SadandConfusedWA Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 At the end of the day, I don't know a single guy who has ever rejected a woman simply because he viewed her as too intelligent. There most often are other reasons: appearance, arrogance (perceived or real), his class or intellectual insecurity, etc. Exactly my point. There are some women that comfort themselves with thoughts such as "I am just too intelligent" when trying to reason away their singleness. It's almost never the reason though. They would be better off discarding that thought as non-sense and thinking of what they are lacking (i.e femininity, social charm, sense of humor etc etc).
SadandConfusedWA Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 P.S. All other things being equal, intelligence is only a bonus.
SierraMarie Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Why would you want a dude that's not even at least at smart as you? That's my question... I know I don't.
grogster Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 P.S. All other things being equal, intelligence is only a bonus. How much of a bonus? If we were to ask the males here which they preferred --a very large penis or very high IQ--what would they select? Or the women: A high IQ versus a high (PA) physical attractiveness. Intelligence is just a word for a mix of intangibles.Sure it can be measured, but that doesn't mean that it's tangible--like height, weight, physical appearance.
carhill Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 If we were to ask the males here which they preferred --a very large penis or very high IQ--what would they select? Interesting choice. Penis power depends on others (as external powers of all sorts do). Intellectual power, the power to reason, deduce, create, understand and perform, is power within; power which is immutable as long as there is life. I guess it comes down to whether one wishes power over others or power over their own destiny. I choose the latter, with the full knowledge that most women I've encountered in my life would make a different choice regarding a mate. IME, they are attracted to those men who have power over others.
OpenBook Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 My EQ brings all the boys to the yard. :lmao: You Go Girl!! I have witnessed this to be true as well. The attention that high-EQ women get from guys - regardless of whether the woman is a beauty queen or not - is so much different from the attention that high-PA women get. There's more respect, admiration, and kindness in it. They just get treated better.
grogster Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Interesting choice. Penis power depends on others (as external powers of all sorts do). Intellectual power, the power to reason, deduce, create, understand and perform, is power within; power which is immutable as long as there is life. I guess it comes down to whether one wishes power over others or power over their own destiny. I choose the latter, with the full knowledge that most women I've encountered in my life would make a different choice regarding a mate. IME, they are attracted to those men who have power over others. Wow, carhill, very well said. I know that I'd take wattage over inches, but I could never have stated why so eloquently.
GoodOnPaper Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 If we were to ask the males here which they preferred --a very large penis or very high IQ--what would they select? I vote for the former. From my experience, being a PhD intellectual has yielded very little "power" of any sort. Physical attractiveness, charisma, and social intelligence seem to get one much further and -- I would assume -- more satisfaction.
Author always_searching Posted October 3, 2009 Author Posted October 3, 2009 It's funny how everyone in this thread perceives themselves to be super intelligent. There are really not that many very intelligent people around (if you look at the distribution of IQ scores, you will know what I mean). To answer the thread's question, people of similar or "close to" intelligence are best suited to each other. How can there be a strong connection between 2 people if one person is intellectually much superior to the other? They perceive the world differently, process the information differently, will more than likely have different interests. I just don't see how a LTR would truly be sustainable if there is a huge disparity. So no, men don't turn you down because you are "too intelligent" and because they are intimidated. They will turn you down if they feel no connection and/or physical attraction to you. Really? I haven't read any thread where someone claims to be "super smart." If we are honest with ourselves, we have some idea as to what our intellect is: if we understand and comprehend certain things that others have a difficult time with; if we enjoy learning new things; if we retain what we have learned; etc. Do I think the majority of people are capable of being intelligent? Yes. Do I think the majority of people are intelligent? No. Here I am not referring to people who are Einsteins--those people are very few. I'm talking about people with a higher than average intellect, which are still fewer than most. This differs from what I call educated, in that people of very low intellect can go to school and get a degree--I've been in school long enough to verify this. The thread itself was directed toward men for a reason: women can think they know x, y, and z about what a man wants, but I just don't find that to be true, generally. Women who answer are generally going to spout off one of two things: (1) women who worry that a man will find them too intelligent are insecure and (2) men will not turn you down if you are too intelligent. From experience--personal and otherwise, the latter can be eliminated. Some men do indeed reject women on the basis of intellect. I've had men tell me this, even some men in the thread (i.e. Alpha Male and another whose comment was deleted) have admitted to this. So, do I think all men turn down women who are more intellectual than they are: no, clearly not. Generally speaking, though: men want to be the intellectual-heavy. As far as the former, most intelligent women I know are not insecure, nor do they go around treating people poorly or looking down on them. However, when men engage them in conversation, and the women clearly out-wit them with absolutely no malice toward the men or pride regarding their intellect: the majority of the time, the men lose interest. Again, as much as I love female input, this tread was directed toward men for a reason--women who are insecure about their own intellect tend to bash others for feeling secure in their own, claiming that those women who are interested in the thread's topic are insecure themselves; or they give the answer that they hope for, which is NO men aren’t put off by intellectual women. So, as much as I usually value ALL responses: unless you are a lesbian or a man, I'd rather you not respond. It's not helping me to gauge how MEN feel when women come to the thread and high-jack it with either their idealism or their own insecurity. Course, it's a public thread, and I can't stop you. But the whole point of this question was to get the MALE perspective--thus why I directed my question both in the title and in the thread itself toward men.
Author always_searching Posted October 3, 2009 Author Posted October 3, 2009 I vote for the former. From my experience, being a PhD intellectual has yielded very little "power" of any sort. Physical attractiveness, charisma, and social intelligence seem to get one much further and -- I would assume -- more satisfaction. No! Being a PhD intellectual is 100% hotter than having a large penis. The mere mention of "PhD intellectual" has got me hot, GoodOnPaper!
Trialbyfire Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Awww, Trialbyfire! *hugs* Indeed, we do rarely agree, but I enjoy your well-thought-out posts and that you are open-minded enough to converse with me, while not being judgmental--particularly regarding the God thread. Well, one day I'd be honored to hear your story, if you decide to tell it. I'm not sure what it was that you were insecure about, but I'm glad to know it's no longer a problem for you, as you seem to be a beautiful, thoughtful, and intellectual woman and, thus, have absolutely nothing to be insecure about! Thanks. The insecurity was tied into my ex-Hs cheating, during our marriage. It's kind of interesting (at least to me...haha...), how the human mind handles blind trust broken. No matter how much effort you put into attempting to be rational about love and trust broken, if not worked on within, it can have some detrimental side effects without. In short, my ex-H valued my externals, head and shoulders over everything else. So, in my mind, I rejected this valuation and needed to be valued for my internals, to an unreasonable degree, including intelligence, morality, personality, heart, lungs, duodenum, etc. The truly whacked out part, was that I got involved with someone who was superficial and selfish, right after my divorce was finalized. In retrospect, maybe I was looking for that place of comfort, as dysfunctional as it turned out to be. More probably, I was trying to right a wrong, by recreating the scenario and hoping for a happy ending. As it turned out, he remained selfish to the last, albeit no cheating since it never got that serious. Don't get me wrong, he wasn't an evil monster, just all kinds of wrong for me. He had many good traits, including intelligence. So, after that, I rejected man after man, if they displayed too much superficial interest, without the compensation of an unreasonable level of valuation of internals. I say unreasonable because the bar was set too high. Finally, I realized that I had to anchor to something, since it felt wrong. So, I anchored to my gut instincts which have, to this day, never been wrong. Also, in retrospect, I've survived and thrived, so if someone else were to cheat on me again, I'm not so fragile that I'll never recover from trust lost. In a quote from the Shawshank Redemption - get busy living or get busy dying. The interesting part was around that time of re-anchoring, I met my fiance, who's a very grounded, giving and caring individual. In essence, he reinforced that re-anchoring. So...that's my story about projection of insecurities, where it focused on intelligence and other internals, where it should have focused on trust lost. I never felt that I was "too anything" for anyone but the focus was wrong, so it didn't get fixed until the focus was on target. Anyways, for anyone who might benefit from my own experience, just make sure your focus is on target, which for the purposes of this thread, would be intelligence.
grogster Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 I vote for the former. From my experience, being a PhD intellectual has yielded very little "power" of any sort. Physical attractiveness, charisma, and social intelligence seem to get one much further and -- I would assume -- more satisfaction. Good point. I'm happy I have both.
IrishCarBomb Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Women of superior intellect never interest me because they never fall for my various traps to ensnare women into being my lady-servants (i.e. girlfriend). These smart women always see through my games and call me out on my bulls**t!! Why would any guy want to put up with that!?!?!? You'd have to be CRAZY to date any girl with moderate intelligence. The dumb ones are easily tricked, and easily impressed by my various card tricks and shiny objects. I can just make up stupid excuses and lame manipulation tricks, and these dumb girls believe it! Woohoo! Dumb women are the only truly beautiful women.
kdark Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 I personally find intelligence extremely attractive. The girl I had the strongest attraction my whole life was pretty good in the looks department, but very, very sharp. It's a shame she had a boyfriend... Dumb girls are a huge turnoff. As soon as I find out her favorite celebrity is Brittany Spears, or that her favorite artist of all time is Lil' Wayne, I don't care if she's a perfect ten, I'm done with her.
SadandConfusedWA Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Really? I haven't read any thread where someone claims to be "super smart." If we are honest with ourselves, we have some idea as to what our intellect is: if we understand and comprehend certain things that others have a difficult time with; if we enjoy learning new things; if we retain what we have learned; etc. Do I think the majority of people are capable of being intelligent? Yes. Do I think the majority of people are intelligent? No. Here I am not referring to people who are Einsteins--those people are very few. I'm talking about people with a higher than average intellect, which are still fewer than most. This differs from what I call educated, in that people of very low intellect can go to school and get a degree--I've been in school long enough to verify this. The thread itself was directed toward men for a reason: women can think they know x, y, and z about what a man wants, but I just don't find that to be true, generally. Women who answer are generally going to spout off one of two things: (1) women who worry that a man will find them too intelligent are insecure and (2) men will not turn you down if you are too intelligent. From experience--personal and otherwise, the latter can be eliminated. Some men do indeed reject women on the basis of intellect. I've had men tell me this, even some men in the thread (i.e. Alpha Male and another whose comment was deleted) have admitted to this. So, do I think all men turn down women who are more intellectual than they are: no, clearly not. Generally speaking, though: men want to be the intellectual-heavy. As far as the former, most intelligent women I know are not insecure, nor do they go around treating people poorly or looking down on them. However, when men engage them in conversation, and the women clearly out-wit them with absolutely no malice toward the men or pride regarding their intellect: the majority of the time, the men lose interest. Again, as much as I love female input, this tread was directed toward men for a reason--women who are insecure about their own intellect tend to bash others for feeling secure in their own, claiming that those women who are interested in the thread's topic are insecure themselves; or they give the answer that they hope for, which is NO men aren’t put off by intellectual women. So, as much as I usually value ALL responses: unless you are a lesbian or a man, I'd rather you not respond. It's not helping me to gauge how MEN feel when women come to the thread and high-jack it with either their idealism or their own insecurity. Course, it's a public thread, and I can't stop you. But the whole point of this question was to get the MALE perspective--thus why I directed my question both in the title and in the thread itself toward men. Whoa defensive much? You are calling others insecure, yet you feel the need to defend your own intellect (yes it comes through your post how offended you are by my comment). I did not address you personally and do feel like I can contribute to discussion. Two main points: You say that when you out-wit men, they get turned off. Why do you feel the need to out-wit men you are attracted to? Why are you more focused on having battle of wits conversation than on having a fun, mutually enjoyable interaction? As much as battle of wits can be a interesting, it doesn't help form a connection, affection or any kind of warm feelings. Personally, I engage in battle of wits with men I am not attracted to in romantic way. With the ones I am, occasionally it's OK, but if that's your main dynamic - you have go t a problem. You can not always believe it when men tell you that you are too smart and that's why they don't want to date you. I do have many male friends and brothers, and it's a lot easier to reject a female by essentially complimenting them then by for example saying: ("You just don't turn me on"). Most men and humans in general will go for comfort over honesty. If you look at this thread, an overwhelming majority of men told you that they in fact find intelligence HOT. Yet you chose to fixate on alpha and couple of others that say otherwise. Hmmm.
clv0116 Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 I've only met 3-4 women smarter or roughly equal, and they were all taken. I would have been interested, and someone obviously was. Whatever relationship issues a gal might have, "I'm too smart" is probably not the reason, but maybe "I'm a bitch" would fit.
stillafool Posted October 3, 2009 Posted October 3, 2009 Exactly my point. There are some women that comfort themselves with thoughts such as "I am just too intelligent" when trying to reason away their singleness. It's almost never the reason though. They would be better off discarding that thought as non-sense and thinking of what they are lacking (i.e femininity, social charm, sense of humor etc etc). :lmao:True, but what are they going to do? Admit to themselves that they are just not attractive enough to get a man? No, that could never be the reason. And, I think men do like intelligent women. Some men require a woman to have a law degree just to sit home and raise the kids.
Author always_searching Posted October 3, 2009 Author Posted October 3, 2009 Whoa defensive much? You are calling others insecure, yet you feel the need to defend your own intellect (yes it comes through your post how offended you are by my comment). I did not address you personally and do feel like I can contribute to discussion. Two main points: You say that when you out-wit men, they get turned off. Why do you feel the need to out-wit men you are attracted to? Why are you more focused on having battle of wits conversation than on having a fun, mutually enjoyable interaction? As much as battle of wits can be a interesting, it doesn't help form a connection, affection or any kind of warm feelings. Personally, I engage in battle of wits with men I am not attracted to in romantic way. With the ones I am, occasionally it's OK, but if that's your main dynamic - you have go t a problem. You can not always believe it when men tell you that you are too smart and that's why they don't want to date you. I do have many male friends and brothers, and it's a lot easier to reject a female by essentially complimenting them then by for example saying: ("You just don't turn me on"). Most men and humans in general will go for comfort over honesty.If you look at this thread, an overwhelming majority of men told you that they in fact find intelligence HOT. Yet you chose to fixate on alpha and couple of others that say otherwise. Hmmm. Okay, well a few things: (1) I wasn't just responding to your post--but to the over-whelming majority of female input. Your post just happened to be the last one I saw before addressing my concern. (2) I wasn't being defensive. I was merely re-re-stating the original intent of my thread which, again, was meant to evaluate male psychology regarding intellectal women. (3) If you look at the thread, you will note that the overwhelming majority of responses have been from women, not men. The majority of posts via men which remain have been for intelligent women, but a number of posts have been deleted that were quite misogynistic in nature. Had you followed the thread from the beginning, you would know this. (4) Please quote my post correctly--nowhere in it did I state that I try to outwit men, or that I find myself to be too intellectual. I was referring to conversations that occur between any two people, one of whom is an intelligent woman. Generally, if one is having a "deep" conversation, a stance is made and argued for. My example was referring to the case where one is having said conversation with a woman and the woman "out-wits" him, whether she intends to or not. I'm not suggesting that my intellectual female friends go up to guys trying to engage in argumentation and out-wit them. LOL, someone would have to be pretty self-important and socially stupid to do such a thing... So, as much as your input as well as all the numerous psychological considerations provided by other posters regarding why a woman thinks she is intelligent, whether said woman is really just ugly, etc. is interesting: it's not the point of this thread. If you find the topic of psychology regarding this topic interesting: start your own thread. The sole purpose of this thread was dictated in the first post, and was questioning how MEN felt about intelligent women. It has nothing to do with whether the woman thinks she's intellectual or not, it has to do with the male perception of an intellectual woman. Regardless, thank you for your being interested and responding, though I don't feel it has engaged in the original direction of the thread.
Author always_searching Posted October 3, 2009 Author Posted October 3, 2009 :lmao:True, but what are they going to do? Admit to themselves that they are just not attractive enough to get a man? No, that could never be the reason. And, I think men do like intelligent women. Some men require a woman to have a law degree just to sit home and raise the kids. Again, folks, this thread isn't relating to why women think they're smart: it is assuming that a woman is empirically of equal or more intelligence than a potential date, whether that potential date will respond well to her, or not. The idea is, all things being considered--the woman is funny, pretty, nice, etc.: whether having an equal or higher intellect is considered favorable from the male perspective. Wow. I am seriously surprised at the negativity regarding the concept of "intellectual women." It's as though intellect clearly indicates physical unattractiveness or some kind of insecurity. That's a really sad, narrow, and generally uninformed view. Just PLEASE REMEMBER: this thread is assuming that the woman is empirically smart--not that she believes she is, but that the man interacting with her perceives her to have equal or higher intellect than himself. THE QUESTION IS: MEN, how do you feel about said woman? This isn't meant to question the woman's psychology, but the male's! I never thought off-topicness would bother me, but some of these responses are just way off my intended mark.
Author always_searching Posted October 4, 2009 Author Posted October 4, 2009 For those of you wanting to post about the psychology behind being an intellectual women, which so many of you seem interested in doing: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?p=2418506#post2418506 There you go! Enjoy!
You'reasian Posted October 4, 2009 Posted October 4, 2009 (edited) Okay, well a few things: (1) I wasn't just responding to your post--but to the over-whelming majority of female input. Your post just happened to be the last one I saw before addressing my concern. (2) I wasn't being defensive. I was merely re-re-stating the original intent of my thread which, again, was meant to evaluate male psychology regarding intellectal women. (3) If you look at the thread, you will note that the overwhelming majority of responses have been from women, not men. The majority of posts via men which remain have been for intelligent women, but a number of posts have been deleted that were quite misogynistic in nature. Had you followed the thread from the beginning, you would know this. (4) Please quote my post correctly--nowhere in it did I state that I try to outwit men, or that I find myself to be too intellectual. I was referring to conversations that occur between any two people, one of whom is an intelligent woman. Generally, if one is having a "deep" conversation, a stance is made and argued for. My example was referring to the case where one is having said conversation with a woman and the woman "out-wits" him, whether she intends to or not. I'm not suggesting that my intellectual female friends go up to guys trying to engage in argumentation and out-wit them. LOL, someone would have to be pretty self-important and socially stupid to do such a thing... So, as much as your input as well as all the numerous psychological considerations provided by other posters regarding why a woman thinks she is intelligent, whether said woman is really just ugly, etc. is interesting: it's not the point of this thread. If you find the topic of psychology regarding this topic interesting: start your own thread. The sole purpose of this thread was dictated in the first post, and was questioning how MEN felt about intelligent women. It has nothing to do with whether the woman thinks she's intellectual or not, it has to do with the male perception of an intellectual woman. Regardless, thank you for your being interested and responding, though I don't feel it has engaged in the original direction of the thread. Ok, Jersey Shortie Plenty of men like intelligent women. Plenty of men dislike and disregard intelligent women whom are over argumentative, demeaning, manipulative or overcritical. Men would adore a woman more intelligent than himself, provided she was easy to get along with. Edited October 4, 2009 by You'reasian
Author always_searching Posted October 4, 2009 Author Posted October 4, 2009 Ok, Jersey Shortie Plenty of men like intelligent women. Plenty of men dislike intelligent women whom are over argumentative, demeaning, manipulative or overcritical. Men would adore a woman more intelligent than himself, provided she was easy to get along with. Who's Jersey Shortie? I agree that being argumentative isn't a good quality for anyone to have... ...generally. Actually, I get off on a man intellectually trumping me in an argument: bringing up the etymology of words, the element of historicity that must to be taken into account in order to comprehend the intentionality of the author, and quoting obscure texts in order to prove his point...oh, I just... Ah-hum, yeah, but that's just me.
GoodOnPaper Posted October 4, 2009 Posted October 4, 2009 No! Being a PhD intellectual is 100% hotter than having a large penis. The mere mention of "PhD intellectual" has got me hot, GoodOnPaper! Why didn't women like you exist 15 years ago?? I think the two biggest things to take from this thread are what TBF said about vibes and what Grogster and I said about how intellect has a hard time standing by itself but can REALLY enhance an entire package. Vibing right is BIG -- it may mean different things for different men, but for me it means that senses of humor really sync. If the vibing is there, then intellect can really be a turn on. I'm not surprised you're into older men. Getting to know who you are and what you like is a result of time and experience. Chances are that many men who would really dig your intellect may not have gotten a lot of experience when younger -- hence the time factor.
OpenBook Posted October 4, 2009 Posted October 4, 2009 Plenty of men like intelligent women. Plenty of men dislike and disregard intelligent women whom are over argumentative, demeaning, manipulative or overcritical. Men would adore a woman more intelligent than himself, provided she was easy to get along with. My thoughts (and experience) exactly!!! Well said, Y'Asian!
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