Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 My WS had an 18 month affair with a work colleague. The devastation I felt was unlike anything I have ever experienced. They no longer work in the same office, but there is a chance in the near future that a project could once again put them in close proximity. I told him: If there is accidental contact and you do not tell me, I walk; if there is intentional contact on either part and you do not tell me, I still walk. I asked him if he was afraid of it, and he replied "yes." I then asked, "beacause you may still have feelings for her? Or, are you afraid of my reaction? Or, what?" He said, honestly, all of it. Now, understand, her halo has fallen off since our therapy. It is no longer the love of his life, his soulmate, etc. He used her, and she used him, despite the intensity of the emotions they both experienced at the time of the affair. WS who have sustained NC, what would you most be afraid of???? There is a part of me that wishes he'd bump into her and cement his LACK of feelings now for her. But there is another part that fears a re-kindling of feelings for her, since I've invested two more years of my life towards reconciliation, and, once again, I'd have to entertain moving on.
foreal Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Damn Spark this is tough! How long has the A been over and with NC?
NOTSURE7 Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 hi spark,as a ws only 9 weeks from dday i will tell you that my first reaction upon reading was one of surprise,if i am reading correctly you are 2 years from dday and he is still worried about the feeling he has for her?..what confuses me is you say her halo is off and he used her,she used him but yet he says he is still worried about his feelings for her?.... but in answer to your question, after 9 weeks of nc and endless hours of talking and being honest and rebuilding trust and a stronger relationship,all the tears i have seen and the devastation i have caused i would be most afraid of my wifes reaction or just the fact that my wife was thinking something was going on that really wasnt and the burden and pain that would cause her... personally i would try and do whatever i could to make sure the situation never arises but i know unfortunately in this economy you cant just up and leave your job..
Sanafa Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Just my opinion I think ultimatums make it easier for someone to "excuse" themselves for lying. And I also, again in my opinion... don't think you will leave... course I am not sure. He has said he is afraid and being honest..... When someone thinks they are going to get in trouble or worse... they want to protect, natural for most Instead, could you not open the communication so you both feel safe and take the ultimatums out of it.
whichwayisup Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 They no longer work in the same office, but there is a chance in the near future that a project could once again put them in close proximity. Then he MUST speak to his immediate boss and explain the situation to him/her, to make sure they don't end up working together in the future on a project. He needs to come clean and admit that he had an affair and that if he goes near her, or even speaks to her, looks her way, he's going to lose everything..Aka YOU. Bottomline is, your H may eventually have to quit his job if the NC is going to remain NC forever.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Damn Spark this is tough! How long has the A been over and with NC? I discovered it through a text on his cell in July 07 and threw him out. They ended all physical contact in September 07. He told her to stop calling or contacting him in December 07. Her response: "Never?" as if they could still be friends.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 hi spark,as a ws only 9 weeks from dday i will tell you that my first reaction upon reading was one of surprise,if i am reading correctly you are 2 years from dday and he is still worried about the feeling he has for her?..what confuses me is you say her halo is off and he used her,she used him but yet he says he is still worried about his feelings for her?.... but in answer to your question, after 9 weeks of nc and endless hours of talking and being honest and rebuilding trust and a stronger relationship,all the tears i have seen and the devastation i have caused i would be most afraid of my wifes reaction or just the fact that my wife was thinking something was going on that really wasnt and the burden and pain that would cause her... personally i would try and do whatever i could to make sure the situation never arises but i know unfortunately in this economy you cant just up and leave your job.. Not sure, I think he is worried about her reaction to HIM, more than his reaction to her. During the affair, while he never promised her a future, he certainly implied one. Hell, he might have even believed it in his confusion at that time. I only had empathy initially for her. She was a single mother still fighting for assets after an acrimonious divorce. She needed a knight in shining armor and he fit the bill --for her. As more and more details come to light, perhaps she was not as victimized as I originally thought. More like a willing participant with lots and lots of perks: trips, limos, gifts, etc. All while I thought he was building a new business, a prestigious new position.and had to travel often. I'm not sure how to feel if there is future contact. Not sure I want to live in fear of it either. Not that kind of woman, ya know what I mean?
foreal Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Spark He's been out of the A for over 2 years and is afraid he may still have feelings for her? And there is NO doubt they have remained NC?? TOTAL NC? I don't think it is unreasonable for you to wish they see each other to cement his non-feelings for her..but it sounds like he is still harboring feelings for OW- or he at least thinks he might. This is not okay for your well being and peace of mind. Have you asked him straight up, "Do you think you are still in love with her? Do you feel a part of you will always love her in some way?" If so, what does he say? Has he been been doing the right things by you since Dec 07? Are you two getting along and does he show true remorse, transparency, love to you etc etc?? ((SPARK))) I want to smack him for you.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Just my opinion I think ultimatums make it easier for someone to "excuse" themselves for lying. And I also, again in my opinion... don't think you will leave... course I am not sure. He has said he is afraid and being honest..... When someone thinks they are going to get in trouble or worse... they want to protect, natural for most Instead, could you not open the communication so you both feel safe and take the ultimatums out of it. Sanafa, good advice usually....BUT when you have been lied to for a long time, you get more than a little cynical. He just wants to go forward and be judged on his actions since DDay. I need to examine the pst to ensure I could someday trust him again. We go 'round and 'round the maypole. Somethings he remembers, some things he does not. Somethings he .....omitted in an effort to spare my feelings. I found out anyway, and it still hurts. He's a big boy. He should be able to stand the heat. He should be making it all better for me, now...dontcha think? Cuz I do.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Then he MUST speak to his immediate boss and explain the situation to him/her, to make sure they don't end up working together in the future on a project. He needs to come clean and admit that he had an affair and that if he goes near her, or even speaks to her, looks her way, he's going to lose everything..Aka YOU. Bottomline is, your H may eventually have to quit his job if the NC is going to remain NC forever. WWIU, I know this is the pervailing opinion among BS, WS, and lots and lots of marraige gurus. I just want to know why. Do I have to live in fear that feelings will be rekindled???? I mean, what kind of life is that? And secondly, why would I want a man who still has feelings for someone else???? I deserve better.
Sanafa Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Sanafa, good advice usually....BUT when you have been lied to for a long time, you get more than a little cynical. He just wants to go forward and be judged on his actions since DDay. I need to examine the pst to ensure I could someday trust him again. We go 'round and 'round the maypole. Somethings he remembers, some things he does not. Somethings he .....omitted in an effort to spare my feelings. I found out anyway, and it still hurts. He's a big boy. He should be able to stand the heat. He should be making it all better for me, now...dontcha think? Cuz I do. I do... and I wasn't worrying about him But again, let's be honest... he could have contact and you won't leave ( again imo) So honesty.... for both, may help.... it will allow him to be honest with you without repercussion and he can learn to trust both you and him.... it builds intimacy. Again... just my thoughts.
foreal Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 i mean, what kind of life is that? And secondly, why would i want a man who still has feelings for someone else???? I deserve better. that is right..you deserve better.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Spark He's been out of the A for over 2 years and is afraid he may still have feelings for her? And there is NO doubt they have remained NC?? TOTAL NC? I don't think it is unreasonable for you to wish they see each other to cement his non-feelings for her..but it sounds like he is still harboring feelings for OW- or he at least thinks he might. This is not okay for your well being and peace of mind. Have you asked him straight up, "Do you think you are still in love with her? Do you feel a part of you will always love her in some way?" If so, what does he say? Has he been been doing the right things by you since Dec 07? Are you two getting along and does he show true remorse, transparency, love to you etc etc?? ((SPARK))) I want to smack him for you. Hey, thanks for the smack to his head foreal! No, he says he no longer thinks of her "in that way." But he does think of alllllll the "damsel in distress" problems she had: a true drama queen in need of a knight in shining armor to rescue her. It was the main appeal, or attraction between them at a time he didn't feel very good about himself. Jeez, one thing I have learned from this whole episode is do not be too reliant, resourceful, self-sufficient and independent. What they once admired about you becomes the very thing they resent about you. Just try it. I swear it works with men. They coming running to your aid to feel like the big hero. Ah, the male ego never wanes, does it?
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 I do... and I wasn't worrying about him But again, let's be honest... he could have contact and you won't leave ( again imo) So honesty.... for both, may help.... it will allow him to be honest with you without repercussion and he can learn to trust both you and him.... it builds intimacy. Again... just my thoughts. I pray you are right Sanafa. I feel like I hang here by a thread somedays. And if I don't leave, what would I do? Would I become that person I promised I would never be? Someone out of control and outing them to the universe? Would I self-sabotage this relationship to a point of no return? Would I finally lose my mind? No person is worth that loss....no love is either.
whichwayisup Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 WWIU, I know this is the pervailing opinion among BS, WS, and lots and lots of marraige gurus. I just want to know why. Do I have to live in fear that feelings will be rekindled???? I mean, what kind of life is that? And secondly, why would I want a man who still has feelings for someone else???? I deserve better. He SHOULD HAVE quit his job a long time ago..Quitting now is kind of pointless in some sense, especially since I get the strong feeling that you really don't trust him yet. Ofcourse you deserve better and to be his first and only choice. You shouldn't have to worry about him rekindling feelings.. By now he SHOULD be strong enough to ward off any left over feelings, or not even entertain those types of thoughts PERIOD! Time has gone by she shouldn't be a concern, let alone a thought in his head.
Sanafa Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 I pray you are right Sanafa. I feel like I hang here by a thread somedays. And if I don't leave, what would I do? Would I become that person I promised I would never be? Someone out of control and outing them to the universe? Would I self-sabotage this relationship to a point of no return? Would I finally lose my mind? No person is worth that loss....no love is either. Can I ask you If your husband is honest ( whatever that may be) will you walk? Because if not, you are simply setting yourselves back ( again imo) and if you will.... is asking needed? Not all to be mean... but people are right here...Personally, I think he was honest when he said "both" concerned him.... and I find it hard to believe that he is more worried about her than him, I mean why would he care even if she did miss him? But I also think he realized he hurt you and when you asked for specific's made it grey to avoid the conflict. Does it change things? He can't give you the answers, imo
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 He SHOULD HAVE quit his job a long time ago..Quitting now is kind of pointless in some sense, especially since I get the strong feeling that you really don't trust him yet. Ofcourse you deserve better and to be his first and only choice. You shouldn't have to worry about him rekindling feelings.. By now he SHOULD be strong enough to ward off any left over feelings, or not even entertain those types of thoughts PERIOD! Time has gone by she shouldn't be a concern, let alone a thought in his head. Yes, true. I think his biggest fear is me.....and my reaction to it all. And I do wonder how would I react? I remain unsure about that one. In the heat of an argument I mentioned "what if" so and so had called me up, or we bumped into each other and I never told you???? He became angry to the point of unhinged. So and so was someone I dated briefly in college, before my spouse and I committed to each other. Never was kept secret from him. Ironic, no?????
PhoenixRise Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Spark This feeling that you are feeling regarding potential contact between you H and FOW is hard to deal with. I think there is a feeling that if you can control all the variables you can control the outcome. It doesn't work that way. At least, It didn't for me. For me, it was an incredible relief when I finally got it...that I couldn't control what he does. I can snoop. I can give ultimatums. I can test him. I can obsess about HER.. none of it matters if your H wants to cheat. Just like always....from the moment we said I DO...till dday he choses whether or not he will honor his comittment to me. The only thing I can control is myself. Do I really want my H if I have to threaten him to make him stay faithful? No. I hope this doesn't sound insensitive. This realization helped me....so I am going to say... Spark..If your husband cheats on you again you will be devestated. You will feel enraged, duped. Incredibly hurt. BUT you will pick yourself up. AND you will have a fantastic life regardless. You are a beautiful, smart, capable woman. You can build for yourself an estatic life completely apart from your H if he proves to be unworthy of you. Don't live your life or you marriage afraid of what he will do. For me.... understanding this is what gave me the courage to recommit to my marriage.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Can I ask you If your husband is honest ( whatever that may be) will you walk? Because if not, you are simply setting yourselves back ( again imo) and if you will.... is asking needed? Not all to be mean... but people are right here...Personally, I think he was honest when he said "both" concerned him.... and I find it hard to believe that he is more worried about her than him, I mean why would he care even if she did miss him? But I also think he realized he hurt you and when you asked for specific's made it grey to avoid the conflict. Does it change things? He can't give you the answers, imo Sanafa, in a REAL relationship there cannot be anymore avoiding of conflict. Conflict exists in every relationship. If there is no conflict, it isn't real. It is a fantasy. How we handle conflict as a couple, is a great indicator of how successful our relationship will be in the future. I confront conflict and communicate feelings, even sad or harsh ones. He does not. I don't need my feelings spared. I need the truth, the complete unadulterated, unvarnished truth to rebuild trust with a man who has lied to me too many times. Every lie or omission sets the recovery clock squarely back to zero. Lying about contact, whether accidental or intentional, would be a deal breaker for me. It is NOT an ultimatum. It's MY TRUE feeling and it needed to be communicated to him as such.
Sanafa Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Sanafa, in a REAL relationship there cannot be anymore avoiding of conflict. Conflict exists in every relationship. If there is no conflict, it isn't real. It is a fantasy. How we handle conflict as a couple, is a great indicator of how successful our relationship will be in the future. I confront conflict and communicate feelings, even sad or harsh ones. He does not. I don't need my feelings spared. I need the truth, the complete unadulterated, unvarnished truth to rebuild trust with a man who has lied to me too many times. Every lie or omission sets the recovery clock squarely back to zero. Lying about contact, whether accidental or intentional, would be a deal breaker for me. It is NOT an ultimatum. It's MY TRUE feeling and it needed to be communicated to him as such. My apologies.... I am well aware the CONFLICT happens.... in ALL relationships. And if that is your truth, then it appears you have your answer. But asking him to rephrase or explain in further detail .... simply, imo.. means you know the answer, just don't like it. Again, apologies.... I wish really do wish you well.
Author Spark1111 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Posted September 10, 2009 Spark This feeling that you are feeling regarding potential contact between you H and FOW is hard to deal with. I think there is a feeling that if you can control all the variables you can control the outcome. It doesn't work that way. At least, It didn't for me. For me, it was an incredible relief when I finally got it...that I couldn't control what he does. I can snoop. I can give ultimatums. I can test him. I can obsess about HER.. none of it matters if your H wants to cheat. Just like always....from the moment we said I DO...till dday he choses whether or not he will honor his comittment to me. The only thing I can control is myself. Do I really want my H if I have to threaten him to make him stay faithful? No. I hope this doesn't sound insensitive. This realization helped me....so I am going to say... Spark..If your husband cheats on you again you will be devestated. You will feel enraged, duped. Incredibly hurt. BUT you will pick yourself up. AND you will have a fantastic life regardless. You are a beautiful, smart, capable woman. You can build for yourself an estatic life completely apart from your H if he proves to be unworthy of you. Don't live your life or you marriage afraid of what he will do. For me.... understanding this is what gave me the courage to recommit to my marriage. Pheonix, so true....and logically I could not function today if I did not believe this in its entirety. Thank you for the complement. I know how strong I am and I WILL survive, better than most I think. But emotionally....ahhh there is the problem. I remain unsure if I WANT to ever experience this pain again. So, is it childlike to look for reassurances to feel safe again? Is that what the ultimatums are all about??? Safety and trust?
foreal Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Pheonix, so true....and logically I could not function today if I did not believe this in its entirety. Thank you for the complement. I know how strong I am and I WILL survive, better than most I think. But emotionally....ahhh there is the problem. I remain unsure if I WANT to ever experience this pain again. So, is it childlike to look for reassurances to feel safe again? Is that what the ultimatums are all about??? Safety and trust? Hell NO! You are 2 years out and your H is worried about the feelings of the OW...GEEZUS!! You are not being childish. You are being a woman who has enough self worth and brains to know that after 2 years her H's concern for the OW's feelings is NOT healthy for the M. Now I want to double smack him.
PhoenixRise Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Pheonix, so true....and logically I could not function today if I did not believe this in its entirety. Thank you for the complement. I know how strong I am and I WILL survive, better than most I think. But emotionally....ahhh there is the problem. I remain unsure if I WANT to ever experience this pain again. So, is it childlike to look for reassurances to feel safe again? Is that what the ultimatums are all about??? Safety and trust? Not just no, but HELL NO Spark. Of course it is not childlike to look for reassurances or to want to feel safe again. If my post made you feel that way then I am sorry. That is not what I intended. I have been there Spark. Hell, sometimes I am still there. I am just saying that the more you feel confident of your ability to be happy without him, the less you will live in fear. Of course you don't want to ever feel that pain again? Who would? But every BS who makes the choice to reconcile with the WS is taking the chance that they will be hurt again. AND yes, I think the ultimatums are about safety and trust. The problem is, for me at least they don't work to establish a feeling of safety or trust. To me they just ended up reinforcing the fact that I was afraid. ((((Spark)))) I hope this gets better for you.
PhoenixRise Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Hell NO! You are 2 years out and your H is worried about the feelings of the OW...GEEZUS!! You are not being childish. You are being a woman who has enough self worth and brains to know that after 2 years her H's concern for the OW's feelings is NOT healthy for the M. Now I want to double smack him. Yes, what she said. Spark your husband is still worried about unearthing feelings for the OW? I missed this in your post. No wonder you are worried. Spark after 2 years, you H should not be worried about his feelings for OW after all this time at the most he should be worried that a meeting could be awkard. Now I want to smack him too. Maybe we can all get together and do a drive by smaking. He won't know why, but deep down he will know he deserves it.
foreal Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Now I want to smack him too. Maybe we can all get together and do a drive by smaking. He won't know why, but deep down he will know he deserves it. OMG a drive by smack down! if only we could! (((SPARK))) Is your H in IC or has he been? Are you?
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