It's all about who?

[NoIDidn't]

Wow, it is all about him, huh?

 

I totally get what you said to him about wishing you had the A. I said the same to my H. But I received empathy and sorrow, not accusations of "haterism".

 

He seems to want all the adoration to only come his way. Does he not realize that you needed him too? Does he not think that you deserve compliments too?

 

This is very telling from him. But please don't leave for a few days. This is the time to see if the fight is worth it. I hope the MC appointment is productive.

 

Sending positive thoughts your way. My H is a somewhat reformed conflict avoider. There is hope, but know your limits.

 

(((foreal)))

[Devil Inside]

Recovering from an A is a process...one that you are in the thick of.

 

I would recommend not taking action (like going away for two weeks) just yet. Make sure that you get back into MC when your therapist returns...don't put it off.

 

Your H is lucky that you are staying put...and as hard as it is he will need to accept that you are going to be in pain. I know how hard it is to watch the woman you love in agony at your own hands...it should be hard for him...that shows he has a soul.

 

I know that right now I feel kind of numb when it comes to my wife's infidelities...but the time will come when I feel more intensely...and I can only hope she sticks through it.

 

Hang in there!

[whichwayisup]

yea, it is bazaar that i am the one who has to do so much work.

 

It seems it's always like that..The BS has to be the bigger person and put up with SO MUCH CRAP..

 

BS's who give their CS's a second chance are very special people with big hearts. Stay strong and just know that you can do this.. Patience and love, remembering why you love him..Why he's worth fighting for. Just hope that he sees this quality in you and appreciates this chance he's getting..

[PhoenixRise]

Wow, it is all about him, huh?

 

I totally get what you said to him about wishing you had the A. I said the same to my H. But I received empathy and sorrow, not accusations of "haterism".

 

He seems to want all the adoration to only come his way. Does he not realize that you needed him too? Does he not think that you deserve compliments too?

 

This is very telling from him. But please don't leave for a few days. This is the time to see if the fight is worth it. I hope the MC appointment is productive.

 

Sending positive thoughts your way. My H is a somewhat reformed conflict avoider. There is hope, but know your limits.

 

(((foreal)))

 

 

I think sometimes wives/mothers who are super competent pay a penalty for their competence. I believe I have.

 

Maybe he doesn't think she needs compliments because he doesn't think she NEEDS him.

[foreal]

I am back- son is napping.

 

H called. said his confidence is just so low b/c nothing he does seems good enough for me....so I point out all the things he's done, and how I have acknowledged them...yes, he says, but then he doesn;t do this or that and it is back to square one. i tried to explain CONSISTENCY to him. He seems to get that- but he is so Gdamed wrapped up in his own Fuchupness he cannot deal with me.

 

I told him what NoIDIDNT brought up..that instead of seeing my comment about wishing I had the A instead, instead of seeing that as 'haterism' maybe he could see how desperate and sad and lonely I must be to feel that way. Yes, he sees that- but then he adds he seems to be able to do nothing to help me not feel lonely.

 

He keeps going back to his lack of confidence..I am like, And how do you think MY confidence is?!! I struggle daily now to get it back, to keep it. I was already so lonely last year when he began to pull away. And I voiced that to him. And he had an A..which only cemented those feelings of lonliness for me. And I am still lonley..only now I am lonely as well as completely destroyed by his betrayal.

 

I am crying. I want to run away.

[foreal]

I think sometimes wives/mothers who are super competent pay a penalty for their competence. I believe I have.

 

Maybe he doesn't think she needs compliments because he doesn't think she NEEDS him.

 

 

Yes. I am a victim of my own success. I feel as though if I were like HER, weak, fragile both physically and mentally, undereducated, dependent, etc then maybe he'd be more kind and understanding.

 

**** that.

[Snowflower]

(((foreal)))

 

I'm so sorry for what you are going through. You're getting good advice here for the most part though so keep posting if it works for you. And definitely go to MC as often as possible, especially if you guys had to stop for a little while.

 

Recovering a marriage after infidelity is hard-probably the hardest thing you or your husband will ever do. And I know it probably seems doubly-hard when it seems like your husband isn't doing what he should. But somehow, from what you post here, I think your husband is trying to do the right thing.

 

I remember I would get so angry...I would scream and cry out at my husband how badly he had hurt me. My husband, I have to say, took it like a champ...he would actually cry sometimes, too when I was like this. Sometimes he would sit there by me with his hands shaking from built up emotion but he hung in there.

 

Let me give you a little different perspective. I am not defending your husband but is it possible that he is just as scared, lonely, hurt, and afraid that you don't love him - just the same way you are feeling toward him? I'm not sure if I'm making sense but I found this helped me when I was at the point you were...

 

I basically tried not to look at my husband as my husband who had betrayed me so horribly. I didn't look at him as someone who had hurt me beyond belief...I would try to look at my husband as 'just' a human being...who was also feeling hurt, confused and scared. I tried to be objective and compassionate about what he was going through.

 

But when I managed to 'get over myself' even for a little bit, and look at my husband as a human being with good and bad traits, mistakes, f-ups and a lot of years of good deeds, it made it easier to get past this stage of intense hurt and anger. I actually learned the trick in IC and it actually felt good to ME to be able to do this sometimes. No, I couldn't just forget about what he had done but looking at from a different perspective-his-almost gave me a mental break from the pain.

 

I also agree with the other posters here and I don't think you should leave for longer than a day or so if you absolutely have to get a break from the situation. I think your husband will feel even worse; his feelings invalidated and he just may start to avoid the issue when you return. It will make things worse, not better. I know you probably don't really care if leaving hurts your husband, but if you want to recover your marriage, his feelings, as well as yours, need to be taken into account.

[foreal]

Thanks Snowflower.

 

I am trying..I feel like we have the Grand canyon between us and hw is it that we will ever be able to come back together.

 

You are right. he is hurting. and he is trying.

 

I will not split. I will hang in here...I do have plans, previously made, to go visit a friend for her Bday in another town about an hour away next weekend. She's the only friend who knows about this (other than MOW of course ahh!!)She has been incredibly supportive to us both. So at lesat I have that to look forward to- plus I get a break from mom duties as H will take care of our son for the weekend.

 

I am so lost right now. I think that numb feeling that Devil Inside asked about is coming over me.

 

I have some Xanax..gonna ake one and maybe I can take a nap while my son sleeps...sleep is something I have had littel of in the past 5 months.

 

thanks again to everyone. What did betrayed spouces do before the internet??!!!

[mnm]

I too feel your pain. Felt the same way, hitting a wall everytime. I did learn something w/ research that opened my eyes. He was hurting just as much as me and I had to acknowledge it. We get so caught up in our pain and betrayal we feel that they have no right to be feeling ANYTHING!!! But unfortunately it is the truth. We as the BS's have so much more to deal with. Not only our feelings but theirs as well. I felt back then that it wasn't fair that not only did I have to deal with the betrayal, but had to UNDERSTAND him as well. UGHHHHH!!! Tough to do.

 

After I read that, it help a lot b/c the way I was handling things was destructive. I still messed up and forgot to think that way, but it was a huge turning point for me. I tried to be more compassionate.

 

Hang in there.

[eeyore1981]

Forreal, I know you are hurting so much right now. What you are feeling is unfortunately part of the process. My latest jag lasted about 6 days. Last night I started feeling like I was coming out on the other side. Today, I am seeing some hope for the future.

I'm here for you, okay? If you need to rant, blubber, whatever, I have a full box of tissues, and I will find a way to push them through the internet to you. You aren't alone. We are all here with open arms for you to help you get through this. Use us if you need to.

[Dexter Morgan]

So my H tells me today that he feels as though, "it's all about you"...he is upset that HIS feelings are secondary right now...when do HIS feelings come into play?

 

when do HIS feelings come into play? they don't...not right now. You first have to be able to heal somewhat before he gets to play the "poor me" crap.

 

 

He felt as though I did not love him, a contributing factor to the A. That before the A, it was all about me..

 

excuses, excuses. NOTHING justifies an affair and does not "contribute" to an affair. He chose to stick his vienna sausage in another woman of his own doing.

 

 

I had a .baby to take care of so I get a pass, sort of, for that, for not taking good enough care of him...but now he tells me that even before we had our kid that I was not giving him what he needed when his mom became ill (enough sex is what that means)

 

tell him to join the f####n' club of people who didn't get enough sex in their marriage that did NOT go out and cheat. we suppose to cry a river for him or something? If not enough sex was reason to cheat, then I'd have been a serial cheater during my marriage.

 

 

 

so back then, it was all about me....and now, here we are full circle and once again it is all about me.

 

maybe you should just tell him that since he is trying to justify his affair, that there is no marriage and that you will have him served with papers very soon.

 

 

 

I am thinking of taking my son and going to visit family for a couple of weeks. H said he felt that was not a good idea as it was 'avoidance'..but I am so Fing sick of him.

 

 

ya, and you visiting your family would just give the pr!ck another "reason" to go out and stick it to another woman.

 

if you leave him, it should be for good.

 

 

Should I leave for awhile? with the intention of returning of course. But is leaving a good idea to give us time apart?

 

for you it would be good. for him, he'd just be thinking of ways he can sneak out without it being known and go catting for sex.

 

He is obviously an entitlement cheater. he felt entitled to cheat, and now that he has devestated you, he wants it to be about him? He doesn't even want to give you the time to process it all and come to a point where you are at least not hurting so much.

 

he says it was all about you when it looks like everything was always about him. Either he gets exactly what he wants or he will be unfaithful.

 

have you thought about divorce? you really should seriously consider it.

[foreal]

when do HIS feelings come into play? they don't...not right now. You first have to be able to heal somewhat before he gets to play the "poor me" crap.

 

 

 

 

excuses, excuses. NOTHING justifies an affair and does not "contribute" to an affair. He chose to stick his vienna sausage in another woman of his own doing.

 

 

 

 

tell him to join the f####n' club of people who didn't get enough sex in their marriage that did NOT go out and cheat. we suppose to cry a river for him or something? If not enough sex was reason to cheat, then I'd have been a serial cheater during my marriage.

 

 

 

 

 

maybe you should just tell him that since he is trying to justify his affair, that there is no marriage and that you will have him served with papers very soon.

 

 

 

 

 

 

ya, and you visiting your family would just give the pr!ck another "reason" to go out and stick it to another woman.

 

if you leave him, it should be for good.

 

 

 

 

for you it would be good. for him, he'd just be thinking of ways he can sneak out without it being known and go catting for sex.

 

He is obviously an entitlement cheater. he felt entitled to cheat, and now that he has devestated you, he wants it to be about him? He doesn't even want to give you the time to process it all and come to a point where you are at least not hurting so much.

 

he says it was all about you when it looks like everything was always about him. Either he gets exactly what he wants or he will be unfaithful.

 

have you thought about divorce? you really should seriously consider it.

 

I was wondering when Dexter would come into this and slam my H YAY!

 

I appreciate your comments. I dont think he would go out and have sex if I left for awhile, but then again, I didnt think he'd have an A.

 

Hmm Entitlement cheater? That could be.....I do think the reason he cheated is b/c he thought he wouldn't get caught...but what a dumbass, he did nothing to hide it as far as his phone...I stupidly just never looked at it...he said I was not stupid, he was, that he took advantage of me and the fact I trusted him...

 

and yes, i have thought about Divorce.

 

a lot.

 

It is interesting how many women here say to see his side, to show empathy etc.....the men are much less forgiving or maybe tolerant..I swear I must really be a man, with really great tits and ass.

[eeyore1981]

I was wondering when Dexter would come into this and slam my H YAY!

 

I appreciate your comments. I dont think he would go out and have sex if I left for awhile, but then again, I didnt think he'd have an A.

 

Hmm Entitlement cheater? That could be.....I do think the reason he cheated is b/c he thought he wouldn't get caught...but what a dumbass, he did nothing to hide it as far as his phone...I stupidly just never looked at it...he said I was not stupid, he was, that he took advantage of me and the fact I trusted him...

 

and yes, i have thought about Divorce.

 

a lot.

 

It is interesting how many women here say to see his side, to show empathy etc.....the men are much less forgiving or maybe tolerant..I swear I must really be a man, with really great tits and ass.

 

LOL!

BBM

I would be more than happy to call your husband names if that is what you need. I was actually using great restraint to try and show the new and enlightened me. Just let me know, I have all kinds of awful things to say, and I aim to please!

[Spark1111]

I was wondering when Dexter would come into this and slam my H YAY!

 

I appreciate your comments. I dont think he would go out and have sex if I left for awhile, but then again, I didnt think he'd have an A.

 

Hmm Entitlement cheater? That could be.....I do think the reason he cheated is b/c he thought he wouldn't get caught...but what a dumbass, he did nothing to hide it as far as his phone...I stupidly just never looked at it...he said I was not stupid, he was, that he took advantage of me and the fact I trusted him...

 

and yes, i have thought about Divorce.

 

a lot.

 

It is interesting how many women here say to see his side, to show empathy etc.....the men are much less forgiving or maybe tolerant..I swear I must really be a man, with really great tits and ass.

 

I feel the same way foreal and even talked about it in therapy.

 

I feel more like the men.

 

I wanted to know every detail. I am less forgiving about his excuses. I want him to "own" his choices and his mistakes and his affair.

 

He says the affair has managed to make our marriage so much better.

 

That's true. It's because HE is so much better; attentive, affectionate, respectful.

 

I, too, have been in pain and I NEVER THOUGHT ANOTHER PENIS would solve my problems.

 

That's why.....we'll see about us.

[foreal]

Sadintexas....point taken. and good advice. thank you!

 

Eeyore- thanks to you too, just for letting me know you are there.

 

gonna go have some fun now with my son...

[PhoenixRise]

 

It is interesting how many women here say to see his side, to show empathy etc.....the men are much less forgiving or maybe tolerant..I swear I must really be a man, with really great tits and ass.

 

 

:laugh:

 

Just tryn to show a little restraint and keeping in mind that at this point you are trying to save the marriage.

 

I think most women have been in situations where a pissed off friend bashes her husband....you sympathise and offer a few choice comments of your own and the pissed off friend forgives her H and is now mad at you for saying bad things about her boo.

 

If we say what we really think you are not gonna turn on us later are you Foreal?

[foreal]

BRING IT ON

 

Do you know how annoying it is to now have to listen to all my friends and family tell me how lucky I am, what a great man I have, what a swell guy I have?? ON A REGULAR BASIS.

 

He's been Mr Fing Perfect his whole Gdamn life...I've always been considered the 'wild' one! He is always in control, the kind of man who leaves his jacket on when everyone else takes theirs off; the kind of man who never ever speaks out of turn or with any anger etc..Mr Fing in control....

 

Not so much now...

[Devil Inside]

I feel the same way foreal and even talked about it in therapy.

 

I feel more like the men.

 

I wanted to know every detail. I am less forgiving about his excuses. I want him to "own" his choices and his mistakes and his affair.

 

He says the affair has managed to make our marriage so much better.

 

That's true. It's because HE is so much better; attentive, affectionate, respectful.

 

I, too, have been in pain and I NEVER THOUGHT ANOTHER PENIS would solve my problems.

 

That's why.....we'll see about us.

 

I think that this is so true in my situation as well...it was about time I became a man and took accountability for my actions.

 

If anything...married or divorced...I will at least come out of this process a more responsible and accountable man...and that is bound to make me a better partner.

[foreal]

I too feel your pain. Felt the same way, hitting a wall everytime. I did learn something w/ research that opened my eyes. He was hurting just as much as me and I had to acknowledge it. We get so caught up in our pain and betrayal we feel that they have no right to be feeling ANYTHING!!! But unfortunately it is the truth. We as the BS's have so much more to deal with. Not only our feelings but theirs as well. I felt back then that it wasn't fair that not only did I have to deal with the betrayal, but had to UNDERSTAND him as well. UGHHHHH!!! Tough to do.

 

After I read that, it help a lot b/c the way I was handling things was destructive. I still messed up and forgot to think that way, but it was a huge turning point for me. I tried to be more compassionate.

 

Hang in there.

 

Thanks for the reminder MNM...this is too true.

[foreal]

I think that this is so true in my situation as well...it was about time I became a man and took accountability for my actions.

 

If anything...married or divorced...I will at least come out of this process a more responsible and accountable man...and that is bound to make me a better partner.

 

This is my hope and desire for us both. I think my H has needed therapy for a long time- and now I do too, maybe I did as well before..but at least we are now on this road...I hope you are doing okay DI. It is not easy.

[Spark1111]

Wow, Lovely, GREAT POST!

[foreal]

I totally 'get' that we are intertwined with one another in relationships of all kinds and that in those relationships we seek to derive fulfillment. However, there is a difference between enriching one's life through your relationship (a/k/a adding to their life) and another "NEEDING" someone to FILL THEIR NEEDS. There should be a required course followed with a written and verbal exam on SELF SUFFICIENCY before getting married.

 

IMO some people 'use' relationships as coping mechanisms. This is a fatal flaw.

 

I believe this is why people wind up in affairs to begin with.

 

They make 'other people' their panacea. The 'other people' are there to make up the difference in the part of them that are bankrupt or not firing on all cylinders.

 

Now that he no longer has his OW as his 'medicine' for self medicating his neediness, he is looking around at his life ... and IMO, you, and saying... 'okay, now how are MY NEEDS going to be met?'.

I don't know what the cure is for someone like this other than growing up. He needs one thing and one thing only... and that is to learn how to change his own diaper. Get him in some sort of therapy because this infantile neediness is impossible to 'fix'. He will forever be a moving target.

 

IMO men and women confuse sex with other things. They make sex mean something other than sex. In other words they make sex mean validation... they make sex mean acceptance... they make sex mean they are desirable... they make sex mean that they are worthwhile... the list goes on. When sex means sex and it is an intimate act ... well then they've got it right. Everything else 'made' to be sex is just a masquerade and the only person they are fooling is themselves.

 

The 'other people' are there to make up the difference in the part of them that are bankrupt or not firing on all cylinders.

 

Now that he no longer has his OW as his 'medicine' for self medicating his neediness, he is looking around at his life ... and IMO, you, and saying... 'okay, now how are MY NEEDS going to be met?'.

 

Lovely, wow!

 

We have MC today and I think I will bring this up....b/c he does seem to be looking at ME to help fix what is broken in HIM. And that is just not doable...a person has to be okay with him/herself... you can't ask of others what you yourself are not willing to give, right? Well, I suppose you can ask, but....

 

Thanks for the post.

[freestyle]

Yet another post from Lovely that should be printed on a billboard.........

[Spark1111]

The 'other people' are there to make up the difference in the part of them that are bankrupt or not firing on all cylinders.

 

Now that he no longer has his OW as his 'medicine' for self medicating his neediness, he is looking around at his life ... and IMO, you, and saying... 'okay, now how are MY NEEDS going to be met?'.

 

Lovely, wow!

 

We have MC today and I think I will bring this up....b/c he does seem to be looking at ME to help fix what is broken in HIM. And that is just not doable...a person has to be okay with him/herself... you can't ask of others what you yourself are not willing to give, right? Well, I suppose you can ask, but....

 

Thanks for the post.

 

It is a classic characterisitc of the cheater...trying to fill a void of pain or loneliness by turning to another and avoiding turning within to find the answers.

 

Only when we love ourselves fully, can we fully love another.

 

That is why IC for the cheater is of such vast importance for the sake of the relationship.

 

It can also be why MC, while important, can be somewhat premature. The cheater has soooooo much internal work to do.

 

Keep your hopes realistic, foreal.

[2sure]

[QUOTE=Spark1111;2388093]That is why IC for the cheater is of such vast importance for the sake of the relationship.

 

It can also be why MC, while important, can be somewhat premature. The cheater has soooooo much internal work to do.

 

Thank you, thank you...its not me.

H has been seeing a MC, basically without me.

H , as you know, is a serial cheater - who created another identity, had a secret phone, secret car...etc.

He was caught by me simply because he became so out of control he was unable to use enough discretion to protect even himself.

 

So - he is going to MC. Now, this is the third although most breathtaking time I have caught him...Ive been to IC, I've been here, I've read the books - I KNOW THE DRILL.

 

Last time, I go with him. Just so we are all on the same page and because he asked me to give him until a specific date to make a decision.

The MC is explaining to me, to us, that his type of cheating is unemotional, immediate gratification, compartmentalized....he called it pornographic cheating. OK - Gotcha, I'm with ya.

 

In discussing the issue of my H's non-need for intimacy and in fact, the avoidance of it...I disclosed that I also suspected I had some issues with intimacy that I may have brought into the marriage.

 

It was as if I handed them the HOLY GRAIL. The therapist grasped on this and I felt, ran with it. And I'm trying to not be defensive - I dont RE mention that its possible my catching him cheating months after our marriage may be something I never quite got over....But I cant help but say, in light of the scope, the breath, the effort, expense, the whole other identity with another NAME and all:

 

"Uhhhh....I cant help but feel we are kind of skirting something here, an important issue...THE FACT THAT MY HUSBAND IS OUT OF HIS FREAKING MIND????" I mean, seriously - you expect me to talk about what, having romantic dinners to reconnect while all the time I'm wondering if he is starting to refer to himself in the third person??????

 

Sorry. Thank you.