My boyfriend and his 'girl friend' issue....

[Loveisabattlefield]

I have heard it all. It won't change until you do something about it. Yes, he may choose her or "his principles", but again, do you really want a guy who will disregard your emotions and feelings to stand on his principles? That's called inflexibility and selfishness! I fought with my now-fiance over all the same things. I told him if he was choosing being her friend over my feelings, then he in fact was choosing her over me.

 

I know it is hard -- it took me three years to realize that I would never get over it, and even though I would be very sad and miss him for awhile, in the long run I would NEVER be happy in a relationship with him if he was still talking to his ex. At least you got him out of your place for now -- that was one thing that held me to him for so long, too -- living with him!

 

I COMPLETELY agree with your advice, Stace!

[esl77]

The subject came up again last night and he vehemently got on his high horse, still not understanding why I even refused to meet her. I think he feels like I'm attacking her so he's defending her, because how can I attack someone I don't even know, right?

I said it's her or me last night, and he said no woman was going to tell him what to do, who he could be friends with or talk to, etc. or try to control his life and push him around. I tried to reason with him, but once he's in this 'mode' he tunes everything out. Yes, if you hadn't guessed already, even though he's almost 30, he's a bit on the immature side. He loves me, but he thinks I'm making an outrageous demand of him to tell him I don't want him being friends with this girl.

If SHE would end the friendship, that would solve it all, but I assume at this point she won't, she has issues apparently, he's even told me that. I even thought of trying to appeal to her woman to woman (or woman=me to crazy bitch=her), but I feel like that would backfire in my face, she'd tell him immediately. I don't know what he's thinking, I meant every word last night, but when he left for work today I missed him already. I feel quite sure he's the love of my life, so letting him go is extremely difficult for me while at the same time trying to maintain some dignity and self-respect. None of his past ex's have ever had a problem with this friendship, so he expects me to be the same way and I'm not. I'm the first one who has stood up and voiced my opinion and issued an ultimatum and he can't stand that.

I understand he's set in his ways and probably feels like I'm trying to dictate who he can and can't speak to or see, and to a point, I can because I'm the other half. There are 2 things he isn't: He is not a liar, and he's not a cheater, which is hard to find this day in age.

He DOES tell me when he talks to her, which is about every other month or so, maybe once/month but he only sees her every other month or so. He also tells me when he is going to meet her, where he's going, what time he'll be there and he's usually done within an hour, he calls me when he's through and typically wants to see me. He also never pays for anything of hers, she pays for her own stuff. He leaves a trail behind, so I see the receipts for dinner, etc. and I've never once caught him in a lie or anything, every time I've ever doubted him I've been wrong, sadly, when I checked up on it. I have access to his email, bank accounts, MySpace page, etc. (not that he knows about all of that ) There is nothing going on, I just disapprove of the friendship. When we fought about it last night he said he never wanted her back, there was nothing there, it wasn't like that, they were not getting back together, etc.

All I know is I'm trying to stick to my guns here, but I'm having a hard time following through because I know me and he knows me better than anyone, and we have a very hard time being separated, like I said I miss him already and he's just at work like any other day. It's sad....

[stace79]

I talked to my fiance about this last night. He told me point blank that the only reason he wanted to stay friends with his ex while he and I dated was that "if things didn't work out with you, I still had that door open. But if I cut off the friendship with her, and things didn't work out with you, I'd never be able to crawl back to her."

 

What he is doing is the equivalent of having "one foot out the door". Maybe he's not sure you're the one; maybe he's just scared of commitment. But you are not asking him to stop talking to several friends, or friends who have no bearing on your relationship. You are asking him to cease a friendship with ONE girl, with whom he had a relationship in the past.

 

Also don't waste your time with her -- I tried contacting his ex myself and she basically said I was an insecure, untrusting girlfriend who "hadn't moved on -- everyone else has". She didn't give a rat's butt about my feelings. If my fiance had wanted to keep talking to her, she was going to keep talking to him.

 

So sorry you are going through this. It may just take you awhile, like me, to get to a point where enough is enough. Take care of yourself though! This kind of thing has a way of making a woman hard, bitter, untrusting and suspicious, which is not good for your current or possible future relationships!

 

The subject came up again last night and he vehemently got on his high horse, still not understanding why I even refused to meet her. I think he feels like I'm attacking her so he's defending her, because how can I attack someone I don't even know, right?

I said it's her or me last night, and he said no woman was going to tell him what to do, who he could be friends with or talk to, etc. or try to control his life and push him around. I tried to reason with him, but once he's in this 'mode' he tunes everything out. Yes, if you hadn't guessed already, even though he's almost 30, he's a bit on the immature side. He loves me, but he thinks I'm making an outrageous demand of him to tell him I don't want him being friends with this girl.

If SHE would end the friendship, that would solve it all, but I assume at this point she won't, she has issues apparently, he's even told me that. I even thought of trying to appeal to her woman to woman (or woman=me to crazy bitch=her), but I feel like that would backfire in my face, she'd tell him immediately. I don't know what he's thinking, I meant every word last night, but when he left for work today I missed him already. I feel quite sure he's the love of my life, so letting him go is extremely difficult for me while at the same time trying to maintain some dignity and self-respect. None of his past ex's have ever had a problem with this friendship, so he expects me to be the same way and I'm not. I'm the first one who has stood up and voiced my opinion and issued an ultimatum and he can't stand that.

I understand he's set in his ways and probably feels like I'm trying to dictate who he can and can't speak to or see, and to a point, I can because I'm the other half. There are 2 things he isn't: He is not a liar, and he's not a cheater, which is hard to find this day in age.

He DOES tell me when he talks to her, which is about every other month or so, maybe once/month but he only sees her every other month or so. He also tells me when he is going to meet her, where he's going, what time he'll be there and he's usually done within an hour, he calls me when he's through and typically wants to see me. He also never pays for anything of hers, she pays for her own stuff. He leaves a trail behind, so I see the receipts for dinner, etc. and I've never once caught him in a lie or anything, every time I've ever doubted him I've been wrong, sadly, when I checked up on it. I have access to his email, bank accounts, MySpace page, etc. (not that he knows about all of that ) There is nothing going on, I just disapprove of the friendship. When we fought about it last night he said he never wanted her back, there was nothing there, it wasn't like that, they were not getting back together, etc.

All I know is I'm trying to stick to my guns here, but I'm having a hard time following through because I know me and he knows me better than anyone, and we have a very hard time being separated, like I said I miss him already and he's just at work like any other day. It's sad....

[esl77]

I talked to my fiance about this last night. He told me point blank that the only reason he wanted to stay friends with his ex while he and I dated was that "if things didn't work out with you, I still had that door open. But if I cut off the friendship with her, and things didn't work out with you, I'd never be able to crawl back to her."

 

What he is doing is the equivalent of having "one foot out the door". Maybe he's not sure you're the one; maybe he's just scared of commitment. But you are not asking him to stop talking to several friends, or friends who have no bearing on your relationship. You are asking him to cease a friendship with ONE girl, with whom he had a relationship in the past.

 

Also don't waste your time with her -- I tried contacting his ex myself and she basically said I was an insecure, untrusting girlfriend who "hadn't moved on -- everyone else has". She didn't give a rat's butt about my feelings. If my fiance had wanted to keep talking to her, she was going to keep talking to him.

 

So sorry you are going through this. It may just take you awhile, like me, to get to a point where enough is enough. Take care of yourself though! This kind of thing has a way of making a woman hard, bitter, untrusting and suspicious, which is not good for your current or possible future relationships!

 

 

 

 

Thank you, you can probably relate more than anyone else. The fact is, I dont' know what to do, even after all of the advice. I love him to death, we do have other issues but she's the main one, always has been from day one. He's never lied about her, he hardly sees/speaks to her, and I know there is nothing going on between them, I don't have to meet her to know that. I think she is just a born loser with 2 failed marriages at the ripe age of 29 and has nothing better to do than try and wedge herself if/when she wants to between he and I, IMO. He tells me what they talk about, and she said when they met for dinner last week that the reason she didn't call him more to hang out was because it always led to a fight between he and I, and he agreed, and he said that was the end of the discussion. He doesn't go into detail about our relationship with her, and in the beginning when we started dating he openly invited me to come with him when he met up with her so these problems wouldn't be here now, and I refused. I still refuse. He said I had an open invitation, he isn't hiding anything. We have talked about them getting back together. He and I broke up over this issue back in November and I didn't speak to him, it lasted almost 3 weeks and he found lame reasons to call me until I agreed to meet him, then the next night he proposed and asked me to marry him, which is now null and void due to the constant arguing (it's gotten lots better since he moved out!) The fact is he could have gotten back with her then, but he didn't. He's had ample opportunities, but I don't think either of them want to get back together, she just has no life. They truly are just friends I firmly believe and he's not leaving the door open for later, she doesn't want him, there's a reason they broke up and part of it is because he is a pretty heavy smoker and she cannot stand that, I put up with it because I love him and it could be worse.

He's dated several people since their relationship ended about 11 years ago, including being married for 6 years. They were only together about 6 months and she dumped him, they 'couldn't get along.' He told me sometimes people make better friends than lovers. I think personally that they get together every once in a while to bitch about their problems, he's told me what they talk about, he gripes about work and I don't know nor care what she talks about. The last time he met her (time before this) was only for about 20 minutes at a fast food place.

I'm insecure I guess about the relationship. As I said, I've always been wrong when I've doubted him or been untrusting. I agree with you, but he doesn't see it that way and I guess he never will, he thinks I'm trying to control him like his mom does with his dad, and he won't have any part of it.

It remember back in May she left him a voicemail asking him to come out one weekend night for her birthday party. Not only did he not call her back or tell her happy b'day or anything of the sort, he never went either. That shows you how good of a friend he really can be. He goes through different people depending on what phase of his life he's in, minus me, he has a hard time separating from me for whatever reason. She's been around for the past 10 years and has dated people in between also, but, surprise, hasn't landed one that stuck yet.

[stace79]

Well, all I can say is that you have to decide how important this issue is to you, and if you can get over it and have a relatively happy relationship. If you can't, you will either have to bail or put up with arguments.

 

One other point I will make - I used to say that the "biggest" or "most important" issue in my R was the ex. Once he told her he couldn't be her friend anymore, we discovered a whole host of other issues that we are now working on. That was just the one that made me the maddest and most unhappy. I would suggest writing out a list of all the pros/cons of your R to see if you really are that happy with this guy.

 

I feel that in my case, it turned in to a competition between me and this ex. Even now, we still talk about what would happen if she ignored his decision to not be her friend and she just showed up randomly. I want him to totally crush her feelings by being a jerk; he would want to be polite but reinforce his decision. I even found myself admitting that I wanted him to crush her feelings and hurt her as much as he hurt me (when he broke up with me for her several years ago).

 

If it's a competition, then it isn't being done for the "right" reasons. Anyway I actually worked with a counselor for a time being, albeit for some other issues in addition to this. But I have a huge problem with forgiveness (of anyone), and it does nothing but put me in a bad mood. I'm sure she isn't crying herself to sleep at night that she ruined my R for awhile and now I won't forgive her. The only one it hurts is us!

 

Thank you, you can probably relate more than anyone else. The fact is, I dont' know what to do, even after all of the advice. I love him to death, we do have other issues but she's the main one, always has been from day one. He's never lied about her, he hardly sees/speaks to her, and I know there is nothing going on between them, I don't have to meet her to know that. I think she is just a born loser with 2 failed marriages at the ripe age of 29 and has nothing better to do than try and wedge herself if/when she wants to between he and I, IMO. He tells me what they talk about, and she said when they met for dinner last week that the reason she didn't call him more to hang out was because it always led to a fight between he and I, and he agreed, and he said that was the end of the discussion. He doesn't go into detail about our relationship with her, and in the beginning when we started dating he openly invited me to come with him when he met up with her so these problems wouldn't be here now, and I refused. I still refuse. He said I had an open invitation, he isn't hiding anything. We have talked about them getting back together. He and I broke up over this issue back in November and I didn't speak to him, it lasted almost 3 weeks and he found lame reasons to call me until I agreed to meet him, then the next night he proposed and asked me to marry him, which is now null and void due to the constant arguing (it's gotten lots better since he moved out!) The fact is he could have gotten back with her then, but he didn't. He's had ample opportunities, but I don't think either of them want to get back together, she just has no life. They truly are just friends I firmly believe and he's not leaving the door open for later, she doesn't want him, there's a reason they broke up and part of it is because he is a pretty heavy smoker and she cannot stand that, I put up with it because I love him and it could be worse.

He's dated several people since their relationship ended about 11 years ago, including being married for 6 years. They were only together about 6 months and she dumped him, they 'couldn't get along.' He told me sometimes people make better friends than lovers. I think personally that they get together every once in a while to bitch about their problems, he's told me what they talk about, he gripes about work and I don't know nor care what she talks about. The last time he met her (time before this) was only for about 20 minutes at a fast food place.

I'm insecure I guess about the relationship. As I said, I've always been wrong when I've doubted him or been untrusting. I agree with you, but he doesn't see it that way and I guess he never will, he thinks I'm trying to control him like his mom does with his dad, and he won't have any part of it.

It remember back in May she left him a voicemail asking him to come out one weekend night for her birthday party. Not only did he not call her back or tell her happy b'day or anything of the sort, he never went either. That shows you how good of a friend he really can be. He goes through different people depending on what phase of his life he's in, minus me, he has a hard time separating from me for whatever reason. She's been around for the past 10 years and has dated people in between also, but, surprise, hasn't landed one that stuck yet.

[esl77]

After much debate and some soul searching, I've decided to try and ride out the storm with him. I do truly love him and would like to work it out if we can get through the issues, even if that means him keeping her as a friend and my dislike of the situation, it isn't really her, she's just the catalyst for our problem. He doesn't like her as anything more than a friend, and he's already said if she even mentioned that he shouldn't be in this relationship, etc. that he would tell her the same thing- that he is a free person who makes his own decisions and she's not going to tell him who he should or shouldn't see.

After being rash last night though, he's talking to me but is about ready to call it quits, so now I have to work through this part of it and see if we can get back together... again.

I'm hoping for the best, not sure yet how this will all turn out, if it was meant to be, it will be okay.

 

Thanks to everyone for their advice, I really appreciate the help.

[AlektraClementine]

Nice. So he snatched the ball right out of your hands and you're the one trying to fix the relationship.

[stace79]

Nice. So he snatched the ball right out of your hands and you're the one trying to fix the relationship.

 

Each person makes his/her own decisions on their own timelines. Trust me, I understand where she is coming from -- I had friends, family, even acquaintances tell me I deserved better. I didn't listen. I had to come to the realization on my own time that any man who would choose another woman's friendship over my feelings wasn't the man for me.

[AlektraClementine]

Stace - you're absolutely right about timelines. I was merely making a comment on the situation. Some people (in this case her BF) can be absolute manipulation masters.

 

p.s. I'm also secretly hoping she sees this little birdie;)

[stace79]

Stace - you're absolutely right about timelines. I was merely making a comment on the situation. Some people (in this case her BF) can be absolute manipulation masters.

 

p.s. I'm also secretly hoping she sees this little birdie;)

 

My fiance is also a manipulation master. He just knows now that I am not afraid to call him on that BS, and I'm not afraid to take my ball and go home! haha

 

The OP should read that book by the comedian... Steve Harvey "Act like a lady, think like a man" or something. It was a good read for me.

[esl77]

Ha, I appreciate the honesty! You're right, he's a master manipulator without being obvious about it, I know it. When I moved him out the weekend of July 4th, I was truly done with it, went out with my friends, did what I wanted, stayed busy, and it wasn't until 2 days later when he came by to get most of his clothes, etc. that he started back pedaling and I wasn't falling for it again, until I did a few days later and took him back again, only difference is he lives elsewhere now. I will look into that book, it sounds funny! Once I get it in my head again that I'm through and don't care, it's okay, but I am not in the mindset again because yet another month+ has gone by and he's still around. He knows for whatever reason I have a weakness for him and have lost most of my backbone, it's still there, but it's minimal these days.

I'll reach my breaking point sooner or later (probably sooner rather than later) and that will be it, it'll be over and done with. I wish you guys lived around here, you'd be a great voice of reason and fun to hang out with I think! My friends have given up on saying anything to me about it anymore. Stace knows exactly where I'm coming from, it sounds like an almost identical situation, only your man chose you, and mine will choose his independence, as he refers to it, over me trying to choose his friends. We'll see what happens..... be back tomorrow!

[EmptyPromises]

your ex sounds like a total tool. i think if he loved you enough and didnt want to lose you, hed cut off ties with her without anyproblems. i dont see why he has to stay friends with his ex, id be very uncomfortable with that.

 

maybe you should turn the tables on him and give him a taste of his own medicine. tell him uve been in contact with an ex that you want to be friends with. let him see how it feels.

[esl77]

Well thank you He certainly has his issues, but doesn't everyone. He hasn't given her up for anyone, not even his ex-wife of 6 years. The ex wife had a problem with his frienship with this girl also until she agreed to meet her, then they were friends. Personally, I think that is very strange and would never go along with it, but to each his own.

I have a couple of ex's still around and my former male best friend of 13 years that comes back to town every so often to visit, we usually meet up for lunch or something. I will do what I want like he does, there are lines that won't be crossed, however, and he is very aware of that. I see my boyfriend every day and he usually spends every night with me or at his parent's house, and I'm very close to them, we talk daily also. Anyway, we agreed last night to try and work things out, he doesn't see this chick but once every so often, now if it became a weekly thing or more frequent or they started talking more often, then I will have an issue with it, but he's looking at moving away and taking a different job and I am staying here, so that will be that if/when it happens.

Who knows, thanks for the advice!

[pinkstar]

This problem is completely understandable. Only women can understand, I completely disagree with what they said that it is completely ok ( One guy has said and I just read his reply to your post). By the way, to be honest I think once a relationship reaches this point and breaks several time and the reason is the same, it means it won't work. It's clear that most men looks for variety and do not undertand what committment mean....For sure, he has some passions toward this special woman and he can never break up. End this relationship, it will be difficult, but it worths...

[esl77]

I have ended it, he has ended it, he always comes crawling back. I have decided to live with it for as long as I can, then that will be it. I don't like the situation, but I love him. He cares about this girl, but not in the sense of wanting to be in any type of relationship with her, that was years ago and if it hasn't happened by now, it probably won't. They aren't compatible apparently as anything other than friends. He and I are polar opposites starting with our political views and ending with things like this issue right here. But he knows he will never, ever find anyone better than me, especially given what he has to offer, so he holds onto me as much as he can, because he's damn lucky to have me in the first place, and he knows that deep down. His family, who has never agreed on anyone that he's dated, all love me like I'm one of their own.

Anyway, I'll tolerate it as long as I can while in the meantime I regain some of my backbone, and when it ends, it ends. I said everything has a beginning and an end, it's just a matter of reaching that point.

I'm not sure what will happen long-term, but I'm actually glad our engagement was broken, if we had gotten married I'd be stuck or already filing for divorce, and I don't want to do that. His ex-wife cheated on him and is now married to that man. He's been cheated on several times, so knowing how painful that is to go through, he would never do that to anyone, he would break up with me (and mean it) first. There is no one else, I know that, it's just a matter of what each of us is willing to put up with and what we aren't!

[Teslacoil]

So you were dating, got engaged, broke up, and then got back together.

 

So right now, you're together but no longer engaged?

 

It sounds like you're playing this by ear, trying to get over his friendship with this girl, and move on with the relationship, where ever it goes.

 

Do you foresee getting engaged to this guy again? Or do you think that the probability of him being "the one" has gone down.

[EarthGirl]

you think he's "damn lucky" to have you and he could never get anyone as good as you because of "what he has to offer"? I'm assuming that you think he has less to offer than you, then?

 

I don't see why you would be with someone if you think they have so little to offer anyway. Perhaps she sees more to him than you do.

[EarthGirl]

p.s. I believe there was a classic song written about this situation...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e47T8dW-gH0

[esl77]

Ha. Avril Lavigne isn't what I'd refer to as a 'classic' song, but whatever you think. He cares more about himself than anyone else, so until that changes, he can't really offer anyone anything. You have to be SELFLESS to make a relationship like this work, and I have been from the day I said 'Yes' when we got engaged. I always put him first, as is evident by this situation. Most girls would say **** it and be done with him, would have a long time ago. I truly love him despite what he's done and hope that one day he will wake up and realize that before it's too late and I am gone, because that day is coming sooner rather than later I'm afraid.

She doesn't see anything in him. If they wanted to go back into a relationship, they've had many opportunities, especially after he got divorced a couple of years back, but they didn't. She doesn't want him, she only cares about meddling in our relationship because he lets her get away with it. If he'd stand up and tell her to get lost, she would, they aren't that tight really. He even referred to her as his 'weekday dinner whore' when he chooses just yesterday. But he won't do that and until he does, she will continue this BS and drama for what it's worth.

 

Teslacoil: Yes, we dated 5 months, broke up for about 2.5 weeks, got back together and got engaged the next day. The engagement was broken off in April (funny that's her name) when I decided I'd had enough of him for a while and packed my stuff to stay with my mom for a weekend, I was gone about 4 days and he stated that when I did that, that ended our engagement. That and we argued all the time, living with someone is highly recommended from my perspective. You don't really know the ins and outs of a person until you've lived with them day in and day out for a while. He's tough to live with but I've done it pretty much since November. I clean up behind him, do things for him, he will sometimes run errands with me and he does cook, but that's about it. He purchased my big Christmas present from a rent to own place, which I didn't know until 2 months later, and he refused to pay it this month after finding out the company screwed him royally, so they just came to repo my present this morning So now I have no engagement, but still have $3k in wedding materials that are useless and a beautiful dress to wear for no one. That, and my present was taken back. Anything of value he's done or given me has blown up in my face, and he thinks he's done nothing wrong!

We are together at this point for as long as I can hold out but no, we are no longer engaged. You're right, it's a 'one day at a time' thing with us, he no longer wants to get married (to anyone, period) and says that eventually I am going to want that, and at that point I'll have to break up with him and move on. He is now anti-marriage and anti-having kids (before he wanted 3, he even picked their names out and he was dead set on that, now he wants none.) He needs to grow up, no girl should have to put up with this type of BS in her life, especially not for this length of time. I don't foresee getting engaged to him, it would probably be a mistake if I did, I won't go through that kind of heartache with him again. Just watching the WE channel with all of the weddings makes me cry now, knowing I've put up with this for well over a year and I have gotten so little in return.