Does This Fit Your Scenario, BSs?

[Gamine]

Okay, this may sound completely bizarre and I'm not giving this a great deal of thought before blabbing it out... but what if we are the flip side of the coin? The mommy they really wanted but the compulsions to acting out are a compulsion for self deprecation.

 

Now, I'm not saying it's the same thing... but what about people who are cutters? They feel 'better' when they are cutting.

[PhoenixRise]

I thought the scenerios you pointed out were right on target for both myself and my H. And are true to at least some degree for 99% of affairs.

 

The biggest thing I believe that I take flack for here is that OW who have affairs with MM are at a vulnerable point in their lives when they do so. Strong women who are not vulnerable DO NOT engage in affairs with MM. Its as simple as that.

 

When I was OW , I thought I was strong. In fact, I thought I was in more control of my life than I had ever been. The reality in hindsight was the opposite.

 

One other thing I want to point out. I was OW several times over. Having an affair with a MM is easier than a real relationship in a lot of ways. That being said if anyone of them had asked me at the time: Who are you??

My response could have been: Anyone you want me to be.

 

2Sure

 

Are you saying that when you were an OW you didn't HAVE a sense of your own identity or are you saying that you did know who you were but you consciously morphed into whatever the MM wanted you to be?

 

What you say about some OW thinking that being the OW is a position of strength is interesting. I read an article some time ago (I think in Vogue) written by an older woman who was an OW. She wrote about the strength of her position and that she got the best of both worlds. She got romance, trips, connection with MM as well as her solitude when she wanted it, while the wife got the dirty socks.

 

AND

 

I have also seen you post that when you were an OW you could have been anyone and that your H's OW could have been anyone.

 

This is the hardest concept for me to wrap my head around. My H said almost exactly these words to me (that initially, she could have been anyone) when we started to reconcile and create a new marriage for ourselves. But if I am reading you right and you became whatever the MM wanted you to be then it makes more sense.

 

A

[Snowflower]

 

 

Now I am wondering just how much mommy issues played a part in my H chosing ME for his W and OW as OW.

 

Any thoughts on this?

 

Yeah, I think absolutely for my husband and me. I had mentioned it earlier in this thread...I came from an intact family, my husband's family was not. It might have been partially why my husband was attracted to me as we started our relationship. I had the family background that my husband had always wanted. Our MC helped us see this.

 

One of the 'complaints' my husband had about me/our marriage was that I never put him first-much like his family of origin. He is right to some extent...like many wives/mothers, I put our children first many times over my husband/marriage.

 

My husband has said he was okay with this for a long time-me putting our children ahead of him--because he NEVER had that growing up. He was neglected emotionally as a child. So, when he saw me placing a very high priority on our own kids-he was perfectly okay with that. I think subconsciously he felt at least his children were getting what he never had. A common thing for a parent to do-to try to correct their own childhood through being a parent. It's actually a very healthy way to handle childhood issues.

 

However, as our children got older and needed us less, or at least in different ways, those old hurts, old voids started to come back to the surface for my husband. But, we didn't change our marital relationship to accommodate this-I don't think either of us even knew to do this. You can guess what happened.

[2sure]

Are you saying that when you were an OW you didn't HAVE a sense of your own identity or are you saying that you did know who you were but you consciously morphed into whatever the MM wanted you to be?

 

You get it completely, completely! When I was OW I consciously gave MM the fantasy OW he wanted. I thought this put me in charge. In reality, it was easy for me to do this because I had no idea who I really was anyway. It was fake it until you make it to the extreme.

 

What you say about some OW thinking that being the OW is a position of strength is interesting. I read an article some time ago (I think in Vogue) written by an older woman who was an OW. She wrote about the strength of her position and that she got the best of both worlds. She got romance, trips, connection with MM as well as her solitude when she wanted it, while the wife got the dirty socks.

 

There is no denying that being given romance, hot sex, gifts, trips, compliments, and feeling like a sex goddess a few hours a week is not fun. Especially if in real life you have had nothing but disappointing relationships, especially when you are struggling in some other aspect of your life, especially when outside of the affair realm...you are not a goddess capable of fulfilling a mans every desire...you are just average. Nobody. The empowerment a nobody feels from an affair is hard to give up.

 

 

I have also seen you post that when you were an OW you could have been anyone and that your H's OW could have been anyone.

 

All you really have to be is willing. The affair fantasy goggles do the rest.

[PhoenixRise]

Yeah, I think absolutely for my husband and me. I had mentioned it earlier in this thread...I came from an intact family, my husband's family was not. It might have been partially why my husband was attracted to me as we started our relationship. I had the family background that my husband had always wanted. Our MC helped us see this.

 

One of the 'complaints' my husband had about me/our marriage was that I never put him first-much like his family of origin. He is right to some extent...like many wives/mothers, I put our children first many times over my husband/marriage.

 

My husband has said he was okay with this for a long time-me putting our children ahead of him--because he NEVER had that growing up. He was neglected emotionally as a child. So, when he saw me placing a very high priority on our own kids-he was perfectly okay with that. I think subconsciously he felt at least his children were getting what he never had. A common thing for a parent to do-to try to correct their own childhood through being a parent. It's actually a very healthy way to handle childhood issues.

 

However, as our children got older and needed us less, or at least in different ways, those old hurts, old voids started to come back to the surface for my husband. But, we didn't change our marital relationship to accommodate this-I don't think either of us even knew to do this. You can guess what happened.

 

 

Amazing how something that is such a blessing (children) can have an unintentionally negative impact on a marriage isn't it.

 

In the context of the conversation happening in this thread I am starting to see some things differently. After our daughter was born, my H started to feel left out. I was breastfeeding and bonded tightly with our daughter. Now I am seeing that that bond triggered mommie issues for him because his mother bonded with my SIL and excluded my H.

 

So while he loved it that I was so devoted to our child, he also feared it because he thought he was going to be left out.

 

AND I too had to learn as our child has grown up and does not need us to the same extent, to make the relationship with my H a priority.

 

Too Bad we don't get a manual when we get married and another manual when we have children that teaches us how to get this all right.

[PhoenixRise]

Are you saying that when you were an OW you didn't HAVE a sense of your own identity or are you saying that you did know who you were but you consciously morphed into whatever the MM wanted you to be?

 

You get it completely, completely! When I was OW I consciously gave MM the fantasy OW he wanted. I thought this put me in charge. In reality, it was easy for me to do this because I had no idea who I really was anyway. It was fake it until you make it to the extreme.

 

What you say about some OW thinking that being the OW is a position of strength is interesting. I read an article some time ago (I think in Vogue) written by an older woman who was an OW. She wrote about the strength of her position and that she got the best of both worlds. She got romance, trips, connection with MM as well as her solitude when she wanted it, while the wife got the dirty socks.

 

There is no denying that being given romance, hot sex, gifts, trips, compliments, and feeling like a sex goddess a few hours a week is not fun. Especially if in real life you have had nothing but disappointing relationships, especially when you are struggling in some other aspect of your life, especially when outside of the affair realm...you are not a goddess capable of fulfilling a mans every desire...you are just average. Nobody. The empowerment a nobody feels from an affair is hard to give up.

 

 

I have also seen you post that when you were an OW you could have been anyone and that your H's OW could have been anyone.

 

All you really have to be is willing. The affair fantasy goggles do the rest.

 

 

2Sure

 

Thank you for answering my questions so honestly.

 

You helped a lot of things to click into place for me. I had never considered that for some women who push that concept of OW strength, they push it because other aspects of their lives are either a mess or at best average. You have given me lots of food for thought.

[Snowflower]

 

AND I too had to learn as our child has grown up and does not need us to the same extent, to make the relationship with my H a priority.

 

Too Bad we don't get a manual when we get married and another manual when we have children that teaches us how to get this all right.

 

Yeah, this thread is making me think, too. It's nice to know I wasn't alone in my mistakes I made in my marriage.

 

A marriage manual would be helpful because sometimes you just don't know! Everyone always says that cheating is never the answer and that the unhappy spouse should discuss their problems rather than cheating. Of course, I agree with this 100%...but if you never quite knew what the issues were...then how can you possibly communicate this to your spouse?!

 

I knew a little about my husband's 'mommie issues' before his affair, but not that much. He kept them tightly bottled up, hidden deep...and I always felt bad if I pried or tried to bring up the past. I kind of figured it wasn't my business-I sensed it was a painful subject for him and left it alone.

 

At a weak point in our marriage-these old hurts were triggered.

 

There was no way I could have even began to predict that his 'mommie issues' were going to rear the ugly head in our marriage. And I know for a fact that my husband didn't know either. When it came out in MC--he was shocked, his surprise was genuine. He had to work through it and one of the biggest steps in recovery is that he and I worked through his pain and disillusionment together.

 

I've always heard that a man will usually have two significant females in his life--his mother and his wife. And I bet the bank that these two females are closely linked emotionally for most men...bringing a whole host of issues, good and bad.

 

I wish I had had a marriage manual to help me see this coming! Maybe I could have prevented this crisis in my marriage.

[2sure]

I dont even want to begin to entertain the mommy issue.

 

I love my mother in law, I know she/he have issues and if we are alike...

 

Nah. just not going there.

[foreal]

I just want to thank you all for posting all this..it is so incredibly helpful....

 

Thank you, I really needed this today.

[Gamine]

I just want to thank you all for posting all this..it is so incredibly helpful....

 

Thank you, I really needed this today.

 

I'm glad that you are feeling better today, foreal. I'm sending you luv.

[2sure]

I just want to thank you all for posting all this..it is so incredibly helpful....

 

Thank you, I really needed this today.

 

I have real love for every single of one you, both because Ive walked through that fire and because I partipated in it.

 

How stupid am I , you know? I cannot believe how long it took me or what I had to do to learn the lessons most of you just ..came by via common sense.

[PhoenixRise]

Yeah, this thread is making me think, too. It's nice to know I wasn't alone in my mistakes I made in my marriage.

 

A marriage manual would be helpful because sometimes you just don't know! Everyone always says that cheating is never the answer and that the unhappy spouse should discuss their problems rather than cheating. Of course, I agree with this 100%...but if you never quite knew what the issues were...then how can you possibly communicate this to your spouse?!

 

I knew a little about my husband's 'mommie issues' before his affair, but not that much. He kept them tightly bottled up, hidden deep...and I always felt bad if I pried or tried to bring up the past. I kind of figured it wasn't my business-I sensed it was a painful subject for him and left it alone.

 

At a weak point in our marriage-these old hurts were triggered.

 

There was no way I could have even began to predict that his 'mommie issues' were going to rear the ugly head in our marriage. And I know for a fact that my husband didn't know either. When it came out in MC--he was shocked, his surprise was genuine. He had to work through it and one of the biggest steps in recovery is that he and I worked through his pain and disillusionment together.

 

I've always heard that a man will usually have two significant females in his life--his mother and his wife. And I bet the bank that these two females are closely linked emotionally for most men...bringing a whole host of issues, good and bad.

 

I wish I had had a marriage manual to help me see this coming! Maybe I could have prevented this crisis in my marriage.

 

 

unfortunatly sometimes you don't know WHAT you don't know. AND for me, coming from a long line of single mothers, learning to balance the needs of a child AND the needs of a husband was just one of the things I didn't know. I didn't even know that it was something I NEEDED to know.

 

Have you ever heard of the Imago theory by Harvel Hendrix? In a nutshell it is the theory that people unconsciously choose as their mate the person who is MOST LIKELY to trigger their childhood wounds in an unconscious effort to get those wounds healed.

 

This thread is making me wonder if there is more than a little truth to the Imago theory.

[PhoenixRise]

I just want to thank you all for posting all this..it is so incredibly helpful....

 

Thank you, I really needed this today.

 

 

Foreal

 

I am glad to see you posting. Hope you are feeling better.

[foreal]

I think I am having a breakthrough-

 

This thread is therapeutic to read.

 

I hope it keeps going...thanks again to you all.

 

I FEEL THE LOVE! and damn I need that.

[Spark1111]

2sure, as always, amazing helpful insights from an OWs perspective.

 

Ah yes, the mommy manual.

 

I think, in a moment of clarity, my husband chose me, the polar opposite of his mother, but then began to complain of what she did that I didn't do often enough to suit him; cook, clean, and.....cook and clean some more.

 

I was a wonderful mother and he adored and supported that aspect of me. I also have a college degree, worked full-time when the youngest started school full-time, belonged to several civic associations. I always felt he was very proud of me, someone very unlike his mother, who never balanced a check book or drove on a highway.

 

When our youngest left for college is when he began to distance himself from me, friends, family and complain of what I didn't do. For the first time ever, complain of what our children weren't doing. Truly strange in retrospect.

 

She presented as a damsel in distress, needing his advice for everything, though she too is college educated with an important position.

 

It worked. So yes, his OW and I share similiar characteristics with one glaring exception: I would never allow anyone to feel sorry for me to the point of being unfaithful, or taking me on expensive trips when they have children to support and that speaks volumes to her true character.

 

She was lonely, few friends, few strong familial relationships, and yet, somewhat manipulative, but with a lot of spiritual speak thrown in for good measure.

 

Somewhat, no, a lot like, his mother.

[bentnotbroken]

WTH:eek:You mean you guys didn't get a manual with your kids? I got one for each child. Though they had different copyright dates, both had the same thing on the first page and the last page....YOU DON'T KNOW JACK:lmao::lmao:

 

We are human and humans screw up. I think we win when we don't let it stop us from trying to do the right thing.

[Spark1111]

The hardest, most challenging job I have ever done. I tell people, especially women, that I have worked outside the home and inside the home, and hands down, the hardest job there is is being home all day with young children. For that alone, I will see you in heaven.

[Snowflower]

unfortunatly sometimes you don't know WHAT you don't know. AND for me, coming from a long line of single mothers, learning to balance the needs of a child AND the needs of a husband was just one of the things I didn't know. I didn't even know that it was something I NEEDED to know.

 

Have you ever heard of the Imago theory by Harvel Hendrix? In a nutshell it is the theory that people unconsciously choose as their mate the person who is MOST LIKELY to trigger their childhood wounds in an unconscious effort to get those wounds healed.

 

This thread is making me wonder if there is more than a little truth to the Imago theory.

 

Hi PR, you're exactly right when you say you don't know what you don't know! I agree...and it is easy to "Monday morning quarterback" almost any situation.

 

I have not heard of the Imago theory. It IS interesting though...and I agree after reading this thread and thinking about my own situation, if there isn't some truth to the 'nutshell' version you posted above.

 

I always heard the saying "you marry your mother" (for the guys) or 'you marry your father" (for the girls), in that you subconsciously pick a mate who shares characteristics of your opposite gendered parent. It makes sense, and I know my husband does remind me of my father in some ways-good ways. I had a good relationship with my father.

 

But yes, I've learned that my husband also had some characteristics that triggered some issues of my own-I just haven't quite figured out where these issues came from.

[Snowflower]

I think I am having a breakthrough-

 

This thread is therapeutic to read.

 

I hope it keeps going...thanks again to you all.

 

I FEEL THE LOVE! and damn I need that.

 

I'm glad this thread is helping you!

 

You can learn a lot of these boards, about yourself, other people and about relationships.

[Spark1111]

unfortunatly sometimes you don't know WHAT you don't know. AND for me, coming from a long line of single mothers, learning to balance the needs of a child AND the needs of a husband was just one of the things I didn't know. I didn't even know that it was something I NEEDED to know.

 

Have you ever heard of the Imago theory by Harvel Hendrix? In a nutshell it is the theory that people unconsciously choose as their mate the person who is MOST LIKELY to trigger their childhood wounds in an unconscious effort to get those wounds healed.

 

This thread is making me wonder if there is more than a little truth to the Imago theory.

 

So true. I've have recently seen/read about the IMAGO theory and I think it has some validity, which certainly explain why marriage takes work.

 

But years ago, and I think this concept is certainly along the same lines, is that we marry a "more improved" version of the parent we had the LEAST successful relationship with in an effort to, yes, heal those wounds.

[silktricks]

Hmmmm - does that mean if you marry twice, and the two people are polar opposites that you're working on... both parents? Or is the second one working on the screwed up relationship of the first? Or maybe the second is some of the other traits of the parent that didn't get dealt with in the first... oh dear, I'm getting so confused...

[Molley]

Totally my WH… He grew up in a house hold where there was no love shown, no affection, no one really spoke to each other about anything significant. Mom got slapped around by the dad every “once in a while.” Of course, I didn’t know any of this until our 18th year together (14 married) after Dday. My family is very loving, affectionate and we talk thing out. The OW globbed on the affection and attention toward my H while I was busy building a business, stressed out over finances and I guess I wasn’t paying enough attention to my husband. Of course, I had no idea that my WH was unhappy, he never said a word, just went out and found the OW. Now 4 ½ months later he’s out of the house for the second time because he just won’t stop contacting her and I refuse to be his doormat, there’s room for only 2 people in our marriage…. So, for the last week, he’s fallen off the face of the earth, I have no idea where he is.

 

In addition she’s older than my H and me, so she acts kind of like his mother, but looks more like his older sister, who cared for him quite a bit when he was growing up. Of course, I’m the polar opposite of the OW. Also, from what my H said about the OW, she’s a single mother, kind, God fearing (OMG… really?), just nice and kind as can be…. She takes care of him, bla, bla, bla…. Of course the fact that I took care of my H for 18 years, doing everything for him, doesn’t count.

 

So yes, scenario #1 and #2 combined has come into play for my WH’s affair. Still, he's an adult, so I'm not using this as an excuse for what happened. My husband destroyed his marriage with his eyes wide open. One day he'll have to come to terms with that.

[Spark1111]

Hmmmm - does that mean if you marry twice, and the two people are polar opposites that you're working on... both parents? Or is the second one working on the screwed up relationship of the first? Or maybe the second is some of the other traits of the parent that didn't get dealt with in the first... oh dear, I'm getting so confused...

 

 

hahahaha! Yes, maybe! I think we are back to, "wherever you go, there you are." Without a lot of introspection and counseling I'd wager.

[Spark1111]

Totally my WH… He grew up in a house hold where there was no love shown, no affection, no one really spoke to each other about anything significant. Mom got slapped around by the dad every “once in a while.” Of course, I didn’t know any of this until our 18th year together (14 married) after Dday. My family is very loving, affectionate and we talk thing out. The OW globbed on the affection and attention toward my H while I was busy building a business, stressed out over finances and I guess I wasn’t paying enough attention to my husband. Of course, I had no idea that my WH was unhappy, he never said a word, just went out and found the OW. Now 4 ½ months later he’s out of the house for the second time because he just won’t stop contacting her and I refuse to be his doormat, there’s room for only 2 people in our marriage…. So, for the last week, he’s fallen off the face of the earth, I have no idea where he is.

 

 

In addition she’s older than my H and me, so she acts kind of like his mother, but looks more like his older sister, who cared for him quite a bit when he was growing up. Of course, I’m the polar opposite of the OW. Also, from what my H said about the OW, she’s a single mother, kind, God fearing (OMG… really?), just nice and kind as can be…. She takes care of him, bla, bla, bla…. Of course the fact that I took care of my H for 18 years, doing everything for him, doesn’t count.

 

So yes, scenario #1 and #2 combined has come into play for my WH’s affair. Still, he's an adult, so I'm not using this as an excuse for what happened. My husband destroyed his marriage with his eyes wide open. One day he'll have to come to terms with that.

 

Good luck to you Molley. I so agree. His issues are not my responsibility. I didn't cause them, can't control them and will not fix them. He has to do that himself.