thing... Staying under those circumstances could basically mean completely giving up, throwing the towel, possibly with shredded self-esteem etc. I understand what you're saying. I honestly believe I could NOT stay in a situation I was not happy in, whether their were kids involved or not too. Whether it was lack of or no sex, an abusive partner or whatever the case may be. I will not continue to sacrifice in the name of love if a person is not willing to do the same for me. But, what I would or wouldn't do, might not be what another person would or wouldn't do. Edited October 29, 2009 by Juniper22
mem11363 Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 This is the ONLY approach that produces a change. The change might be an honest conversation about sex - as opposed to all the previous discussions which were dishonest and evasive. It gives you a shot at a repair and it also ends a lot of marriages. The truth is that women are very different then men in this area. Many women are perfectly happy in a low sex/no sex marriage as long as the man is doing everything else they want and is not having sex with anyone else. I have repeatedly said that if you are a man - not getting your needs met - and you keep doing a splendid job of taking care of hers then it does not matter what you say to her - your actions make her certain that you are totally comitted so that she can safely ignore your requests. I do not know why fathers don't tell their sons and daughters this stuff. I know I will tell mine. I agree with what you wrote. And I would add that if a spouse will not meet your needs and it has been adressed then stop expecting change and do something about it. Every man should meet his wifes needs but a man should expect his wife to meet his needs also. This is the reason why I divorced my wife. She was happy as heck and she did not want to have to bother with sex. I tried for a long time and I heard every excuse. She got very angry with me when I tried to talk to her. She had every excuse so I tried to overcome all of her excuses. I am the same weight I was when I was in college and I was an athlete on a wrestling scholarship in college. I keep in good shape and I look much younger than my age. So it was not like I let myself go. My wife said I was very attractive so I have no idea why she just did not want to have sex. There were so many excuses and she just said she did not know. I tried everything. She had every excuse so I tried to lighten her load. Too tired (give her time to nap). Too busy (I did more of the chores). It went on and on. I recommend to all men to confront the problem and if she does not respond then take action. After my wife did not want to go to a marriage counselor and did not want to meet my needs I had enough and I stopped making her life comfortable. I stopped meeting any of her needs. Boy she did not like it when I stopped meeting her needs. I told her since she did not meet my needs I would no longer meet any of her needs. I told her that I wanted to show her what it was like being me. So I would no longer fund any of her shopping. I also told her that I really had no need to talk with her anymore since I knew it was important to her. Anyway she was livid after one week. She was crabby and she did not like it at all. To make a long story short I decided I would rather be single than lonely. I filed for divorce and my wife then said she would try and change but I just did not want to go through it anymore with her. What did I learn through it all? Confront and try to make thing better but expect your wife to meet your needs. If you have a wife that does not want to meet your needs then take action and if you need to be prepared to move on. Now divorced she has to work more hours and she is unhappy. I am much happier even though I use to love my now XW. If a person does nothing then there will be no change.
itmustbeme Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 There is a saying that goes “If mama isn’t happy then no one is happy”. You notice that there is not a saying that says, “If Daddy isn’t happy no one is happy”. Why because men are more likely to suffer in silence. We are conditioned to think that sex is bad. How can we leave a marriage because of lack of sex? We constantly grapple with that. The problem with that is men do not just consider sex a physical need they also consider it an emotional need. It is how men feel loved. It is not the only thing but it lets a man know that his wife loves and accepts him. That they are doing something that is only for him. Now picture a marriage like this. The wife goes to work and makes all of the money for the home or at least most of it. Now her husband decided that he loves his wife but he is not going to talk to her any more or only once in a while. Also she cannot talk to anybody else either. Just how happy do you think that woman is going to be with her life? Also imagine that the wife has sex with her husband 2 to 3 times a week. The husband also has time to golf which he loves since he does not have to bother talking with his wife. Wow life is good for him but for her it is a living hell. What is described above no one would wonder that she is not happy and wants things to change or she is gone. Yet my Ex could not figure this out. She never thought that I could ever leave for lack of sex. When I did file divorce she was stunned. Although when I stopped talking to her and stopped giving her money she was very unhappy. She was livid and I told her I am going to treat our marriage just exactly the way she treats our marriage. I will refuse to meet her two top needs financial support and time together (conversation). I even told her that if she saved up some money and bought me a new driver I would talk to her for a while. I did this because our sex life was something she would use to get things. When I did not want that from her anymore and stopped talking to her and cut off money to her life sucked for her. What is the point of all of this? Read this quote from the post above: The truth is that women are very different then men in this area. Many women are perfectly happy in a low sex/no sex marriage as long as the man is doing everything else they want and is not having sex with anyone else. I have repeatedly said that if you are a man - not getting your needs met - and you keep doing a splendid job of taking care of hers then it does not matter what you say to her - your actions make her certain that you are totally committed so that she can safely ignore your requests. This quote is right on. When I met all of her needs she was sure I would not leave. If you take care of your wife’s needs and she is happy or comfortable with it then you have no chance to change things. You also are not going to change things by bitching or complaining on a web site (although it does help to vent). You have to be willing to not accept it and talk with her. I am much happier dating someone else and not having to bring home a check to a woman who used me as a paycheck. My Ex did not want the divorce and she wants our family back. I have moved on but men are too afraid to move on. I went years without change but I am much happier now that I did something about it. If a guy is not willing to do the hard work then he will get nowhere. Another important thing is he must be willing to leave the marriage if she will not fix the problem. But do not allow her to get angry and do nothing and send you sulking after a fight about it(happened to me all the time). When I told her I wanted a divorce she told me I should have communicated this to her. She never thought she could lose me over this. I did not stick around to see if things would have changed but she sure did offer to change and said she would do anything just before divorce was final but I did not want to try anymore. Don't put up with it. I must also say that I don't think that a woman has to have sex with her husband no matter what. As a matter of fact she should not have sex with her husband if she does not want too. But she should also understand he should move on and find a woman that does desire him and does want to have sex with him. Ok that is enough for now but I just want to encourage men to do something and don't suffer. If you are a lousy husband than change and become a good husband and repair things. If you are a good husband and live in a sexless marriage then expect changes or expect to find a new woman who appreciates you.
mem11363 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 IMBM, As for a lack of raw lust - that happens and does not have to be cause for divorce. It can be supplemented/replaced by what I think of as "true love." In true love we make sacrifices to make our partner happy. We do this without hesitation, without conveying our lack of desire to participate and often we enjoy what we do simply by virtue of the fact that it makes our partner happy. If wife loves you enough to be glad to please you, even when she is not feeling lusty - that is a good marriage. If wife loves you enough to cross out of her comfort zone and tell you what she needs to enjoy sex more - that is a good marriage. A spouse who says - "I really love you deeply, just am not attracted to you anymore therefore will not have sex with you often/at all" is showing a sociopathic indifference to your misery and doesn't love you in the real sense of the word. Your wife was totally indifferent to your misery - totally. Partly because she truly believed it would never effect her. I often tell sexually frustrated posters - the worse thing you can say to a non performing spouse - the worst thing by far - is: "I would never divorce you over sex." That statement guarantees your needs will continue to be pushed to the very bottom of the priority stack. There is a saying that goes “If mama isn’t happy then no one is happy”. You notice that there is not a saying that says, “If Daddy isn’t happy no one is happy”. Why because men are more likely to suffer in silence. We are conditioned to think that sex is bad. How can we leave a marriage because of lack of sex? We constantly grapple with that. The problem with that is men do not just consider sex a physical need they also consider it an emotional need. It is how men feel loved. It is not the only thing but it lets a man know that his wife loves and accepts him. That they are doing something that is only for him. Now picture a marriage like this. The wife goes to work and makes all of the money for the home or at least most of it. Now her husband decided that he loves his wife but he is not going to talk to her any more or only once in a while. Also she cannot talk to anybody else either. Just how happy do you think that woman is going to be with her life? Also imagine that the wife has sex with her husband 2 to 3 times a week. The husband also has time to golf which he loves since he does not have to bother talking with his wife. Wow life is good for him but for her it is a living hell. What is described above no one would wonder that she is not happy and wants things to change or she is gone. Yet my Ex could not figure this out. She never thought that I could ever leave for lack of sex. When I did file divorce she was stunned. Although when I stopped talking to her and stopped giving her money she was very unhappy. She was livid and I told her I am going to treat our marriage just exactly the way she treats our marriage. I will refuse to meet her two top needs financial support and time together (conversation). I even told her that if she saved up some money and bought me a new driver I would talk to her for a while. I did this because our sex life was something she would use to get things. When I did not want that from her anymore and stopped talking to her and cut off money to her life sucked for her. What is the point of all of this? Read this quote from the post above: This quote is right on. When I met all of her needs she was sure I would not leave. If you take care of your wife’s needs and she is happy or comfortable with it then you have no chance to change things. You also are not going to change things by bitching or complaining on a web site (although it does help to vent). You have to be willing to not accept it and talk with her. I am much happier dating someone else and not having to bring home a check to a woman who used me as a paycheck. My Ex did not want the divorce and she wants our family back. I have moved on but men are too afraid to move on. I went years without change but I am much happier now that I did something about it. If a guy is not willing to do the hard work then he will get nowhere. Another important thing is he must be willing to leave the marriage if she will not fix the problem. But do not allow her to get angry and do nothing and send you sulking after a fight about it(happened to me all the time). When I told her I wanted a divorce she told me I should have communicated this to her. She never thought she could lose me over this. I did not stick around to see if things would have changed but she sure did offer to change and said she would do anything just before divorce was final but I did not want to try anymore. Don't put up with it. I must also say that I don't think that a woman has to have sex with her husband no matter what. As a matter of fact she should not have sex with her husband if she does not want too. But she should also understand he should move on and find a woman that does desire him and does want to have sex with him. Ok that is enough for now but I just want to encourage men to do something and don't suffer. If you are a lousy husband than change and become a good husband and repair things. If you are a good husband and live in a sexless marriage then expect changes or expect to find a new woman who appreciates you.
Toodamnpragmatic Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 but bravo...... Where are you Fallen Angel to add your 2 cents???? Or Lizzie to explain to itmustbeme, that his wife just didn't want to sleep with him, was bored and her libido has started up again with someone else????
soserious1 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) Now picture a marriage like this. The wife goes to work and makes all of the money for the home or at least most of it. Now her husband decided that he loves his wife but he is not going to talk to her any more or only once in a while. Also she cannot talk to anybody else either. Just how happy do you think that woman is going to be with her life? Also imagine that the wife has sex with her husband 2 to 3 times a week. The husband also has time to golf which he loves since he does not have to bother talking with his wife. Wow life is good for him but for her it is a living hell. What is described above no one would wonder that she is not happy and wants things to change or she is gone. Yet my Ex could not figure this out. She never thought that I could ever leave for lack of sex. When I did file divorce she was stunned. Although when I stopped talking to her and stopped giving her money she was very unhappy. She was livid and I told her I am going to treat our marriage just exactly the way she treats our marriage. I will refuse to meet her two top needs financial support and time together (conversation). I even told her that if she saved up some money and bought me a new driver I would talk to her for a while. I did this because our sex life was something she would use to get things. When I did not want that from her anymore and stopped talking to her and cut off money to her life sucked for her. What is the point of all of this? Read this quote from the post above: This quote is right on. When I met all of her needs she was sure I would not leave. If you take care of your wife’s needs and she is happy or comfortable with it then you have no chance to change things. You also are not going to change things by bitching or complaining on a web site (although it does help to vent). You have to be willing to not accept it and talk with her. I am much happier dating someone else and not having to bring home a check to a woman who used me as a paycheck. My Ex did not want the divorce and she wants our family back. I have moved on but men are too afraid to move on. I went years without change but I am much happier now that I did something about it. If a guy is not willing to do the hard work then he will get nowhere. Another important thing is he must be willing to leave the marriage if she will not fix the problem. But do not allow her to get angry and do nothing and send you sulking after a fight about it(happened to me all the time). When I told her I wanted a divorce she told me I should have communicated this to her. She never thought she could lose me over this. I did not stick around to see if things would have changed but she sure did offer to change and said she would do anything just before divorce was final but I did not want to try anymore. Don't put up with it. I must also say that I don't think that a woman has to have sex with her husband no matter what. As a matter of fact she should not have sex with her husband if she does not want too. But she should also understand he should move on and find a woman that does desire him and does want to have sex with him. Ok that is enough for now but I just want to encourage men to do something and don't suffer. If you are a lousy husband than change and become a good husband and repair things. If you are a good husband and live in a sexless marriage then expect changes or expect to find a new woman who appreciates you. I am a woman who lived in a marriage that became totally sexless for one year and that in the years prior to that we had sex less than 5 times.. this sad state of affairs was at my now ex-husband's request. I was also the sole bread winner in our marriage and can tell you from direct experience that attempting to limit my spouse's access to money and other items in an attempt to show him what his refusing to meet my sexual needs was like back fired totally. Now unless your Ex had a lawyer that got his degree out of a cracker jack box, I respectfully submit that as entertaining as your story is, I doubt it would fly in many divorce settlements. When my lawyer and my ex and his lawyer met for settlement talks, it was hammered home to me that my husband wasn't some sort of prostitute, that my depriving him of his "usual and customary" access to funds constituted spousal abuse, that in marrying him and allowing him to stay at home that what I had been granted was obligations and responsibility.. paying his bills didn't entitle me to anything except literally the obligation to either continue paying them or decide to end the marriage by requesting divorce. Haranguing, nagging or attempting to limit his funds because he wouldn't have sex with me was considered to be "cruel and abusive" I was made out to be rather perverted, disgusting old woman who's interest in sex was unseemly and unnatural. I ended up settling with him, giving him half the marital assets, I am also paying him $2,750 per month plus medical and dental for life unless he remarries. My ex now doesn't have to talk to me, nor does he have to have sex with me .. and he still receives a not insignificant chunk of my monthly income. Those in sexless marriages thinking the "I'll teach her (or him as the case may be) a lesson might wish to consult with a family lay attorney before attempting this tactic. Edited October 30, 2009 by soserious1
Juniper22 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 soserious, but why was he refusing to have sex with you? Obvioulsy that happened first before your limiting of funds etc. So I guess his not wanting to have sex, and your attempt to teach him lesson, you both were in the wrong. Its probably best you moved on.
soserious1 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 soserious, but why was he refusing to have sex with you? Obvioulsy that happened first before your limiting of funds etc. So I guess his not wanting to have sex, and your attempt to teach him lesson, you both were in the wrong. Its probably best you moved on. Why didn't he want sex with me? There are several reasons, all inter twined 1. I gave too much.. the man didn't have to work, he milked an old back injury that prevented gainful employment but strangely didn't prevent regular sessions at the health club. 2. His own mid-life crisis.. he worked out at the gym, went tanning, slept in, surfed the web looking at porn. I went to work .. he looked rested and youthful, I just looked old. 3. Different lifestyles.. you can't hang out till all hours when you've got a grant proposal due in the morning or important research to do. I was the adult in the relationship, he, the middle aged teenager.. I wasn't any fun. 4. His having to look at my aging face and body didn't turn him on, it only reminded him of his own mortality. It's easier to pretend you're still young when the women you're bedding are young. Having to stare your age peer wife in the face makes that impossible and he just couldn't face it. he also had odd ideas about women in mid-life and sexuality, he felt it to be unseemly and disgusting that a woman past menopause would have any desire at all.
Fallen Angel Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 but bravo...... Where are you Fallen Angel to add your 2 cents???? Or Lizzie to explain to itmustbeme, that his wife just didn't want to sleep with him, was bored and her libido has started up again with someone else???? TDP?? May I ask why you called me out on this? I have stayed well away from you, yet here you are seeming to want a fight.. funny, see the thing is, I happen to think that itmustbeme was amazing with what he did. So now what? But the thing is TDP, if you ever bothered to pull your head out of your...... well.. anyway, if you actually READ the things I say instead of jumping to conclusions that I am a man hater and lashing out angrily at me because of your assumptions, then perhaps you would have known better than to call me out in an effort to pick a fight with me over something that we agree on.. LMAO!! I agree, alimony is an outdated concept in this age of equality. Unless you forced your spouse to stay home and not work. Perhaps EVERY marriage should have to start with a prenup... Personally I would love to be a stay at home wife and mother, but I couldn't imagine ever denying my partner sex either (within reason.. obviously I say no at times, and he does also). But if I chose to live a sexless life, I would not expect my partner to continue providing in his "husbandly duties" ie finacial support. Perhaps I am not typical though, I tend to be more old fashioned in my ideas about the difference between men and women and their roles and responsibilities in a relationship. *shrug*
mem11363 Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 FA, This is not about you. And it is not about sex. It is really about love. Men in this deprived situation are angry their wives simply don't love them as much as they want to be loved. In this case someone really deeply loves their wife, expresses it daily, even intently and yet the love is simply not returned. Still it is a drag when you get lashed out at for holding the opposite opinion that you actually have. TDP?? May I ask why you called me out on this? I have stayed well away from you, yet here you are seeming to want a fight.. funny, see the thing is, I happen to think that itmustbeme was amazing with what he did. So now what? But the thing is TDP, if you ever bothered to pull your head out of your...... well.. anyway, if you actually READ the things I say instead of jumping to conclusions that I am a man hater and lashing out angrily at me because of your assumptions, then perhaps you would have known better than to call me out in an effort to pick a fight with me over something that we agree on.. LMAO!!
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