Author Athena Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 Originally Posted by Athena View Post I am so sick of my life. Sick of myself. Sick. Sick. Sick Why? It's like when Owl thought I was only worried about what people thought about my circumstances... I don't worry about what they think of ME, but what they think of me TRYING all that I can to save this M! Even YOU thought at first I wasn't, and you tried to encourage me to try... but I did that for years and years... My own mother has constantly tried to 'encourage' me and tried to 'persuade' me to 'try' again and again, and I have felt angry and disappointed with her, because it was YEARS of trying with a cheating H before I even confided in my mother!!!! AND because I think she is almost selfishly thinking of NOT ME.... let me see how to describe this... SHE loves my H, and has loved him like a son for so many years, so she is inclined to want me to 'try' again. Also, she loves him as a person -- he always makes her laugh with his wit, humor and funny stories with perfect accents of his travels... the true charmer can turn it on for women of all ages... grr... now, here's the part that makes me squirm... my mother will then turn around with the next breath after telling me to give H yet another chance, and state with absolute certainty that if HER own H (my late father) had EVER cheated on her, she would have dumped him immediately! So -- what's all the double standards for?! It all makes me 'sick'... that's why I felt sick when I read your post telling me that if I really loved my H, I should 'try' and 'do everything to make this M work!'... Quite honestly, the divorce does not make it better. You are "legally" free from the guy, but the emotional attachment is still there. This part of your post is such an Eye Opener for me!!! Oh, Jeez... you are right... here I was thinking/believing it was the Way Forward, to D my H, but you have been through something very similar to me (endured many of your spouse's affairs) and you say that is NOT what happens! I have tried many things to emotionally detach from H this past year. And I am not as entangled up in him as I was before. But I heed your advice to cut off communication with him too... I have been keeping up with this, also to let him know how the kids are doing, but they are old enough to do so directly with him... If I may ask, how long have you been separated? Have you filed for a divorce? We are not separated. I just make sure I do not fly over to see/visit him at all... he had an affair with an OW for over a year and came home at the end of his project, and I found out about that A within weeks of his return home, in January of last year... then he stayed home with us for a few months while unemployed, then flew to Europe for a job, then he chose to quit that job to go BACK to the OW's country -- same town, same offices!!!!! (but by then she had already hooked up with a buddy of H's! Actually did so soon after H left her country). Since then H has a schedule of two months 'on' and two weeks 'off', but whereas I would normally go see him, I won't... I don't want to see the place & people where he Openly had her as a full-time g/f... also, in March this year he didn't come home for his two week visit since he was having another affair, and I had sensed another A and had been questioning him about it... So, we are not 'separated' legally, but we are living apart while he works abroad... of course, when his job ends soon, if he doesn't find a new job to go to, he will come home (for however long/mths it takes to get a new job) I have not 'filed' D papers yet since the lawyer wants a $7 grand retainer fee which I do not have. But I have gone to see the lawyer twice and discussed the case, and given him copies of all the necessary paperwork. Since I am seeing H abroad on a family vacation in three weeks time, and since H is next coming home for Xmas this year, I am leaving the D papers to be filed in December. Unless if anyone here knows if I can serve D papers to H on my own at the end of the vacation?! hmm... there is a three month cooling off period by law, so by the time he returns home in December it would be time to allow the D to continue... that seems like a good idea... I wonder if I could have him served there, but is that cruel? I don't even know. But as Owl said, it's 'either him or me', I can't do this Divorce 'nicely' with H's collaboration... Ill give you my two cents. NO MATTER WHAT, dont even THINK about getting together with him after the divorce. After my divorce, we started sleeping together for several months. It only makes it that much harder. And then when you get cheated on again, you feel like an idiot for thinking it would all be different. Yeah, thanks, this makes perfect sense... My fiance and I have been together for two years and I proposed two weeks ago. I told her that there would be no second chance if she ever cheated. I would not even consider it. I would be gone like the wind. She understood... her ex husband cheated on her as well. I have been divorced for a few months longer than her.Congrats on getting engaged. You sound healed and healthy again, and fortunate enough to have found someone special again. How old are you both? Any kids from either x-M's? I certainly wouldn't go thru this again with any other future partner either... if there is cheating involved, it's a dealbreaker. I have had enough of this lifestyle. Your life is worth more than this. Don't say life sucks... it can ALWAYS be worse. MUCH worse. No one is worth abusing yourself mentally over their actions. Turn the hate and anger into a positive driving force to move on with your life. Once you find it within yourself to do that, things will get better for you VERY quickly.You will feel so much better about yourself and your life. But first, you have to decide to end this or make it work. If ending it is what you are going to do, then do it now. Thank you, it's true, other people have it way worse. And as for the abusing myself mentally over their actions -- lol -- that's due to the training one receives at the hands of a Disordered spouse!
carhill Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 Unless if anyone here knows if I can serve D papers to H on my own at the end of the vacation?! Generally, legal process must be served by an independent party, whether in person or via mail. Under circumstances such as ours, with an amicable D, a 'friend' can serve the documents, in person or via mail, following proscribed legal procedures for proper service. In your case, something tells me you're going to need a professional process server. A lawyer would give you proper advice for your jurisdiction, but of course that would require retaining one. Another option is to use a legal clinic and/or do research into procedure on your own, as I have. Remember the plan. Center yourself, provide yourself security and then move forward. One day at a time
AirlinePilot Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 Congrats on getting engaged. You sound healed and healthy again, and fortunate enough to have found someone special again. How old are you both? Any kids from either x-M's? I certainly wouldn't go thru this again with any other future partner either... if there is cheating involved, it's a dealbreaker. I have had enough of this lifestyle. I will be 39 in September. My ex wife is two months younger than I am. And my fiance is 37. My ex wife and I had no children. I wanted kids, she did not. Before we were married, she said she did. But after she was finished with residency, she decided that kids would complicate our lives. I was upset about it, but I could not force her to do it. So... I had to try and accept that I would never be a father. Looking back, Im glad that we did not have any. It made it easier to never have anything to do with her again... EVER. I saw my my ex wife about a month ago while I was in Chicago. Just my luck that she would be in O'Hare airport in the same concourse at the same time I was. I had not seen her in 3 years. When I saw her my stomach knotted. When she saw me, I started to panic in my head. I went to my gate and started rushing my crew to get ready. But... she had to come over and talk to me. My first officer saw her coming and said "Hey its your ex wife. Should I call the airport police?" I just shook my head. She came and tried to act like we were old friends. That was the longest 5 minutes of my life. I said goodbye. She tried to give me a hug but I walked away. I got on the plane, and flew, and life went on. I had no feelings for her at all. My fiance has a daughter that I love and she loves me. In fact, I am going to adopt her. We have decided after our wedding we will have a child as well. I never thought I would be with anyone again. I hated women for a long time. Well.. thats not true. I didn't hate them, I just didn't trust them. It took me a while to believe in anyone again. But once you end it and REALLY cut off all communication, your life will change. The hate and anger are gone and you look back and use it as a learning experience. You were married much longer than I was, but the person who told me these same things had been married to his wife for 31 years when they got divorced. Once it all sunk in and I saw how he had moved on and was feeling normal again, I knew I wanted that. I mean this... once you can end it and cut off all communication, and turn your anger and hate into a driving force for change in your life, EVERYTHING will get better and you will be happy again. In MY opinion, the WORST thing you can do is try and ignore it all and make an attempt to fill your life with something else to forget about it all. It wont work. You simply MUST deal with it and move on. I tried to travel all the time and spend money to forget. It didn't work. I had a good time, but when I laid down at night, it was all waiting in bed for me. When I made the decision to move on, my life became normal again very quickly. I saw that love is real and you can find it with the right person. But dont worry about finding someone right away. Once you move on in your life, love will find you. Thank you, it's true, other people have it way worse. And as for the abusing myself mentally over their actions -- lol -- that's due to the training one receives at the hands of a Disordered spouse! Yes, I remember feeling like it was my fault. I blamed myself. I beat myself up. I filled my life with work. Flying is my job and truly was my first love. So... I bought an airplane. All I did was fly. Flew for work, flew on my days off. While it is something I love, it did not fix the way I was feeling. I had to face it. I swear to you, once you let go completely, your life will turn around and you WILL be happy again. It wont be easy, but it WILL be worth it.
Author Athena Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 Another option is to use a legal clinic and/or do research into procedure on your own, as I have. Remember the plan. Center yourself, provide yourself security and then move forward. One day at a time Oh, so I CAN do an initial 'procedure on my own'..! Good. I will start looking into it. I think I would have H served first, perhaps at the end of the vacation... (anyone here see that as being a bad idea, please post your thoughts on this... I need input). Then, by the time the 3 mths cooling off period required by our state has past, I will then retain the lawyer, and move ahead with the divorce.
Author Athena Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 But once you end it and REALLY cut off all communication, your life will change. The hate and anger are gone and you look back and use it as a learning experience. You were married much longer than I was, but the person who told me these same things had been married to his wife for 31 years when they got divorced. Once it all sunk in and I saw how he had moved on and was feeling normal again, I knew I wanted that. I mean this... once you can end it and cut off all communication, and turn your anger and hate into a driving force for change in your life, EVERYTHING will get better and you will be happy again. When I made the decision to move on, my life became normal again very quickly. I saw that love is real and you can find it with the right person. But dont worry about finding someone right away. I swear to you, once you let go completely, your life will turn around and you WILL be happy again. It wont be easy, but it WILL be worth it. How old is your step-daughter-to-be? Great idea having a baby together, too. Especially since you had wanted children, and now can still have them! Wow, interesting that you gave me this piece of advice about cutting off ALL communications with H after D.... because I was stupidly thinking of 'being fair' and all, by allowing his name to be on the title of the house... and to let him come home and stay in the house when he comes to see the kids... (dunno if he would time it to be when they are home from college). But -- having seen your healing by having no contact with xW, I am seriously re-thinking this... it seems like I will be too enmeshed and entangled with H if I continue to share a house with him... from this aspect, I need to rethink things. Funny -- I never thought of completely cutting off contact with him before this... hmmm... fortunately, I have Full Power of Attorney for him... so if needs be and I HAVE to sell this house (grr! It's the house I found all on my own, without him seeing it until four months after we had moved ourselves in; the kids and I , my brother and my son's friends moved us!!)... This house, unlike one of the posters said, does NOT haunt me with H's cheating memories because he didn't get involved with the buying or the fixing of it -- or the decor, nothing... it was all done by the time he came home. I very much see this house as 'my baby'. Yes, if I could afford it, I would certainly keep it, it took me three years of looking at houses for sale before I laid eyes on this one, and put in an offer the same day! That's how much I knew it was mine! I also like how you phrased this: <<<Once you move on in your life, love will find you.>>>. Thank you APilot!
carhill Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 My apologies for forgetting the details, but, if you're in the US and he is working abroad, and you wish to serve him while abroad, you'll need to research that nuance carefully. The way it works is the divorce documents (unique to your jurisdiction) are prepared, filed with the clerk of the court and are presented to him (generally in person) pursuant to a specific procedure documenting his receipt and then a timeclock starts ticking for him to respond. In Cali, that's 30 days. He must respond to the court for his position to be considered. Again, this is where you need to research international service procedures. If you mess up anything, the court can throw out everything, forcing you to start over. There are filing fees involved which you cannot generally avoid. Take your time with this part. Get it right.
Author Athena Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 If you mess up anything, the court can throw out everything, forcing you to start over. There are filing fees involved which you cannot generally avoid. Take your time with this part. Get it right. Thanks for the info, I will look into it all.
AirlinePilot Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 How old is your step-daughter-to-be? Great idea having a baby together, too. Especially since you had wanted children, and now can still have them! She is 6. I would write more, but I have to go to work. Ill try and login when I get to my hotel tonight.
tami-chan Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Athena, I was reading AirlinePilot's posts and you know what, it is encouraging in that he said that once you let go of this heavy load you wll be happy again. There are good people there, who will HELP you heal your broken heart. I do not for one second doubt that you will find someone worthy of the love and loyalty that you can give-I know you know that as well. Physically, that's a no-brainer, you are a beautiful woman ( where's that photo of yours?), and judging from the things you have said here....you are smart and you have a good heart... Take the second step...(first step was when you did not sleep with him the last time he was here)....
Author Athena Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 Take the second step...(first step was when you did not sleep with him the last time he was here).... Hi Tami, Yes, that was indeed the first step -- resisting his charms, ha ha, but as Taylor pointed out... he's put it in a 'horde of women' eww... and that is what I was visualizing when he tried anything... Athena, I was reading AirlinePilot's posts and you know what, it is encouraging in that he said that once you let go of this heavy load you wll be happy again. There are good people there, who will HELP you heal your broken heart.There are good people everywhere, and in between them there are some not-so-good people. It is good that you can learn from experience to avoid those people who are no good for you. I do not for one second doubt that you will find someone worthy of the love and loyalty that you can give-I know you know that as well. Physically, that's a no-brainer, you are a beautiful woman ( where's that photo of yours?), and judging from the things you have said here....you are smart and you have a good heart... Thanks Tami. I do wish to live in line with all my values and priorities once again (and that includes a man who values and prioritizes me). How is it going for you Tami? You are on the same path as me, just a little ahead...
tami-chan Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 How is it going for you Tami? You are on the same path as me, just a little ahead... Yes...H will be here next week..Fri-Tue. He will have a chance to talk to our daughter and family. He wants to apologize.... too late..but I think it is good that he plans to do that. I did my "apologizing" and it's actually very "freeing". I expect a lot of drama....but I am done. It is now a question of ACTUALLY filing the divorce..I read the formal wording "Application in the Dissolution of Marriage"...whoah...hit me like a ton of bricks....
Author Athena Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 Surprising that your H willingly will face your family to apologize! wow, wonder how that will go... will you be there to witness it? I am thinking your family will forgive him, since he is man enough to face them... Sad about the actual wording on the D-papers... Tami... strength to you.
tami-chan Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Surprising that your H willingly will face your family to apologize! wow, wonder how that will go... will you be there to witness it? I am thinking your family will forgive him, since he is man enough to face them... Sad about the actual wording on the D-papers... Tami... strength to you. My H is saying all kinds of things I want to hear...so who knows if he will have the courage to do it. But if he won't do it to my family, he needs to do it to our daughter. She loves him and has no ill-will, so I think that is encouraging to him. Thank you, Athena....strength to you, too!
ForumFool Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 ((Althena)) I am glad you are moving forward....I know a few of us have told you in the past to stop all contact and I am glad you are now considering it. It WILL work in your best intrest emotionally and as far as the divorce...you do not want any issues from emails and postings to come up in court...I have been divorced ..it is really best to as you said let your grown kids keep contact. As to the house I know you love that house ...but if you have to let it go to be happy and free of all this sorrow and anger then do it...You are paying a high price for this house...your self esteem and happiness is being sucked away by staying for this house...
taylor Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Hi Athena, After reading your husband's e-mails two thoughts came to mind: 1. Too many "I's" in his words. I, I, I, I, I. All about him. 2. He's the one who's stuck. After reading your responses to Airline Pilot, only one thought came to mind: 1. Damn, she's got guts..and strength. You go girl. You are going to make it through this.
stillafool Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Athena, don't you have a way to block your H's emails so you don't have to read them?
jj33 Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Thanks for the info, I will look into it all. Athena you dont want to do international service of process yourself. It will end in tears. Yours. he will laugh or mock you. Or there will be arguments. Or he will dissuade you. An international divorce is complicated. Dont play around with this. Do it right or you will only find yourself in a worse situation. Hire a lawyer. Anything else is just procrastination. And as for posting his emails. I would strongly advise against it. Do you secretly want him to find your posts and see your pain? This is a public forum. Anyone can google and see your posts. You are baring your H's most intimate thoughts on your marriage verbatim to the entire world (or those that have access to loveshack). Is that really in your best interest?
BlackWhite Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 Are you really divorcing him? What does he do overseas?
nothingissacred Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 I want to say that reading through this thread has been very helpful for me. So, thank you to all who are giving great advice for athena. I share most of the same fears athena (the one that struck me most, was what IF H is *fixed* and then some OW benefits from it down the line, instead of me) And a lot of your H's letters have so many things that my H has been saying. It does get quite exhausting when they throw out what we want to hear, and make promises, and make us *think* they're sincere and there's hope, but *never* follow up with real *action*. sad. so so sad. and heartbreaking. And thank you very much for the book titles...I'll be ordering them today. stay strong Athena! You can do this and I can do this...one day at a time.
jj33 Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 Are you really divorcing him? What does he do overseas? You do realize that this is a public forum and that might be too much information...
BlackWhite Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 You do realize that this is a public forum and that might be too much information... If he is just some contractor or some engineer, there are hundreds or even thousands of them. No one in here would know he is. Unless, he holds a well-known position such as the minister of so and so for the United States.
Author Athena Posted September 25, 2009 Author Posted September 25, 2009 Hello LS posters, my friends, and fellow readers Here is an update on my situation (for a synopsis read post 177). Our family went overseas in August for the vacation and I met up with H there. I took my counselor's advice and did not get into any emotional conversation of any depth of the state of our marriage while there. H was only too pleased to avoid the same, since he was on 'my turf' with MY side of the family there (siblings, mom, etc) and he wants to maintain as positive an image of himself (and our marriage!) in front of them all, as possible. We actually had a good time together; H hired a car and drove the kids and me to see some new 'n wondrous sites! HOWEVER: I have made sure to continue keeping an emotional distance from him and so I ensured I did not sleep with him there -- thus bringing it from January this year to now that I have said "no" to him in this department (I don't want to become emotionally tied/invested in him plus who knows who he might be doing). Also, upon our return home, I have begun putting my mental health first, and I have taken great care to not get embroiled in any in-depth email 'conversation' or dissection of our M and relationship. H, on the other hand, has sent me a couple of emails where he tells me how awful he is feeling, and of having nightmares of losing me... my reaction has been to delay a reply, then to not address those issues at all, but to give him brief news of the kids, and the household matters. This I am doing in an effort to not be ensnared back into his emotional hold over me. I am being civil and polite, while breaking old habits. He has not been able to seduce me this time. Next update is on my having gone back to Graduate School! I am now studying for my Masters full time, and loving it! Next year I will be able to intern through the Universities connections, and this will be helpful both for learning purposes as well as for networking and establishing possible future employment. For now, I am getting back into the swing of studies, and that certainly helps keep depression mostly at bay. My son is home (having graduated in May). He has a part time job with reasonably good pay (and he's not even pimply-faced lol), and next week he starts a course to study for his MCATS. So he lives in the house with me and provides some company, and keeps me busy with making meals for us both. Daughter is away at college. H is due to end his work contract at the end of December, whereupon he will return home. Then he will need to scramble for a job! I must say, I have not forgotten the advice of you guys telling me to find a job. I am putting steps into place. I returned from the trip in late August, had to do "Springcleaning" at home, also get my daughter moved into residence at college, and sign up for my own studies. Now I am getting some kind of a routine established. Grad school entails a lot of reading and studying... I have a resume ready, and I will next put my attention to getting a part-time job somewhere. Basically, I have started setting things into place for a better and healthier me in the future. LOL -- my mother STILL tries to talk me into 'not divorcing' my H (she did this on vacation, and on the phone when I call her, so I have cut that down a little ) Yup, Carhill, I am "centering myself, providing security, and then moving forward". It's a Plan (wow, Owl -- look at me) Taylor -- where are you? Been MIA since late August!!!
aeh Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 Athena, from all the posts I have read of your situation, you seem like a very strong woman. It seems like you have taken charge of what must be a very difficult situation in many ways. I know you are hurting, but you radiate great strength to me. I am proud of you for taking care of you, for putting your needs first, for your restraint. Reading your post struck a chord with me just now because I literally just finished a series of texts with my H who is currently away which dissect our marriage and the way my love for him has changed, the ways I have changed and how I can't believe the enormous consequences and life altering views that resulted from something he terms so meaningless. Wow, all this for something so meaningless?! I find it difficult when he is not home to not engage with him in texts of this nature so I admire your restraint immensely. And of course, now I feel guilty for some reason for being so cutting to him in my remarks when I know he is trying so hard and truly feels remorseful. But I can't stop myself....
Author Athena Posted September 25, 2009 Author Posted September 25, 2009 Athena, from all the posts I have read of your situation, you seem like a very strong woman. It seems like you have taken charge of what must be a very difficult situation in many ways. I know you are hurting, but you radiate great strength to me. I am proud of you for taking care of you, for putting your needs first, for your restraint. Reading your post struck a chord with me just now because I literally just finished a series of texts with my H who is currently away which dissect our marriage and the way my love for him has changed, the ways I have changed and how I can't believe the enormous consequences and life altering views that resulted from something he terms so meaningless. Wow, all this for something so meaningless?! I find it difficult when he is not home to not engage with him in texts of this nature so I admire your restraint immensely. And of course, now I feel guilty for some reason for being so cutting to him in my remarks when I know he is trying so hard and truly feels remorseful. But I can't stop myself.... I fully understand your guilty feelings aeh, but don't worry -- it IS necessary for your H to feel some of the (negative) consequences for his actions! Thank you for posting your thoughts!
lostsoulmate Posted September 25, 2009 Posted September 25, 2009 coming out of your post. Joy about truly understanding why so many years have gone by and nothing had changed until now... until you decided you had to make changes to make your life better. It feels good to feel good about where your life is heading. Athena, we are all very proud of you! I hope this new found you with so much happiness continues to do things and enjoy being "you"!!!! Peace, hope and brightness!
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