sometimes I think he resents me and my work.

[Jax Star]

Oh, you're too kind, I'm not NEARLY as good at picking a fight as you. *blushes* So what are those 'half' of the things you said you're not doing to me? You need to be more specific than that. I could also say that 'you contradict yourself half the time', but without posting the quotes here that would be pointless wouldn't it?

 

 

 

So... the OP should 'try to understand and compromise' and 'not think that he is chauvinistic/immature/etc' just so he feels more like a man? And I suppose her following my advice (communicate about the issues bothering her) would be 'emasculating' to him and would make him feel less like a man? Okaaay... Well, if my SO's ego was SO ****ING FRAGILE that me even saying I need him to fix his own meals, or talking him through his resentment of my earnings, would totally CRUSH his man-ego, I wouldn't think he was much of a man to begin with. I really hope the OP's husband isn't like that either. Or you, for that matter. *raises eyebrow*

 

 

 

THANK YOU for the link! Finally the first piece of proof I've seen you post after countless requests from me. Now maybe you can go find the 'I insinuated that she should leave her husband' proof, although I figure that would be mighty hard to procure.

 

Hell yeah that'd be horrible!!! The reason OPs post isn't to hear anyone else's opinion after all, instead of adding fuel to the fire we should just tell all of them that their SO is fine and to try and understand him/her.

 

 

 

I totally agree with this. Sometimes I think it's society's fault more than the man's. Like how some women look down with derision on their husband or other men they know if the men happen to earn less than them (not in the OP's case of course). Or how little boys are brought up to think it's 'emasculating' to lose to girls. I play several competitive games in which men and women aren't segregated, and it's just sad to see how some of the men sulk and act like their ego has been severely bruised when they lose to me.

 

Watch what you post!

 

You might give the OP IDEAS!

 

Seriously though, if his identity is so easily wounded, perhaps it is because it is built on illegitimate ideas. Shouldn't one build their identity on things that actually can stand the changes life brings? We cannot always be prepared for what might happen and I feel it's time we allowed men to alter their role and purpose to something more adaptable and useful.

If he cannot handle her making more or having a larger occupational responsibility simply because of her gender or his gender, how can he weather events that might come? What if he lost his job entirely and had to be a SAH father for a while? Would that be HER fault? Would he be less of a man?

 

He needs her help and perhaps the help of a therapist to learn to accept that he is needed in their unit and there are many ways he can be of use to their family. All roles are important regardless of the gender of the person filling it.

 

His attitude about roles is what is harming him, not his wife's success or her feelings about the dubious way he is reacting to her success . They are married. Her success is THEIR success. He is having trouble accepting that.

 

 

Oh no! Words like influence and persuasion doesn't exist anymore! When you’re desperately looking for answers from somewhere else instead of the source, you’re more than likely going to carry some of those opinions back to the source for questioning. But it's obvious that you are not psychiatrist so you wouldn't know how to give non-conflicting advice or opinions.... I also can tell some people on here are combatants when it comes to their gender. Everyone is entitling to their own opinion. Some of you are like vultures when a guy expresses himself about some men. :laugh:Ready to categorize his behavior.

 

This society has destroyed women’s minds as well. If a woman believes that a man is trying to decelerate her career goals in any form, he’s controlling, chauvinist, sexist, and an oppressor. Pessimism is some women’s habitual method or procedure when addressing a man's behavior. Reasons like him wanting to spend more time with her or noticing that her career is severely stressing her out is considered rhetoric with thoughts of trickery or deception.

 

The saying is true, that the world isn't just back in white and there’s a gray area, but there are people who are happy with those black and white areas.

 

If the guy’s ego is damaged, we wouldn't know for sure. We would have to ask him if he is upset that his wife makes more than him. "Shouldn't one build their identity on things that actually can stand the changes life brings?" I partially agree. It depends. A man shouldn’t give up on things he takes pride in because of the changes life brings. He still can pursue those things if it makes him feel like a man. Would she or should she feel less of a woman if she asks to be demoted because her husband wants her to be home more? What if he was the breadwinner and she wanted to cut back on hours at work to stay home because she felt as a mother and wife it’s her duty to manage the home but he disagreed? What if she threw a fit because of it. Is she immature, sexist, or Chauvinist?

 

 

Who are you guys to try an seize or derogate how a man feels about himself as a man? You guys need your own show so that you can change every man to think the way you feel he should! So how does a man suppose to act when it comes to being a man? How longer have you been with your SO? Let us people know Tyra Banks No. 1 and 2.

[sally4sara]

Oh no! Words like influence and persuasion doesn't exist anymore! When you’re desperately looking for answers from somewhere else instead of the source, you’re more than likely going to carry some of those opinions back to the source for questioning. But it's obvious that you are not psychiatrist so you wouldn't know how to give non-conflicting advice or opinions.... I also can tell some people on here are combatants when it comes to their gender. Everyone is entitling to their own opinion. Some of you are like vultures when a guy expresses himself about some men. :laugh:Ready to categorize his behavior.

 

This society has destroyed women’s minds as well. If a woman believes that a man is trying to decelerate her career goals in any form, he’s controlling, chauvinist, sexist, and an oppressor. Pessimism is some women’s habitual method or procedure when addressing a man's behavior. Reasons like him wanting to spend more time with her or noticing that her career is severely stressing her out is considered rhetoric with thoughts of trickery or deception.

 

The saying is true, that the world isn't just back in white and there’s a gray area, but there are people who are happy with those black and white areas.

 

If the guy’s ego is damaged, we wouldn't know for sure. We would have to ask him if he is upset that his wife makes more than him. "Shouldn't one build their identity on things that actually can stand the changes life brings?" I partially agree. It depends. A man shouldn’t give up on things he takes pride in because of the changes life brings. He still can pursue those things if it makes him feel like a man. Would she or should she feel less of a woman if she asks to be demoted because her husband wants her to be home more? What if he was the breadwinner and she wanted to cut back on hours at work to stay home because she felt as a mother and wife it’s her duty to manage the home but he disagreed? What if she threw a fit because of it. Is she immature, sexist, or Chauvinist?

 

 

Who are you guys to try an seize or derogate how a man feels about himself as a man? You guys need your own show so that you can change every man to think the way you feel he should! So how does a man suppose to act when it comes to being a man? How longer have you been with your SO? Let us people know Tyra Banks No. 1 and 2.

 

Dear Jax,

 

I advised the OP that her raise would help better afford a therapist for her husband to work through his feelings. I further advise she refrain from using words like "ridiculous" when discussing these issues with her husband.

Just because I don't feel compelled to tiptoe around on a public forum for fear of influencing other readers does not mean I am advising her to crush his spirit or want to make her feel like he is some oppressor to her. I used some sense; if he was a controlling oppressor, she probably wouldn't have the self esteem left this far in their relationship to even have a successful career.

About the only part of my post to the OP was to suggest he may be struggling with finding other things beyond his earning ability to feel proud of - like being a good father.

 

Even the post you quoted - I suggest they seek a therapist.

[Els]

Everyone is entitling to their own opinion. Some of you are like vultures when a guy expresses himself about some men. :laugh:Ready to categorize his behavior.

 

Get over it. This case isn't 'special' by any means. In case you don't notice, almost EVERY thread has categorism of sorts. It's just that for you 'chauvinist' seems a worse category to be in than 'selfish', 'game player', etc. Well, it's you who decided it, not us.

 

This society has destroyed women’s minds as well. If a woman believes that a man is trying to decelerate her career goals in any form, he’s controlling, chauvinist, sexist, and an oppressor.

 

So... what would you call a woman who tries to decelerate her man's career goals? Domineering, perhaps? Selfish? Controlling? Oh wait, 'chauvinist' is a far worse thing than the above, right?

 

A man shouldn’t give up on things he takes pride in because of the changes life brings.

 

Beautiful quote. I couldn't agree more. He shouldn't, and neither should a woman. Why the double standards???

 

Would she or should she feel less of a woman if she asks to be demoted because her husband wants her to be home more?

 

No, but she would feel less of a career woman; and maybe a career woman is what she wants to be.

 

What if he was the breadwinner and she wanted to cut back on hours at work to stay home because she felt as a mother and wife it’s her duty to manage the home but he disagreed? What if she threw a fit because of it. Is she immature, sexist, or Chauvinist?

Anyone, male or female, throwing fits because of anything is immature.

 

 

Who are you guys to try an seize or derogate how a man feels about himself as a man? You guys need your own show so that you can change every man to think the way you feel he should! So how does a man suppose to act when it comes to being a man? How longer have you been with your SO? Let us people know Tyra Banks No. 1 and 2.

 

I'll answer after you, my dear. How long have you been with your SO? Nobody's 'derogating how anyone feels about themselves' here. We're just saying his behaviour needs to change. God. If that is 'derogating', then EVERYONE posting ANY sort of advice is derogating how the subject of the OP is conducting themselves.

[Jax Star]

Dear Jax,

 

I advised the OP that her raise would help better afford a therapist for her husband to work through his feelings. I further advise she refrain from using words like "ridiculous" when discussing these issues with her husband.

Just because I don't feel compelled to tiptoe around on a public forum for fear of influencing other readers does not mean I am advising her to crush his spirit or want to make her feel like he is some oppressor to her. I used some sense; if he was a controlling oppressor, she probably wouldn't have the self esteem left this far in their relationship to even have a successful career.

About the only part of my post to the OP was to suggest he may be struggling with finding other things beyond his earning ability to feel proud of - like being a good father.

 

Even the post you quoted - I suggest they seek a therapist.

 

Well don't come and comment on what I have to say to another as if you're in agreement. I haven't read what you wrote but you came at me as if you disagree with everything I had to say.

[milvushina]

woah.. that was a big fight, lol. Thank you for taking the time to post. Jax, I will not answer all of your points but you said that he feels bad, not about my success but about the fact that he hasn't been as successful.. this is correct. I know this because he has told me, he has said (not angrily) that he doesn't think he will ever make more money than I do, he feels like I've gotten ahead of him now and he won't catch up, and sometimes that bothers him. Sometimes he gets worked up about how he doesnt' get recognized, he gets stressed and moody and lashes out. So I make it more about me than maybe it really is. It is hard not to take things personally when you feel like you're being picked on.

 

I didnt' mean to say he's not manly. He told me that because he lost his father, he had problems with knowing how to "act like a man" while he was growing up and honestly I don't even know for sure what that means, but it means something to him.

 

He does not try to hold me back. We are in TX and everyone here to some degree has a traditionalist-type view of men & women. Maybe it's harsh to call him chauvanist. I have a question for you guys though.

 

About suggesting couseling - do you think that counseling is something everyone should do? Just curious because I think we're an unusually happy and well adjusted couple. We fight sometimes and I like to come on here because I don't like to air our disagreements to people we know IRL. But we are not in a place where we're having real trouble. Do you still think counseling is something to benefit from?

 

Thanks for you time - Elswyth, sally -

[Jax Star]

Get over it. This case isn't 'special' by any means. In case you don't notice, almost EVERY thread has categorism of sorts. It's just that for you 'chauvinist' seems a worse category to be in than 'selfish', 'game player', etc. Well, it's you who decided it, not us.

 

I'm use to the lashing on this site, preferably by women. I'm just a guy trying to take a stand. Comments like yours doesn't bring equality or peace, just more division, hatred and resentment, BUT you have a right to your opinion.

 

So... what would you call a woman who tries to decelerate her man's career goals? Domineering, perhaps? Selfish? Controlling? Oh wait, 'chauvinist' is a far worse thing than the above, right?

 

Well you could've said that about a man who tries to decelerate a woman's career goals is Domineering, perhaps, Selfish, or Controlling. Why Chauvinist? The world that's associated with sexism, which means that a man feels that he is stronger, smarter, and better than you in all ways because you are a woman?

 

Beautiful quote. I couldn't agree more. He shouldn't, and neither should a woman. Why the double standards???

 

There is no double-standard here at all. You're the only one shouting it. Maybe because of past afflictions. I don't know! If it's disrupting their marriage it has to be resolved. Speaking in general, If your career is more important than your marriage then you shouldn't have gotten married.

 

No, but she would feel less of a career woman; and maybe a career woman is what she wants to be.

 

Well if feeling less of a career woman is better than a happy marriage then go for it.

 

Anyone, male or female, throwing fits because of anything is immature.

 

Correct, any man or woman throwing fits is immature but why does the man have to be Chauvinist?

 

 

I'll answer after you, my dear. How long have you been with your SO? Nobody's 'derogating how anyone feels about themselves' here. We're just saying his behaviour needs to change. God. If that is 'derogating', then EVERYONE posting ANY sort of advice is derogating how the subject of the OP is conducting themselves.

 

 

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!! You are hilarious. You're answering a question with a question. I don't play by those rules; pretty annoying. You have this idea on how men should act so let's hear it. How should a man act or feel about being a man?

[milvushina]

I don't think chauvinism means that you feel stronger, smarter, and better in all ways just because of your gender. I think it can be feeling like certain roles or behavior are dictated because of gender. It does not mean that you hate the other gender or feel they're inferior in every way. If a man and a woman both work for a living but then the man expects the woman to spend more time taking care of the baby because she's the woman or the nurturer, then that's chauvinism imo.

 

My husband is mostly fair and does his share of things. He would prefer to make more money and be the head of the household. I think it could be argued that is chauvinism because he feels that way because he's the man. But as long as he is not mean and rude about it I don't care.

[Jax Star]

woah.. that was a big fight, lol. Thank you for taking the time to post. Jax, I will not answer all of your points but you said that he feels bad, not about my success but about the fact that he hasn't been as successful.. this is correct. I know this because he has told me, he has said (not angrily) that he doesn't think he will ever make more money than I do, he feels like I've gotten ahead of him now and he won't catch up, and sometimes that bothers him. Sometimes he gets worked up about how he doesnt' get recognized, he gets stressed and moody and lashes out. So I make it more about me than maybe it really is. It is hard not to take things personally when you feel like you're being picked on.

 

I didn't mean to say he's not manly. He told me that because he lost his father, he had problems with knowing how to "act like a man" while he was growing up and honestly I don't even know for sure what that means, but it means something to him.

 

He does not try to hold me back. We are in TX and everyone here to some degree has a traditionalist-type view of men & women. Maybe it's harsh to call him chauvanist. I have a question for you guys though.

 

About suggesting couseling - do you think that counseling is something everyone should do? Just curious because I think we're an unusually happy and well adjusted couple. We fight sometimes and I like to come on here because I don't like to air our disagreements to people we know IRL. But we are not in a place where we're having real trouble. Do you still think counseling is something to benefit from?

 

Thanks for you time - Elswyth, sally -

 

 

Thanks for listening to my post. I am glad you didn’t take any of these comments about him being a momma’s boy or chauvinist back to him because it might’ve caused series problems. I know that you were just venting to us which is clearly fine. I am not faulting anyone for that.

 

 

Being a man, I know how I wouldn’t want to be approached by my woman. My assumptions were quite accurate. He’s just going through a life crisis right now. With most men, growing up seeing their mother’s struggle, they don’t want to see their wives work so hard. They want to be the breadwinners like they wish they could’ve for their mothers. They see the stress or aguish it puts their SO/wife through for a man to count on the majority of her income, even if she’s not saying it or hinting it. It’s just there. I’m not saying all men with those circumstances think like that. I’m not saying this is the case for him because you've clarified a lot of things for us. I can understand why seeing his wife accelerate would make him feel less of a man because he had no fatherly footsteps to follow in. There’s nothing wrong with him expressing these feelings, just as long as he’s not being condescending towards you or taking it out on you severely. We all get a little grumpy with life when we feel that we’re not going anywhere fast. It would have been easier said than done, also rude, to tell him to find a better career and stop complaining, which you didn’t. That would’ve probably been a lot of people’s replies to your latest post.

 

Counseling is not a bad option. Maybe if you find a counselor 15 to 25 years his senior he might feel comfortable with expressing himself because the distant in age would be close a to father figure. I think you should bring up counseling if he continues to let those problems affect your marriage, otherwise he just might feel you're trying to fix him, which most men do not like to feel by their SO/wife...... Or maybe he's different.

[Jax Star]

I don't think chauvinism means that you feel stronger, smarter, and better in all ways just because of your gender. I think it can be feeling like certain roles or behavior are dictated because of gender. It does not mean that you hate the other gender or feel they're inferior in every way. If a man and a woman both work for a living but then the man expects the woman to spend more time taking care of the baby because she's the woman or the nurturer, then that's chauvinism imo.

 

My husband is mostly fair and does his share of things. He would prefer to make more money and be the head of the household. I think it could be argued that is chauvinism because he feels that way because he's the man. But as long as he is not mean and rude about it I don't care.

 

 

Yeah, but a lot of men wouldn't take it that way because of the content it's being used. If a woman calls a man chauvinist, he's likely to think she feels he believes the superiority of men over women.

 

Some men just believe in some traditional roles and are very happy with them. Something that looks admirable or commendable, like wanting to bring home most of the bread so his wife doesn't have to work as hard, is now being looked at as chauvinism or sexism, which is even more difficult for some men to understand and adapted to.

 

If you know he doesn't expect you to work and take care of the baby because you're a woman, that's clearly okay. To each it's own. Some men believe women should because their mothers did. Does that make him chauvinist? If so, that would make his own mother chauvinist since she taught him to feel way. A man only wants the love and time his mother gave him for his own children via his wife.

[sally4sara]

About suggesting couseling - do you think that counseling is something everyone should do? Just curious because I think we're an unusually happy and well adjusted couple. We fight sometimes and I like to come on here because I don't like to air our disagreements to people we know IRL. But we are not in a place where we're having real trouble. Do you still think counseling is something to benefit from?

 

Thanks for you time - Elswyth, sally -

 

No, I'm not one of those people who think everyone should be in therapy. I also don't think anyone who can benefit from therapy, necessarily need to be in therapy for very long.

 

Yes I do think therapy could help your husband. I never suggested the pride he could feel by being the main earner was something he shouldn't feel proud to do. If one spouse makes more than the other, they should feel proud to do so. I just don't think it has to be the man for it to be a source of pride. OP, you might feel proud to do this and you should because you're helping your family. If you helped your family by staying home, you could and should feel proud of doing that too and not just because you're the wife, but because it is a necessary element to having a family. It is just as important a task if your husband is the one doing it. He may just not know how to view this as a source of pride for himself despite the importance of the task. A therapist can help him see past the social expectations of a man with a family being the bread winner and realize that he can be proud as a father and proud of you and your career as equally important to your life together.

I feel anyone struggling with circumstances beyond their immediate control can benefit from some external guidance.

 

Its only chauvinism if he feels he must be the head of the household by lording a larger paycheck over a wife. You haven't said that is how he is behaving so this is surely fixable.

[Els]

I'm use to the lashing on this site, preferably by women.

 

Oh trust me. There are more women in general on this site but I think the men have a higher proportion of extremists. Then again, I'm wondering how many of those accounts actually belong to just one person. Especially accounts with 20 posts which only comment on gender threads.

 

I'm just a guy trying to take a stand. Comments like yours doesn't bring equality or peace, just more division, hatred and resentment,

 

I'm just a girl trying to take a stand as well. What do you think your comments bring? Not your suggestions of action (which are similar to mine), but your comments to Sally and I?

 

Well you could've said that about a man who tries to decelerate a woman's career goals is Domineering, perhaps, Selfish, or Controlling. Why Chauvinist? The world that's associated with sexism, which means that a man feels that he is stronger, smarter, and better than you in all ways because you are a woman?

 

Perhaps true. Alright then, since it suits you better. Domineering, selfish, and controlling. So now our argument is over?

 

If it's disrupting their marriage it has to be resolved. Speaking in general, If your career is more important than your marriage then you shouldn't have gotten married.

 

When did the OP say that her career was more important than her marriage?! This is exactly the point I'm trying to make. If it matters more to the man that she has a better job (I'm not saying this is the OP's case, based on her clarification it doesn't seem to be) than her feelings or the relationship, then HE shouldn't have gotten married.

 

Well if feeling less of a career woman is better than a happy marriage then go for it.

 

AND if making more money than his wife is more important than a happy marriage then go for it? What point are you trying to make?

 

Correct, any man or woman throwing fits is immature but why does the man have to be Chauvinist?

 

Sorry. He's domineering, controlling and selfish, in a gender-role sort of way. Is that better?

 

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!! You are hilarious. You're answering a question with a question. I don't play by those rules; pretty annoying. You have this idea on how men should act so let's hear it. How should a man act or feel about being a man?

 

LOL! Talk about pot calling the TABLE black. It's pretty annoying to not answer a question that is SO obviously a dig which has nothing to do with the topic whatsoever? Well, I'll be the bigger man in this case then. And I thought guys tended to not be so petty, geez. I've been with my current SO for going on 1.5 years now, certainly not as long as the OP. He's every bit as masculine as a guy can be without being a neanderthal idiot. Sally I believe has been with hers for much longer.

 

So now that I've answered... how is a woman supposed to act when it comes to making a man feel like a man? How longer have you been with your SO? Let us people know Mr. Bombastic. Feel free to go ahead and make something up like I suspect you will though; since I have mentioned my relationship in my previous posts and you have not, you can say whatever you like.

[Els]

I don't think chauvinism means that you feel stronger, smarter, and better in all ways just because of your gender. I think it can be feeling like certain roles or behavior are dictated because of gender. It does not mean that you hate the other gender or feel they're inferior in every way. If a man and a woman both work for a living but then the man expects the woman to spend more time taking care of the baby because she's the woman or the nurturer, then that's chauvinism imo.

 

I agree with that. That's why I asked you how he is most of the time.

 

My husband is mostly fair and does his share of things. He would prefer to make more money and be the head of the household. I think it could be argued that is chauvinism because he feels that way because he's the man. But as long as he is not mean and rude about it I don't care.

 

That's great then. All of us have preferences; it's how we set our priorities and deal with them that's important. I would definitely LOVE to have my SO leave his medical school so we can go off into the sunset and sail happily ever after. But the realistic part of me, the part of me that cares for him and us and our future, knows that he should not do that.. and I should NEVER pressure him to do so or resent him for not doing so. As long as your guy manages to deal productively with his feelings about you making more money and it doesn't mess your relationship up, that's fine.

 

I'm a bit curious why you said he's resentful when he needs to watch the baby though? Since now you did mention that he does his share most of the time.

 

About suggesting couseling - do you think that counseling is something everyone should do? Just curious because I think we're an unusually happy and well adjusted couple. We fight sometimes and I like to come on here because I don't like to air our disagreements to people we know IRL. But we are not in a place where we're having real trouble. Do you still think counseling is something to benefit from?

 

I think that depends on both of your attitudes towards it. It can always be beneficial if you both want to benefit from it. Even old grandparents who've been together for 40 odd years probably could benefit from it.

[Els]

I like how you accuse me of going on forever when you're the one with the 'last-post' syndrome, Jax Star. If you really thought that the argument was getting out of hand why not just stop like a real man usually does, instead of a 'last post' that's blindingly full of immaturity? Since it's so 'typical' for women to want to go on and on forever. Oh right, because you're exactly what you like to accuse us women of being.

 

You're right, this shouldn't go on. It's an insult to the spirit of the community to see posts that look like a middle school girl's note to another. 'OMG I didn't say you were a bitch, I just said you azns are total sluts :D I wasn't even talking about you silly! Hahahaha what are you, stupid??? Bet you don't even know what bitch means, sucker!:D OMG I thought this was funny til you started hunting me down in English class to confront me! Ooooo so you sit behind me in English? Ain't that a good excuse, darlin'?'

 

Miluvshina, I hope you and your hubby manage to work this out. Best of luck.

 

Jax Star, I do hope you'll stick to your word regarding this. It would be quite sad for me to have to be the traditional 'bigger man' again and bow out.