Author taylor Posted August 17, 2009 Author Posted August 17, 2009 he used you to satisfy himself, its plain and simple, you know i am a wh and i have no problem admitting my faults.. when times were good he was this amazing om for you but when the going got tough he headed right for the hills,he didnt want the bad times taylor, he just wanted the good times..plain and simple.. personally i wouldnt waste your time on the resentment issue and work on forgetting about him once and for all.. NotSure, I am surprised but glad you posted on this thread. I know I have been somewhat hard on you in your own theads. Perhaps because I, too, am a WS and hard on myself, I project that on other WS. But, I think you are right. He was looking for a good time girl..someone to escape his troubles and woes with. We even had a little fantasy place we called our own. We had a name for it. We put things in our fantasyland...like sand, water, candles, twinkling stars, wine, and kisses. We talked often about "going there". He wanted a physical relationship, but this good time girl was not that willing. Not to say he wasn't wearing me down. He was pulling all the stops out with his methods of seduction and they were working. And then the boss broke the affair bubble. I guess I should thank her for saving me from the downward spiral I know I would have experienced following a sexual encounter with him. She may have even saved my marriage, if I look at it just right. He wanted sex, he wanted continual ego boosts and lots of TLC, but he had no intention of holding my hand thru any bad times I was enduring. I feel stupid for not realizing..or perhaps not wanting to believe, his heart wasn't as into it as mine was. I want to lose the resentment and move on with my life. But it's not a matter of just forgetting it. It's part of the healing journey. I have to walk thru it...just like you do.
2sunny Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 And, you are right, I did question for a long time how much I meant to this OM. No one behaves the way he did toward someone they truly care about when that person is going thru the emotional crises I was. Obviously he didn't care for me nearly as much as I cared for him. It's taken me a year to come to terms with this. from the actions of this man - and what he continually asked you for when you were seeing him - it looks like a guy i once knew who had a strong drug and alcohol problem. i had no idea at the time and things only make sense now that the missing piece of the puzzle shows reality. this guy i knew would also ask for food when he came by, $1.00 (for a hamburger) a couple bucks for gas money. even though he should have had enough money - all of it and more was being spent on his drug habit. he hid it well... and reality shows looking back that he was emotionally incapable of any feelings for anyone else because he was so deeply seated in his addiction. don't know if it means anything to you - but when it all made sense - it sure was easy to look back and wonder why i didn't see it back then.
PhoenixRise Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Thank you for your insight, PhoenixRise. My husband and therapist both said exactly what you have said here. They "saw" it right away. I am just beginning to "see" it now...over a year later. I can't tell you how much it hurt he didn't contact me after I lost the job. It hurt like hell. But do you know what idiotic thing I did? You are going to think I am just bananas.... I gave the OM my entire last paycheck. I met with him and told him I didn't want the boss's money. It was blood money and I wanted no part of it. I guess in a way it was my parting gift to him..that and a goodbye letter. If he truly felt like he had caused me to lose my job (I certainly didn't look at it that way then), I wonder how he felt about taking that money from me? Hey Taylor I hope you are doing well this morning. Yeah, I think your were bananas to give this man your last paycheck. I know you said you helped him a lot, loaned him your car, listened to his troubles, etc. But was this the only time you had given him money? What kind of man takes and keeps a woman's final paycheck??? I think the fact that he even took your money knowing that you were newly unemployed says a lot about his character. I am really sorry that you got hurt. I think it is good that you are dealing with your buried resentment and anger toward the OM. Better to deal with those emotions in the bright light of day than to have them buried beneath the surface. Continue to do whatever you need to do to heal Taylor. As painful as this has been I am betting that you have grown so much as a result of it.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 fooled once and 2sunny, For a year I have been trying to make sense of many things but it is certainly hard when emotions cloud the picture and pieces of the puzzle, answers to the important questions, as you say, go missing. And it's hard to find closure..lay things to rest..find peace... when things don't made sense. Some say there is no such thing as closure. I disagree. Closure is when you can take something that caused you great confusion, stress and turmoil..something that impacted your life in a negative, yet profound way...AND PUT IT TO REST to the point where you can and do feel PEACE with regard to it. Closure is not just burying something..refusing to think about it..pretending it doesn't exist. That is what I have been doing with regard to this job loss/OM issue. I should have dealt with it long ago, but instead, I buried it and pretended it didn't bother me. But, lo and behold, it resurfaces and is preventing me from moving forward free and clear. Some here say closure comes from within. I agree with this. But it can take a long time to "see" reality and a long time to wrap our heads around that reality..to accept it..to make peace with it. And I do think in many cases, as in mine, forgiveness plays a big role...either forgiveness of self or forgiveness of another. But I also think other people can help accelerate the closure process..the ones who hold the pieces to the missing puzzle..the ones who hold the answers to the important questions. They can bring clarity to the reality we need to see..the reality we need to accept. But as in your cases, and mine, those people are not willing participants..they don't freely give us the information we need that can help us find closure. It just makes closure that much more difficult to find. fooled once - 11 years is a long time to go with unanswered questions. You seem to have found some peace. Was it just the passage of time that dulled the urgency to KNOW the answers? Was it realizing the answers wouldn't make any difference..that the outcome is the same regardless? Was it that you just resigned yourself to the fact that these questions would never be answered and so you pieced the reality together best you could and left it at that? Or was it a case where you just said F it..it's not going to control me, and made a promise to yourself to not look back ever again? 2sunny - I'm glad you got some of your answers..the missing pieces to the puzzle. I think that was a gift to you..offering the clarity you needed to make sense of the situation so that you could move past it. Interesting you bring up drug and alcohol addiction. My OM was a former user of both drugs (weed) and alcohol (mainly vodka). He left high school in the 10th grade perhaps because of this. I know for a fact, tho, that he no longer used alcohol..steered clear. Not sure about the weed, tho. He once told me he used it to seduce women in high school and that I should try it. My response back was "why, so that someone can seduce me?" His hands often shook. I thought it was the caffeine and cigarettes. But I will admit I glanced a few times at his arms to see if there were track marks..I didn't even know what I was looking for. But I certainly was suspect. I really affaired-down. They say that is common. I have a college education. I am married and live in a beautiful, manicured neighborhood. Have a beautiful home. I don't smoke, do drugs, and have only an occassional glass of wine. I have a nice car, 401K and a Roth IRA. My OM dabbled in drugs and alcohol and he smokes. He never graduated high school and works hard at just above minimum wage. He rents a home in the city and is struggling to pull himself out of debt. He is divorced and his live-in girlfriend left him. His car and his phone work some of the time. Why did I fall for this man? You would think if you are going to throw your marriage away you would at least pick an affair partner "better" than your spouse. Just another question that needs answered and put to rest.
Owl Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Question...I truly don't remember this...how long out are you from the end of the affair? If you're only a matter of weeks, or a couple of months, I can sorta understand why you would still feel the way that you do about how the affair/relationship ended. But honestly, if you're much more than that, I'd be concerned. It would make sense if I were hearing "I DID feel xxx way about how the relationship ended....". But what I think I'm hearing is "I DO feel xxx way about how the relationship ended...". You're still angry at him NOW for how he ended the relationship. Perhaps I'm mistaken and misreading your posts? Editted to add...just re-read that you're 16 months out from d-day, and the "wounds aren't still fresh". Either I'm misreading your posts, or I WOULD have some definite concerns about how you look back and view the affair from this distance out. This far out, the anger shouldn't be about how he ended the affair...it should be more around the fact that he set the stage for this to happen in the first place.
jasminetea Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 It seems Taylor's EA ended 16 months ago. Is that right, Taylor? I don't believe that's too long to move on. We're all individuals, after all. I can understand it taking that length of time after what the OM put you through Taylor, I think you've really, really suffered and you're obviously feeling pretty awful about what you risked losing - that alone is going to take a long time to come to terms with. I'm gutted for you, and wish I could help.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 Hey Taylor I hope you are doing well this morning. Yeah, I think your were bananas to give this man your last paycheck. I know you said you helped him a lot, loaned him your car, listened to his troubles, etc. But was this the only time you had given him money? What kind of man takes and keeps a woman's final paycheck??? I think the fact that he even took your money knowing that you were newly unemployed says a lot about his character. I am really sorry that you got hurt. I think it is good that you are dealing with your buried resentment and anger toward the OM. Better to deal with those emotions in the bright light of day than to have them buried beneath the surface. Continue to do whatever you need to do to heal Taylor. As painful as this has been I am betting that you have grown so much as a result of it. Thanks, PhoenixRise. I am doing better today than I have in the past 4 days. This forum and posters like you have helped beyond belief. It's funny. I thought I had got my strength and resolve back. I've been on this forum for months now dishing out advice, not looking for any. And then, all of a sudden, I fall apart..triggered by a thread about assigning blame to the OM. Go figure. With regard to the money... Funny again. I used to watch Judge Judy. Seems like there were many young women there trying to recoup money from lovers who left them. I used to think..how ridiculous..these women handing money over to these lazy, low-life boyfriends who are just using them...how stupid can they be? Ane here, I go and do the same thing (Kick myself in the azz ONE more time) I will say, tho, that my OM was not lazy. He was very hard-working. But he came from a poor family, was not educated, and had a scummy, dirty job in a little shop where the boss bullied and patronized him. He earned every penny he made. And he spent the little money he did have on his kids..trying to make their lives as normal as possible after their mother abandoned them. Yes, he took money from me several times. But he may have justified it, knowing the money could be used to benefit his children. That's certainly how I looked at it. He tried to pay me back after I bought his lunch for him for a week (he said he lost his debit card and couldn't access cash). I told him to forget it..use the money to buy Christmas presents for the kids. And when I handed him my final paycheck as a parting gift I told him to use it to do something nice for himself for a change. I certainly don't begrudge him taking the money. But I do wonder what the heck I was thinking. In any "normal" relationship I've ever been in, I have never given a man money. I wasn't the only person who gave money or material things to this man. The boss gave him "extra" money at Christmas. And other coworkers gave him clothes, toys, furniture and appliances that they were discarding. And it's not as if these other employees had much to give. Most were temps also working minimum wage..and many were divorced single parents supporting kids, too. He had a way of getting people to empathize with his situation. He knew how to tap into people's giving natures.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 Question...I truly don't remember this...how long out are you from the end of the affair? If you're only a matter of weeks, or a couple of months, I can sorta understand why you would still feel the way that you do about how the affair/relationship ended. But honestly, if you're much more than that, I'd be concerned. It would make sense if I were hearing "I DID feel xxx way about how the relationship ended....". But what I think I'm hearing is "I DO feel xxx way about how the relationship ended...". You're still angry at him NOW for how he ended the relationship. Perhaps I'm mistaken and misreading your posts? Editted to add...just re-read that you're 16 months out from d-day, and the "wounds aren't still fresh". You know how to ask the hard questions, Owl. You don't let me get away with anything. You certainly sound like a therapist (lol). Yesterday I had to think so hard about the questions you asked before I responded that my submission timed out twice and I had to start all over again. So, I thank you for making me dig deep. I know I am 16 months out and perhaps should be well into recovery. In many ways I am. I see the value in my marriage and my husband. And he and I have reconnected. Still working on greater emotional intimacy, which has always been our main marital issue. But trust and faith have been restored. And I see a future now with him..one where we can find happiness. I know it is possible now. That is a big, big step. But I also know now that I buried some painful aspects of the affair in an effort to get passed it at quickly as possible. You know very well I did not move that fast passed the affair because of withdrawal..the addiction..the longing...the GOOD feelings that accompany an affair. THESE feelings no longer exist. I have put them behind me..a monumental challenge and a monumental accomplishment. But these other issues I buried..ones that seemed secondary to the withdrawal..are just now surfacing. How and why they floated to the surface NOW ...I don't know...All I know is they are here...they feel fresh and newly unearthed. and I have to deal with them. Perhaps withdrawal left me so weak I couldn't face them. Perhaps now that I am past withdrawal and stronger, I am allowing myself to face them..knowing NOW I am better able to handle them. Don't know.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 I WOULD have some definite concerns about how you look back and view the affair from this distance out. This far out, the anger shouldn't be about how he ended the affair...it should be more around the fact that he set the stage for this to happen in the first place. You know I trust and respect your words of wisdom, Owl. You haven't steered me wrong ever. And I want you to know that every night I take to bed my thoughts/feelings and the words I read on this forum and I sleep on them. And some mornings I wake up with better clarity than the day before. I am sure it frustrates you when some of us just aren't seeing the light or can't wrap our heads around "right" thinking. Don't give up on us. We are trying. Last night I went to bed wondering WHO I should be directing this anger and resentment at...really. For the past year I have dumped it on myself..piles and piles..to the point where I can't forgive myself. I am trying to put some of this on the OM now..for the first time. I'm trying to find a reason to dump the anger and resentment on him..perhaps just in an effort to take some off of myself so that I can forgive myself. What you suggest is that I be angry and resent him for "setting the stage" for the affair to happen. Blame him perhaps for hurting my husband, disrespecting my husband. But as a WS I simply can't. I can't wrap my head around this. I have tried. I can't take THAT off of myself and dump it on him. Why? Because I let him. I was in control of who I let into my marriage. I let him in. He accepted MY invitation all wrapped up in ribbons and bows. And once I invited him in, I entertained him. He entertained me. And all was euphoric. Neither one of us wanted the "party" to end. The only thing I can think of to blame or get angry at the OM for is THE THINGS I HAD NO CONTROL OVER...THINGS HE HAD CONTROL OVER. I am angry at the betrayal. He led me to believe his heart was in it as much as mine was. I thought he cared about me as much as I cared about him. I thought I meant as much to him as he meant to me. But he didn't. He could have taken steps to SHOW me that I meant something to me..SHOW me that he cared. But he chose not to. I realized in the 10 days after I lost the job that he was not genuine, not sincere, like I was. I saw a completely different side of him from that day forward. It is no different than how you "saw" your wife when you learned of her betrayal. You saw her in a different light. One you didn't expect. One you didn't want to see. I am sure it was quite the disappointment to you. I am sure your faith..your belief..in her as a person was shattered. In a way, this is how I felt about the OM...like I was "seeing" a different person all of a sudden. He wasn't who I thought he was at all. He shattered any faith or belief I had in him. I thought he cared. He didn't. And that hurt. And I thought he was a man of substance..someone who would not let another person down..especially one in need. He said he hated people who did this and had it done to him so many times..So, never in a million years did I think he would let me down..not be there...when I needed him most. He could have acted..SHOWN me that he wasn't going to let me down..SHOWN me that he wanted to be there...but he chose not to. Even if the affair was ending, even if he couldn't physically be there to comfort me, He could have at least told me he WANTED to be there, WISHED he could be there. Even if he couldn't be there because the affair was ending, he could have let me know in some way that I did mean something..anything. But he chose, instead, to make me believe I meant nothing and that he cared nothing for me. He chose to let me believe his heart was never in it. That's what hurt the most. I am not angry the affair ended. I am angry because he led me to believe his heart was in the affair and when he had a chance..a real chance to show me that..he didn't. I know I am going to have a very difficult time trusting people from here on out. I don't even trust my judgements about people and their motives anymore. I took a job a few months back. Lasted only one day. Why? The company had 90 male employees and 10 female employees. One of the men smiled big and looked me up and down as he held the door for me to come in. And as I toured the place, I could FEEL the eyes on me. This, perhaps, would not have bothered anyone else. But it bothered me. I "saw" these men as predators...all lying, insincere, untrustworthy vultures with only one thing on their minds. I felt so uncomfortable, I didn't go back. I knew I couldn't work in an environment with 90 men that reminded me of the OM. Do you see what I'm getting at, Owl?
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 I'm gutted for you, and wish I could help. You have, just by posting and validating feelings. Thank you.
Spark1111 Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Than that was the right choice for you Taylor at this point in your healing. Do not do anything that makes you feel uncomfortable. You are learning boundaries to protect your marriage and that is a good thing. In IC, I confided to my therapist the beginnings of my WH's affair. After months of mutual attraction and flirtation and the beginning's of confiding personal problems to each other at work( a huge NO NO), she invited him over to see if he could help her with her young and difficult son. Things progressed sexually from there. This was at a point when I had only empathy for her and the way he threw her under the bus on DDay. My therapist's response stunned me when he said: "Ah, so that is how she hooked him." Trips, gifts, car repairs, dinners, etc., everything and anything to help poor, poor, OW, was the dynamic of this relationship. He now resents how he was played to keep it going. And, in many ways, he played her too. After DDay, after dropping him like a hot potatoe for fear of what I may do to her, she re-initiated contact when she realized I would not seek revenge and their jobs were safe. Guess what her next "lament" was? Her mean, vindictive exH wouldn't take their son to Disney. She had my husband considering paying for it because his feelings for ther poor, poor child were real. Wow, what a dynamic. Newsflash: People who truly love you, do not ALLOW you to exploit, or be exploited. They cherish and care and protect you, even from yourself. You are late to be getting to this resentment stage, but you are finally here. Good for you.
Owl Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 So are you angry at OM for being a predator (a self-admitted one, at that)...or are you angry at YOURSELF for refusing to let yourself see him as a predator, regardless of the evidence and his own personal statements? Are you angry at OM for not contacting you at the end...or are you angry at him for deceiving you about what kind of person he was/is?
Gamine Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 There is nothing wrong with realizing that 'all that glitters is not gold'. You reached for someone packaged in charisma in search of something deeper. The feelings you have concerning being made a fool of are things that I have had to work through with my husband. Whatever we focus on expands. Whatever we think about with force becomes bigger. You had the benefit of learning a lesson in life that some continue to lie to themselves about. Consider yourself a fortunate person because you have learned this lesson early enough in your life whereby you can still make the most of it. Through all of this you carry anger and resentment. You are justified. But you also learned how to spot an opportunist. You must also understand that you did not make him this way... you were just unlucky in that you were in his path. This guy has probably been the source of many disappointments for many people. He seemed all bright and shiny though. But underneath he is empty. You aren't. You can evolve.
PhoenixRise Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Taylor Other posters have mentioned the idea that APs see each other through "affair goggles".... meaning the only truth they see about each other is filtered through the prism of the affair. I didn't really deep down get this until I read your posts. Of course you wanted to see him as a good man, a man who was perhaps misunderstood, a man who would not let you down....look at the enormous price you were prepared to pay to keep your connection to him...the price to yourself and to your marriage. Of course you only wanted to see that within him that proved him worthy of this. I know that his disappearance when you needed his support hurt you terribly. It is understandable that you would feel hurt. I just hope that eventually you will see his emotional abandonment as a blessing. You got the chance to see exactly WHO he is and exactly how he behaves when the chips are down. AND years from now, when you look back at this period of your life the OM won't appear in your memory bathed in a rosey glow and you won't be thinking of him fondly. Continue to dig deep to figure out how you got here and you will learn to trust yourself again. If you never had a BS detector before, you have a well developed one now.
GreenEyedLady Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Taylor: What do you think you would have gotten out of him contacting you? This is what I came out with from your posts: He's a single parent, you have your H to fall back on. Your H found out. You and OM have never had sex (right?). And you expect him to seriously keep contacting you. He's gonna get his booty kicked by your H for a woman who he's not sleeping with? I get that he was your friend and you feel betrayed at that level. But you are MARRIED. He keeps contacting you, he "gets" that your H is gonna come after him. I would think he didn't want to make matters worse for either of you. He doesn't want to lose his job because he is a SINGLE parent. (Now he should have been doing his job, but if you're at will employees, then employers don't have to give a reason for laying people off/firing.) Employer may have even taken this into consideration. I think it's good that he didn't contact you. There was already too much damage and I don't how him contacting you would have done any good. In fact more likely the A would have continued and even became a PA. He knew you weren't leaving your H, you didn't want to take it to the next level. He is a man and he's not going to jeopardize everything if he's not getting sex. They don't even jeopardize everything if they ARE getting sex. I know you want to paint the picture that he was a user, and he probably was. But you also used him. He wanted more from you, you are married and you didn't want to go there, but HE DID. He wasn't getting what he needed. It wasn't enough for you to support him and hold his hand and get your emotional needs met. I am glad that you are working it out with your H. Your H sounds like a loving and caring man. And if you need to get angry at your AP to get over it then I guess that's a good thing. GEL
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 There is nothing wrong with realizing that 'all that glitters is not gold'. It is quite the disillusionment, tho, and a very profound source of pain. you also learned how to spot an opportunist. Maybe. Right now I am very guarded about who I trust. But, for the most part, it's me I don't trust..not 100 percent yet. You must also understand that you did not make him this way... you were just unlucky in that you were in his path. Maybe I got put in his path on purpose. Maybe from this experience he will learn how his behavior hurts other people..people who are genuine and giving and open..and maybe he will change his ways. This guy has probably been the source of many disappointments for many people. He seemed all bright and shiny though. But underneath he is empty. I think you are right on, here, Gamine. He talked alot about people letting him down..about the many bridges he burned on purpose because others did something to slight or offend him. Maybe he never stopped to see how he may have contributed to these broken relationships. I know he felt victimized by his ex-wife. You would have thought she was the devil himself. He blamed her for everything wrong in his life. But she wasn't the only one. He often said he was the "black sheep" of his "dysfunctional" family...how no family member had even seen the inside of his house in three years. He said he was the "misfit" in school. And his live-in girlfriend "abandoned" him because "she didn't know how to hold a relationship together." I never stopped to consider the role he may have played in these broken relationships. Could all these people be wrong? I was too busy soothing his pain and building him up to see "their" side. I convinced myself that all these people were wrong about him..that they weren't seeing him for who he really was. One day I told him this: If you give a child a shiny pretty penny and a dirty, crumpled up dollar, which are they going to take? They are going to take the penny because they don't "see" the value in the dollar. I told him that that is probably why these other people in his life abandoned him..they couldn't see his value...they couldn't see him for who he really was. In the end, I was the one who couldn't see him for who he was. These people in his life..the ones that turned their back or abandoned him..may have seen what I couldn't for a long, long time.
silktricks Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Ane here, I go and do the same thing (Kick myself in the azz ONE more time) I will say, tho, that my OM was not lazy. He was very hard-working. But he came from a poor family, was not educated, and had a scummy, dirty job in a little shop where the boss bullied and patronized him. He earned every penny he made. And he spent the little money he did have on his kids..trying to make their lives as normal as possible after their mother abandoned them. Yes, he took money from me several times. But he may have justified it, knowing the money could be used to benefit his children. That's certainly how I looked at it. First, you don't know what happened with his kids mom - you only have his word for it, and as (I think) you are learning, his words aren't worth the paper they aren't printed on... You are still making excuses for this heel. He tried to pay me back after I bought his lunch for him for a week (he said he lost his debit card and couldn't access cash). I told him to forget it..use the money to buy Christmas presents for the kids. And when I handed him my final paycheck as a parting gift I told him to use it to do something nice for himself for a change. I certainly don't begrudge him taking the money. But I do wonder what the heck I was thinking. He didn't try to pay you back very hard, or he WOULD have paid you back. You should begrudge him taking the money. He used you. It sounds like he tricked you. He certainly did NOT seem to miss you after you were gone. He attempted to seduce you, and he took money from you. WTF are you still thinking when you make excuses for him? I wasn't the only person who gave money or material things to this man. The boss gave him "extra" money at Christmas. And other coworkers gave him clothes, toys, furniture and appliances that they were discarding. And it's not as if these other employees had much to give. Most were temps also working minimum wage..and many were divorced single parents supporting kids, too. He had a way of getting people to empathize with his situation. He knew how to tap into people's giving natures. It sounds like he's had a lot of experience in how to use people. It's no wonder you fell for his line, he's used to throwing it out and catching whoever is available to use.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 Taylor Other posters have mentioned the idea that APs see each other through "affair goggles".... meaning the only truth they see about each other is filtered through the prism of the affair. I didn't really deep down get this until I read your posts. Of course you wanted to see him as a good man, a man who was perhaps misunderstood, a man who would not let you down....look at the enormous price you were prepared to pay to keep your connection to him...the price to yourself and to your marriage. Of course you only wanted to see that within him that proved him worthy of this. I know that his disappearance when you needed his support hurt you terribly. It is understandable that you would feel hurt. I just hope that eventually you will see his emotional abandonment as a blessing. You got the chance to see exactly WHO he is and exactly how he behaves when the chips are down. AND years from now, when you look back at this period of your life the OM won't appear in your memory bathed in a rosey glow and you won't be thinking of him fondly. Continue to dig deep to figure out how you got here and you will learn to trust yourself again. If you never had a BS detector before, you have a well developed one now. Every word you write so eloquently here hits home and hits hard, PhoenixRise. The part bolded is exactly how I want to walk away from this. I am trying to get there. I am starting to see it. I know I had affair "goggles" on. It's scary because I didn't even know I had put them on. And seeing reality for what it truly is is not a simple matter of just removing the goggles. I am sure many BS get quite frustrated at their WS because it takes so long for them to see straight and think straight again. It's like coming out of a drunken stupor..or perhaps a coma! Seeing the emotional abandonment as a blessing...I think this is what Owl is also eluding to. I am hoping eventually I will see it like this...as soon as I can get rid of the pain also associated with it. Kind of like childbirth, I guess...a pain and a blessing at the same time. I will think of it that way. Thank you so much for posting here. It's helping immensely.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 So are you angry at OM for being a predator (a self-admitted one, at that)...or are you angry at YOURSELF for refusing to let yourself see him as a predator, regardless of the evidence and his own personal statements? Are you angry at OM for not contacting you at the end...or are you angry at him for deceiving you about what kind of person he was/is? No, not angry at him for being a predator. If he wants to be a wolf, let him be a wolf. Let him proclaim it from the rooftops. Let him hunt all he wants in someone else's back yard. But don't come sniffing around me. I have no use or respect for a predator. Never did. Never will. And don't disguise yourself as a SHEEP if you are indeed a wolf. Don't let me tend to you, care for you, give my heart to you THINKING you are a SHEEP. Don't leave me hanging..THINKING my SHEEP is lost somewhere and can't find his way back to me. Don't leave me to figure it all out on my own, in the most painful way, that you aren't a SHEEP after all, BUT A WOLF pretending to be a SHEEP. That you are not lost somewhere, but that you have run off because you are afraid of being shot. Most of the pain stems from him letting me down by not contacting me. He sent a loud, clear message that: He didn't care enough about me to call. I didn't mean enough to him to call. His heart was not in it enough to call. He was only in it to see what he could get out of it, not what he could put in it. I'm not angry at him because he stopped "feeling it." I'm angry at him for pretending for MONTHS that he was "feeling it"..when obviously he wasn't. My anger and resentment at him (and at myself) is for fooling me...pretending to be someone he wasn't. It makes me angry he made a fool of me by taking advantage of my giving nature under the guise of being a SHEEP. I didn't realize who he really was until I lost my job and I saw his true colors.
Owl Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 So at the bottom of it all...it's not that you're angry that he left and didn't say goodbye.... ...you're angry because he deceived you about his intentions and feelings. Would you agree?
silktricks Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 My anger and resentment at him (and at myself) is for fooling me...pretending to be someone he wasn't. It makes me angry he made a fool of me by taking advantage of my giving nature under the guise of being a SHEEP. I didn't realize who he really was until I lost my job and I saw his true colors. I would say that you still are coming to terms with realizing who he is.... and that it's taking an uncommonly long time to do so. You are now 16 months past affair and past losing your job, and you are just NOW beginning to get angry at HIM - and even now most of your anger appears to be because he didn't help you when you needed it - he didn't meet your fantasies of what and who he was. You are only now starting to realize that he really was the predator he said that he was. He may have fooled you, but maybe you are angry because YOU fooled YOURSELF. You saw what you wanted to see. You wanted (needed?) to be his rescuer and he allowed you (wanted you?) to fill that role, because it helped him. So you rescued him. Gave him money, gave him your job, came just short of giving him yourself and your marriage. Now you are angry because he didn't rescue you when you needed it... but those weren't the rules of the game you both were playing... you may not have known those rules, but they were certainly being broadcast. Sorry, not trying to be mean, but this is what I see....
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 Taylor: What do you think you would have gotten out of him contacting you? What I wanted to get out of him by contacting me was this: The affair is over. It ended when you lost your job. But before we part ways, I want you to know I am sorry you lost your job. I feel responsible. I am sorry you lost your father. I wish I could be there for you like you have been there for me but I can't. But it's not because I don't care for you. I want you to know you meant something to me, I cared for you, and I wanted to be there for you. I want you to know my heart was in it, even though it was wrong. If circumstances were different, you know this would have a different ending. I also want you to know that because my heart was in this, too, that I am also hurting. We never thought about the consequences of letting our friendship cross lines and now we are paying the price. But at the same time, you and I both know we would be paying an even bigger price if we let the affair progress. THAT's what I wanted out of the contact. I didn't get it. Not even close. This is what I came out with from your posts: He's a single parent, you have your H to fall back on. Your H found out. You and OM have never had sex (right?). This is all correct. We were on the verge of a sexual encounter. He had already asked and I had said yes. It had been building up to that point for months. And then I lost my job in a matter of a couple days...and it never happened. And you expect him to seriously keep contacting you. He's gonna get his booty kicked by your H for a woman who he's not sleeping with? No, I didn't expect him to KEEP contacting me. One contact with the above words would have sufficed. He didn't mind contacting me a couple times to see if my husband had suspicions. And he didn't mind sending me word that he wanted me to try to get back into the company. But he couldn't contact me to tell me any of the above. I get that he was your friend and you feel betrayed at that level. But you are MARRIED. He keeps contacting you, he "gets" that your H is gonna come after him. Yes, he disappeared the minute he knew my husband KNEW. I get that. But he had exactly 13 days prior to that to contact me about the job loss...prior to my husband knowing anything. For 13 days he didn't have anything to fear..and he still didn't contact. I would think he didn't want to make matters worse for either of you. He doesn't want to lose his job because he is a SINGLE parent. (Now he should have been doing his job, but if you're at will employees, then employers don't have to give a reason for laying people off/firing.) Employer may have even taken this into consideration. I can see this, GEL. And believe me, I am trying to see his side of things. I have been doing that for a year..trying to justify his cold shoulder the second I lost my job. But if he was so worried about his job, why didn't he cool it before I lost mine? That was the time to do it..IF he was so worried. He definitely made matters worse for me by NOT cooling it before I got fired. And the thing is, he did make matters worse for me by just disappearing. I spent months trying to figure out why he just disappeared on me..what did I say..what did I do...was he angry, mad, irritated, ashamed, scared, hurt, confused...what was it? I devoted months of time thinking about this when I could have moved on had I known for sure where his heart and head were after I left the job. He could have spared me alot of confusion and heartache. The silent exit was heartless and void of compassion. I think it's good that he didn't contact you. There was already too much damage and I don't how him contacting you would have done any good. In fact more likely the A would have continued and even became a PA. Like I said above, his silence did alot of damage. Honest thoughts and feelings spread out on the table and a quick firm goodbye would have made it easier and faster to let go and move on. He knew you weren't leaving your H, you didn't want to take it to the next level. He is a man and he's not going to jeopardize everything if he's not getting sex. They don't even jeopardize everything if they ARE getting sex. I get this. But every day for months he was jeopardizing everything and that didn't stop him. Nothing stopped him..not even the boss's reprimands..until I got fired. The chance of getting sex never changed...I had been waffling..sitting on a fence for months..and only agreed just days before the firing. I know you want to paint the picture that he was a user, and he probably was. But you also used him. Yes, we used each other. The difference being that my heart was in it. His wasn't. I truly cared about this person. He didn't. He meant something to me. I meant nothing to him. He wanted more from you, you are married and you didn't want to go there, but HE DID. He wasn't getting what he needed. It wasn't enough for you to support him and hold his hand and get your emotional needs met. You aren't the first poster to tell me this. But if this is true, then why did he stick around for months if he wasn't getting what he needed? And I did tell him just before I got fired that I was willing to cross the line with him. After the firing, that's all I wanted from him was to know he cared. Many other coworkers called and expressed care, concern and sympathy for what I was going thru. I wasn't providing any of them with sex. If they could pick up the phone and call, why couldn't he..the one I was emotionally connected to.
boldjack Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 A very interesting thread, Taylor. I empathize with your loss of your father, but with little else. For somebody who is supposedly a "giver", you are remarkably self-absorbed. Yes , your OM was a louse, I was an OM and I was a louse (albeit for different reasons) but that is no excuse for your present behavior. Concentrate on your husband, remember him? Stay NC with the OM and let the OM stay NC with you. JMHO.
Author taylor Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 So at the bottom of it all...it's not that you're angry that he left and didn't say goodbye.... ...you're angry because he deceived you about his intentions and feelings. Would you agree? Yes, it made me angry that he obviously pretended to have feelings and intentions. And while he was investing in the pretense, I was investing in him in a genuine way. And I didn't realize any of this until the day I left the job. Every day he didn't call the more confused I got. I didn't understand. It made no sense to me. I gave him every benefit of the doubt. Every excuse. Yes, he doesn't have time..daughter's sick. His phone is dead..shut off. Maybe he's sick. Maybe he's overloaded with work. Maybe he's shy Maybe he just doesn't know what to say As time went on, none of the excuses held up. As the excuses fell by the wayside, the only thing left, the only thing that made any sense was He never really cared. I never really mattered. It was all fake. And he was a fake.
Owl Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 And now you really understand what it is that has you angry. Not that he didn't contact you or try to at the end...but the simple fact that he wasn't what you thought he was. That he knowingly and intentionally led you to believe that he was one thing...while he was in reality something completely different...so that he could get you to carry this over to the physical. This IS something to be angry at him for. You know...somedays I wonder if I shoulda hung out a shingle...LOL.
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