Not using NC....

[HBJen]

While I am 100% aware that NC is the best form of moving on and moving forward, I ask myself - what is the best form of trying to get things back? Yes, my fiance after 2.5 years broke up with me. Yes, he claimed at the time that he wasnt sure if he loved me anymore. Yes, he continues to feel that for the time being, this is the best decision. But, the thing is, there is still something very strong between us. He was very messed up at the time that we broke up. He was going through family withdrawals (Being in Canada when he was from the US), hating his current job status, hating his lack of social life.

 

What I am getting at is, I have not taken the NC approach just yet. We did take about 2 weeks not talking to eachother, and the agony never seemed to improve. We spoke finally, and have continued to talk over the last few days. There is definitely something there. Not necessarily something that is guaranteeing us to be together again, but something that is worth investigating to see what may happen next.

 

I know there is a lot of emotional risk here. But isnt falling in love in the first place an emotional risk? When you decide to be with someone, and dedicate yourself to them, doesnt that mean that you stick it out through thick and thin?

 

I love this man, my heart is completely with this man - and he is a good man.

 

I dont really know what I am going to get from posting this, lol - I just really wanted to get that off my chest. I know I cannot repair what him and I have on my own, and I know he will have to be 100% invested as well. The thing is, if I go NC, then that is the approach for us both to move apart from eachother isnt it? When that isnt what I want to see - then what is the right approach?

[PinkToes]

You will no doubt get a lot of responses from people agreeing with you that NC is the best way forward, and I feel that way too. However, in a philosophical sense, "thick and thin" can include a period -- even a long period -- of no contact.

 

What I mean is that sometimes people do split up and try to move on, and both of them discover that they really want to be together. Sometimes that's what it takes to figure it all out.

 

And it doesn't really matter that this rarely happens; I'm just suggesting that if you belong together, a period of no contact will not change that.

 

And if, for now, you're still hoping to get back together eventually, don't be afraid of losing contact. If you are meant to be -- however you define that concept -- you will be strong enough to survive the separation.

[TaraMaiden]

If you look around the threads on this forum, you will find two things:

 

Those where both are unsure, are predominantly in limbo, uncertain, as if closure is completely evasive, and confused to the hilt.

They both prevaricate, side-step and live from day to day with an agonising empty feeling in the pit of their stomachs.

And one partner is undeniably, definitely 'playing' the other.

 

This is particularly true when one partner 'instigates' the break up, but attempts to convince the dumped partner that things may change, they're not sure, they're in love but worried about what might happen...yadah yadha yah....

 

This puts the dumped partner on a spin, and they don't know which way is up...

 

the other type is where the dumped partner and the dumper, stay in contact and try to stay friends.

This never works.

 

THIS. NEVER. WORKS.

it's agony for the dumped person, because they're hanging on by a thread to Hope, in the mistaken belief that this type of contact might get better, and surely, things can't be over if the dumper wants to stay friends....

 

I believe, without exception, that it has been shown that both instances lead only to failure and heartbreak.

the only sure-fire way you will get him back is if he contacts you and says:

"I made an awful mistake, I desperately love you, I can't live without you, and I really want to try again."

 

Everything else is just breadcrumbs and back-burner shi*t.

 

Go No Contact.

 

Because it's the only way you can isolate yourself to get your head clear and start seeing the light.

[hoping2heal]

While I am 100% aware that NC is the best form of moving on and moving forward, I ask myself - what is the best form of trying to get things back? Yes, my fiance after 2.5 years broke up with me. Yes, he claimed at the time that he wasnt sure if he loved me anymore. Yes, he continues to feel that for the time being, this is the best decision. But, the thing is, there is still something very strong between us. He was very messed up at the time that we broke up. He was going through family withdrawals (Being in Canada when he was from the US), hating his current job status, hating his lack of social life.

 

What I am getting at is, I have not taken the NC approach just yet. We did take about 2 weeks not talking to eachother, and the agony never seemed to improve. We spoke finally, and have continued to talk over the last few days. There is definitely something there. Not necessarily something that is guaranteeing us to be together again, but something that is worth investigating to see what may happen next.

 

I know there is a lot of emotional risk here. But isnt falling in love in the first place an emotional risk? When you decide to be with someone, and dedicate yourself to them, doesnt that mean that you stick it out through thick and thin?

 

I love this man, my heart is completely with this man - and he is a good man.

 

I dont really know what I am going to get from posting this, lol - I just really wanted to get that off my chest. I know I cannot repair what him and I have on my own, and I know he will have to be 100% invested as well. The thing is, if I go NC, then that is the approach for us both to move apart from eachother isnt it? When that isnt what I want to see - then what is the right approach?

 

You sound like you're very much in denial. I understand how that can happen, losing a loved one is very painful and I understand the incentive to create a falsehood to comfort oneself. You seem to belive that because for YOU the bond is strong, that for YOU the love is there that means it is for him also. It isn't, and being in his life won't change that. He already had you in his life, he chose to opt out on that choice. You are not someone he wants to comitt too. You can go ahead and further drive your denial by justifying his breaking up with you as being a part of stress, or home sickness but it isn't going to change anything. There are a lot of people who have had to deal with demanding jobs and being in alternate locations and/or countries. You were his fiance, his fiance and he chose to cease that because he doesn't want to comitt to you. I can't believe the logic, why people think being in that persons life will help win them back, when you were already in their life and they cut you loose? But I guess, between tv and movies romanticisizing the idea, and the few indecisive adults still stuck in "teen" mode you've got a recipe for conflicting messages and a wonderful aid for those who only want to see what they want to see.

[caramel c]

I couldn't have said it better than TaraMaiden did.

[HBJen]

See - the thing is, I dont necessarily believe in "meant to be" - I believe that we build our own destiny. Chemistry is something we cannot control, but the outcome of our relationships are not pre-planned....they are worked on by 2 people and built to last. I also dont believe in playing games. I feel like this "no contact" thing, is just a mind trick I am trying to play with him to make him see how great I am. The reality is, he knows how I feel, whether I talk to him or not. We had a talk about our relationshihp and where it stands (the day we broke NC), and it is up in the air most definitely - but, we decided to not discuss it for a couple weeks and see where things go from there.

 

See, he is the type of person who takes things literally. I dont talk to him = I am over him. He isnt the type of man who is macho or egotistical, he is sensitive and currently very confused about his own self. When I know he is feeling this way and having a hard time dealing with what is happening to him - and I know that he needs the support from me, how can I just walk away....especially when I love this man.

 

In regards to the "friendship" bit - we both agree, we cannot be just friends...there is too much love between the 2 of us that we would only be lying to eachother if that is what we were looking for. He feels there is something to rebuild, he just feels that he has to fix "himself" before things can progress, and I respect that about him.

[Thaddeus]

Those where both are unsure, are predominantly in limbo, uncertain, as if closure is completely evasive, and confused to the hilt.... And one partner is undeniably, definitely 'playing' the other... This puts the dumped partner on a spin, and they don't know which way is up...

 

the other type is where the dumped partner and the dumper, stay in contact and try to stay friends.

This never works.

 

THIS. NEVER. WORKS.

it's agony for the dumped person, because they're hanging on by a thread to Hope, in the mistaken belief that this type of contact might get better, and surely, things can't be over if the dumper wants to stay friends...

The truth in TM's response cannot be overestimated. Read. Study. Read again. Understand.

[caramel c]

See - the thing is, I dont necessarily believe in "meant to be" - I believe that we build our own destiny. Chemistry is something we cannot control, but the outcome of our relationships are not pre-planned....they are worked on by 2 people and built to last. I also dont believe in playing games. I feel like this "no contact" thing, is just a mind trick I am trying to play with him to make him see how great I am. The reality is, he knows how I feel, whether I talk to him or not. We had a talk about our relationshihp and where it stands (the day we broke NC), and it is up in the air most definitely - but, we decided to not discuss it for a couple weeks and see where things go from there.

 

See, he is the type of person who takes things literally. I dont talk to him = I am over him. He isnt the type of man who is macho or egotistical, he is sensitive and currently very confused about his own self. When I know he is feeling this way and having a hard time dealing with what is happening to him - and I know that he needs the support from me, how can I just walk away....especially when I love this man.

 

In regards to the "friendship" bit - we both agree, we cannot be just friends...there is too much love between the 2 of us that we would only be lying to eachother if that is what we were looking for. He feels there is something to rebuild, he just feels that he has to fix "himself" before things can progress, and I respect that about him.

 

I feel sorry for you because I think you are headed for emotional disaster. I don't know if any of us can say the right thing to get you on the right path of thinking...

[Surfer Girl]

He broke up up with you as he needs to fix himself.... With NC.... he has a better chance of fixing himself..... You can't fix him.... Give him the space that is what he wants....

[hoping2heal]

See - the thing is, I dont necessarily believe in "meant to be" - I believe that we build our own destiny. Chemistry is something we cannot control, but the outcome of our relationships are not pre-planned....they are worked on by 2 people and built to last. I also dont believe in playing games. I feel like this "no contact" thing, is just a mind trick I am trying to play with him to make him see how great I am. The reality is, he knows how I feel, whether I talk to him or not. We had a talk about our relationshihp and where it stands (the day we broke NC), and it is up in the air most definitely - but, we decided to not discuss it for a couple weeks and see where things go from there.

 

See, he is the type of person who takes things literally. I dont talk to him = I am over him. He isnt the type of man who is macho or egotistical, he is sensitive and currently very confused about his own self. When I know he is feeling this way and having a hard time dealing with what is happening to him - and I know that he needs the support from me, how can I just walk away....especially when I love this man.

 

In regards to the "friendship" bit - we both agree, we cannot be just friends...there is too much love between the 2 of us that we would only be lying to eachother if that is what we were looking for. He feels there is something to rebuild, he just feels that he has to fix "himself" before things can progress, and I respect that about him.

 

And cementing what I said earlier, denial. Not without the help of him though, I see. Yikes. So, if you two had married, you would just seperate because he doesn't think he can work on himself while you are together? I find that last line all to be a little too much BS for me to swallow without thinking I'm eating someone's crap, how about you?

 

It's fine and admirable even for people to realise they want to improve things, to heal from things, etc. But you don't need to break up to do that, Hell, I know that one first hand. He's just playing you for a fool kiddo.

[HBJen]

OK - so basically, what is being said is that all relationships are clear cut and that NC is the only way (no matter what the circumstances or who the 2 people are) for it to go? That just because I want him back and I am willing to take different steps to do so - this puts me in the "denial" spot?

 

I am not saying I am not in denial, hahaha - what I am saying is, I have a different thought process about this, based on who he is and who I am. We come from 2 different backgrounds - his very sheltered, mine not at all. We have seen different things in life and have dealt with things differently in the past. Why is it that because we have broken up in the way that we have, that it just means that it is over, and doesnt mean that its a test for us to endure?

 

You could be right - I am not denying that by any means. I just wonder if this NC thing is really that good for my situation. And from what I have read in this forum, NC only works to get over someone and move on....and that is not what I think is the best thing to do.

[hoping2heal]

He broke up up with you as he needs to fix himself.... With NC.... he has a better chance of fixing himself..... You can't fix him.... Give him the space that is what he wants....

 

Surfer no one wants space to "fix themselves" unless they don't want to really be with that person, well okay I suppose in the case of some addicts who are englightened enough to want to finally quit dragging others down with them, but that's a rarity too. That whole line is what is known as "a cop out" sure, maybe he does want to fix himself, but he doesn't want to be with her. He's probably hoping by the time he's conviniently "fixed himself" she will have moved on, and he never has to be the "bad guy" and shoulder all of the guilt of dumping his fiance and hurting her.

[HBJen]

And cementing what I said earlier, denial. Not without the help of him though, I see. Yikes. So, if you two had married, you would just seperate because he doesn't think he can work on himself while you are together? I find that last line all to be a little too much BS for me to swallow without thinking I'm eating someone's crap, how about you?

 

It's fine and admirable even for people to realise they want to improve things, to heal from things, etc. But you don't need to break up to do that, Hell, I know that one first hand. He's just playing you for a fool kiddo.

 

I cant disagree with you - atleast in regards to the peice about not needing to break up to do that. But just cause I feel that way, and you feel that way - doesnt mean that everyone feels that way. Everyone doesnt think the same, and we have to be able to accept that too.

 

Maybe he is playing me for a fool - He is not a jerk though, and he would never do anything to intentionally hurt me like that - so that is something I will never believe. I believe he is truly lost and confused - which is why I dont want to back out just yet.

[HBJen]

I feel sorry for you because I think you are headed for emotional disaster. I don't know if any of us can say the right thing to get you on the right path of thinking...

 

Maybe you are right caramel. Maybe there is nothing to be said. But, the discussions do help - they help me think of all points of views. Whether I agree with the points of views or not doesnt matter - it still allows me to think about the situation thoroughly.

 

I am already in an emotional disaster though....so I am not necessarily heading into one - I am just prolonging it if thats the case, lol.

[EricaH329]

I know there is a lot of emotional risk here. But isnt falling in love in the first place an emotional risk? When you decide to be with someone, and dedicate yourself to them, doesnt that mean that you stick it out through thick and thin?

 

This statement says a lot.

 

There is going to be a lot of emotional risk either way you handle this situation. Whether you continue to stay in contact with him, hoping that things will get better... or if you decide to go NC and break it off all together.

 

What really caught my attention, though, was the statement "When you decide to be with someone, and dedicate yourself to them, doesnt that mean that you stick it out through thick and thin?" I completely agree with this statement. I do believe that once you dedicate yourself to someone, you stick it out with them. BUT... what I do not agree with, is if it is ONE sided. Which, apparently, it is. He has decided that sticking it out with you is not going to work for him. Yes, I understand that he wants to remain in contact, but he has made it clear that he feels like he can't be with you anymore. Which, in turn, means that he feels as though he cannot stick it out with you.

 

Once it becomes one sided like this, you need to start thinking for yourself. This man is not giving you the time of day to work things out together. Instead, he feels as though not being together and still talking may or may not make things better. But the fact remains... he does not feel as though working it out while being together is an option at this point.

 

Don't let it be an option for you either.

[caramel c]

Maybe you are right caramel. Maybe there is nothing to be said. But, the discussions do help - they help me think of all points of views. Whether I agree with the points of views or not doesnt matter - it still allows me to think about the situation thoroughly.

 

I am already in an emotional disaster though....so I am not necessarily heading into one - I am just prolonging it if thats the case, lol.

 

I know, girl. I'm in one myself. The problem is that it looks like yours will get worse, and you will be left blaming yourself when that happens. I hope I'm wrong and something will click and lead you to a more logical outlook on your situation. I'm on your side! I just don't know what else to say.

[HBJen]

This statement says a lot.

 

There is going to be a lot of emotional risk either way you handle this situation. Whether you continue to stay in contact with him, hoping that things will get better... or if you decide to go NC and break it off all together.

 

What really caught my attention, though, was the statement "When you decide to be with someone, and dedicate yourself to them, doesnt that mean that you stick it out through thick and thin?" I completely agree with this statement. I do believe that once you dedicate yourself to someone, you stick it out with them. BUT... what I do not agree with, is if it is ONE sided. Which, apparently, it is. He has decided that sticking it out with you is not going to work for him. Yes, I understand that he wants to remain in contact, but he has made it clear that he feels like he can't be with you anymore. Which, in turn, means that he feels as though he cannot stick it out with you.

 

Once it becomes one sided like this, you need to start thinking for yourself. This man is not giving you the time of day to work things out together. Instead, he feels as though not being together and still talking may or may not make things better. But the fact remains... he does not feel as though working it out while being together is an option at this point.

 

Don't let it be an option for you either.

 

Thanks for the response Erica. When I spoke to him last about our relationship - he actually stated that after the time we have spent not talking at all - he wants to include me in his life, and that we have something to reconcile, its just not something that can be done quickly. I agree with that. I obviously have some trust issues now where he is concerned, and jumping back into something would not be smart. He still needs to figure out the path that he wants to take. Us being in contact is not for the form of friendship - it is because we still love eachother. He knows that I am not willing to pick up and move to the US right now to be with him, because I dont trust that right now.

 

If I was to go there and just be with him, or if he was to think that is the best option - then I think him and I would be doomed for failure. Because I have trust issues, and he hasnt worked out his details either - we would go right back to where we were.

 

I think a lot of men make decisions quickly in regards to relationships - where women spend their time thinking it through deeply and then when they do make a decision, its a decision they are 100% satisfied with (Of Course, this isnt always the case, I am just generalizing). He wasnt happy with himself, got scared - bolted. Maybe he is realizing that bolting was a reaction not a solution - and is trying to figure out himself if there is a light at the end of the tunnel for us.

[hoping2heal]

I cant disagree with you - atleast in regards to the peice about not needing to break up to do that. But just cause I feel that way, and you feel that way - doesnt mean that everyone feels that way. Everyone doesnt think the same, and we have to be able to accept that too.

 

Maybe he is playing me for a fool - He is not a jerk though, and he would never do anything to intentionally hurt me like that - so that is something I will never believe. I believe he is truly lost and confused - which is why I dont want to back out just yet.

 

I understand all people don't think the same, I get that. However, and maybe I'm nutso I just don't believe people who are trully in love with another person give them up; unless they've cheated, or done something terrible and deeply hurtful to the other party. It doesn't sound like that applies to your case. As for his reasons of needing to break up and thinking differently, okay let's roll the hypothetical dice. He's doing this because he thinks the only way to solve a problem is too break up, again we are back to problematic because he will just keep repeating the offense in the future everytime there is a problem (Which if that IS the case, it actually signals a lack of intimacy HE feels exists between the two of you or he would know he has room to grow with you and still be safe) and break up everytime, because he's got the idea that this is acceptable. I understand you don't want to believe he would hurt you or be so calleous, but not wanting to see or believe it, won't make it not so.

[Surfer Girl]

So how is he going to fix himself.... What is he doing to make this happen? And why does he feel the need to break up in order to do that? Yes, I do agree with hoping to heal.... to a certain degree.... if the relationship requires the support.... but some people don't get it until they have lost everything and have hit rock bottom to get to that point....

[HBJen]

I know, girl. I'm in one myself. The problem is that it looks like yours will get worse, and you will be left blaming yourself when that happens. I hope I'm wrong and something will click and lead you to a more logical outlook on your situation. I'm on your side! I just don't know what else to say.

 

You have said enough, and I very much appreciate the support

 

I am actually going to be travelling for most of September in Europe (for work and pleasure) which I will be very busy - and will give me some time to seperate myself from the situation. So - I will have semi-NC.

 

I do think though, I am going to continue keeping contact with him at this point - and judge from there where things can go. And after my trip, and I have had some time to seperate myself from the situation - and he has had some more time - then I think we will both be able to make a better judgement call on our future.

 

(I really just wanted to use this for no reason other than the fact that it is friggin adorable, lol)

[hoping2heal]

Thanks for the response Erica. When I spoke to him last about our relationship - he actually stated that after the time we have spent not talking at all - he wants to include me in his life, and that we have something to reconcile, its just not something that can be done quickly. I agree with that. I obviously have some trust issues now where he is concerned, and jumping back into something would not be smart. He still needs to figure out the path that he wants to take. Us being in contact is not for the form of friendship - it is because we still love eachother. He knows that I am not willing to pick up and move to the US right now to be with him, because I dont trust that right now.

 

If I was to go there and just be with him, or if he was to think that is the best option - then I think him and I would be doomed for failure. Because I have trust issues, and he hasnt worked out his details either - we would go right back to where we were.

 

I think a lot of men make decisions quickly in regards to relationships - where women spend their time thinking it through deeply and then when they do make a decision, its a decision they are 100% satisfied with (Of Course, this isnt always the case, I am just generalizing). He wasnt happy with himself, got scared - bolted. Maybe he is realizing that bolting was a reaction not a solution - and is trying to figure out himself if there is a light at the end of the tunnel for us.

 

Okay, have you two met yet?

[hoping2heal]

So how is he going to fix himself.... What is he doing to make this happen? And why does he feel the need to break up in order to do that? Yes, I do agree with hoping to heal.... to a certain degree.... if the relationship requires the support.... but some people don't get it until they have lost everything and have hit rock bottom to get to that point....

 

Surfer I understand your point, but that would imply the person didn't realise they needed to get help until they have lost everything. I don't think it makes sense (maybe I'm understanding you wrong) for someone to decide to make a change, or get some help for something but then they need to hit rock bottom to decide they need to change or get help? Isn't that redundant?

 

But yeah, some people ARE in relationships that are bad for them, I guess that is the other exception and they know they can't really grow or get what they need by sticking in that relationship, I guess that is for the most part all I can think of for exceptions.

[HBJen]

So how is he going to fix himself.... What is he doing to make this happen? And why does he feel the need to break up in order to do that? Yes, I do agree with hoping to heal.... to a certain degree.... if the relationship requires the support.... but some people don't get it until they have lost everything and have hit rock bottom to get to that point....

 

Well - basically what happened was (very short version) He has been having a bit of an emotional breakdown over the past few months. It wasnt him and I that were having the problem. He experienced some personal failures in some things that he was very passionate about (career path) which very much hurt his ego. He was away from his family that he is VERY close with, he didnt have any friends here other than me - and I was very busy with work. So now, he is back in his hometown, he is trying to find work (but where he is from is very harshly affected by the economic breakdown in the US), and he is spending time with his family, and he is trying to spend time alone (since we were together 24/7) to make himself a better man.

 

Because of the tensions he had with himself, he took it out on me and I took it back otu on him - but there was never a point in our actual relationship where there wasnt obvious love between eachother. Its just that the situation was emotionally disasterous, and played with our minds.

 

I think he did hit rock bottom, the day that he broke up with me - and the following couple of weeks afterwards. And I think now, we are at a point of trying to discover if we can move forward and beyond.

[HBJen]

Okay, have you two met yet?

 

Im sorry - not sure what you mean here? If you mean have we ever met in person, lol - yes - its not an internet relationship - we lived together for 2 years also.

 

If you mean, have we seen eachother since the breakup - no - and I dont think either of us are ready for that yet anyway. Like I said, I want to take it slow just as well as he does.

 

If I misunderstood the question, I am sorry.

[hoping2heal]

Well - basically what happened was (very short version) He has been having a bit of an emotional breakdown over the past few months. It wasnt him and I that were having the problem. He experienced some personal failures in some things that he was very passionate about (career path) which very much hurt his ego. He was away from his family that he is VERY close with, he didnt have any friends here other than me - and I was very busy with work. So now, he is back in his hometown, he is trying to find work (but where he is from is very harshly affected by the economic breakdown in the US), and he is spending time with his family, and he is trying to spend time alone (since we were together 24/7) to make himself a better man.

 

Because of the tensions he had with himself, he took it out on me and I took it back otu on him - but there was never a point in our actual relationship where there wasnt obvious love between eachother. Its just that the situation was emotionally disasterous, and played with our minds.

 

I think he did hit rock bottom, the day that he broke up with me - and the following couple of weeks afterwards. And I think now, we are at a point of trying to discover if we can move forward and beyond.

 

Okay HBJen, so he's one of those people who like to cry wolf in other words. I hope he can realise that it is not going to be productive for either of you for him to handle tension in his life or your relationship by ending it. It's going to wear on you and create insecurity issues in you. You are going to get it in your head that you need to avoid conflict because you don't want to overwhelm him and have him pull the cord on your relationship, will in turn lead you to hold your feelings inside, and stop you from honestly and effectively communicating and making your needs known to him.

 

There are all kinds of detriment that take place when one partner pulls this in a R/S you need to make it clear that this is not acceptable and you two need to find another way to deal with stress and conflict in your relationship.