jalex2012 Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 My husband came home three months ago from a business trip. He is a writer and he was working with some colleagues and stayed in their homes. One was a single woman with whom he hit it off quite well it seems. Apparently, he poured his heart out to her about the problems in our relationship (of which he had never expressed any to me) over the 4 days he stayed with her. I have got various versions of what occurred, but he came back wanting 'more' in our relationship. He sees this relationship as having stimulated us to talk more, but I found his method of getting emotionally close to someone else deceitful, especially since she said if things were different she would be interested in him and he said he thought about having an affair with her. All this is rather murky even though I have tried to get a really clear idea of what happened. In any case when he came back he wasn't happy with the answer I gave him when he asked me if I still loved him. Which I do.... I was, literally, just totally surprised and really hurt and am having real trust issues with him now, which makes me quite sad. He claims nothing is happening with this woman, she lives on the opposite coast, but he has continued to talk with her at least once a week. (It has been 3 months) Until finally two weeks ago, I told him to stop it because it was getting in the way of healing whatever rift has occurred between us. We have been married 19 years and have one son so our relationship is much different than what he would have with someone whom he just met yet he seems to want that kind of new relationship kind of excitement. He says my concern over this woman is a generational thing -- he is 41 and I am 53 (I'm still in great shape fortunately). I don't think it has anything to do with being younger although it might have to do with experience -- I was previously married and have tried to be really careful in this relationship. In any case, if some married man can give me some insight into what is happening with my husband I would appreciate it. We are doing some counseling, but I am really hurt, particularly because he doesn't think it matters that he has a close relationship with another woman.
Toodamnpragmatic Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 My husband came home three months ago from a business trip. He is a writer and he was working with some colleagues and stayed in their homes. One was a single woman with whom he hit it off quite well it seems. Apparently, he poured his heart out to her about the problems in our relationship (of which he had never expressed any to me) over the 4 days he stayed with her. I have got various versions of what occurred, but he came back wanting 'more' in our relationship. He sees this relationship as having stimulated us to talk more, but I found his method of getting emotionally close to someone else deceitful, especially since she said if things were different she would be interested in him and he said he thought about having an affair with her. All this is rather murky even though I have tried to get a really clear idea of what happened. In any case when he came back he wasn't happy with the answer I gave him when he asked me if I still loved him. Which I do.... I was, literally, just totally surprised and really hurt and am having real trust issues with him now, which makes me quite sad. He claims nothing is happening with this woman, she lives on the opposite coast, but he has continued to talk with her at least once a week. (It has been 3 months) Until finally two weeks ago, I told him to stop it because it was getting in the way of healing whatever rift has occurred between us. We have been married 19 years and have one son so our relationship is much different than what he would have with someone whom he just met yet he seems to want that kind of new relationship kind of excitement. He says my concern over this woman is a generational thing -- he is 41 and I am 53 (I'm still in great shape fortunately). I don't think it has anything to do with being younger although it might have to do with experience -- I was previously married and have tried to be really careful in this relationship. In any case, if some married man can give me some insight into what is happening with my husband I would appreciate it. We are doing some counseling, but I am really hurt, particularly because he doesn't think it matters that he has a close relationship with another woman. I am 46 and happy to give my opinion, when you tell me what he said the problem was.... I would and always say it comes down to sex and a male feeling whether the compromises of a wife and family are worth it. Also you cavalierly mention the age difference and the fact you have been married 19 years, meaning if you were together for a year before marriage he was 21 and you 33..... That could be the jumping point for this post.....
Reggie Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 The age difference is meaningless, IMO, considering the fact that women have a greater capacity for sex than men as they age. In fact, that age difference is probably ideal in terms of sexual compatibility, with women peaking so much later. It is a problem of lack of loyalty and poor boundaries. He was completely wrong to discuss your marital issues with another woman and this is a btrayal. Your age has nothing to do with it.
carhill Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 OP, a couple questions: When you say he apparently poured his heart out to her, please elaborate about exactly how you received this revelation. During the three months he spoke with her on the phone once a week, how often was that in front of you? Who called whom? If you could do anything tomorrow, what would that be, regarding your marriage? Note, I'm talking about *you*, not him. Thanks!
Toodamnpragmatic Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 The age difference is meaningless, IMO, considering the fact that women have a greater capacity for sex than men as they age. In fact, that age difference is probably ideal in terms of sexual compatibility, with women peaking so much later. It is a problem of lack of loyalty and poor boundaries. He was completely wrong to discuss your marital issues with another woman and this is a btrayal. Your age has nothing to do with it. She hasn't mentioned anything about sex, I did. Also she has or could be going through menopause, which can affect sex. Reggie have you read the # of posts from women or about women who have no interest in sex (some men too)???? Age has little to do. I may be 100% off base, but let her answer please. Also the age difference I commented on was when they met.... A 21 yo guy and a 33 yo woman can certainly present some issues over the years.
stillafool Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 I am 46 and happy to give my opinion, when you tell me what he said the problem was.... I would and always say it comes down to sex and a male feeling whether the compromises of a wife and family are worth it. Could you tell me what you mean by this?
carhill Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Not Todd but I can say many males feel loved through sex, and a death of it leaves them feeling unloved. No clue if that is relevant here. The OP will have to advise.
Author jalex2012 Posted July 6, 2009 Author Posted July 6, 2009 The problem(s) in the marriage -- yes, not enough intimacy but also him wanting to do more things together but also less things together -- in general a better relationship. So it sounds good... its just the place he started from has made me really quite upset. He told me 'he poured his heart out to her'.... after I asked him about it and I have asked a number of times to try and get a sense of what was really going on. He e-mailed her a couple of times after he returned from his trip and I saw those -- they weren't romantic in any way, but they did talk about being open --- its just I know how fast a 'friendship' can change into something else, particularly if one feels one's spouse is not ideal in some way. He always talked to her in private, never in front of me... and I only know that he talked to her because I asked him, he never told me about it without me asking. They ARE working on a project together, but I have a feeling they were making more work about it than necessary... What would I have done differently? I was really busy in the fall and in the winter and clearly I wasn't paying enough attention to him... so that was my fault... still, I don't think I should have had to ask him to stop talking with her when he could see how much it was and is bothering me. I don't have any close male friends and probably never will (which is why I'm relying on you guys as I don't really know who to ask about this) -- I have colleagues who I work with and who I enjoy but I would never talk about close personal things with them as I think they would get the wrong idea. I can barely talk with a guy at a party without them thinking I'm flirting with them -- don't exactly know what I do wrong but that's the way it is. Anyway, I appreciate you guys helping me. I know I have not been a good enough friend to my husband sometimes, and I'm not really sure what I hope to gain by going over and over the fact that I think he was wrong about what he did. I guess I just want to trust him again and to clarify with him what we should do to safeguard our commitments to each other -- I just think he has a completely different idea -- and that makes me nervous and anxious.
carhill Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 OK, that's good information for digestion.... Could you clarify one more thing, as we each have different perspectives on 'intimacy'. Am I hearing you right that your H didn't feel your intimacy was adequate and, by using the word 'intimacy', did he (or do you) mean sex? I ask this because, in my M, I felt the emotional intimacy was severely wanting and I chose, incorrectly, to seek it out with another woman. I just want to be clear on the terminology. Lastly, when I read this: I was previously married and have tried to be really careful in this relationship. I'm forced to ask myself what do you really mean by careful? My W and I are getting a D, but, through MC, I learned from the mistakes I made and don't think of having to be 'careful' in future relationships, rather using the tools I learned, making them a part of the relationship dynamic. I'm just curious where your 'careful' came from. Thanks! BTW, I'm 50 and have been married (not D'd yet) for 9 years.
Author jalex2012 Posted July 6, 2009 Author Posted July 6, 2009 Yes, not enough sex. Actually my attention to sex had waned... I'm not sure what happened. Anyway, in the last month my husband and I have re-generated that part of our relationship and now we are quite happily making love every day. And as for being careful, I mean just never putting myself in a situation where I might jeopardize the relationship.... if I feel attracted to another man, (and I did at one point in a work situation) than I discontinue or walk away from that situation.... As hard as it may be I am really curious about what it means to be with someone for a long time... as interesting as a 'new relationship' is, I'm seriously invested in that idea.... I just need to get over my pain at the sense of betrayal I feel... I think maybe I just need to talk about it more with my husband until I get over it... ' thanks much for the talking...
carhill Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 When you're in counseling, talk about how you feel about your H having such a close friendship with another woman. Are there any conditions under which you feel such a relationship could continue? Did he disclose any romantic feelings towards this person? I ask this because it's possible to have non-romantic feelings, yet still have an inappropriate relationship. It's about priority. Do you feel that you are his priority? Can you feel that way even if he continues to have some contact with this woman, presumably for professional reasons? Does he want that? How long have you been going to counseling? We went nearly every week for about 14 months. We did have a couple of month-6 week long hiatuses interspersed where we used the tools and worked on our own. IME, meaningful change/improvement/results take time. Even though MC didn't 'save' our M, I believe we both benefited from it.
michelangelo Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 The age difference is meaningless, IMO, considering the fact that women have a greater capacity for sex than men as they age. In fact, that age difference is probably ideal in terms of sexual compatibility, with women peaking so much later. It is a problem of lack of loyalty and poor boundaries. He was completely wrong to discuss your marital issues with another woman and this is a btrayal. Your age has nothing to do with it. The first part of your commentary is not true for women during and after menopause. while generalizations are a tough thing to do. In this case, the hormones that spark FREQUENT desire for sex decline rapidly in women at that time. So given that her man in a significantly younger than she is, his libido is likely greater than hers.
Reggie Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Not necessarily. He is in his early 40's and the testosterone is already declining. And, with hormone replacement she may not feel too much of a drop off.
Athena Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 especially since she said if things were different she would be interested in him and he said he thought about having an affair with her. Sorry I am not a man, but I would still like to give my opinion here... while it is a good thing that your H came home and voluntarily gave you the truth about what happened, it's not an appropriate attachment the minute SHE told him 'she would be interested in him' and he told you he 'thought about having an affair'. Your H is happy to have a new best friend, but since his M is more important to him, he should, in order to put you at ease (esp. since he and she both expressed interest in taking that R further... oh... but for you, the W...) cut ties with her. I don't think it's a generational thing at all, it's a marital thing. How old is Ms. Wonderful?
michelangelo Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Not necessarily. He is in his early 40's and the testosterone is already declining. And, with hormone replacement she may not feel too much of a drop off. How old are you Reggie? I'm 50 and have lived this. A man my age does not even have the same level of drop off as a woman does at menopause. A 40 year old man even more so compared to a wife 13 years his senior.
Reggie Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Mich, I'm 55. A high % of my buddies are using Viagra(it works incredibly, bTW). But, I've been dating some in my age range and the women are voracious.
Author jalex2012 Posted July 6, 2009 Author Posted July 6, 2009 thanks Athena -- yeah, Ms. Wonderful was his age, around 40 and he has stopped talking with her.... I think we are going to be okay.... we were having a lot of trouble communicating and a lot of misunderstanding... but I think things are getting better.. Still, its been good chatting on this board and getting some other perspectives...
2sunny Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 i think he's feeding his ego with her attention. he kept it a secret - still keeps contact (emails, phone calls) a secret. this isn't a good sign. he should be willing to show you any contact or words spoken should be in front of you. why is he still hiding it? something still doesn't add up - i think his involvement and intentions run much deeper than he is willing to admit. and the cover up is bigger than he wants you to know. that is what my gut says. also - his willingness to betray you by telling her YOUR problems (when he didn't bother telling you first) shows his manipulation to get her sympathy and attention... he's reeling her in big time. it also shows that he's capable of betraying you on the highest level. i wonder if he would mind you telling a sexy guy all about his lack of performance in bed? i bet he wouldn't like it at all. stop blaming yourself. he is the one that crossed the line. just because the M hit a rocky patch didn't give him carte blanche to go find some new hot thing. i didn't see you doing that to him - so stand up for yourself and set some tight boundaries... boundaries that say - knock off all this $hitty behavior and contact with the OW or you get divorce papers immediately. you better start checking up on him too... his cell bill, his cell messages or texts, the money he spends (he will send her gifts etc) his email acct, new - secret - email accts). start taking action - put your foot down and make him either be decent or get out.
Author jalex2012 Posted July 6, 2009 Author Posted July 6, 2009 thanks 2sunny.... I think you are right, except not in quite such a harsh way... I think he is/was very confused about our relationship and didn't know how to talk with me about it... yes, that is pretty stupid, but that is the way it was.... (not anymore)... and yes, no excuses when a marriage hits a difficult part to go and find someone else -- too easy.... And it was ****ty what he did and I've berated him and he's apologized and he isn't talking with her anymore. And the woman, as far as I'm concerned, was wrong to say she would be interested in him if things were different... you just don't tell confused and vulnerable married men that --- I have very little respect for her.
NOTSURE7 Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 ok this is actually a post i can help on instead of being the one who is taking all the advice, if you read my posts i am 36 married man who has cheated. i will try to help you as much as i can, i really beleive your H is engaging in a true emotional affair,he is looking to her to provide an ear,to listen to him,to get him,to understand him and make him feel important and alive,i also would say you might be naive to beleive that nothing physical has happened,once that emotional connection is there then the physical is not far behind. I think your H has true issues in your relationship and he was tired of talking to himself about it but instead of coming to you,he found someone else more than willing to listen, for some reason us men have the hardest time coming to our wives and opening up and find it easier to find that connection elsewhere and it leads to trouble.i have always handled things myself and i ended up with another woman and a full blown A, its easier to talk to someone else and the internet has made it even easier. This ow is going to tell him anything he wants to hear, just make sure he is realy not still talking to her, beleive me its easy to deceive, i am not proud of it but i am just telling you to keep your eyes open, the minute you let your guard down and your H thinks all is clear he will be right back out there.
jjreed Posted July 12, 2009 Posted July 12, 2009 I'm 36 - 12yrs marriage. You will never know what truly happened on the trip. All you can do is take him for his word or leave him. I won't give advice about whether or not I think he has cheated. In fact, no one in this forum should because none of us have a clue about what happened on the trip. Communication is a big issue in marriages. It takes a concerted effort. When it has broken down, it's like a second job. Keep working at making your marriage better, even when you don't feel like it. He needs to do the same.
Author jalex2012 Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 I want to thank everyone who responded to this thread... my husband and I have worked through a lot of our difficulties and the rift of communication has been healed. We are better than ever... Thanks to you virtual advisors.... I kept pushing him to tell me what exactly happened on his trip because the story just didn't fit with who I know him to be. So I don't think anything happened other than a little advice and comforting... (there was no talk of an affair and his colleague never said she would have been interested in him if things were different -- that was his liberal interpretation meant to shock me out of my complacency) I think changing our way of communicating and being together could have been handled more gently, but perhaps nothing would have woken me up so completely as the perceived threat of him leaving .... People grow and change and sometimes its hard to keep current with those changes if the lines of communication aren't wide open... Anyway, thanks again for the help.
Lizzie60 Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 I think the lack of sex is probably the reason why he goes elsewhere. Methink he's having more than just a platonic friendship with this woman. I don't really have an advice.. unfortunately there is not much you can do at this point.. he's already into her big time.. I'm afraid you can't stop him now.. I say.. if you don't want to be patient or look the other way... leave..
Lizzie60 Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Oh .. I should add.. if that can help... Here's what I've heard from MMs before.. ' I love my wife.. but if I had more sex at home.. I wouldn't be here, everything is perfect except our sex life'.
carhill Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 And I'll add, as someone who has gone through it, that two weeks is the 'honeymoon period' of meaningful change. Update us in six months. Best wishes!
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