Author Jaytb Posted September 25, 2009 Author Posted September 25, 2009 What would be worse and make you want to dump your partner quicker if they A. gained 20-30ish pounds or B. started smoking I bet ya most will say A.. I agree with the other posters, definitely no smokers for me ! But it is about health and more! Like, for instance, compatibility. I like to take long walks and I ride my bike too. I also like to swim and I snowboard occasionally. Now I'm not saying that if you're overweight you can't do those things, but you are less likely to be active physically. So I would like to enjoy those things with my partner as much as I can. So I guess what I'm getting at is that many people here are assuming that weight issues are only about appearances, which is false in my case. It's about more than just appearance for me.
stace79 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 bitter? defensive? not at all. just want some opinions 1. Because for men, I'd bet 9/10 times they don't give a crap about why a woman might have put on 10 pounds. They just care that all of a sudden you have a little pooch in your belly or a bit of a muffin top in your jeans. So it isn't that you are concerned about a woman's overall health; you just want someone who looks good in a bikini/miniskirt/tube top. 2. Men will frequently list weight gain as the only reason they suddenly have a problem with their relationship. So it's like, what, your girlfriend's personality or devotion or intelligence or nothing else are valuable enough to stick with her? That makes me conclude that you could insert any personality into a skinny girl's body, and most men would be happy. They don't care about the type of person you are; they just want someone who fits society's definition of thin and beautiful to parade around on their arm. I frequently find that it's not even that the man notices the weight gain or dislikes it -- it's usually he's afraid of what his friends will say if his gf gets a little more poochy. Total shallow and superficial. However, no, not every man is like that. Just more than I'm happy about.
stace79 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 I agree with the other posters, definitely no smokers for me ! But it is about health and more! Like, for instance, compatibility. I like to take long walks and I ride my bike too. I also like to swim and I snowboard occasionally. Now I'm not saying that if you're overweight you can't do those things, but you are less likely to be active physically. So I would like to enjoy those things with my partner as much as I can. So I guess what I'm getting at is that many people here are assuming that weight issues are only about appearances, which is false in my case. It's about more than just appearance for me. Well this is not proving anything. I used to work with a chick who was pretty hefty -- I'd bet at least a size 16. But she was in incredible health! She participated in triathlons and bike races. She was just a big girl. But she was healthy, exercised a lot and was more active than most of the waifs we worked with. I'd bet you still wouldn't date her because she wasn't thin, even though she was healthy and would probably have run circles around you.
samspade Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 Men define what's attractive in women, just as women define what's attractive in men. Men generally prize physical beauty, sexual availability, skinniness, and youth, among other things. Of course, every man is different. If you don't believe me, ask yourself how many cosmetic products are sold that are designed to make a woman look older, fatter, uglier, or more manly.
Sam Spade Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 Well this is not proving anything. I used to work with a chick who was pretty hefty -- I'd bet at least a size 16. But she was in incredible health! She participated in triathlons and bike races. She was just a big girl. But she was healthy, exercised a lot and was more active than most of the waifs we worked with. I'd bet you still wouldn't date her because she wasn't thin, even though she was healthy and would probably have run circles around you. Sumo wrestlers are also very healthy and active .
stace79 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 Sumo wrestlers are also very healthy and active . I am not the one claiming that I won't date an overweight person for "health reasons". And I don't believe they are actually healthy.... slightly active, maybe, but not healthy.
carhill Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 Yes. Without a doubt. Your room 101 will have a Playmate in it. Or possibly a dominatrix. You better fear black leather. 500lb dominatrix in leather. Yum. I call it the divide and conquer strategy. Seriously, for the record, my stbx was at least 50lbs over healthy and it never affected my feelings towards her. That erstwhile angry and mostly distant personality, yeppers. She was essentially the same weight when we split up as when we met.
Trialbyfire Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 I get that sometimes it's not easy to keep it together all the time, so of course some people gain weight in the short term. That's ok with me. But if, once your stressful period is over, is your partner going to get back to a healthy routine or just do the same things and end up gaining weight consistently over time?It depends. Part of the equation is how supportive their SOs are. If an SO bludgeons them about their weight gain during this short-term duration, do you think this will have any effect on how quickly they get over their stressful period, particularly with someone who doesn't have a reasonable level of self-esteem or functional coping tools? For me, it becomes a question of: does she put any effort into staying fit or does she do nothing about her weight?That's a question that should have been figured out during the dating process or short-term relationship aspect. IF you've already previously defined that this person strongly believes in remaining healthy and then, suddenly gains weight in a 180 turn-around, either they were lying previously or they're going through some really serious emotional trauma. Ironically my gf actually loses weight during stressful periods. I actually tell her to eat hamburgers and other fatty stuff when that happens, haha. Although I suppose those saturated fats aren't so good for you:eek:Saturated fats can kill, no matter what size you are. Some people who look thin, are actually really unhealthy, since fat can gather around organs, without being visibly displayed. Look to if they smoke, drink excessively, what they eat and if their exercise regime is regular, v. dragging themselves to the gym, bitching and griping all the way.
clv0116 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 If I see a woman and she's not physically attractive to me, I'm done, I already know all I need to know about whether or not I'd date her. If I hear a girl talking and her voice is just super annoying, I ALSO know all I need to know, and her looks don't matter. Just because looking bad is a disqualifier it does not follow that all it takes is to look good. Most women and many men here can't seem to figure that out. Weight gain is a real issue and in America I think it's something a guy should get pretty afraid of. There is a profile of a frumpy-looking guy on one of my dating sites who is 56 years old. He seems to be an intelligent, home-owner, businessman with varied interests. What cracks me up is that based on some of his interests, he seems like someone I could at least have an interesting conversation with. EXCEPT that in his profile, he states he is only looking for women between 18 and 30 but emphatically states, "No Goldiggers." I don't see your point.
ebab83 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 I would say that sadly in order to pro-create we all need to have sex, in order to do this we must find someone sexually arousing. I do think however, that people who would either date you in secret or choose not to date you at all based on the exterior characteristics are very shallow. I personally don't have a 'type'. I find a connection of the mind is very attractive, and usually when this happens i start to look at the guy in a different way to before. Suddenly taking more notice of features and quirks and finding them to actually be lovely. What i mean to say is, sometimes i can appreciate a good looking guy or fit looking guy. Sometimes i can appreciate that little belly or odd nose shape equally as attractive.
Author Jaytb Posted September 25, 2009 Author Posted September 25, 2009 2. Men will frequently list weight gain as the only reason they suddenly have a problem with their relationship. Where is this the case? So it's like, what, your girlfriend's personality or devotion or intelligence or nothing else are valuable enough to stick with her? That makes me conclude that you could insert any personality into a skinny girl's body, and most men would be happy. They don't care about the type of person you are; they just want someone who fits society's definition of thin and beautiful to parade around on their arm. not true for me. I don't think many men dump their gfs the second they gain a pound. I just don't see that as the case much of the time. Usually if a man dumps his gf it's likely for several reasons. And no, I can't get along with certain personality types. So a skinny girl who's narcissistic is a no no. I frequently find that it's not even that the man notices the weight gain or dislikes it -- it's usually he's afraid of what his friends will say if his gf gets a little more poochy. Total shallow and superficial. that's childish behavior yes. However, no, not every man is like that. Just more than I'm happy about. What would you be happy about then? Well this is not proving anything. I used to work with a chick who was pretty hefty -- I'd bet at least a size 16. But she was in incredible health! She participated in triathlons and bike races. She was just a big girl. But she was healthy, exercised a lot and was more active than most of the waifs we worked with. I'd bet you still wouldn't date her because she wasn't thin, even though she was healthy and would probably have run circles around you. well this isn't proving anything either lol
clv0116 Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 1. Because for men, I'd bet 9/10 times they don't give a crap about why a woman might have put on 10 pounds. They just care that all of a sudden you have a little pooch in your belly or a bit of a muffin top in your jeans. So it isn't that you are concerned about a woman's overall health; you just want someone who looks good in a bikini/miniskirt/tube top. 2. Men will frequently list weight gain as the only reason they suddenly have a problem with their relationship. First, yes. I generally don't care why, I worry about when the next 10, and the next, etc. are following along and I think about what I can do to head that off. Secondly, probably true but most likely because that's what often changes for the worse. If a GF suddenly starts acting like a complete c*nt then I guess that would be something to also complain about, but it seems like a sudden change in personality like that is pretty rare.
SoulSearch_CO Posted September 26, 2009 Posted September 26, 2009 Some people who look thin, are actually really unhealthy, since fat can gather around organs, without being visibly displayed. Look to if they smoke, drink excessively, what they eat and if their exercise regime is regular, v. dragging themselves to the gym, bitching and griping all the way. Yep. Friend I used to have was SO tiny - Asian. Very beautiful, the guys DROOLED over her. Incredibly unhealthy. Her blood pressure was through the roof. Ate junk, smoked, didn't work out. And yet, she was skinny, so that's all that mattered to guys.
yongyong Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 Get a woman who doesn't seem like your GF (even better if you guys can make it to Jerry springer's weird couple eg: very skinny guy n very fat girl couple) Although you get disgusted just by looking at her, be patient. hypnotize yourself by saying "she must have good personality. people say they look at their bf/gf personality first. so as long as she is sweet, then it should be fine. plus I will be categorized as 'the most deep hearted guy' in my social circle" whereever you walk with her, people certainly will pay attention to you guys cuz you guys are totally opposite. BUT they will pay deep respect to you since you are the most unshallow person they've ever seen. are you with me? can you figure out what I am trying to say here?
Isolde Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 Umm... I hope you're being sarcastic yongyong. That's dating for validation, just in a different way from usual.
stace79 Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 First, yes. I generally don't care why, I worry about when the next 10, and the next, etc. are following along and I think about what I can do to head that off. Secondly, probably true but most likely because that's what often changes for the worse. If a GF suddenly starts acting like a complete c*nt then I guess that would be something to also complain about, but it seems like a sudden change in personality like that is pretty rare. See, at least you are honest about being shallow. It's the guys who pretend they are not shallow who bother me most. At least a guy who will come right out and admit his superficiality, I can dismiss right from the start, knowing that his personality will never really be attractive to me anyway, so we're set! No wasted time.
Jersey Shortie Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 Good first post Jay. I think actually you touch on things that both men and women can think and feel. "(ignore this if you're a woman, you can expect to marry a Brad Pitt look-alike CEO with a huge cawk. You would not be shallow at all, because of course you deserve all this in a man and more, no matter what you offer)" See now you think women are saying they "deserve" Brad Pitt (for the record I don't think Brad Pitt is a prize). And alot of women here think men are saying they deserve Playboy Playmate of the year while he can be the average Joe. You are arguing about the pressure you feel as a man and alot of women are talking about the same kind of pressure they pick up on as a woman. All women are inherently worried about their bodies at some point in their life and all of us have something we wish we could change..okay most of us. Like 99.1%. So it's not that women expect or even want Brad Pitt it's that we worry that our bodies aren't good enough for what a man might want when put up against the images he sees daily of other women. I want to know, why is it that if you show concern about your partner's weight gain, that means you're shallow and you only care about weight? seems like you care about the health issues involved with weight gain, no? I mean, I don't mind a little weight gain, but at what point does a little weight gain start to become too much? I guess 20-30 pounds is ok, but will that be it? will it end at only 30 pounds, or continue until 50, 100, 500 pounds? (lol maybe not 500) That's sort of my reasoning, and I think that's what seems to bother men about weight gain. Lets be honest, most men aren't thinking about weight gain and saying "damn, she is being so unhealthy I don't care if she is fat as long as she is healthy". Most guys are looking at the extra on a purely visual basis. They might want their partner to be healthy but that isn't the main focal point why men get upset at a partners weight gain. And when a man shows "concern" (what alot of women would say is "critism") for her weight gain, she starts wondering what else he doesn't like, if he expects her to have the kind of body that men regularly absorb through the media and wonders what other expectations he has. The truth is it is ALOT harder for women to be naturally slim then it is men. Women have more fat. So it's ironic that men ask us to be the complete opposite of what women have more naturally and hold us to stricter set of rules. At the end of the day you are basically talkign about this subjects because you feel like you aren't being heard and being critized from other women. And women are coming from the same exact place on the other end of the specturm.
Author Jaytb Posted September 28, 2009 Author Posted September 28, 2009 Good first post Jay. I think actually you touch on things that both men and women can think and feel. See now you think women are saying they "deserve" Brad Pitt (for the record I don't think Brad Pitt is a prize). that was designed to be specifically hyperbolic and absurd lol. And alot of women here think men are saying they deserve Playboy Playmate of the year while he can be the average Joe. You are arguing about the pressure you feel as a man and alot of women are talking about the same kind of pressure they pick up on as a woman. All women are inherently worried about their bodies at some point in their life and all of us have something we wish we could change..okay most of us. Like 99.1%. So it's not that women expect or even want Brad Pitt it's that we worry that our bodies aren't good enough for what a man might want when put up against the images he sees daily of other women. I'd say women need not worry about their bodies. If a guy can't handle a heavy woman, then the two aren't a match in the first place. Why worry about what some jerk thinks about you? Lets be honest, most men aren't thinking about weight gain and saying "damn, she is being so unhealthy I don't care if she is fat as long as she is healthy". Most guys are looking at the extra on a purely visual basis. They might want their partner to be healthy but that isn't the main focal point why men get upset at a partners weight gain. Men can have more than one thought at once. Part of it is "yeah, she looks bad" but the other part is "what is she doing to herself to gain weight?" At least I ask myself that. (well I'm not dating everyone I see so I don't think really about other people's lifestyles anyway) And when a man shows "concern" (what alot of women would say is "critism") for her weight gain, she starts wondering what else he doesn't like, if he expects her to have the kind of body that men regularly absorb through the media and wonders what other expectations he has. well a) he should be upfront about expectations and therefore she won't have doubts in her mind and b) she should ask about what his expectations are if he isn't upfront about it. Same thing with genders reversed. The truth is it is ALOT harder for women to be naturally slim then it is men. I think it's harder for women to lose weight. It's not any harder for them stay thin (given similar caloric intake and exercise levels). (health problems and pregnancy complicates the situation but I make exceptions for those things) Women have more fat. So it's ironic that men ask us to be the complete opposite of what women have more naturally and hold us to stricter set of rules. women have a higher body fat percentage. That's natural. It doesn't give you free reign to become 200+ pounds and say it's natural though. At the end of the day you are basically talkign about this subjects because you feel like you aren't being heard and being critized from other women. And women are coming from the same exact place on the other end of the specturm. I'm talking about this just to talk about it. I wanted to tell people that there is more complexity to this issue than meets the eye.
cognac Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 1. Because for men, I'd bet 9/10 times they don't give a crap about why a woman might have put on 10 pounds. They just care that all of a sudden you have a little pooch in your belly or a bit of a muffin top in your jeans. So it isn't that you are concerned about a woman's overall health; you just want someone who looks good in a bikini/miniskirt/tube top. 2. Men will frequently list weight gain as the only reason they suddenly have a problem with their relationship. So it's like, what, your girlfriend's personality or devotion or intelligence or nothing else are valuable enough to stick with her? That makes me conclude that you could insert any personality into a skinny girl's body, and most men would be happy. They don't care about the type of person you are; they just want someone who fits society's definition of thin and beautiful to parade around on their arm. I frequently find that it's not even that the man notices the weight gain or dislikes it -- it's usually he's afraid of what his friends will say if his gf gets a little more poochy. Total shallow and superficial. However, no, not every man is like that. Just more than I'm happy about. That is because we men are honest. While women who have a physical problem with their significant other will invent a thousand different "personality" reasons for divorcing/leaving him, men will just be upfront and tell you to watch your weight because its not attractive. You act as if men are the only ones who don't like fat people. In reality the standards of physical beauty for women are way easier than men. For a woman to be attractive, all she has to do is not be fat. For a man to have an attractive body, he had to be 6 feet tall with big muscles etc etc. So it's true yes, men are generally not attracted to fat women, but women are not attracted to fat men, short men, balding men, poor men, asian men, red haired men, men who are not extremely funny all the time, wimpy men, ETC ETC ETC ETC. Do you see why women are more shallow? You just lie and make up excuses for your shallowness. Man: "Stop gaining weight it's gross" Women: "I just don't feel the chemistry anymore, let's get a divorce"
stace79 Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 That is because we men are honest. While women who have a physical problem with their significant other will invent a thousand different "personality" reasons for divorcing/leaving him, men will just be upfront and tell you to watch your weight because its not attractive. You act as if men are the only ones who don't like fat people. In reality the standards of physical beauty for women are way easier than men. For a woman to be attractive, all she has to do is not be fat. For a man to have an attractive body, he had to be 6 feet tall with big muscles etc etc. So it's true yes, men are generally not attracted to fat women, but women are not attracted to fat men, short men, balding men, poor men, asian men, red haired men, men who are not extremely funny all the time, wimpy men, ETC ETC ETC ETC. Do you see why women are more shallow? You just lie and make up excuses for your shallowness. Man: "Stop gaining weight it's gross" Women: "I just don't feel the chemistry anymore, let's get a divorce" Perhaps you are partly right, but most women will suffer through once married, while men will divorce their wives and try to date a much younger bimbo.
Thaddeus Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 Perhaps you are partly right, but most women will suffer through once married, while men will divorce their wives and try to date a much younger bimbo.The vast majority of divorces in North America are initiated by women. Care to re-state?
stace79 Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 The vast majority of divorces in North America are initiated by women. Care to re-state? My bad -- the men just step out on their wives. Although can you point me to that stat? I would like to read about that.
Thaddeus Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 My bad -- the men just step out on their wives. Although can you point me to that stat? I would like to read about that.Stats vary depending on your jurisdiction, but here's an AARP article which references it.The majority of midlife divorces are initiated by women. Don't believe it? In the AARP survey, 66 percent of women reported that they asked for the divorce, compared with 41 percent of men. And men more often than women were caught off-guard by their divorce (the news blind-sided 26 percent of men, compared with 14 percent of women).And another one, slightly different numbers but the trend is the same:...really the divorce reform movement ultimately must come down to making the alternatives less desirable or unavailable (primarily for women, who file 70-80% of the divorces).
stace79 Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 Stats vary depending on your jurisdiction, but here's an AARP article which references it.And another one, slightly different numbers but the trend is the same: Interesting articles, although the AARP study only reflects divorce in the 40s, 50s, and 60s, and the second doesn't cite the source for the stat that wome are initiators of 60-70% of divorces.
yongyong Posted September 28, 2009 Posted September 28, 2009 tired of hearing about shallow Bull shxt who the heck wants to live with ugly person? If average looking guy is looking for Megan Fox level girl, that is shallow (it won't happen anyways so I say it's just a hope) If averae looking guy doesn't want to talk to less than average , ugly girl, isn't that toally understandable? are we working hard to get married with ugly spouse so we can prove to the world that you are very humane?
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