Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 I've been seeing a guy for a couple of months who is going through a divorce. He's a writer and lives in my home city in Scotland, has done for years. He knows loads of people here and didn't want his wife to get wind of the fact that he was seeing someone else. He said this was because it would hurt her and also because of all the 'dividing up' of goods and chattels which isn't yet complete. He said he'd been thinking about me for a long time and had 'planned' to 'get' me. He's moving south next week and says his original idea had been to wait until he got south before contacting me so he could see me in complete freedom. It didn't happen that way as we got together sooner than that. I've therefore been a secret all this time ... not able to go places with him in public if it was in my city, or somewhere where people from his work might be. A couple of weeks ago he said I should think of moving down there to be with him because my job situation is bad. He said that down there I wouldn't be a secret and things would be easier. I've gone along with all of this but lately got really fed up with it. On Friday he said he was going to be really busy over the next week saying his goodbyes and doing a lot of work. Then I found out he was going to spend the day walking with a female friend. I got annoyed because he didn't have time to spend with me, but did with her. She of course, like everyone else, doesn't know about me. He was angry about me 'rocking the boat' and since then has been really odd with me, quite cool and aloof, saying he didn't think things were going to work out etc. He did still meet me to look at furniture together today but it felt a bit forced, as if he was going through the motions. He was anxious all the time that people would see us together, as we were in town. I had to persuade him to come round and see me next week, otherwise I doubt he'd have made much effort to see me all week - he said he was busy every night. Whether or not he will turn up on Monday evening is another matter. And whether or not he will be open and loving if he does is yet another matter again. The plan is still - on the face of it - that I move there eventually and in the meantime I go down to see him from time to time. But he's drawing back from me and a lot of the spark has gone. I basically feel as if now that he has me, he doesn't want me, especially when I've been a bit demanding and unhappy, particularly regarding the time he is not spending with me, the secrecy and the fact this other woman had a whole day of his time. He told me later she was upset that he was going and he had to comfort her by saying he'd be back up in north again and would see her in London. Are alarm bells ringing for anyone else? A male friend of mine thinks he is a total player and is just going through the motions because he has a shred of integrity about what he has done with me (inviting me down, getting involved in the first place). The problem for me is I do love him and feel there is potential there but that I've probably blown it all. But I am guessing he's not so keen on me now ... my friend thinks because I've made myself too available and also made myself look needy and clingy. I'd really appreciate any opinions on the matter. Should I just give up and end it before he does? Or is there a way of salvaging something? He says he loves me but I don't know that he isn't just saying that... he's told me of several female 'friends' that he 'loves' and gets a lot of emails and attention from women, often with very loving and familiar messages in the subject line. Am I just a complete idiot for being involved in this thing and should I get out? Anyway, that's it. Total honesty would be welcome ... I've no idea how to proceed. I spent a lot of tonight composing an 'ending it' email and then thought I didn't really want to end it but that I'd blown it by being so needy and available ... then I felt rubbish about myself.
Stark Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 Any guy that will not walk with you in public and wants to keep you a secret is hiding something and not someone you want to be with. Stand up for yourself and don't put up with the BS.
sugarmomma Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 This should be in the OW forum. Anyway, yes you are being manipulated by a man that is very much married. He has an OW and an OOW. Wow, this guy is a piece of work. You are not inlove with him because you don't love yourself. If you did, you would never allow a MM to bring you this kind of crap talking about he is divorcing. Tell him to leave you alone until he comes with a divorce decree. In the meantime NC. I wouldn't even send him a letter. I would just disappear on his ass. No future in trying to love a MM. Good Luck.
Ruby Slippers Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 It sounds to me like he's got a few women all over the place and doesn't want any of you to know about each other. In other words, he sounds like a complete scumbag. If it were me, I'd end all contact with him and never look back.
dreamticket Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 im sorry to say this but i think you are being used and you dont deserve this. he wants you but he wants you to be something you are not! he wants you to occupy a particular place in his life which then enables him to do exactly what he wants, when he wants all the rest of the time the bit about walking with the female friend sounds really inconsistent and hypocritical to me sounds like he is calling the shots - why not give him some ultimatums about his behaviour and assert yourself in the relationship?
cyril's fan Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 Was the plan for you to move IN WITH HIM or just to the South?
Author Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Author Posted June 28, 2009 Thanks everyone! Cyril's fan: The plan was/is for me to move in with him. He's doing all the right things there, and saying them ... but it would take a while for me to get a job there and meantime I'm completely unsure what's going on. I got fairly assertive about things after the walking with female friend thing and then got the cold treatment followed by 'you're ruining a good thing' line afterwards. He followed that up by saying life is short and I should be making the most of our time together ... which of course made me feel like I was being destructive and unreasonable. Meanwhile, it's a week before he moves and the only way I managed to get an arrangement to see him before he goes was by really pushing for it. Part of me thinks just send a sort of ultimatum email, another just say I'm busy too and can't see him after all. That would be less dramatic but mean I didn't have this feeling of sitting around like a doormat. Yes, I've probably been manipulated but it was good (too good to be true?) for a while and felt genuine. I think dreamticket is probably right - it's all on his terms and when I've tried to make some of my own he's backed off. Maybe just getting busy and resuming my own life as an independent being is the best idea? It will probably be exactly what he wants - getting him off the hook, but best for me too? Any thoughts?
cyril's fan Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 I'm surprised he would let you move in with him since that would make it more difficult for him to see other people. Does your gut tell you that he's thwarting the plan? But there are red flags. You may want to reconsider your decision to move to the South. You can give him an ultimatum or tell him you're busy. But if he really liked the chase, he may chase you down again and after you've decided you want to be with him, what happened may happen again. Getting busy and living your life is a good idea. You should live for yourself, whether or not it's what he wants. If you're living happily and a life you want, who cares what he wants or what it does to him? You'll be the one having the last laugh.
Author Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Author Posted June 28, 2009 I don't think he's thwarting it exactly ... but it's not liable to happen for quite a while and meantime he's showing signs of being nervous about the whole idea. And there's the fact that he told the walking woman he'd be back up to see her 'because she got upset' and he 'ended up having to comfort her' ... he only told me this in a bit of a rush after the whole thing was out in the open about spending the day with her. I kind of get the feeling it was a bit of a confession and that he was flagging up that he had an arrangement to see/meet her again. You can see I'm confused ...!
Author Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Author Posted June 28, 2009 oops - sent that post before I'd finished. Anyway, not sure what to do basically. Don't feel good about all the female pals stuff (there are plenty of them and they all send emails with subject lines like 'lovely hills day' and address him as 'gorgeous' and handsome' ... those that I've seen snippets of ...) I feel there's a bit of something there but it's kind of been eroded by all my recent insecurity. I can easily get busy with my own stuff again but feel I need to kind of do something about him supposedly coming round to see me at the beginning of the week. I now feel I pushed him into that and he's not coming of his own free will. I'd rather if he did come to see me it was because he wants to ... I suspect what will happen is that he will be huffy/weird/remote if he does turn up and that will just be hellish. Maybe I should just cancel and leave things like that?
cyril's fan Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 You sound quite composed and on top of things amid the problems. You also seem to know what you should or want to do. That's good. Going on and living your own life is a good idea.
SoulSearch_CO Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 Quest - the only "good thing" you ruined was the game he has going with you and these other women. Oh, the poor baby. Don't feel pity for this guy - he is playing you. He's crafty - it takes a really good manipulator to turn around and use the guilt on you because he's feeling guilty. I'd be done with this one. Cancel the "date" and then go NC.
torranceshipman Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 What about this for an end it email: 'Hi xx, Here's the thing...It's obvious to me that you are seeing other women, and that you aren't always honest with me, so I don't want to date you any more. To be honest, all these pre-conditions about sneaking around, etc, were also WAY too much baggage for me, and a real turn-off. Dating should be fun and all your baggage and your own sneaking around/communicating with lots of other women just turned it into a hassle. But thanks for the good times, I'm cool about staying friends if you are, and good luck with your divorce!' I wouldn't waste your time telling him anything emotional - make it clear, to the point, and resolute. In an email is great as he doesn't even deserve to hear this in person! If I were you I'd send the email today-in fact, immediately, then shut off your PC, give yourself a huge pat on the back and go do something nice to pamper yourself....
dressing up Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 I'm cool about staying friends if you are' I wouldn't add that unless you're really comfortable with it, OP. He doesn't look like he's good friend material.
Author Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Author Posted June 28, 2009 torranceshipman - great end-it email ... unfortunately got it too late as did what you suggested otherwise and sent one, then packed off for most of the day. Mine was short, just basically saying I was going to be out the evening he was due and wouldn't be waiting in for him. Plus I said I hoped the move went well. That was it. There was so much harsh stuff I could have said but I've heard him react to that stuff from his wife and it is water off a duck's back ... decided not to give him the pleasure of putting me in the 'unhappy thwarted woman' category. Blimey - not one person had a word of support for him. Kind of thought there might be another perspective on all this but no-one but no-one thinks so ... should listen to my instincts more often, and earlier. Well, another one bites the dust ... Thanks all for you support and advice.
sugarmomma Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 Good for you quest! Relationships shouldn't be so complicated and he seemed like a master manipulator looking for someone to prey upon. Gld you ended it but be ready because he will try to come back. They always do.
Ruby Slippers Posted June 28, 2009 Posted June 28, 2009 decided not to give him the pleasure of putting me in the 'unhappy thwarted woman' category. GOOD FOR YOU. You handled it very well. And I agree -- he will DEFINITELY be back. Your calm approach is going to drive him insane. Don't give him the power by buckling to his desires. Give the dude a taste of his own medicine. Blimey - not one person had a word of support for him. Kind of thought there might be another perspective on all this but no-one but no-one thinks so ... should listen to my instincts more often, and earlier. Well, another one bites the dust ... Thanks all for you support and advice. Live and learn, Quest. Live and learn. *hug*
Author Quest Posted June 28, 2009 Author Posted June 28, 2009 Just checked my email and there is a reply from Mr M in which he makes no reference to the fact that I'm cancelling seeing him tomorrow. He begins by calling me his 'darling' and then tells me what he's been up to, what a great day he has had and what did I think of the fact that he was thinking of buying such and such furniture for the new house (the one I am supposed to move into eventually). He doesn't ask to see me either, which I find quite weird ... given that he is moving away next weekend. I have no idea what to make of it and what to do? Do I spell out my unhappiness in a long, detailed email or just ignore for the time being? What is he wanting from me? He doesn't want to see me and yet he is writing intimate emails. I'm confused. Done nothing yet, though ... would appreciate some advice as my head is gone. Thank you all for kind words about my email ... but it didn't seem to register with him at all!
Ruby Slippers Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Oh, your e-mail registered. This guy is a master manipulator. He will come to see you tomorrow and pretend he didn't get your e-mail or didn't understand that part or some other lame lie, and try to woo you back. The chase is on. Chasing the catch is his fix. Once the fix is satisfied, you will have served your purpose for him once more. Don't even answer the door.
SoulSearch_CO Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Oh, your e-mail registered. This guy is a master manipulator. He will come to see you tomorrow and pretend he didn't get your e-mail or didn't understand that part or some other lame lie, and try to woo you back. The chase is on. Chasing the catch is his fix. Once the fix is satisfied, you will have served your purpose for him once more. Don't even answer the door. HAHAHA...brilliance. Pure brilliance. I totally agree. It crossed my mind when I read this earlier, but I wasn't sure how to word it. Ruby said it better.
Author Quest Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 Thanks for your replies. You are all masterly perceptive. I need a good dose of your brains for a week or two, me thinks! And your emotional serenity! I have done nothing about his email and must admit I'm kind of surprised you think the calling off of the meeting has registered ... but it makes sense I suppose. I wondered why he didn't even respond to it ... and suggest meeting up some other time. I'll be out part of the evening anyway but I don't know if I can stay out until midnight or whenever his cut-off time would be for calling, if he does. I'll need to put earplugs in and hide under the blanket, lights off:D What a palaver! The problem is, what do I do generally? He moves at the weekend. So do I just lie low until that is over? We're supposed to meet down south in a week or so, and had plans to do stuff over the summer. He's not talking about any of that now either, at least in his email, another hurtful thing. Is this all about him just trying to 'catch' me? What is the point of it? Just that? Should I take it as given there will be no future and just disappear? Or should I send some sort of clear indication that I consider it over and ask him not to contact me again? I thought I was clear in my email ... not harsh, but clear that I was out tonight and didn't expect to see him again! Do I need to be clearer, or just leave it? This has turned out to be a real head warp ... and there I was all in love with my girlish notions! Thanks again ... any more suggestions would be really welcome!
Author Quest Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 Forgot to mention that it is clear he got my email as his was sent by 'reply' so mine is at the end of it ... he can't pretend he never got it! It's just the fact that he doesn't mention my not being in tonight that got to me ... that COULD be because he just doesn't care and it isn't of any consequence to him, couldn't it?
stepka Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Quest, you did well but you certainly have the hardest fight in front of you--could you go spend the night at a friend's house? If he asks later why you weren't there, just tell him the date was unconfirmed so you made other plans.
Author Quest Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 Hi Stepka, Yes, I am sure I could arrange that with someone and so be out all night! Won't it be clear if I've said I 'can't wait in' that the 'date' is off? You are all very wise and seem to have been right about things so far so I can only guess it won't be clear (or at least be ignored). I am not sure how to fight this battle after tonight though ... Mind you, he will be in a different city, in a different part of the country from this weekend, so it will probably be fine then ... he'll be pursuing other women down there, presumably. Do I just keep out and busy until the weekend and then suppose it will all be okay? Or do I need to send some sort of very firm email?
Ruby Slippers Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I know this is all very easy for us to say from the outside, but I think that deep down, you KNOW you can do better than this. You can be with a man who truly loves you, and is not just using you to spice up his unsatisfactory life, to pump up his ego and endorphins. I advise cutting off all contact with him and never having anything to do with him. I would write one final e-mail telling him I want nothing more to do with him, and telling him not to contact me under any circumstances. No explanation why. Just the facts. Then after that one e-mail, no more e-mails, no phone calls, no visits. Nothing. This man is bad, bad news, and at BEST you are spinning your wheels with him. At worst, he is causing damage. Get out while you're still strong, and don't ever go back.
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