writergal Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I read in the book, "He's Just Not That Into You," by Greg Behrendt and Liz Tuccillo that a man who gives a woman his phone number, instead of asking her for her phone number, is that it is men's way of tricking a woman to ask him out. The "But He Gave Me His Number" Excuse Dear Greg, I met a really cute guy at a bar this week. He gave me his number and told me to give him a call sometime. I thought that was kind of cool, that he gave me control of the situation like that. I can call him, right? Lauren Dear Control Freak, Did he give you control, or did he just get you to do the heavy lifting? What he just did was a magic trick: It seems like he gave you control, but really he now gets to decide if he wants to go out with you " or even return your call. Why don't you take Copperfield's number, roll it in a newspaper, pour milk in it, and make it disappear. "Give me a call." "E-mail me." "Tell Joey we should all hang out sometime." Don't let him trick you into asking him out. When men want you, they do the work. I know it sounds old school, but when men like women, they ask them out. ___________________________________________________________ Well, I recently have been exchanging emails with a new guy I met on match.com who initiated contact with me, and asked me if I'd be interested in meeting him in person. I emailed him back that I prefer to talk on the phone before meeting for dates, hoping he'd take the hint and ask me for my phone number. Do you know what he did? He offered me his phone number! Is he into me? What do you think? My gut says to just forget about this guy and move on. If I call him, I'm doing his work for him, asking him out. Right? If I email him, and tell him "hey, thanks for your nunmber" and offer him my phone number, I'm STILL doing the work to get this guy to ask me out. Too much effort, I say. Why are guys so thick-headed? Should I have responded to this guy's email with "Thanks for your phone number, but I'm only interested in men who ask for my phone number," makes me come across like a b*tch. I really like this guy but if I follow this book's advice, this guy clearly isn't into me then, if he's not asking me out directly. What do you think?
IrishCarBomb Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Treat it like a game (rules, etc...), and you'll never win. Honestly, if something as trivial as me providing my number first got you disinterested because of some book, I'd probably feel I'd dodged a bullet. It's nice when a person can make their own decisions.
D-Lish Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I think you can throw a lot of what those books say out the freaking window:p BUT- I am a firm believer in not chasing a guy- ever. Those books can't possiby cover every kind of scenario. What if this guy is a bit shy- or rusty at dating? He asked you out, you asked to talk on the phone, he gave you his number. That doesn't really add up to playing games. Especially since HE reached out to you first. I think you can take some useful advice from those books, I also think a lot of it is designed to combat men that play games. Not all men play games. Instead of playing hardball and starting out this interaction with a readiness to play games and strategize.... Why not gently put the ball back in his court and give him your number. Tell him when you are available to talk- and give him a couple available times... then see if he calls. If he doesn't- then you know he's not willing to put in the effort.
Author writergal Posted July 14, 2009 Author Posted July 14, 2009 Thanks for your viewpoints. I agree with you that he did initially contact me. But, my gut says that shy or not, a guy who is interested in me *will* ask me for my phone number. I'm not playing games with this guy, by expecting him to ask me for my phone number either. No. I'm not going to give him my phone number and ask him to call me because then I'm technically chasing after him, by doing that. His first instinct should have been to ask me for my phone number, regardless of whether he's shy or not. I forgot to add that in his most recent email to me, he gave me some typical bs male line about not being very good on the phone which to me is a total crock. He smells of a game-player to me. Let's face it. If he really was serious about getting to know me, he would have asked me for my phone number. Greg B. is right. I'm not going to ask any guy out. If you want me, you better ask me out. My last boyfriend I also met online. I pursued him; initiating contact, offering him my phone number and email address. And he didn't have to do any work. Turns out, that was a HUGE mistake because as my heartsick posts on this forum regale, he "just wasn't that into me," and was a horrible jerk to me, despite my best efforts to try to make it work. And a healthy relationship is not one-sided; and this relationship was definitely one-sided because it was 100% me trying to make it work and my ex-bf doing absolutely nothing to make it work because he just wanted a casual sex relationship after his divorce. So no, I'm not going to call this new guy from match.com. He had his chance to ask me for my phone number but blew it. I sent him a short email thanking him for his phone number,but that I wasn't going to call him because I didn't think he was that serious about getting to know me, since he didnt ask me for my phone number, and I wished him the best of luck. Now. Please dont yell at me okay?
D-Lish Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I'm not going to yell at you:p But may I ask... Are you sure you aren't projecting some of your pain from the last break up onto this new guy? It's pretty evident from your post you've been hurt recently. I don't think flipping it around and giving him your number is chasing him- it's putting the ball back in his court. What else besides him giving you his number instead of asking for yours makes you think he's a player?
patcha Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I actually think it's possible that since it's online... he may have been considerate in giving you his number instead of getting yours. I remember when I asked a girl I was *extremely* into out, I gave her my number to call me when she gets there. She then emailed me back her number. I didn't ask for hers just in case she felt uncomfortable giving it to me, since I was a stranger online.
IrishCarBomb Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I'll interject with what I see as the mentality of the guy: Well, I recently have been exchanging emails with a new guy I met on match.com who initiated contact with me, "Oh cool, here's a hot girl that I'm clicking with. Man, I'd like to meet up with her, I'll see if she wants to meet in person..." and asked me if I'd be interested in meeting him in person. I emailed him back that I prefer to talk on the phone before meeting for dates, "Oh, ok, that's a good idea, she wants to talk on the phone to get to know each other a little better. I can see that. We can exchange numbers and talk (even though I don't like the phone). Here, I'll put mine down first." *Writes down number* "Thanks for your phone number, but I'm only interested in men who ask for my phone number," "Uh... wtf?!? You mean to tell me I've ruined everything because I put my number down first? Is that honestly the criteria you used to evaluate our compatibility?!? As far as I can tell, I behaved as a reasonable person would have, but for some reason it did not fall within some bizarre rule you have. But hey, if you aren't going to be reasonable, I guess it's better that I don't build a relationship with you."
carhill Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 "For a good time call 555-1212" Is there no sense of humor in dating anymore?
alphamale Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I really like this guy but if I follow this book's advice, this guy clearly isn't into me then, if he's not asking me out directly. What do you think? when a guy doesn't ask for your number he is avoiding rejection meaning he has no cajones. do you really want to be with this type of man? god forbid if you were out one nite and some brute started to hassle you, this guy would probably be under a table cowering and shivering like the weasel that he is...
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I'll interject with what I see as the mentality of the guy: "Oh cool, here's a hot girl that I'm clicking with. Man, I'd like to meet up with her, I'll see if she wants to meet in person..." "Oh, ok, that's a good idea, she wants to talk on the phone to get to know each other a little better. I can see that. We can exchange numbers and talk (even though I don't like the phone). Here, I'll put mine down first." *Writes down number* "Uh... wtf?!? You mean to tell me I've ruined everything because I put my number down first? Is that honestly the criteria you used to evaluate our compatibility?!? As far as I can tell, I behaved as a reasonable person would have, but for some reason it did not fall within some bizarre rule you have. But hey, if you aren't going to be reasonable, I guess it's better that I don't build a relationship with you." Agreed! I understand the "rule" that the book talks about, but I think that is more appropriate for dating IRL. Online, people can be a little more hesitant because they don't know you at all, really. The guy might think that you would be freaked out if he asked for your number. He may just be trying to be respectful.
Author writergal Posted July 14, 2009 Author Posted July 14, 2009 D-Lish: I admit I may be projecting some of my past relationship pain into this present situation. I think its impossible not to project some of the past into the present. But I am aware of it, yes. I am also aware that my dating pattern has always been to pursue men, and not allow the men to pursue me. So, my new dating strategy is to stop being the pursuer and let the men come to me. I saw my sister and quite a few girlfriends be pursued by their now-husbands and wives. I don't want to be completely inflexible and am willing to meet the guy halfway, but I simply refuse to do any of the initial contacting. And I'm certainly not going to offer my phone # to any guy who doesn't first ask me for it. I just can't do that anymore because when I've done that, the relationship has never worked out. But I'm also aware that I tend to be attracted to emotionally unavailable men, and pursue them with fervor. What else makes me think he's a player? He's 42 years old. He should know better. Your suggestion that I offer him my phone number, and give me times to call me and see if he does, did cross my mind. However, I felt like that would be doing more work then I should have to. Why should I offer him my phone number when all he had to do was ask if he could call me? He's 42 years old! Plus, his stupid line about not being very good on the phone. Well you know, Im not very fast on my bike, but I don't whine about it when I go on bike rides with dates or friends. I just ride my bike. His phone excuse is so lame to me. I know most men probably don't like talking on the phone because they're not chatterboxes like we women are. But c'mon! Me thinks he doth protest too much! Not a good sign to me, in that case. Whine about not liking the phone translates to me as "hurry up and meet me in person so I can decide whether or not you're someone I'd like to see again on a second date." That's what makes me think he's either a player. A wolf in shy-man's clothing. And I'm not about to board the Dating Titanic singles-cruise, only to drown in the cold Atlantic waters of hell froze over because this idiot can't ask me for my phone number. Patcha: It's not being considerate to offer your number to someone when clearly its reasonable to ask them for their phone number. I mean, he did join an online dating website hoping to meet women. So its not like he's too scared to call them. IrishCarBomb: I know I seem unreasonable to you, especially since this guy did initiate contact with me. I'm sure he was genuinely interested in me. I don't deny that. I really like him too. But the thing you forget to take into consideration about match.com, is that online dating is like fast-food dating; there's more than one entre to choose from, so why put forth any real effort if you can set up 5 first dates with women per week. I may be fortune's fool for emailing this guy to tell him I'm not going to call him since he didn't ask me for my phone number. Then its a lesson learned and I am the fool who missed out on a date with a guy I may be really compatible with. But its my lesson, right? I have to start somewhere. And I'm not willing to compromise on the phone number thing anymore. If it is a bizarre rule to you, I respect that we have a different perspective. But to me, it's a way for me to change my unhealthy dating pattern of pursuing men and jumping into things too quickly, instead of letting things develop slowly over time. I don't know how else to explain my rationale behind my choice to you.
carhill Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I'm sure he was genuinely interested in me. I don't deny that. I really like him too. I'm not willing to compromise on the phone number thing anymoreOK, sounds completely rational. Read that over a few times just to get it settled. Oy! I'm so glad I'm way too old to deal with that kind of stuff anymore. Humor and lighthearted banter and flirting apparently has gone out of style. Take that FWIW from an emotionally available man
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I think you are making too much of this. He gave you is number, so you can give yours. What's the deal? So what if he didn't ask. By giving you his number, he is, in effect, open to taking yours too. Just give it too him, and see if he calls. If he doesn't, then forget about him. If he does, then great. Maybe you can meet up. He may be a really cool dude. Or he could be a tool, but you don't know since YOU HAVEN'T EVEN MET HIM YET.
Author writergal Posted July 14, 2009 Author Posted July 14, 2009 Alphamale: Thank you!! That is exactly how my ex-bf was. He didn't ask me for my phone number because he didn't have the cahones, as you say. He was a total wuss, not wanting to take a chance of asking me for my phone number. So this new match.com, I got the same "wuss" vibe from him, especially when I read his bs line about not being that good on the phone. Give me a break!! I mean, he shared me with that he is a top community organizer who talks on the phone ALL the time. Plus, did I mention he's 42 years old? He's not a 20-something in-experienced kid. He's a lazy, middle-aged man, never married who doesn't want to put forth the effort of asking a woman for her phone number. God forbid I got into a relationship with this guy (who, like my ex-bf) probably would run away from the first sign of conflict and have the mentality that the relationship should be over, as a result. No thanks. If a guy asks me for my phone number, I can be assured that he really is interested and isn't afraid of possibly being rejected. Show me a man with cahones and I will give him my phone number. Carhill: I know. It is sad to think that old fashioned flirting and dating in person has become pretty much extinct for singles in my Generation X of thirty-somethings (great tv sho by the way).
carhill Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 He's a lazy, middle-aged man, never married who doesn't want to put forth the effort of asking a woman for her phone number. God forbid I got into a relationship with this guy (who, like my ex-bf) probably would run away from the first sign of conflict and have the mentality that the relationship should be over, as a result. LOL, thanks for that. Boy, did I prove my wife wrong after she thought that same exact thing. The parallels are striking.
LostLamb Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I can't believe this thread. You are on a dating site and a man you like has offered you his number , what are you waiting for? Sounds like you are playing games and might not be ready to date! If you don't like him , move on and talk to others.
Cherry Blossom 35 Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 He's a lazy, middle-aged man, never married who doesn't want to put forth the effort of asking a woman for her phone number. God forbid I got into a relationship with this guy (who, like my ex-bf) probably would run away from the first sign of conflict and have the mentality that the relationship should be over, as a result. No thanks. You don't even know the guy, and you have already labeled him off of a couple of quick email exchanges. You shouldn't go out with him, because you have already judged him.
boogieboy Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Him saying he doesnt like talking on the phone is a big red flag....but other than that... Of course he is shy, thats why hes on the net looking for dates, hes too lazy or cant do it in person. You are being a bitch. Are you basing your definition of pursuing off of that one guy that you let treat you badly? That was your fault, not his, and it doesnt have to do with you givng your info first. Theres alot more to "doing all the work" after giving a phone number. For instance, if you start to feel after a few dates like youre doing all the work...YOU STOP! So he gives you his number, Where will this slippery slope end? If he doesnt: Try to grope you during the after date makeout session?Ask you if he can spend the night...just so you can feel good saying no?ask you if you had a dog named spot?tell you your hair looks nice?mention kids within the first hour?text you "I miss you" 5 times a day? Sounds to me like you enjoy being angry at your ego not being stroked than the actual issue. You ask what everyone thinks and then say "well I dont care what you guys think, I want to be pursued for once, and be relieved of all the dating work, just like my last guy was." Go ahead and play the games, and see where it gets you. Because what your doing IS games.
red shoes Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 An ex I asked out first over the email gave me a positive response and asked for my number to call to arrange for the date. That, to me, is the best way a guy should handle it. But not everyone is the same. For your information, the guy seemed great at first but turned out to be not quite the same at the end. I won't go into details but needless to say, we broke up.
Lizzie60 Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I think most of these books are BS... but a good way for the author to make money.. I think you got to go with your instinct.. For some guy.. it's cool to give their number.. if you really like him.. you got nothing to lose.. I don't know a lot of women who go around giving their number.. so I think it's perfectly normal for a guy to give his number.. That way.. he is giving you the choice. to call or not to call.. you decide.. I think it's fair..
Author writergal Posted July 14, 2009 Author Posted July 14, 2009 Ok, to everyone: I DO appreciate your opinions and that's why I come here and post my questions. If I come across as being a dismissive person, I apologize b/c each of your posts has valuable insight that I can glean and apply to my situation. Boogieboy; I agree with you. I am being a bitch to a certain degree. I know for a fact that I am basing my opinion of pursuit based on the debacle that my last relationship was. And yes, like Eleanor Roosevelt and Dr. Phil say, "we teach people how to treat us, by how we treat ourselves." I can't take 100% blame for my ex-bf's bad behavior. I can only take responsibility for my allowing him to treat me badly and not do anything proactive about it, although I did try talking to him several times about things to see if we could reach a compromise where both our needs were met, but that was always met with resistance and it failed. But I digress...that's for another thread. And, after reading everyone's posts in this thread, maybe I need to rethink getting back into online dating, when I'm clearly still reeling with anger and bitterness from my last relationship, because that will surely leak into any new dating opportunities if I'm not careful. I just don't want to repeat the past so maybe I'm being hypervigilant about not being the pursuer in future dating opportunities. Believe me, online dating is my least favorite choice. In my graduate school program, its 90% women (education) anyway, so that's out. Most of my friends are married (gay and straight). Then, the few activities I do are social but the men in those groups are not single; they are either married, gay or in a relationship with another woman. Yes, those people have friends of friends of friends who I could possible date, but that hasn't really happened to me yet. Hence my choice to join match.com. I could write another thread easily about the trials and tribulations of online dating. And actually, online dating reminds me of Shakespeare's play, Love's Labors Lost...proof that dating games have been around since the Renaissance period! "Oh the tangled web we weave when we first practice to deceive," (Sir Walter Scott, not Shakespare). Methinks I doth protest too much. (Writergal_Speare)
red shoes Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 I would be interested to read your trials and tribulations thread on online dating and probably learn a thing or two about it.
boogieboy Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Wow, you defused me good....see ..youre not a bitch anymore! I forgot to say that your guy probably gave his number first, because alot of women are apprehensive about giving out their number online...and he might have felt he didnt attract you enough to ask for that. (he is still chicken though) So you dont have to pursue with vigilance, you can lay back and relax a bit...youre going to be well aware this time of your actions this time. If you really feel like maybe you jumped back into dating too soon, then you should hold off, but if not, keep it going. In fact try plentyoffish.com and cupid.com. They are free, and have more people than match.com. Can never have enough options!
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