Virgo1982 Posted October 15, 2009 Posted October 15, 2009 NID, I think that's part of the reason affairs happen too. The cheater doesn't have a realistic idea of how much work and sacrifice having a family requires. They don't realize you have to rekindle the fire and really mean it when you say, "for better or for worse." In defense of SOME of those cheaters, the other partner should also make an effort to meet their spouse's needs. I have no problem with a BS being angry and lashing out. But if that BS is selfish and self-absorbed-even without being a cheater-I would like them to be realistic as well.
NowhereToHide Posted October 15, 2009 Posted October 15, 2009 Thanks Delajoonal. One of my parent's was blessed to have a step father who was wonderful. But there was still the pain of not being with the biological father and there was resentment toward the mother for leaving him. I struggled for months to end my A. My children helped me and have no idea, they are small. Every night when I contemplated leaving, I walked into their rooms to watch them sleep and kiss them. Hold their hands and prayed they would never know this discretion of mommy. But also pray for the happiness within my M. It would not be fair to them either to stay with my H if I did not have any desire. Someone posted and I also agree about your H being caught up. His OW did have much to lose with small children and she may have chosen to leave first. I hope he really loves her and not leaving because he feels obliged or wants to save her. How long have they known each other? How much time did they spend together? I sense you are very independent, strong, and respected. I honestly believe that if my xMOM's W were financially independent, healthier, and stronger, he would have left whether I existed or not. Yes he is an a&& for cheating, but it was not in his heart to leave her struggling financially and physically with two small children. We were all friends so I know her story, hospitalizations and such, there are some areas in his life that he will never be able to do with her. But I admire him for looking at the other aspects to improve their M. His W had more to lose than any of the adults, I had to put myself in her shoes. Even if she felt there was no choice but to accept his behaviour, I was not going to be the one any longer. Spoiled... I used to do the same thing. During my darkest days I would often go into my children's rooms and sit on their beds and stare at them and cry. I KNEW I could never leave them, no matter how much I loved my xAP. Being a child of divorce (from infidelity), I just couldn't do it. The interesting thing is that I've harbored so much anger and sadness toward my xAP because he didn't "want" me enough and that he ended our A with such insensitivity towards me. It's so irrational since I didn't choose him either. It wasn't until this moment of reading your post that I imagined him sitting on the beds of HIS two children feeling as though there was no way he could ever leave them, no matter how much he loved me. Wow. Now THAT is perspective. There is so much healing for everyone. All I know is that I wish more than anything that I hadn't responded to his first email. Too much pain.
candoit Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 he didn't tell me he was married until i found out on my own , i am saddened by the idea of him leaving his wife and kids , but i also realise that if he leaves , he is making that decision because he is unhappy in the marriage and chances are he was going leave anyway
Fallen Angel Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 I am glad that you are getting some answers, Dela. I am shocked, though, at the tone of the "I want him to leave" from some. Its as if no one is thinking of what is actually going to take place. A family is going to be broken apart. It seems that the MW take this into consideration in most cases (unfortunately, not so in yours Dela, I'm so sorry). There seems to be a form of denial going on. Some don't even mention *who* or what it is that the MM would be leaving. People get divorced all the time, but there is no point in pretending that a family wasn't torn apart by it. Even if they didn't have children, a family is torn apart by a divorce. In-laws often want to keep in contact with a former DIL or family member by marriage. I'm not making a case for the *wrongness* of wanting a married AP to leave their spouse, just a case for actually allowing yourself to acknowledge the truth of what happens. I think this is the number one reason why so many Affair marriages don't last - because the people in the A didn't think about how things would unfold realistically. We do understand. We do know the reality of what will unfold, but that doesn't stop the heart wanting what it wants. I liken it to, if someone held a gun to me and told me I had to decide between my life and the life of a stranger, I die or they did.. who would I chose to live? As hard as it is to admit, I would do what I could to walk away breathing.... I guess if I had been on one of those boats, the joker would haave gotten his fireworks show.. UGH, I am an awful person. I didn't walk into this knowing he was married, but now that I know, how do I stop my heart from loving and wanting him even at the expense of other people's feelings? (especially someone who is a stranger to me)
NoIDidn't Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 We do understand. We do know the reality of what will unfold, but that doesn't stop the heart wanting what it wants. I liken it to, if someone held a gun to me and told me I had to decide between my life and the life of a stranger, I die or they did.. who would I chose to live? As hard as it is to admit, I would do what I could to walk away breathing.... I guess if I had been on one of those boats, the joker would haave gotten his fireworks show.. UGH, I am an awful person. I didn't walk into this knowing he was married, but now that I know, how do I stop my heart from loving and wanting him even at the expense of other people's feelings? (especially someone who is a stranger to me) Fallen, this almost makes it seem worst. Your explanation comes down on the side of just being selfish, IMO. But again, I am not making a case for saying that anyone is wrong, just to be mindful of what is going to happen - to be realistic. Your heart isn't the best judge of reality, IMO. And I mean "Your" in a general sense, not you personally. As I said in my previous post, it seems that the MW posting here understand what they would be asking the MM to leave. And most seem unwilling to leave their families, so seem to be coming off as asking "why should he". As a married woman myself, I can see their point. I used to tell my H that if I ever had an affair it would be with a MM, and not a SG. I wanted someone who had the same to lose. Someone who wasn't likely to start stalking me or do anything to endanger my marriage. At the time, we didn't have kids. Now that we have children, I can't believe I used to think like that. And I know how unbelievably selfish that sounds. You are not alone in having some traits that you'd rather disown.
Spoiled Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 Spoiled... I used to do the same thing. During my darkest days I would often go into my children's rooms and sit on their beds and stare at them and cry. I KNEW I could never leave them, no matter how much I loved my xAP. Being a child of divorce (from infidelity), I just couldn't do it. The interesting thing is that I've harbored so much anger and sadness toward my xAP because he didn't "want" me enough and that he ended our A with such insensitivity towards me. It's so irrational since I didn't choose him either. It wasn't until this moment of reading your post that I imagined him sitting on the beds of HIS two children feeling as though there was no way he could ever leave them, no matter how much he loved me. Wow. Now THAT is perspective. There is so much healing for everyone. All I know is that I wish more than anything that I hadn't responded to his first email. Too much pain. Same here, I sent him several very ugly messages and called him at work giving him hell one day. Because like you, I was angry, why was I not good "enough" for him? Yet, he still was kind to me, still loving toward me, and still was sensitive through it all and I could hear the pain in his voice. I could see the pain in his eyes the last time we saw each other. Yes, I imagined my xAP in the emergency room with his W, caring for his children while she was in physical pain, rising early to prepare them for school, drop them off, pay bills, then head off to work 10 hour shifts. How could he possibly leave his family? I would have felt like the scum of the earth if I asked and/or expected him to leave. I'll never forget his words in regards to how he felt during one trip to the hospital with his W. She was in tears and telling him how she did not know what she would do without him and how much she loved him. It killed him mentally, it killed me too. I ended the A because we both were hurting terribly. I hope he finds happiness, joy, and peace. I hope he respects my decision, is not angry with me, and knows how much I truly cared about him. Cared enough to let go.
MistyK Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 Spoiled... I used to do the same thing. During my darkest days I would often go into my children's rooms and sit on their beds and stare at them and cry. I KNEW I could never leave them, no matter how much I loved my xAP. Being a child of divorce (from infidelity), I just couldn't do it. NTH, Why do you consider divorce the equivalent of leaving your children? When my H and divorced, I knew it meant I would have to share time with him, but we had to do that within the context of the marriage to getthings done anyway. "Leaving" them was never on the table. For women, divorce doesn't often mean all that much less time with the kids. My xH got a great deal because of our work schedules, so he gets to see them for at least 2 hours everyday (except on my weekends) in addition to his weekends and weekday overnight. So, in his case, he didn't lose much time either. Maybe that's why I didn't see it as such a tremendous loss, and why I didn't see why fMM couldn't do the same. Like my xH, once he seperated, he saw the kids every single day and remained completely involved. Divorce is one thing, leaving the children is completely another. Divorce in itself is NOT a decision to stop parenting.
Confused4Now Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 NTH, Why do you consider divorce the equivalent of leaving your children? When my H and divorced, I knew it meant I would have to share time with him, but we had to do that within the context of the marriage to getthings done anyway. "Leaving" them was never on the table. For women, divorce doesn't often mean all that much less time with the kids. My xH got a great deal because of our work schedules, so he gets to see them for at least 2 hours everyday (except on my weekends) in addition to his weekends and weekday overnight. So, in his case, he didn't lose much time either. Maybe that's why I didn't see it as such a tremendous loss, and why I didn't see why fMM couldn't do the same. Like my xH, once he seperated, he saw the kids every single day and remained completely involved. Divorce is one thing, leaving the children is completely another. Divorce in itself is NOT a decision to stop parenting.I'm with you on this...just looking at the numbers of 50% of marriages end up in divorce I'm sure a good percentage of them have kids. I mean people have to just deal with being co-parents. When I walked away from my marriage and I had a 12 year old at the time. It never changed how much time I spent with her....if anything it increased for me. It's what you make it....
Spoiled Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 NTH, Why do you consider divorce the equivalent of leaving your children? When my H and divorced, I knew it meant I would have to share time with him, but we had to do that within the context of the marriage to getthings done anyway. "Leaving" them was never on the table. For women, divorce doesn't often mean all that much less time with the kids. My xH got a great deal because of our work schedules, so he gets to see them for at least 2 hours everyday (except on my weekends) in addition to his weekends and weekday overnight. So, in his case, he didn't lose much time either. Maybe that's why I didn't see it as such a tremendous loss, and why I didn't see why fMM couldn't do the same. Like my xH, once he seperated, he saw the kids every single day and remained completely involved. Divorce is one thing, leaving the children is completely another. Divorce in itself is NOT a decision to stop parenting. NTH, Why do you consider divorce the equivalent of leaving your children? When my H and divorced, I knew it meant I would have to share time with him, but we had to do that within the context of the marriage to getthings done anyway. "Leaving" them was never on the table. For women, divorce doesn't often mean all that much less time with the kids. My xH got a great deal because of our work schedules, so he gets to see them for at least 2 hours everyday (except on my weekends) in addition to his weekends and weekday overnight. So, in his case, he didn't lose much time either. Maybe that's why I didn't see it as such a tremendous loss, and why I didn't see why fMM couldn't do the same. Like my xH, once he seperated, he saw the kids every single day and remained completely involved. Divorce is one thing, leaving the children is completely another. Divorce in itself is NOT a decision to stop parenting. Seeing our children daily or every weekend would not have been an option. We live 4 hours apart, if my xAP had left, his W would need to continue living in their hometown near her family due to her medical condition. My parents have been married 40years. When growing up, my father RARELY missed any of our events(sports, etc.) and it meant the world to my sibling and me. My sibling and I thank our father often due to our gratefulness and joy for his presence in our life. It frightens me to think I could possibly "hinder" this connection of our children with their fathers. You allowed your xH to see the children often. Many xWs only allow the visitation rights, nothing more. If my xAP would have left his family for ME, his W's friend, she would have done everything in her power to give us hell and would never let him see them other than what was given by court. Causing the children to suffer even more.
NowhereToHide Posted October 16, 2009 Posted October 16, 2009 NTH, Why do you consider divorce the equivalent of leaving your children? When my H and divorced, I knew it meant I would have to share time with him, but we had to do that within the context of the marriage to getthings done anyway. "Leaving" them was never on the table. For women, divorce doesn't often mean all that much less time with the kids. My xH got a great deal because of our work schedules, so he gets to see them for at least 2 hours everyday (except on my weekends) in addition to his weekends and weekday overnight. So, in his case, he didn't lose much time either. Maybe that's why I didn't see it as such a tremendous loss, and why I didn't see why fMM couldn't do the same. Like my xH, once he seperated, he saw the kids every single day and remained completely involved. Divorce is one thing, leaving the children is completely another. Divorce in itself is NOT a decision to stop parenting. I don't disagree with you. In most situations, it can be an arrangement that works well for both parents... sometimes even giving the father even more time than he used to have. However, with my xAP, he lived 8 hours away. To actually be together, one of us would have had to move. Even if a court let me take my kids away from their father, I couldn't have done it. And my xAP would have been crushed if he moved that far away from his kids. With that kind of distance, it makes visitation much more complicated. Could we have figured it out? Yes. Would it have been challenging. Absolutely. And I guess what it comes down to is that while we loved each other so much, we just didn't love each other enough to go through what we would have had to to make it happen. I've often wondered what would have happened if we lived in the same city. He once mentioned that, at least for him, he would have probably left for me. Who knows.
GreenEyedLady Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 do the OW want or even expect their MM to leave their W? or do they like being the OW? with no expectations, or limitations, etc.?? or do you want the MM to leave his W, so there is no more A, but an open relationship that you can now begin if your MM after divorces/leaves his W for you? this is what i mean by every A is different according to the situation. i guess it depends on if the A is about love, s-e-x, adventure, etc.? i am curious, because i know i will NEVER get the answers from my OWN H and his OW...you can't imagine how frustrating that is...no answers ever. (also, my H and his OW have both filed for D's, so this why i ask...i NEVER thought my H's OW would divorce her own H, as they have 2 very small kids, new home, a business, etc...too much to lose...so i am really in shock even more than when i found out about the A..i NEVER thought it would come to this, as well as my H's OW, made it seem she never wanted more than just the EA) but i am wondering, did my H"s OW expect him to leave me..as he did? ( i know no one can answer that here..but...) or does the OW like things just the way they are? being an A... i really appreciate anyone that responds and your honesty and being kind as well.. this is a very theraputic forum for me, so thank you again for your responses. First, I am a fOW whose MM ended his M... I am also a fOW who was lied to, yet when I found out over a year after the fact, I didn't leave him either. I expected to be the one and the only which for the most part was true. I took the tack that it was his problem he was married, not mine. I had very high expectations and when I didn't like what was going on, I broke it off. In fact our final break up occurred when I felt he was stringing me along and I told him that I wasn't dating a married man anymore and to look me up if he was single and maybe we could work something out if I wasn't dating someone else. Now, I also think our R was atypical. I seem to be more of a pain in the a** than other OW in general. I think that me not knowing from square one also has something to do with it. He also never hid me or treated me badly. But I was NEVER willing to be #2 and I wouldn't have stayed unless I felt he was sincere about leaving his XW. I thought from day one that it was a legitimate R and that it had potential (remember that I did not know he was married). It was very crushing to know that he had lied to me. We are now married. But I liken it to reconciling. It is difficult work. He has changed so much from when I first met him. I don't know your situation. Is your hope to reconcile? GEL
FeelingLonely98 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 I would love nothing more than to spend the rest of my life in his arms, as the only woman in his arms. OPEN LETTER To all future possible OW and OM - You meet someone. Something clicks. Something feels good. One of you makes the next step - takes the friendly and maybe flirty interaction to the next level. Maybe a touch, maybe a wink, maybe some words, ... It continues, it feels exciting, fresh, fun, new. At some point you find out that your "partner" is a MM or a MW. PLEASE, at that point consider telling this partner that you will never date someone that is married. That you are calling it off. And that you will not see them if the leave their spouse or even divorce their spouse. So tell them NOT to leave on your account. OM and OW - Please know how much pain that is caused by Affairs and destruction of marriages. My own 47 yr old STBXW told me if she didn't meet the 18 yo OM (OB?) that she would still be home now. And knowing NOW what I didn't know then I think we could repaired our M. We had 16 yrs. of great times and fun and love. And I believe the next 16 years would have been much better. OM and OW - yes sometimes I think the M your partner is in is VERY bad and they probably shouldn't be in it. But, from my discussions with others, my own experience, my interaction with the LS folks, I think more often than not the M could be ok and last a long time. If there were no OM and OW willing to hop into bed or "fall in love" with a MM or MW then I think we would have a much lower D rate. You are venturing into a relationship with a cheater and a liar. No matter how great the sex is, there has to be some remorse and disatisfaction in you. Even Lizzie, I wish folks like her would venture out into dating without commitment but do it with single folks. TOO much pain and suffering and hurt. Just ask trippi, sumdude, mrmayI, dela, ... ME. There are so many GOOD single available people in this world. Just wait your turn and find one of them. Speaking from my personal experience, the pain of a broken marriage is horrific, in some ways worse than death, because it feels like it didn't have to happen. Thank you, FL98 PEACE!
NowhereToHide Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 OPEN LETTER To all future possible OW and OM - You meet someone. Something clicks. Something feels good. One of you makes the next step - takes the friendly and maybe flirty interaction to the next level. Maybe a touch, maybe a wink, maybe some words, ... It continues, it feels exciting, fresh, fun, new. At some point you find out that your "partner" is a MM or a MW. PLEASE, at that point consider telling this partner that you will never date someone that is married. That you are calling it off. And that you will not see them if the leave their spouse or even divorce their spouse. So tell them NOT to leave on your account. OM and OW - Please know how much pain that is caused by Affairs and destruction of marriages. My own 47 yr old STBXW told me if she didn't meet the 18 yo OM (OB?) that she would still be home now. And knowing NOW what I didn't know then I think we could repaired our M. We had 16 yrs. of great times and fun and love. And I believe the next 16 years would have been much better. OM and OW - yes sometimes I think the M your partner is in is VERY bad and they probably shouldn't be in it. But, from my discussions with others, my own experience, my interaction with the LS folks, I think more often than not the M could be ok and last a long time. If there were no OM and OW willing to hop into bed or "fall in love" with a MM or MW then I think we would have a much lower D rate. You are venturing into a relationship with a cheater and a liar. No matter how great the sex is, there has to be some remorse and disatisfaction in you. Even Lizzie, I wish folks like her would venture out into dating without commitment but do it with single folks. TOO much pain and suffering and hurt. Just ask trippi, sumdude, mrmayI, dela, ... ME. There are so many GOOD single available people in this world. Just wait your turn and find one of them. Speaking from my personal experience, the pain of a broken marriage is horrific, in some ways worse than death, because it feels like it didn't have to happen. Thank you, FL98 PEACE! Well said. I will regret my A for the rest of my life.
Fallen Angel Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) OPEN LETTER To all future possible OW and OM - You meet someone. Something clicks. Something feels good. One of you makes the next step - takes the friendly and maybe flirty interaction to the next level. Maybe a touch, maybe a wink, maybe some words, ... It continues, it feels exciting, fresh, fun, new. At some point you find out that your "partner" is a MM or a MW. PLEASE, at that point consider telling this partner that you will never date someone that is married. That you are calling it off. And that you will not see them if the leave their spouse or even divorce their spouse. So tell them NOT to leave on your account. OM and OW - Please know how much pain that is caused by Affairs and destruction of marriages. My own 47 yr old STBXW told me if she didn't meet the 18 yo OM (OB?) that she would still be home now. And knowing NOW what I didn't know then I think we could repaired our M. We had 16 yrs. of great times and fun and love. And I believe the next 16 years would have been much better. OM and OW - yes sometimes I think the M your partner is in is VERY bad and they probably shouldn't be in it. But, from my discussions with others, my own experience, my interaction with the LS folks, I think more often than not the M could be ok and last a long time. If there were no OM and OW willing to hop into bed or "fall in love" with a MM or MW then I think we would have a much lower D rate. You are venturing into a relationship with a cheater and a liar. No matter how great the sex is, there has to be some remorse and disatisfaction in you. Even Lizzie, I wish folks like her would venture out into dating without commitment but do it with single folks. TOO much pain and suffering and hurt. Just ask trippi, sumdude, mrmayI, dela, ... ME. There are so many GOOD single available people in this world. Just wait your turn and find one of them. Speaking from my personal experience, the pain of a broken marriage is horrific, in some ways worse than death, because it feels like it didn't have to happen. Thank you, FL98 PEACE! I don't know why you chose me to quote here, but since you did I feel obligated to respond. I did not know my MM was married when our relationship started. We had been online friends for years, and through all those years he had never once talked about his wife. He never denied being married, but gave no indication that he was married so I never asked. It just was not important for me then, because we were nothing but "chatty friends" talking about the world and small talk, nothing too personal, nothing flirty, nothing sexual. But I liked him very much. I liked his personality, his views on things etc. and considered him a friend. Eventually I confided in him some problems I was facing in my life, hurts I was suffering both in and out of my marriage.. why? Because he listened. Our friendship was still just that, friendship. Nothing more. I never thought it would be. He was in the military, and after 9/11 we lost contact with each other for many years. I missed him a little at first, but it was just because he was someone who took the time to talk to me, and I was lonely, but not for him specifically. Then, about 3 years ago now, out of the blue he messaged me one night. It so happens that he messaged me on the night I was planning to commit suicide as a means to escape my abusive marriage. I did not confide that to him then, because we really didn't know each other, but that night, him taking the time to talk with me saved my life. We began speaking to each other online everyday, in time our relationship moved from friendship into an emotional affair and from the computer to the phone. We had contact several times a day every day, I called him when I left work at one am every night, he called me at six am every morning to help me wake up so I could get my kids ready for school. I fell in love, even if I didn't tell him. In time he told me he loved me. He told me that he didn't expect my feelings to be returned, but that he just wanted me to know how he felt. What married man does that? I simply didn't know that affairs like that really happened. Naive, I suppose, but i thought married men who had affairs were in it for the sex. I never knew a married man would devote such time and energy and emotion for someone he was not even able to kiss let alone have sex with. I still did not know he was married. I had no indication as such, because our romance was strictly on the phone and through emails, and as I was free to call him anytime, day or night, how could I know? I suppose I could have asked, and in hindsight i should have, but there really was simply nothing to lead me to that conclusion. Through his affection and attention I found enough of the 'old me' to decide that I did not have to suffer from my husbands abuse anymore. (And no, MM never pressured me to leave my marriage. While he knew a lot of what I was going through, I did not tell him everything, as I was ashamed about some of the abuse I had been subjected to.) At the time, I thought I was the only one 'cheating' though, I really thought he was single. I left my husband. I was totally in love with MM. And our relationship moved forward. By the time I found out he was married I was head over heels, and it was too late for my heart. I was furious with him, for having lied to me by ommission. I battled with myself for weeks as to if I could continue to see him now knowing the truth. I asked him why he would not tell me he was married.. his answer was in the beginning it simply didn't matter because we were doing nothing wrong. Somewhere in the middle he fell in love with me, something he never intended to do and was afraid if he told me he would lose me, in the end, he didn't tell me because he loved me and knew that because he had not been man enough to tell me before he declared his love for me, he was afraid I would hate him and cut all contact with him. But in the ultimate end I overlooked it, because the heart wants what the heart wants, and it will not be denied. Had I known he was married I would have never allowed myself to fall in love with him. I would have never allowed myself to open up so completely to him like I did, and I certainly would never have made love to him. If I had known he was married, there would have been no affair with me. Period. But what would you have me do? You talk to me about the pain that someone else suffers, and I submit to you that I TOO FEEL PAIN. Would you cut your own wrists to spare me from doing the same? NO. But when you ask me as an OW to think of the pain of the BW and because of her pain walk away, you put it in terms that is incomprehensible for me. It is not that I do not feel badly for the BW I do, I feel guilt, and shame. BUt please understand that I too am in love with this person, and that I suffer a pain just as great. I know you see many OW/OM after their affairs have ended say that their pain is nothing compared to the betrayed spouse. But I propose that is fallacy. I submit that my pain is equal to the pain that ANY betrayed person feels, because I was betrayed by him as well. But just as his spouse wants to hold on to him, so do I and yet you ask me to discount my pain and my needs for the sake of someone who i do not even know. Please.. if you want to plead to me, plead that I love myself enough to want more. But in the same breath, love yourself enough to want more from your wandering spouse as well. But don't ask me to see my own feelings as being less worthy than yours, when you do, it often falls on incapable ears. Edited October 30, 2009 by Fallen Angel
jennie-jennie Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 Thank you, FA, for telling it like it is.
Fallen Angel Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 Can I also add FL98 that by putting falling in love in quotes like you did when referring to my feelings was dismissive and hurtful. I really do love him. I am sorry if knowing that sometimes the love the OTHER feels is real is not something you want to see, but the truth is, sometimes it is every bit as real as the love you feel for your spouse and every inch as deep.
DiDi123 Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 FA- How are you today? Please take good care of yourself and although I am new here I have read so many of your posts and learned so much from you- thank you. You are helping me more than you know!!! ((hugs))
Fallen Angel Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 FA- How are you today? Please take good care of yourself and although I am new here I have read so many of your posts and learned so much from you- thank you. You are helping me more than you know!!! ((hugs)) DiDi, I am well today, as well as one can be in this. Thank You for asking. I am glad that my talking about the path I am walking is helpful to others, I hope in healing myself somehow I can help someone else to not have to walk the same path. But if it is a path we must walk, then I would rather walk it with some of the great people I have met here than have to take those long lonely steps by myself. I do not want to hijack this thread however, and since it will be some time before you have private messages, we can talk in the thread titled Fallen Angel, as I assume since the thread is about me, I can say whatever I want to there.. lol. Stick around, hun. There are a lot of people here to learn from. ((HUGS))
learnfrommymistakes Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 Hi I give you credit for coming here and asking and know you must be so hurt, and emotionally drained. I never expected/thought of myself as OW...for many reasons, but to answer your question, it was hell, hardest thing i ever went through. When I met the MM, he was actually separated. He was here on business and left his home area to get some space from his issues/etc. So i had no idea who would go back home and rekindle the relationship with his wife. He and i met, and fell hard, it was only over a few weekends, but it was intense, something i never experienced before. He left because his business was over where i lived, and went back home. We kept in touch and were missing eachother a lot..this is totally new for me, these intense feelings. Long story short, he went back with his wife, to try and make it work...He never lived near me, so it was just odd. I was shocked when he went back to her, and this is where all hell broke loose. I was already crazy abt him..nd had a hard time stopping it, i was sick by it, and felt mistreated because he did not tell me he went back to her, i got a call from her, asking who i was, and i was like..who is this. I thought she was just mad that they were separated and jeaolous ..but i had it all wrong, he moved back in with her...without telling me. MAJOR issues from there. I tried to cut it off totally, many times...I felt horrid guilt for ven talking to him, but we had this intense connection. I saw him abt once a year, when he was on business trips. Each time I felt disgusting, guilty, angry, sad, but also xhilirated and was in love...for the first time. I worried abt how wrong it was all the time, even tho i only saw him once a year, it ate at me. He needed to be there for the kids. I NEVER asked him to leave, or wanted him to leave her for me, but did want him to stop lying to her and was disgusted to a point that he would do this to her, and that i was willing to see him. I felt each time, he was in loveless marriage that had already almost ended and somehow, knowing they were separated at one point, helped me deal with the guilt a litt.e I broke off contact many times and beat myself up to the point of insanity (not really) but just felt gross and sick abt what i had done, and mostly what he and i were doing to her. They had an open marrige at one point, so he says, and there were issues, so it was complicated..he said she cheated, who knows. I found it very hard to move on, tried so hard, many time, but he stayed with me. I dated great men in between, and he just never left my heart. It is like a sickness really. I moved on to a great but the feelings for the MM just ate away at me and i wanted to forget him so badly. His marriage did end up falling apart, over time, not because of us, but because it had a lot of cracks. He separated and actually just got officially divorced. I was with a different man...but am now single again and it is OH SO complicated. Since we dont live near eachother its hard to know what it would be like in real life. I love him, always have, but also have had the deepest pain because of this relationship, being hidden, no one knowin who i was, his lies, his deception i assume. I dont know what the hell was going on, but it was the most painful time in my life, over abt 6 years. I have lost trust, never had it, and am stuck in between seeing him now that he is single and staying far away. When u are with a mm or even separated it does something to you, or to me it did. I lost trust and respect and dont think i could ever trust him based on the fact that he lied to his w to be with me a few times. My gut is in knots all the time from the past, and its a mess. I screwed up good relationships with great men becuse I could not move past this intense chemistry for the previously MM. So in short, lol..long... I never wanted to do it, i was already involved with him when he went back to wife, i thought he was in a bad marriage, i tried to stop it, i was weak and vulnerable at the time..so it was and has been the most difficult, complicated situation i have ever been in and i would urge and beg others to think long and hard before doing it. It is horrible on everyone..I know some OW will disagree and dont feel the remorse i do, but i am only speaking for me. So many get hurt and lied to, not just the spouse, but the OW gets lied to and has to live with things as they are. ITS a messy crap sandwich My heart bleeds for women who were cheated on, truly. I think it is so complicated..cause a lot of OW never planned on it, it just happened, some people want or like to be OW, they get kick out of it, but i hated most of it and felt powerless which is a cop out...i always had the spouse in mind, always..and feel like i ruined her life, even tho she did not know abt me, and i only saw him occassionally...i begged him to be honest with her, or to stop seeing me. IT SUX and still does....but i wont go into my issues, this is about you..and i hope u heal and find someone wonderful and worthy of you...You seem like a strong, capable, kind person and you deserve to be happy and not lied to. Hugs Learnfrommymistakes
OWoman Posted November 1, 2009 Posted November 1, 2009 Even Lizzie, I wish folks like her would venture out into dating without commitment but do it with single folks. TOO much pain and suffering and hurt. Just ask trippi, sumdude, mrmayI, dela, ... ME. There are so many GOOD single available people in this world. Just wait your turn and find one of them. FL98, I am sorry for your pain. And I'm sorry that your WW was willing to sell you out for what you present as so small a prize - I can understand who diminished that must make you feel. However, although I'm not Lizzie, I feel compelled as one of the possible "folks like her" (forgive me if I'm misinterpreting what you mean here) to take issue with your assertion that a SG would do as well as a MM for the purposes we (us "like Lizzie-folk") have in mind. IME, that's simply not the case at all - and I came to that conclusion from hard, bitter experience. SGs invariably start wanting more - at least, in the age group in which I'm interested; and no, I'm not prepared [was not prepared, at the time - am now happily M so it doesn't apply any longer] to play around with toy-boys simply to find something that really does want "no strings attached". We also have standards. And no, I don't see why we should "wait our turn" to find someone that someone else deems acceptable for us to get it on with. After all, that's between us and our intended - as two consenting adults. It's no one else's role to approve or disapprove who we choose - the person in question has the right and responsibility to accept the advances or otherwise. We do not belong to a homogeneous society where everyone subscribes to the same moral codes or cultural practices, and there is no family council to pick our potential partners for us. If everyone only ever got it on with someone that "society" approved of, we'd live in highly segregated enclaves where everyone around us looked exactly like ourselves, fearing and being suspicious of difference. Thank god that some people venture across lines of expectation and sanction, and break the rules. Were it not for the renegades, we'd have no science, no techology and no progress - just myth dressed up as religious doctrine.
MizzBlue72 Posted November 1, 2009 Posted November 1, 2009 This was a hard one for me. I wanted him to not leave his wife, and asked him to try to work it out more than once. He won't - he says the relationship is too far gone. I know that he is not leaving for me - but this still weighs on me. I don't want to cause any pain for MM or BS. I DO love him, but I would put him and his happiness before mine. I don't want to the OW.
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