Cinnamon777 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 My husband and I are in limbo. I want to separate... he is still holding on. We've been married for 8 years, and for a good part of that time he drank too much. I ignored my intuition to marry him because he is a good man and I allowed myself to be convinced it wasn't going to be too bad to cope with the drinking. He has never been abusive, just disconnected. It's a bit of a long story but we've had our ups and downs as with any marriage. I felt rejected every time he chose to drink over choosing to "be" with me and he felt like I was telling him what to do by asking him not to drink so much. The tug of war over the years finally resulted in me saying "do whatever you want" about 2 years ago and I stopped trying to convince him to change. Emotionally I shut down from him and became indifferent. We are both going to individual counseling. I'm working on giving myself permission to choose a happier life for myself, which means letting go of my marriage. Since making this decision, I've felt a huge relief and like a chain has been lifted off my heart. While this has not come easily, I do feel so much better. He has realized how much the drinking effected me and is now wanting to work on things and wants me to tell him what to do to "save" the marriage. I just can't give him a list. He is who he is and changing himself for me is only a surface solution. I believe ultimately his core personality will take over and break through any masks he puts on to try and please me. I just wish that it could be a clean break. We have children. We have a house. We live week to week financially. It's all just so complicated and we are still living together so that we don't destroy the finances that we worked so hard to balance. I don't make enough money to support an apartment on my own (yet) and I don't want to make him pay to make up the difference and not be able to maintain his own place. Emotionally I'm walking a tight rope all the time because I'm excited to move on but trying to respect his hurt feelings. I want to go and meet new people (not dive into a new romance) and start opening my heart again - but he thinks it's disrespectful. I feel like money is forcing us to stay together. I could move back in with my parents, but they live in another state and I don't want to take the kids that far from their Dad. I want him to be in their life as much as possible. I feel a little trapped today. I wish there was something he could take to stop hurting so much and just let me go emotionally. I know it will all work out. It's just today is one of those days when the burden is feeling so heavy... my heart is sad... I just want to be free... I could really use a hug right now...
LisaUk Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Hi Cinnamon, I'm sorry you are having a hard time. It does appear that your husband is trying his best to change. I know it is frustrating that he didn't do this before, but sometimes it takes a make or break situation to really give someone the desire to change. My ex didn't give me the opportunity to change before he left, he didn't even tell me he was unhappy. After he left, he said that he felt we would always be the same people and we should be true to ourselevs. In other words, he didn't think I was capable of change. He couldn't be more wrong, an experience such as the loss of your mariage DOES change you. My ex would hardly know me now, so much in me has changed in the last 3 months. You've changed through your counselling? Why are you so determined to believe that your husband can't/won't through his. I know you think he is doing it for you, but he isn't, he is doing it for himself, because he doesn't want to lose you because he loves you so much, he wants to be a better man for you. I am trying to understand how you feel, truely, I know it must be difficult for you. Having been on the other side of this though, I can tell you, people can and do change. Have you considred MC?
Gunny376 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 WOW~! Your being brutally honest in your post! With yourself, your husband, and your marriage! BTW? Big time HUG! :love: Once a woman has an emotional disconnect? Its almost impossible to get it back for either her or the SO. Once its gone? Its gone. Even if she truly wanted to re-connect. Its just not generally possible for her to do so? It took me a long time a lot of learning to figure that out? That what needs to be nurtured, maintained, with women was the emotional relationship with a woman. That I need to engage her and with her emotionally and on an emotional level. That women are emotional beings, but men have been and are culturally and socially conditioned to be unemotional. While women are the exact opposite. The confusion arises because of social and cultural conditioning? A really good book on this subject is "Why Men Don't Get Enough Sex, And Women Don't Get Enough Love"
LisaUk Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I studied a bit about love patterns in my degree (Psychology), if you have loved someone before there is an imprint and it is possible to reignite this if both parties put in the hard work!
Author Cinnamon777 Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 [FONT=Times New Roman][sIZE=3]Hey LisaUK, Thanks for writing and I appreciate your thoughts of encouragement. I have thought of MC and I've talked about it with my counselor. I just don't see my feelings changing toward him. I felt a warm, comfortable kind of love toward my husband since the beginning that I thought over time would grow stronger as we faced life together. It just hasn't happened, in fact over time the feelings have gotten weaker and weaker. I can see myself being friends with him, but the thought of trying to be intimate with him causes me quite a bit of anxiety. I suppose I won't know if MC will help if I don't try it. I understand he wants to try... now that I'm all done trying. Now I'm ready to walk out the door... he says "wait... I'm sorry". WTF! I told him numerous times I was unhappy... he just thought it was "normal" unhappiness that occurs in marriage - not that I was REALLY unhappy. Apparently he didn't see the "real" sadness in my tears. The reason I believe my husband won't change is that[/sIZE][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman][sIZE=3] he is only motivated by what he "should" do or be and is completely frozen when it comes to doing things he want's to do. He "should" save our marriage, he "should" work hard at his job, he "should" be a good father to the kids, he "should" stop drinking.... to me that is just not living, it's existing. He's living the life he "should" have instead of the life he might want to have. I have been open and encouraging him to embrace something he wants to do, but he just can't get away from the "shoulds". I'm very tired of what "should" be done at this point. [/sIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman][sIZE=3]I think that Gunny is right in that I just don't think I will be able to emotionally reconnect to him. There might be an imprint I could tap into... but there are a lot of things from our relationship imprinted on me about how I've been disappointed over and over again when he told me he would change or that the drinking was over. How am I supposed to find it in myself to try, again, when I gave everything I had when he was unwilling to listen to my feelings? I'm sure he can change more, he has stopped drinking, started working out, and is finally pitching in with some chores around the house. We are both changing... I just don't feel like we are growing and changing together. While I do think we are able to work together, I simply have no desire toward him. I don't want to stay in a functional, but passionless and sexless marriage. We had sex up until a few months ago, but it was just an empty physical act. I want to move forward and he wants re-runs. I don't know. He can change. I can change. He has every opportunity to make some kind of major change over the past few months to show me that he wants to be a different person... but other than the drinking (which I realize is MAJOR, but he says is no big deal since it was just a bad habit like smoking), it's only been minor stuff. I'm sure that there is much he can change to be a better person for me. The drinking really was a huge thing!! I'm really proud of him for sticking with the sobriety for so long this time. While he is changing, I'm still changing too. I just don't think he can become a person that embraces life, chases after what he wants, enjoys the laughter of the children playing outside, or will ever step up to the plate to try and hit a home run. It's much safer for him to try for a hit IF he has to get up to bat. Maybe I'm wrong... It took eight years for him to realize drinking was holding him back and hurting our marriage. Thank you so much for the hugs Gunny!! Much appreciated... [/sIZE][/FONT]
LisaUk Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Hi Cinnamon It sounds like you really did try to tell him you were unhappy for all those years. I'm guessing you did this in a calm way? Not just during arguments or upset? Sometimes people don't HEAR you if issues are only raised on these occasions. It must be incrediably upsetting for you that now you are totally spent and want to move forward with your life, he chooses now to step up to the plate. Sometimes it really does take a huge jolt to make someone aware of their problems and perhaps your husband just got the jolt, because he now knows you are done. From your words I get the impression that you are an incrediably gentle, giving, caring women. I do feel for you, I can see you are really trying and that you fear you will not be able to reignite your passion for your husband, that you do not want to stay in an unhappy, loveless relationship. All you can ask yourself is have we done everything we can? On the one hand he has made the effort, he is sober, so positive change, but you feel he is doing it because he should, not because he wants to. I do think MC would be a good idea, it may be that the way in which each of you express yourseleves and communicate with each other is being misinterpreted? I guess you will never know unless you try it. Passion and emotional connection can come back, with time, communication and rebuilding trust. These things are achievable. It's difficult to imagine now, I understand that. If you walk away from this and you know you have tried everything you will be able to move forward happy, but if you haven't tried everything, will you always have that element of doubt and regret? I'm sending you a hug too :love: you sound like you could do with one. When your children get home from school, go grab them and hold them tightly. Please do keep posting.
TrustInYourself Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 WOW~! Your being brutally honest in your post! With yourself, your husband, and your marriage! BTW? Big time HUG! :love: Once a woman has an emotional disconnect? Its almost impossible to get it back for either her or the SO. Once its gone? Its gone. Even if she truly wanted to re-connect. Its just not generally possible for her to do so? It took me a long time a lot of learning to figure that out? That what needs to be nurtured, maintained, with women was the emotional relationship with a woman. That I need to engage her and with her emotionally and on an emotional level. That women are emotional beings, but men have been and are culturally and socially conditioned to be unemotional. While women are the exact opposite. The confusion arises because of social and cultural conditioning? A really good book on this subject is "Why Men Don't Get Enough Sex, And Women Don't Get Enough Love" Wrong, this is simply an assumption based on your personal opinion and experience. This is a generalization which is limited and not completely true. It has nothing to do with a woman being incapable of reconnecting. That can happen easily. The problem is, why would she, when the man is clearly flawed. If that man made real change for himself, then it's up to her to choose what she wants and needs. You are afraid, so you calculate risk. It's risky to put your heart on the line. For many, the risk doesn't outweigh the reward. For you Gunny, and for many others, you choose to be guarded. You live your life the way you choose.
Author Cinnamon777 Posted July 1, 2009 Author Posted July 1, 2009 Thanks for the hugs and support!!! When I talked to my husband about my feelings it was not during arguments, it was usually when I was feeling so overwhelmed with sadness I couldn't hold it in any longer. I'm not much of a shouter, and luckily while he may raise his voice, he isn't much of a shouter either. So talking with him about my feelings, while usually emotional, was not during times that he could not have "seen" or "heard" me. Because he couldn't really admit he had a "problem" with the drinking, it just made him angry (maybe embarrassed) that I was pointing out the excess. He sometimes reacted by drinking more, as he felt like I was "telling him what to do" and sometimes he reacted by not drinking for weeks or months at at time. When he stopped, I would get my hopes up that we would work on things and our marriage would improve. We would make plans for changes together. We often talked about moving to a new place, getting a fresh start, him making a career change to something that makes him happier. Something would happen though and it would all fall through. Ultimately he was scared to make a move. Even though the kids are young, he didn't want to move them. He didn't stick with his exercise. A social gathering would bring him face to face with a bottle and he was unable to say no... we went through these kinds of cycles at least 3 major times. Getting excited and having the wind taken from my sails over and over has just left me not wanting to try with him anymore. I have a hard time believing his words. I can no longer envision dreams with him. I just don't want to try anymore. I feel terrible that he is sad. I was sad for a long, long time. I cried my tears. I offered him hope, suggestions, support, and encouragement. I layed awake many nights trying to sleep next to my passed out husband. I made many efforts to keep our sex life spicy to distract him from drinking. While I didn't offer him any ultimatums, I still believed that he knew how I felt about things. I did tell him a few times that I had doubts about being able to stay with him. I did express how sad I felt about the drinking. I told him how much I felt like we needed to change. I do feel like I did everything I could and at this point I don't have any regrets in regards to my efforts. I do agree with TrustinYourself... we do live our lives the way we choose. I choose to live mine by moving forward and trusting my instinct that I'm making the best choice for myself and even for my kids. I am choosing to no longer go in circles. I choose to continue working on myself to be the best person I can be. It's just so hard to be in the same house. He does make a good effort to be positive, but he is pretty good at pushing his feelings away. It's been part of the disconnect that I've felt for years with him. He just sometimes catches me off guard with his tears and expressions of sadness. It will be nice when we finish cleaning out the office to make a separate bedroom... even better when we can sell our condo and move into separate places. It's a little exhausting to feel excited for the most part, but have to be more reserved around him. I try to respect and acknowledge his feelings. I appreciate his cooperation to separate. This week is just one of those tough ones. Thanks again to those of you reading and writing back!!
LisaUk Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Hi Cinnamon, It does sound like it has taken this extreme, this jolt to make your husband realise just what he is going to lose through his addiction. It also sounds like you tried and tried for years to make him understand and you felt you gave him the oppurtunity to work on things with you by saying you thought your relationship would not survive this. Unfortunately, I don't think your husband really heard this until it became a reality. You sound exhasted, I think you feel you have reached the end of the line, that there is nothing left in you to work on your marriage. Only you know if you did everything you could and if you can do anymore. I hope whether you stick to your decision or whether you decide to try again, that you find some happiness. It must be hard for you to feel trapped in a situation because of finances, I do hope that posting here helps, I can try and empathise with your situation, although I will admit that it is difficult for me, as I am more in your husbands position (although, in a different set of circumstances). Nevertheless, I do hope that I can support you somehow and not let my situation cloud the expression of that. I don't like to think of anyone in pain and alone, so I do hope you will keep posting. Take comfort and joy in your children and stay strong, keep posting.
myway4077 Posted July 7, 2009 Posted July 7, 2009 Lisauk i can tell you have been throught alot and your advice is 100 percent from the heart. The reason i know this is beacuse that is how i feel with what am going through. You are right people can change for the better it just takes that jolt. Cinnamon take your time and make sure you are making the right decision, you may feel like starting over but in return you may loose the person you wanted by your side all along, someone special.
myway4077 Posted July 7, 2009 Posted July 7, 2009 trustinyouself your thread has been recommended to me by a few people, i have added you to my contacts and was hoping you can send me your thread. Thank you.
Lisa616 Posted July 7, 2009 Posted July 7, 2009 Hi Cinnamon, Just wanted to say that I was/am (we are separated currently) married to an alcoholic.....he has been sober for awhile, but the first 10 years of our marriage he was not. I know that I have been helped a great deal by going regularly to Alanon meetings. Not only did it help me learn to "detach with love" but also helped me in not continuing to seek out relationships with people who have alcohol or any other type of addictions. For me, I am a co-dependent type personality so it really helps me keep my desire to control and micromanage everything in check. Just a suggestion.....it really does help also Alateen or Alatots for the kids.....mine go and really like it. Hope it works out in the best way possible for you no matter what you decide. Good luck.
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