seoa Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 I'm going to continue with my new & favourite past-time on here, of quoting Steven Carter... (If you want a guy's viewpoint of being a CP, read his stuff, that's what it's there for...!) I remember being in a relationship from which I was with-holding a full commitment. My partner was justifiably annoyed. The more politically correct part of me was telling her that this was my problem, not hers. We would often have long soul-searching conversations in which I would explain that I was the one who couldn’t love fully. That I didn’t even love myself fully. That I didn’t even know myself. My partner acted as though she believed my words. But did I? Did I really? No. Even as I was talking, another voice inside my head was thinking: She is the reason I can’t move forward. She’s the reason I can’t feel more committed. She’s not… something. And then I would go through all the ways in which she was a little bit less than perfect. Less than perfect for me; less than perfect in general. Never for a moment considering the countless ways in which I was less than perfect. So really, the normal break-up rule also applies to CPs - they don't tell you what they're really thinking, they say what they think you want to hear... This is pretty much what my CP did... Told me that it was him, he couldn't do relationships - but I know what he was thinking was "This is your fault - if you were better in ways X, Y and Z then I would be able to do this." CP is like any other phobia (like being frightened of flying) - the only person who can admit they have the problem is the sufferer, and only they can choose to get help... But they won't get help till they admit they have a problem, and most of them don't. You can wait for that to happen (far be it for me to tell you not to - coz that's what I'm doing) or you can move on, but chances are it probably won't, so you basically have to decide how much of your life you're willing to hand over to waiting (probably not much longer for me...)
BCCA Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 BCCA- LOL- the word douche just made me literally lol in my office at work. LOL glad you got a laugh out of it. CP is like any other phobia (like being frightened of flying) - the only person who can admit they have the problem is the sufferer, and only they can choose to get help... But they won't get help till they admit they have a problem, and most of them don't. You can wait for that to happen (far be it for me to tell you not to - coz that's what I'm doing) or you can move on, but chances are it probably won't, so you basically have to decide how much of your life you're willing to hand over to waiting (probably not much longer for me...) Thats just it. People change because they want to, not because YOU want them to. Its so much easier to blame everyone else, circustances, price of rice in China, than it is to actually look in the mirror. Self reflection takes a lot of inner strength, and most people with problems like this have next to none.
LisaUk Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 Yes, ecm. When someone plays the "all in" card, then drops the ball and runs with no explanation, it's not very funny to the individual who's experienced it. Ok so here is my ex's Houdini exit. We were together 18 years from highschool, lived together 10 years and engaged 8 years, two weeks after we FINALLY set the date to marry in church, after walking me round four different wedding venues, discussing vows, talking with our sets of parents, drawing up guest lists etc, he tells me "it all feels a bit real", then leaves and says AFTER he left (as i asked for answers, repeadtely), he hasn't loved me in years, been unhappy and that he didn't say anything for all those years because he wanted to avoid conflict. Trouble is, I was doing so well, (has been 6 months), but this last week i am backsliding so bad. I am starting to belive all the reasons he gave me, which really I know are his justifications to himself b/c he can't admit his CP, but for some reason I am beating myself up and buying into it all again. Help! (Sorry to hijack your thread ecm, I'm sorry to hear the trouble you are having. I know this is easier said than done, but let this one go, he will never change, you can't convert him, only he can see he has a problem and address it, no one but him).
Surfer Girl Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 From my idea of Cps..... Some such as in Lisa Uk case will have so much anxiety of making the marriage real... Willl run... and can't look back.... Others can not make the committment... of being togther and will run... but at the same time they can not make the committment of letting go either.... and will want to be back with the ex after a period of time which takes us on the rolllercoaster ride.... They think I can't be without them without really looking at what a long term relationship is.... and once again running, the anxiety is to much.... This is where the on again off again relationship starts to assume a pattern... It will not change without some kind of therapy..... This cycle could go on for years... without therapy.... it is a losing battle
caramel c Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 Eventually, youll be able to spot the signs a little easier next time, and hopefully not be as deep 'in' before it happens. I know its happened to me a couple times as well, and Ive gotten to the point where I can see the signs. TBF is dead on though, its the worst kind of mind f$#& you can experience. And Im sure you know this, but people dont do stuff like this for anyone but themselves. It sounds good when they say its for your own good, and in a way - maybe it is, but that is not the reason behind it. You guys will be ok, and the next time you meet some douche who pulls the old Houdini, you'll have 0 time or patience for it. Youre only wrestling with it now because you have so much invested, but Im telling you - if it happens again (and I REALLY hope it doesnt) you want let yourself fall that far in. I wish I could feel good about what you are saying. The problem is, there were no signs of this problem. We were 2 people who met, hit it off, had a great time together, fell in love, and started moving towards something more serious. This is good stuff. Nobody saw it coming, nobody. Especially not me. He is kind hearted, generous, affectionate, intelligent, brave, and honest. He has good friends and family and a great career going. I knew nothing about his anxiety issue until the last couple weeks that we were together...
caramel c Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 I guess I should have said that he did at least have an explanation. He started having doubts, about us, about our relationship, whether it would last, and when I asked specifically, what is it about this relationship that isnt working for you - he said he didn't know. It was every single thing about it or nothing at all. He said it was causing him major stress and anxiety to the point where he was physically ill. I saw that he was, at the very end there. I tried being comforting, supportive, told him in so many ways I'd be there for him no matter what. Then when I saw that he wasn't receptive to that I surrendered. I didn't put up much of a fight at all. As he was apologizing profusely for hurting me I simply told him it was ok, that he can get the help that he needs, that I'd be ok and he'd be ok. That is the main gist of the breakup.
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 LisaUK- No worries:) I WANT to hear everyone's stories/input, etc. I've never been on any sort of site like this, so I don't really know the rules, anyway. Please hold... I want to look at a calendar...ok, the last time we spoke/texted was 9/11. I signed up on the site on 9/14 and today is 9/23. This honestly has been the easiest 1st 2 weeks ever. I 'm not sure if it's that I've finally had enough or if it's getting to vent and hear other people's stories. Maybe both? Every other time, I've talked to my mom, my sister, my friends about it. ( even though I think the only one who really gets it is my mom) Most people don't get it. It seems so easy for others to say "he's a d*ck, he doesn't deserve you, he's using you, etc." If they've never been in this situation, they don't know how it feels. As I type this, I'm starting to think it's similar to being in an emotionally abusive relationship. Mind you, I feel fortunate to say I've never been in any sort of abusive relationship, so I can't say what THAT feels like, either. (So I apologize if anyone takes offense to my saying that) I have taken some psych classes, and helped friends through situations. I can spot signs/symptoms, etc. Actually, every word I type is making me want to choke the Sh*T out of him as I am realizing it IS almost like that. Even though they may not be playing with a full emotional "deck", they know what they are doing. RIGHT? This is brilliant. Light bulb moment. %$*!!!! (ok, I need to strike previous posts when I said I never pushed for a relationship- I guess this is kind of saying I was not ok with merely "hanging out") About 2 months ago, I tried to end it with him. I basically told him that I didn't want someone who didn't treat me a well as I treat them. I told him that I am better than what he was giving me, and that I didn't think we could "hang out" or whatever "non-relationship" relationship we were having. I told him I shouldn't have to wonder what he's feeling about me, etc, etc. I tried so hard not to cry b/c I wanted to really make my point without him feeling bad or say what I wanted to hear b/c I was crying. So, what does he do? Get annoyed! Not like arguing angry or anything, but miffed. Still, he wouldn't talk about his feelings. Basically, I told him if he's not into me then he needed to let me walk away. Did he? NOPE! Still kept coming around. Another weekend, he called & I told him I didn't want to hang out b/c I was tired of the way things were going. I'm done being treated like a booty call. If you want to continue hanging out, you need to step it up. Still kept coming around. Showed progress. So, long story a little less long (sorry)- I gave him the out TWICE!!!!!!! IN THE PAST TWO MONTHS!!!!! So, why, when we were "ending things" did he accuse me of "continuing to hang out" with him. What the efffffffffffff? I tried to end it, then HE didn't let it end, then he accused ME of dragging it out saying "you knew how I felt about commitment". Ok, well, if he knew I was trying to end it b/c I knew my feelings were getting strong.... who does that?! So: point: is that a "CP" thing? Or is just a "I am a big d*ck who wants to control you" things? OH-MY-GOD! You might be witnessing my "last straw" with this do*che-bag (BCCA-LOL). (I won't lie- honestly, probably not but I can dream...)
alphamale Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 Why do you run with things get good? And if you like someone, who ISN'T pressuring you to commit...why run? because we don't want to get too close to any one girl. with closeness comes commitment then engagement then marriage and kids. by running away we can avoid all the things that come after commitment. the other reason i run away is cause i can't see myself with one woman for any extended amount of time - for me meaning longer than 6 months or a year
wondering_girl Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 hey girls, definitely the light bulb goes off in my head too when you said "emotionally abusive relationships" like seriously, do you have to control everything? who wants to be with them? but ya know i think by the time the light bulb comes on it's like years later uggggggggggggh my bf of 4 years after a petty argument disappeared on me? ughh, and controls when we have our talks.
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 Caramel C- sounds familiar from day 1, 1st time he called me: 3 1/2 hours, then met the next day for drink and were inseparable... my story changes though through the 5 years it's been going on. Sometimes, we were "commited," sometimes we were "hanging out". But whenever we got close- he was off like a prom dress. I don't think they'd run if they DIDN't care, though. I used to be a "they" (and still prob. am to some degree, which is why tend to like the "jerks".) I ran when it got scary. If I didn't like someone, I could just tell them. That doesn't scare me. I can be honest. What scared me is the thought of "forever"... If your guy didn't think "forever" could happen with you, it wouldn't scare him... (btw- I went to school for elementary education, not psychology, so I hope I'm not COMPLETELY off...it's just what I think makes sense, logically. Even though NONE of this RIDICULOUS CP behavior is LOGICAL. )
caramel c Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 ecm it sounds like he had no problem identifying and admitting his issue. That means a lot. He can get help with it, IF what he really wants is to eventually settle down.
audrey_1 Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 Ack. All this sounds exactly like the situation that still mind &*$#s with me, a year later. Except ours was long distance. Talk about drama. I've never been in an emotionally abusive relationship, either. It's either worked or it hasn't, but with no truly bad behavior on anyone's part. This guy found me online, is a childhood friend, and boy do I wish I'd just said "no" to meeting up. *sigh* All the stuff you described happened with us. I know it isn't me, but for some reason, I can't let him go. Maybe it's the childhood nostalgia stuff that makes it harder for me to give him the boot like I would anyone else. That's an extra bit of mind &*$#ing. We still text/email occasionally. I always initiate. LC worked better for me than NC. We never talk about "us" anymore; it's always small talk, and I've seen him for coffee a couple times. It's like the "relationship" part never existed, and it was intense while it lasted. He's seeing someone else, and I heard through the grapevine she just confronted him on where they stand, and he told her he loved her but wasn't in love with her. Poor girl. They're still seeing each other, though, I think, so maybe she's okay with being a doormat. Anyway, I know exactly where you're coming from. It's especially difficult when this person, despite that major gliche in their programming, has a deep effect on you, and you know - and are used to - better.
Kamille Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 It's interesting that you say you might be a commitmentphobe too EMC. I called my first serious boyfriend the "Space cadet" because he was a typical classical commitmentphobe. I even knew precisely what family abandonment issue caused him to be that way. Only years later did I come to realize that I was a commitmentphobe too, and that this was precisely why we stayed together for so long. Like you, I was an expert at "not putting pressure on him". This was actually to my advantage because I myself didn't want to deal with the pressure that came with a relationship. But you know what, a few people in this thread alone have mentioned that they "hardly ever put pressure" on their CP bfs. But that's the thing: Only commitmentphobes can't handle the normal pressure that comes with being in a relationship. I'm not saying drama queen pressure but, you know, having expectations and stating them. So now, if I'm dating and looking for a relationship, I say I'm dating and looking for a relationship. If I really like a guy, I tell the guy I really like him. I used to think that would freak guys out. Turns out, it only freaks commitmentphobes out. So it's best to be clear about your expectations. And plus, most men love providing for women. A part of me thinks my cp ex-bf couldn't really commit to the R because I was too easy-going for him.
alphamale Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 i've let soooo many great women go due to my commitmentphobic ways...women that most guys would give an arm and a leg for
caramel c Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 Caramel C- sounds familiar from day 1, 1st time he called me: 3 1/2 hours, then met the next day for drink and were inseparable... my story changes though through the 5 years it's been going on. Sometimes, we were "commited," sometimes we were "hanging out". But whenever we got close- he was off like a prom dress. I don't think they'd run if they DIDN't care, though. I used to be a "they" (and still prob. am to some degree, which is why tend to like the "jerks".) I ran when it got scary. If I didn't like someone, I could just tell them. That doesn't scare me. I can be honest. What scared me is the thought of "forever"... If your guy didn't think "forever" could happen with you, it wouldn't scare him... (btw- I went to school for elementary education, not psychology, so I hope I'm not COMPLETELY off...it's just what I think makes sense, logically. Even though NONE of this RIDICULOUS CP behavior is LOGICAL. ) See, some things are similar in our situations but some are not. We weren't exactly inseperable, we would go out usually twice per week on average. We didn't have very long phone conversations. No sleepovers (we didn't...) Also, he never pulled back at all. Just when we broke up. He had initiated ALL of the talks about the future.
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 wonderinggirl- 5 years later to be exact, for me. I hope you learn from these things you are reading and that 5 years form now, your personal jerk-face is nothing more than a faint memory. OR, I hope you can learn from these things and get him in shape so you're not 35 and addicted to venting online (as I have apparently become in the past week or so.) this is addicting. bad. but good. I wanna go watch "glee", but I'm so into hearing everyone's thoughts.
audrey_1 Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 because we don't want to get too close to any one girl. with closeness comes commitment then engagement then marriage and kids. by running away we can avoid all the things that come after commitment.[/QUOTe] Says who? I broke an engagement because I wasn't ready for these things, either. My CP guy was awesome! We went hiking, to NFL games, great sex, lots of laughs...and no pushing on my end. I was fine with "hanging out." I just wanted to know that he at least liked me a little bit. He was a stone! Never told me he loved me, either, so he didn't follow your rules to keeping a woman around. In fact, there's a bunch of them he didn't follow. the other reason i run away is cause i can't see myself with one woman for any extended amount of time - for me meaning longer than 6 months or a year Why not? Did you talk yourself out of it, as alluded to in previous posts? She's less than perfect because x, y and z?
alphamale Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 Says who? says me Why not? Did you talk yourself out of it, as alluded to in previous posts? She's less than perfect because x, y and z? no, i just got bored and wanted to move on
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 Caramel C- hmmm. Yeah, mine was more like "I don't want to be anyone's boyfriend, I never want to get married, etc"...but then was with me 24/7. ANYONE who met him was like "wow, he is so in love with you". So, there approaches were definitely diffferent. Still, they both ran when things get "real". I wish I could fix the part of their brain that tells them to act like a chicken, trust me. If I had an answer or any of it really made sense to me, I'd probably be doing something else instead of this...like planning a wedding or something. It's their loss. For real....until I go to bed and start thinking all over again.
wondering_girl Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 wonderinggirl- 5 years later to be exact, for me. I hope you learn from these things you are reading and that 5 years form now, your personal jerk-face is nothing more than a faint memory. OR, I hope you can learn from these things and get him in shape so you're not 35 and addicted to venting online (as I have apparently become in the past week or so.) this is addicting. bad. but good. I wanna go watch "glee", but I'm so into hearing everyone's thoughts. hi ecm i love the "jerkface name" if you have a couple of minutes my post is on here too with his silent treatment ways.... ahh, you're right about addicting, i like to read now because of LS plus, it's nice to vent..... me and jerk face is in our late 20's so its not like we're kids ya know... but he always disappears on me when we're doing great and he blows up on something petty and disappears
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 AlphaMale: do you ever get feelings for these people, though? I think there's a difference between being single b/c you haven't found anyone worth settling down with and ending things with someone you love becasue you get scared. Ya know? If you DID get feelings, you STILL got bored & broke up? I guess I have to read your "guide". My guy doesn't sleep around or anything. He just is weird. He wants to be alone, play guitar, chill, etc. I know he has issues, but he isn't out and about dating multiple girls at a time or anything. I'm losing track of names..Audrey, Kamille- so many similarities. Kamille- you might be on to something
alphamale Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 AlphaMale: do you ever get feelings for these people, though? of course, i loved some of them madly...but just being "in love" with someone isn't always a good reason to stick around.
caramel c Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 Caramel C- hmmm. Yeah, mine was more like "I don't want to be anyone's boyfriend, I never want to get married, etc"...but then was with me 24/7. ANYONE who met him was like "wow, he is so in love with you". So, there approaches were definitely diffferent. Still, they both ran when things get "real". I wish I could fix the part of their brain that tells them to act like a chicken, trust me. If I had an answer or any of it really made sense to me, I'd probably be doing something else instead of this...like planning a wedding or something. It's their loss. For real....until I go to bed and start thinking all over again. I hear ya. Well, we are not the ones with the issues, they are. At least we walk away being us.
Author ecm Posted September 24, 2009 Author Posted September 24, 2009 Audrey- I just looked what city yo live in to make sure we weren't dating the same guy. Stone. No I love you....EXCEPT one time when it snuck out and you would have thought he just shat himself by the look on his face...like it was the worst thing he could EVER have done. Mine could never give in to showing any weakness...verbally. You too?
audrey_1 Posted September 24, 2009 Posted September 24, 2009 of course, i loved some of them madly...but just being "in love" with someone isn't always a good reason to stick around. So what is? Just curious. And with those you "loved madly," did you still say "I love you but am not in love with you" when you were ready to bolt? Or did you just not say anything and bolt? Any regrets at all? I hear ya. Well, we are not the ones with the issues, they are. At least we walk away being us. Yes, but they still walk away to repeat the same behavior with someone else.
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