theycallmeprincess Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 Gawd- Today I am just sick of all these cheaters (including my H) and their boo-hooing. "I don't know what to do"...wahhhhwahhhh wahhhhh!! "I'm so confused"....wahhhhhh wahhhhhhhh "I was out of my mind"...boo hooo hoooooooo! "I never meant for it to happen"...wahh wahhh whahhhhh!! "I am on a roller coaster"...booohooooo bahhhh wahhhhhh and on and on... Somebody call these people a WHAAAAMBULANCE. Grow some balls and sack up. That goes for women cheaters too. If you're so sick of it, then why don't you grow the balls and leave their cheating a$$?
2sure Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 No, I'm fine. I'm down to venting , no action. Thats perfectly acceptable and not scary at all.
freestyle Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 I agree It is a self pitying, self obsessive, primal whine. Not real remorse. that`s why I said crocodile tears.................Phoenix, you nailed it.
PhoenixRise Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 No, I'm fine. I'm down to venting , no action. Thats perfectly acceptable and not scary at all. Good. Venting is good. Not scary. Don't get me wrong. You seem like a kick a$$ kind of woman and I so admire that. I just don't want you to accidentally hurt yourself.
2sure Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 My therapist gave me the bad news that I was not crazy, not suicidal or even homicidal...just really and justifiably pissed off. She knows me well, so I decided to just run with the whole sanity thing.
bentnotbroken Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 The general expectation is for the BS to live a higher standard. If you chose to remain in the marriage, one is expected to immediately forgive and in most cases forget. They are expected to never have crying jags, screaming matches or fits of anger. At the same time they are expected to show compassion for the person who helped "break" them in a sense. They are expected to listen to the excuse labeled as reasons without any reaction and to take what is said by the WS as sincere, simply because they are there. They are expected to never ever mention the A or the fallout of it. Don't bring it up, it might remind the WS of when they were being really "bad". But BS is told of all the things that "forced" WS to cheat, i.e. being reminded of the "bad" things they did in the past. Most professionals says it takes up to five years if both partners are working to recover. Yet, because WS has chosen to remain(BS should be grateful first of all)then compassionate, understanding, supportive and have a pocket full of tissues for yourself and WS. They are expected to deal with their own feelings and the feelings of WS(and children if they know). Wow! :eek:what is one to do. Deal with the grief handed to you or deal with the grief that they brought on themselves....what is a person to do? I don't know about most BS, I can only say my experience was lack of "sincere" remorse.
PhoenixRise Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 My therapist gave me the bad news that I was not crazy, not suicidal or even homicidal...just really and justifiably pissed off. She knows me well, so I decided to just run with the whole sanity thing. :laugh: Too bad about the therapist giving you a sanity declaration.. if she had said that you were even just a little bit crazy you could have caused a hell of a lot of mayhem and gotten away with it clean. I have posted here before that I think anger from a BS is a good thing. I think it shows that you esteem yourself enough to react when someone steps on you. Yes, you are justifiably pissed off. I know this is a T/J But.. Do you believe your H is mentally ill or do you truly think he is just using mental illness as an excuse for bad behavior?
PhoenixRise Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 The general expectation is for the BS to live a higher standard. If you chose to remain in the marriage, one is expected to immediately forgive and in most cases forget. They are expected to never have crying jags, screaming matches or fits of anger. At the same time they are expected to show compassion for the person who helped "break" them in a sense. They are expected to listen to the excuse labeled as reasons without any reaction and to take what is said by the WS as sincere, simply because they are there. .... Yet, because WS has chosen to remain(BS should be grateful first of all)then compassionate, understanding, supportive and have a pocket full of tissues for yourself and WS. They are expected to deal with their own feelings and the feelings of WS(and children if they know). Wow! :eek:what is one to do. Deal with the grief handed to you or deal with the grief that they brought on themselves....what is a person to do? I don't know about most BS, I can only say my experience was lack of "sincere" remorse. There does seem to be an idea that BW are not women. They don't feel the same passions, anger, hurt, insecurities that other women feel. On the other forum you see OW be advised not to beat themselves for how they feel or who they love. BUT BW are expected to exert superhuman emotional strength and be able to control their emotions, direct their anger always to the right target, understand the pain the WS is feeling and make everything OK so the WS is not tempted to cheat again. I can see why some OW "claim" they don't want to be wives if this is their view. They can't see that wives are women who feel everything that all women feel. AND betrayed wives can be and are sometimes just as at the mercy of their feelings as the OW was when she was "falling in love" with the MM in the first place.
Author foreal Posted September 2, 2009 Author Posted September 2, 2009 Back from my massage- yes it was fabulous...everyone who wants one should book one for yourself right now....cheaters and cheatees alike! MASSAGES FOR EVERYONE!! (almost as good as Champagne for everybody!!) and also fabulous is that I see I am not alone with these feelings- I was thinking I was the only BS who had moments of WTF is going on here? I was shoved into oncoming traffic and was in intensive care for a good 60 days...When I woke up, who was there to nurse me back to health? Oh ****! The man who shoved me into the traffic! So okay, he's there tending to me tenderly, and in between changing my bandages he begins to tell me how bad his toe hurts b/c when he shoved me into traffic he stubbed it, REALLY BAD...and no doubt, a stubbed toe can hurt like a muther fker...but as I lie there with oozing, puss filled gashes and broken bones, the thought of his stubbed toe, at times, just doesn't bring forth a lot of warm fuzzy feelings. Now that I've had a massage, I can go back to putting some neosporin on his toe and give him a Sponge Bob bandaid..... And for those of you horrified by my comments....it's called sarcasm and humor- those of us fresh out of intensive care some times use those instead of a morphine drip...
redtail Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 I was shoved into oncoming traffic and was in intensive care for a good 60 days...When I woke up, who was there to nurse me back to health? Oh ****! The man who shoved me into the traffic! So okay, he's there tending to me tenderly, and in between changing my bandages he begins to tell me how bad his toe hurts b/c when he shoved me into traffic he stubbed it, REALLY BAD...and no doubt, a stubbed toe can hurt like a muther fker...but as I lie there with oozing, puss filled gashes and broken bones, the thought of his stubbed toe, at times, just doesn't bring forth a lot of warm fuzzy feelings. F***in' A!
Jilly Bean Posted September 2, 2009 Posted September 2, 2009 Sounds like you're the one who needs to grow a pair, hon. His boo hooing is one thing, but you're the one who's tolerating him, and his cheating.
Author foreal Posted September 3, 2009 Author Posted September 3, 2009 Sounds like you're the one who needs to grow a pair, hon. His boo hooing is one thing, but you're the one who's tolerating him, and his cheating. I AM tolerating him...some times...for now, yep, I sure am. I am not tolerating his cheating- he is no longer doing so. I AM tolerating the fact he did cheat though...some times...for now, yep. It is understanding that allows people like me to tolerate people like him (I stole that line from Ferris Bueler) My balls thank you for your concern.
Sanafa Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 I will replace your words. I CHOOSE to tolerate his behavior ( his boohoooing) I CHOOSE to work on forgiving him ( not sure you have done that yet) I CHOOSE to stay in the marriage I CHOOSE to read or otherwise listen to the booohooo's. All choice For all of us..... and if anyone tells me it isn't ... I will lose it. This is your life.... you can live it miserable by "tolerating" or you can do something about it. He had an affair that was NOT your choice... BUT..... what you now do from this day forward is up to you and only you. In fact... .this is BY FAR my biggest problem with "recovery".... Why on god's earth if you profess to love each other at all would you continue to put each other through this? 5 years is the norm... AND only a small percentage like 5% are actually BETTER after an affair Pain all over..... and it's constant...... sorry.... truly seems cruel for BOTH people. Either you can or you can't.... but too many know the answer deep down and spend the first 2 years trying to "look" good and still divorce. Life is here... today.... appreciate it together or move on, it's a gift
Author foreal Posted September 3, 2009 Author Posted September 3, 2009 I will replace your words. I CHOOSE to tolerate his behavior ( his boohoooing) I CHOOSE to work on forgiving him ( not sure you have done that yet) I CHOOSE to stay in the marriage I CHOOSE to read or otherwise listen to the booohooo's. All choice For all of us..... and if anyone tells me it isn't ... I will lose it. This is your life.... you can live it miserable by "tolerating" or you can do something about it. He had an affair that was NOT your choice... BUT..... what you now do from this day forward is up to you and only you. In fact... .this is BY FAR my biggest problem with "recovery".... Why on god's earth if you profess to love each other at all would you continue to put each other through this? 5 years is the norm... AND only a small percentage like 5% are actually BETTER after an affair Pain all over..... and it's constant...... sorry.... truly seems cruel for BOTH people. Either you can or you can't.... but too many know the answer deep down and spend the first 2 years trying to "look" good and still divorce. Life is here... today.... appreciate it together or move on, it's a gift Oh my god I had no idea I had a choice! My balls thank you too Sanafa! Yea i get it the choice thing...
Sanafa Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 Oh my god I had no idea I had a choice! My balls thank you too Sanafa! Yea i get it the choice thing... Anytime Foreal.. anytime Truth..... no one dove on you when you were bohooing.... just post after post of support... so yes, I as well as others that have posted find this to be nothing more than a dig out of anger and rather immature. If you don't want to read a particular " boohhoo" thread or post... you always have options.
Jilly Bean Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 I AM tolerating him...some times...for now, yep, I sure am. I am not tolerating his cheating- he is no longer doing so. I AM tolerating the fact he did cheat though...some times...for now, yep. It is understanding that allows people like me to tolerate people like him (I stole that line from Ferris Bueler) My balls thank you for your concern. Then stop complaining. You are accepting all that he has done to you, and still does to you, just by staying with him. I think most women who own a pair would have kicked him out by now...
PhoenixRise Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 I will replace your words. I CHOOSE to tolerate his behavior ( his boohoooing) I CHOOSE to work on forgiving him ( not sure you have done that yet) I CHOOSE to stay in the marriage I CHOOSE to read or otherwise listen to the booohooo's. All choice For all of us..... and if anyone tells me it isn't ... I will lose it. This is your life.... you can live it miserable by "tolerating" or you can do something about it. This is true Sanafa. We all make choices and Foreal is chosing to try to save her marriage/family. Are you suggesting that she is not allowed to be sometimes frustrated by the situation? Isn't this a place to vent if need be? Don't you come here to do the same at times? He had an affair that was NOT your choice... BUT..... what you now do from this day forward is up to you and only you. In fact... .this is BY FAR my biggest problem with "recovery".... Why on god's earth if you profess to love each other at all would you continue to put each other through this? This I will never understand. A BS gets questioned as to why she would try to reconcile with her WS but in cases where the OW loves the MM the OW sees no conflict with committing herself to a man who has proven that he is a cheater and a master of deception. 5 years is the norm... AND only a small percentage like 5% are actually BETTER after an affair Pain all over..... and it's constant...... sorry.... truly seems cruel for BOTH people. Either you can or you can't.... but too many know the answer deep down and spend the first 2 years trying to "look" good and still divorce. Are we still talking about Foreal here? Life is here... today.... appreciate it together or move on, it's a gift Sanafa Considering the fact that you are having trouble reconciling the fall out from your affair, I am surprised that you are surprised that Foreal is having a moment and venting. I found humor in her OP because I have thought the same things regarding my own H, I would guess these thoughts have crossed the mind of many BS. Yes people have the right to post what they want. WS can post as much as they like about their confusion and their feelings and they often find support. Just as BS can't stay angry forever no matter if they stay in the marriage or not.... WS do have to "man up" at some point.
PhoenixRise Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 Then stop complaining. You are accepting all that he has done to you, and still does to you, just by staying with him. I think most women who own a pair would have kicked him out by now... Jilly I disagree with this assesment. There are many ways to show courage and many ways to know that you own a pair. Forgiving a bad act is not the same thing as accepting a bad act. AND we don't know what if anything Foreal's husband is still doing. Being a BS, even a BS who is in the process of forgiving does not make you a saint. You are still human. You are still a woman. You still feel everything that all women feel and you still have to work it through.
Sanafa Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 Sanafa Considering the fact that you are having trouble reconciling the fall out from your affair, I am surprised that you are surprised that Foreal is having a moment and venting. I found humor in her OP because I have thought the same things regarding my own H, I would guess these thoughts have crossed the mind of many BS. Yes people have the right to post what they want. WS can post as much as they like about their confusion and their feelings and they often find support. Just as BS can't stay angry forever no matter if they stay in the marriage or not.... WS do have to "man up" at some point. Oh, I completely understand wanting the WS to Man up.... trust me, and I truly don't think they ever do. However Foreal isn't only complaining about them... she is complaining about posters here who are also struggling. Funny, when she needed support everyone was there for her... but she can complain that others are looking for the same. Had this post been ONLY about her WS... then go atter...but that isn't the case and we know that. So... again.... comes down to choice.
bentnotbroken Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 Jilly I disagree with this assesment. There are many ways to show courage and many ways to know that you own a pair. Forgiving a bad act is not the same thing as accepting a bad act. AND we don't know what if anything Foreal's husband is still doing. Being a BS, even a BS who is in the process of forgiving does not make you a saint. You are still human. You are still a woman. You still feel everything that all women feel and you still have to work it through. Excellently said.
Sanafa Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 "Are we still talking about Foreal here?" Honestly.... yes and many many others. As I said in the previous post, I am not sure she has even fully decided to stay. Not my place to say for sure and not trying to. BUT so many do this..... and to me it is incredible pain to the ENTIRE family. So many end up putting each other through the mud because they can't decide and make a commitment either way. I am not blaming but I do think it is painful to watch. Again only based on what I have seen here and on the Harley's board. I am uncertain where the success rate is given that is as high as some people say.... but it certainly isn't reflective here or on the other board and I believe the Harley's say approx 30% survive. I don't know.... cynical... that is possible.... as I also am struggling and looking at trust and the reality of human nature. And again, I agree with you... no one is perfect nor should they be expected to be. My issue truly wasn't with Foreal being angry with her WS... it was projecting and bring in other people's comments from this board. They also deserve a place to vent without someone purposely starting a thread to bash them.
PhoenixRise Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 "Are we still talking about Foreal here?" Honestly.... yes and many many others. As I said in the previous post, I am not sure she has even fully decided to stay. Not my place to say for sure and not trying to. BUT so many do this..... and to me it is incredible pain to the ENTIRE family. So many end up putting each other through the mud because they can't decide and make a commitment either way. I am not blaming but I do think it is painful to watch. Again only based on what I have seen here and on the Harley's board. I am uncertain where the success rate is given that is as high as some people say.... but it certainly isn't reflective here or on the other board and I believe the Harley's say approx 30% survive. I don't know.... cynical... that is possible.... as I also am struggling and looking at trust and the reality of human nature. And again, I agree with you... no one is perfect nor should they be expected to be. My issue truly wasn't with Foreal being angry with her WS... it was projecting and bring in other people's comments from this board. They also deserve a place to vent without someone purposely starting a thread to bash them. I see your point. BUT Sanafa, for some people....It truly can take months or longer before they KNOW if they will be able to get over it to the extent needed to preserve the marriage. AND yes, the process of finding this out can be painful. AND yes. I have said in this tread that if you are staying in the marriage the WS needs to be showing remorse and soul searching AND that WS who post here really are trying to figure things out and they have a right to post and get support.
Sanafa Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 I see your point. BUT Sanafa, for some people....It truly can take months or longer before they KNOW if they will be able to get over it to the extent needed to preserve the marriage. AND yes, the process of finding this out can be painful. AND yes. I have said in this tread that if you are staying in the marriage the WS needs to be showing remorse and soul searching AND that WS who post here really are trying to figure things out and they have a right to post and get support. Of course they do... and I have truly come to care for many and feel there pain which has been helpful to me. I just took issue with calling in others on this board that deserve the same support and to be honest, It isn't the first time Foreal has posted similar. While I understand her anger and her right to it.... it would be refreshing if she not bash other members here when the urge to strike hits and bash her WS instead.
hoping2heal Posted September 3, 2009 Posted September 3, 2009 We all make mistakes, and none of us here is infallible. Isn't it better for a WS to feel awful about what they did as opposed to sweeping it under the rug? The WS's are entitled to their feelings of failure and disappointment in themselves just as the BS's are entitled to feel betrayed. Part of the attraction to the OW/OM is that they make the MP feel good about themselves. When the A ends, that stops and they face scorn from everyone around them. It's a lonely place to be. I understand no one is perfect, but not everyone blindfolds themselves, and begins walking in front of a shooting range during target practice. Moreover, asking for compassion afterwards. You all know exactly what you're getting into, and asking for "compassion" for that is just another way to justify it imho. It isn't like you woke up and oops fell into a pothole by accident. Everyone knows affairs hurt people (that's right, I'm not even going to talk about it from a moral stand point) I'm talking about how EVERYONE knows affairs HURT. If you choose to walk right into one, what do you expect to happen to you?
2sure Posted September 4, 2009 Posted September 4, 2009 Whether Forreal , myself , or the countless other BS here who ultimately choose to stay or leave....its a process. The venting, the crying, the anger, the rage....all of it is a process. For anyone to come onto a relationship support forum and chastise someone for participating in the process is nothing more than righteous ignorance. The BS , the OW, the WS can all feel like both a victim and a criminal from day to day.
Recommended Posts