coping with shocking revalation

[fooled once]

Concerned friend --- you do not have to support your friends actions.

 

And I totally disagree with the implication that YOU have done anything wrong.

 

Your friend decided to screw a married man.

 

She then TOLD YOU.

 

She then defends her actions.

 

And people do change WhiteFlower when they are doing something that is against what they normally would believe. The friend can change her personality. It happens all the time with people. We are not the same people at 40 that we were at 20.

 

So it is entirely POSSIBLE that the friend has changed her personality and her views and the original poster SHOULD be wary of her. She should avoid the toxic behavior of her 'friend'.

 

I mean, if you found out a friend was involved in a burgulary or in harming someone, would you still stand by them and support what they did? Heck no.

 

Concerned friend - sounds like your friend is only concerned about herself and not who she hurts; nor her job since when this comes to light, it could be bad for her. Your other friends who say you need to cut her some slack are crazy, IMHO.

 

You have every right to decide to NOT be around someone who is doing something against your beliefs. You have that right because we all have free will and there is NOTHING wrong with cutting negative/toxic/harmful people out of your life.

 

Protect YOURSELF first and foremost because in the end, we are all responsible for our OWN actions and no one else will look out for ourselves except us.

 

I don't even know how you can be around her without discussion of personal lives, so I think it is in your best interest to just let her know that you care about her; but you disagree with her actions and you don't want to be involved in all that drama. Let her know she has a choice to make - to continue to sleep with a married man (which is her right) or to have you involved in her life while she is doing this.

 

You are allowed to be judgmental - we all are even if some don't believe that. But that doesn't mean you are wrong or anything. Just means you choose to NOT be a party to her actions nor support her actions.

 

That is YOUR right and it does not make you a bad person or not a good friend.

 

Honesty and integrity are, IMHO, a huge part of who we are and what we are. Your friend is neither of those things right now (and maybe never was) and it is best to protect yourself from her issues.

 

And tell the rest of your friends to go pound sand.

 

I am sorry your friend has chosen to get involved with someone and thinks it is okay to hurt others the way she is doing.

 

And yes, I would let the wife know what is going on. She has a right to be protected against any STD's that your friend may have.

[fooled once]

She STILL is a generous and compassionate person. Her affair does not change her DNA nor her personality. She may defend her actions since you NOW know and approach her on a subject never discussed before in your history as friends. You never questioned her compassion and generosity before and now she feels you are dismissing those qualities simply because she is sleeping with someone she is not married to/having an affair with/another woman's H. Her innate qualities have not changed so do not see her in any different light.

 

And I could not disagree with this more.

 

WF - how do you know the friend is still a generous and compassionate person? She is doing something that is NOT generous nor compassionate.

 

Her innate qualities HAVE changed because of HER actions.

[Adunaphel]

I didn't see anywhere in the post that the OP was going to spread rumours around or try to ruin her friends reputation, I think she was pointing out the obvious, that people aren't stupid and sooner or later those whom she works with COULD put two and two together and figure out an affair is going on.

 

 

I didn't, either. (as I already stated in post #19)

I'd like to make it clear that I was just replying to a post of NoIdid'nt, who was replying to a post by WhiteFlower, who was giving the OP an opinion about why her friend was acting weird.

[NoIDidn't]

I didn't, either. (as I already stated in post #19)

I'd like to make it clear that I was just replying to a post of NoIdid'nt, who was replying to a post by WhiteFlower, who was giving the OP an opinion about why her friend was acting weird.

 

 

LOL.

 

And THIS, Friends, is how rumors get started.

 

LOL

[Adunaphel]

LOL.

 

And THIS, Friends, is how rumors get started.

 

LOL

 

:lmao:

[Concerned Friend2]

This is not about blaming anyone for anything at all. She said that her friend changed behavior AFTER CF2 got her to spill the beans and then wondered why. I only pointed out why she sees her behavior changing.

 

I'm not even sure CF2's friend would have ever divulged the info had she not been prodded.

 

I don't consider asking someone who I have a close relationship with ONE question "prodding." She's been sharing small details over the months about her involvement with this person and the truth is, I was growing suspicious that this guy might have a girlfriend because of some of the things she was sharing. I didn't want to just assert that without asking for more information, I don't consider that "prodding." For example, she and this person live in the same city and she would talk about "hooking up" for elaborate weekends in Vegas and Los Angeles for weekends and such. I asked her why they didn't go out in their own town and that's when she told me that it was because he was married and had a family. If you saw someone you care about potentially on a ledge, would you just sit by and let them jump?

 

And as for this assertion that I'm going to be the one to reveal her secret. I would never do that. However, you can't ingonre the fact that in the workplace, people talk and if someone were to discover their involvement, that could have serious consequences for her. More serious for her than for him since he has a family and even though they are both at fault for the situation, she might be perceived as trying to break up a family. My friend has a high profile role in her company and has worked hard for what she has. The divorce she went through was devastating to her and I would hate to see her compound her pain by risking everything.

 

Amazing how many judgements and assessments you pass on me when your own advice TO me is not to pass judgement. Ironic actually...

[Concerned Friend2]

I didn't see anywhere in the post that the OP was going to spread rumours around or try to ruin her friends reputation, I think she was pointing out the obvious, that people aren't stupid and sooner or later those whom she works with COULD put two and two together and figure out an affair is going on.

 

Whichwayisup-this is EXACTLY my point. Glad to know that the majority of folks don't jump to conclusions and offer valuable perspectives around here...

[pink smartie]

I very recently ended a short affair. I had told two of my great friends about it and their support was greatly beneficial in helping me sort through my emotions.

 

All I can tell you is that I was fortunate enough to have friends who didn't judge me for getting involved with a MM. Instead, they had faith that I was a good person capable of making the right decisions for myself. They empowered me instead of belittling me, and that more then anything prompted me to end things. It made me realize I was in charge of my own destiny.

 

I'll be honest with you and at the risk of shocking people here: I don't regret the affair. I'm happy it ended, but it has put a lot of things in perspective for me. Like your friend, I was rebounding from a bad relationship and the intensity and romance of the affair did me a world of good. Your friend's affair might be similar.

 

It is up to you to decide whether you can maintain the friendship. If it makes you lose respect for her, then it is best for both of you that you take some distance from the friendship. As a friend, you could also address her strenghts as she makes the choice to continue or end the affair. The choice remains hers.

 

I have found this article quite helpful in helping me take charge of my actions:

http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/sex_relationships/facts/affairs.htm

It might help you understand your friend better. I especially like the question "Do I want to be in this relationship more then I want to be out of it?"

[fooled once]

Concerned, I hope you know that the majority of us don't think YOU did anything wrong. Please don't feel like you have to defend yourself.

 

Friends talk. Talking isn't prodding

 

You do not have to stand by and be a party to her adulterous affair.

 

You have the absolute right to not have someone who is toxic in your life. You have the absolute right to not have that type of drama in your life.

 

It does NOT make you a bad friend.

 

It makes you a smart person to stand firm in your moral beliefs and to surround yourself with those that share those.

 

Like I said, if I found out a friend did a crime, I wouldn't stay around and "support" that person with their lifestyle. I would avoid it and not want to be around. You know the saying "birds of a feather flock together".

[Jilly Bean]

Concerned - I agree with Fooled wholeheartedly.

 

People change, and therefore, so do friendships.

 

We have the choice to support or tolerate changes in our friends, or not.

 

I have supported friends through rehab, for example, but I would not support a friend through an affair.

 

I would be just like you, and call it judging if you want, but I would not want to be a part of it. I would feel like an accessory to a crime, that I wanted nothing to do with.

 

I don't see the problem with being honest, telling her that you love her, that you understand things have been difficult, but that you think she's acting out in a bad way, and that there is only trouble down the road. That you don't want to abandon her, however, your belief system is such that you won't support anyone's EM affair. That you will be there for her should she extricate herself, but until then, it's too painful for you to be a part of it.

[NoIDidn't]

Amazing how many judgements and assessments you pass on me when your own advice TO me is not to pass judgement. Ironic actually...

 

That's always amazing, isn't it? LOL.

 

Seriously, I think somehow this situation triggered WF from her affair. Maybe she lost some friends as a result of having a cavalier attitude about it too. Her postings have really changed over the last few months so it really seems like she was triggered. I have never seen her come after a poster in this way. (((WhiteFlower)))

[MistyK]

Originally Posted by Concerned Friend2

I stand by my decision to let her know I am here if she needs my support. However, I come first and I feel the need to keep a distance, to protect myself from toxic and unhealthy situations. I don't think that makes me a bad friend, I think that makes me a human being with good sense.

 

 

I really think this is the best tack you could take. Boundaries are a good thing and there's no need to feel guilty about setting them with her. Everyone gets defensive when they get called out on bad behavior, especially if she otherwise has been on a moral high horse about these kinds of issues. I suspect she'll come around eventually if she's a true friend.

[subdued]

I've never known her to be so selfish and inconsiderate regarding the impact of her actions.

 

One of our other very close friends who also knows of the affair has been very critical of my choice to keep a distance, calling me a bad and unsupportive friend.

I don’t like the strain and tension that this situation is causing on all of my friendships. Is there a way to maintain these friendships without exposing myself to toxic and unhealthy behavior? The way she's behaving makes me question her character and integrity. I'm interested in this group's thoughts regarding my choice to keep a distance.

 

It sounds like you are seeing your friend in a new light and have less desire to hang around her as a result. That doesn't make you a bad and unsupportive friend. Your other friend has no right to say that you are.

 

I suggest finding new friends.

[Spark1111]

Concerned, my WS had an affair with a divorced colleague. After DDay, it was shocking how many people in the workplace suspected.

 

My daughter had a relationship with a senior boss (they are both single) but it was against workplace policy. Amazing how many people knew despite their attempts to keep it secret.

 

After DDay, two of the trusted handful I confided my situation to, with the caveat to not repeat a word as we live in a small town and I did not want my children hurt, gossipped. It got back to me. Needless to say, we are no longer friends.

 

Trust your instincts. Tell the truth of your opinions. Take the high road. If at the end of all this, you are no longer friends, what kind of friendship did you truly lose?

[GreenEyedLady]

Seriously' date=' I think somehow this situation triggered WF from her affair. Maybe she lost some friends as a result of having a cavalier attitude about it too. Her postings have really changed over the last few months so it really seems like she was triggered. I have never seen her come after a poster in this way. (((WhiteFlower)))[/quote']

 

I really don't see how she "came after a poster."

 

Nothing she said was rude.

[White Flower]

I don't consider asking someone who I have a close relationship with ONE question "prodding." She's been sharing small details over the months about her involvement with this person and the truth is, I was growing suspicious that this guy might have a girlfriend because of some of the things she was sharing. I didn't want to just assert that without asking for more information, I don't consider that "prodding." For example, she and this person live in the same city and she would talk about "hooking up" for elaborate weekends in Vegas and Los Angeles for weekends and such. I asked her why they didn't go out in their own town and that's when she told me that it was because he was married and had a family. If you saw someone you care about potentially on a ledge, would you just sit by and let them jump?

 

And as for this assertion that I'm going to be the one to reveal her secret. I would never do that. However, you can't ingonre the fact that in the workplace, people talk and if someone were to discover their involvement, that could have serious consequences for her. More serious for her than for him since he has a family and even though they are both at fault for the situation, she might be perceived as trying to break up a family. My friend has a high profile role in her company and has worked hard for what she has. The divorce she went through was devastating to her and I would hate to see her compound her pain by risking everything.

 

Amazing how many judgements and assessments you pass on me when your own advice TO me is not to pass judgement. Ironic actually...

Asking for more information, by definition, is prodding. You are a friend, and it may have been pertinent to prod because you care for her. By suggesting you were prodding, I was not accusing you of intentionally prodding in order to use the information against her. Yet, I did want to convey that once she shared her story knowing that her behavior changed she may have felt more vulnerable around you. Have you ever considered that your knowledge of her affair may have caused a change in your behavior? She may have sensed that, causing her behavior to change?

 

I bolded the second statement because I see that you have genuine concern for her. She is lucky to have a friend who is so concerned about her welfare and the future of her job security. I would hope that you can convey to her your deepest sincere concern while at the same time convey that you are not judging her.

 

Thirdly, it was my very concern that you were seeing your friend under a judgmental light. Now it appears you have just proven it. I never said you were judging; I only said she may have perceived that you were and how you should handle it if you still cared about her.

 

Thanks GEL.

[fooled once]

WF - aren't you judging Concerned Friend? Are you saying she is doing exactly what you are doing?

 

How do friends "prod"? Acquaintances prod. Friends who are like sisters don't prod. Asking questions isn't prodding. Was she just to remain silent when her friend dropped the bomb on her that she is screwing a married man and she doesn't care who gets hurt?

[NoIDidn't]

I really don't see how she "came after a poster."

 

Nothing she said was rude.

 

One doesn't have to be rude to "come after" someone else.

 

She accused the OP of things that the OP never said. She assumed that the OP had ill intentions towards her friend.

 

That to me is coming after her.

 

You and she are free to disagree.

[NoIDidn't]

We judge people and situations all the time. I think the OP is well within her rights for judging her friends actions as unacceptable to her and acting in accordance with how she feels about it.

 

Why do the people that always should "don't judge" not see that they are judging when they do that?

 

Everybody judges people. Some judgments you like, some you don't.

[White Flower]

WF - aren't you judging Concerned Friend? Are you saying she is doing exactly what you are doing?

 

How do friends "prod"? Acquaintances prod. Friends who are like sisters don't prod. Asking questions isn't prodding. Was she just to remain silent when her friend dropped the bomb on her that she is screwing a married man and she doesn't care who gets hurt?

LOL, no I am not. Once again, I said her friend may have perceived her prodding (yes, by definition prodding means asking--attach any sentiments you like to the word) as an attack on her morals and may not have perceived her intentions as good. I did not say she attacked her friend nor did I say her intentions were bad. Do you see the difference?

 

The point here is somebody jumped to a conclusion and then several others jumped in to defend her when, in the first place, my OP was misunderstood. Now THAT is what you call judging! Or better yet, jumping the gun.

 

As someone who has been an open book about my own A I have put myself on the line by the possibility of changing how others perceive me. Only once did I feel regrets about telling someone because she was a very judgmental person. I walked on eggshells around her and even though I ended the A I still feel like I can't share everything with her. I did not say CF2 was like this; only that I hoped she wasn't. She asked why her friend's behavior may have changed and I can only relate my experience to her. I believe that is why she questioned those in this forum.

 

I actually think she's a pretty nice gal.

 

Also, I disagree that her friend 'doesn't care who gets hurt'. I believe she believes it will end soon and that she is using the A as a crutch to get through her D and the terrible year she's had. Just a hunch based on my own experience and others who have shared with me.

[White Flower]

Concerned friend --- you do not have to support your friends actions.

 

And I totally disagree with the implication that YOU have done anything wrong.

 

Your friend decided to screw a married man.

 

She then TOLD YOU.

 

She then defends her actions.

 

And people do change WhiteFlower when they are doing something that is against what they normally would believe. The friend can change her personality. It happens all the time with people. We are not the same people at 40 that we were at 20.

 

So it is entirely POSSIBLE that the friend has changed her personality and her views and the original poster SHOULD be wary of her. She should avoid the toxic behavior of her 'friend'.

 

I mean, if you found out a friend was involved in a burgulary or in harming someone, would you still stand by them and support what they did? Heck no.

 

Concerned friend - sounds like your friend is only concerned about herself and not who she hurts; nor her job since when this comes to light, it could be bad for her. Your other friends who say you need to cut her some slack are crazy, IMHO.

 

You have every right to decide to NOT be around someone who is doing something against your beliefs. You have that right because we all have free will and there is NOTHING wrong with cutting negative/toxic/harmful people out of your life.

 

Protect YOURSELF first and foremost because in the end, we are all responsible for our OWN actions and no one else will look out for ourselves except us.

 

I don't even know how you can be around her without discussion of personal lives, so I think it is in your best interest to just let her know that you care about her; but you disagree with her actions and you don't want to be involved in all that drama. Let her know she has a choice to make - to continue to sleep with a married man (which is her right) or to have you involved in her life while she is doing this.

 

You are allowed to be judgmental - we all are even if some don't believe that. But that doesn't mean you are wrong or anything. Just means you choose to NOT be a party to her actions nor support her actions.

 

That is YOUR right and it does not make you a bad person or not a good friend.

 

Honesty and integrity are, IMHO, a huge part of who we are and what we are. Your friend is neither of those things right now (and maybe never was) and it is best to protect yourself from her issues.

 

And tell the rest of your friends to go pound sand.

 

I am sorry your friend has chosen to get involved with someone and thinks it is okay to hurt others the way she is doing.

 

And yes, I would let the wife know what is going on. She has a right to be protected against any STD's that your friend may have.

Sorry fooledonce, I just saw these two posts.

 

No, a person does not change their innate personality. One can change their behavior but not their personality. CF2's judment may temporarily be foggy and we can discuss her moral fiber until the cows come home but her innate personality has not changed. She is still warm, caring, and a great worker. She does not see MM's W right now and while that may hurt you it is the only way she can block her recent change of behavior as the immoral label everyone including herself gives it. Usually the fog lifts and she becomes herself again and realizes she cannot have both innate personality and temporary behavior change colliding without it being terribly disruptive to her life. At this point, she WILL begin to see (and care) who this behavior hurts.

 

 

And I could not disagree with this more.

 

WF - how do you know the friend is still a generous and compassionate person? She is doing something that is NOT generous nor compassionate.

 

Her innate qualities HAVE changed because of HER actions.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I believe her actions have changed albeit temporarily. I was still generous and compassionate with all in my life during my A. Even toward the exMM's W. She'll never know it, but she did benefit from it in the end. I never took more out of his day than if he would have been where he said he was and I 'gave him back' even though I still loved him. I could have told the world, forced him to make a decision, and ruined everybody's life. Quite possibly I'd be living with him now had I done that. But I wasn't like that before, so why would I change my personality because of an A?

[IfWishesWereHorses]

No, a person does not change their innate personality.

 

Not true, addiction can cause major personality changes and very often even when the addiction is kicked those changes remain. Hence the term "sober alcoholic".

[NoIDidn't]

The point here is somebody jumped to a conclusion and then several others jumped in to defend her when, in the first place, my OP was misunderstood. Now THAT is what you call judging! Or better yet, jumping the gun.

 

The point is CF2 is free to judge this situation and the change in her friend's behavior however she wants. She has to do what is best for her, not her friend or whatever is left of their friendship.

 

Everything else IS judgment from ALL of us. Including your OP. You judged her by some event or person from your own life.

 

As someone who has been an open book about my own A I have put myself on the line by the possibility of changing how others perceive me. Only once did I feel regrets about telling someone because she was a very judgmental person. I walked on eggshells around her and even though I ended the A I still feel like I can't share everything with her. I did not say CF2 was like this; only that I hoped she wasn't. She asked why her friend's behavior may have changed and I can only relate my experience to her. I believe that is why she questioned those in this forum.

 

Which is why I said that I think you were triggered. I think your experience with this friend is what made that first post come across so accusatory.

[Owl]

Sorry fooledonce, I just saw these two posts.

 

No, a person does not change their innate personality. One can change their behavior but not their personality. CF2's judment may temporarily be foggy and we can discuss her moral fiber until the cows come home but her innate personality has not changed. She is still warm, caring, and a great worker. She does not see MM's W right now and while that may hurt you it is the only way she can block her recent change of behavior as the immoral label everyone including herself gives it. Usually the fog lifts and she becomes herself again and realizes she cannot have both innate personality and temporary behavior change colliding without it being terribly disruptive to her life. At this point, she WILL begin to see (and care) who this behavior hurts.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree. I believe her actions have changed albeit temporarily. I was still generous and compassionate with all in my life during my A. Even toward the exMM's W. She'll never know it, but she did benefit from it in the end. I never took more out of his day than if he would have been where he said he was and I 'gave him back' even though I still loved him. I could have told the world, forced him to make a decision, and ruined everybody's life. Quite possibly I'd be living with him now had I done that. But I wasn't like that before, so why would I change my personality because of an A?

 

Perhaps her personality was never that "warm, caring, etc..." person...but her actions were those of one? Who's to say WHICH set of actions were the ones that defined her personality?

 

I agree with the other posters in this case...I had a friend who was very close to me...who ended up sleeping with a married woman. He also ended up getting married, and cheating on his wife. We're not friends any longer.

 

I didn't trouble myself as to which set of actions defined his character...the ones that led me to be his friend to begin with, or those that came later. I knew that regardless of that, I would not condone/support his actions. When he made it clear that he was going to continue these actions regardless of my view of them, he made it clear that these actions were more important to him than was my friendship.

 

Or you can look at it the other way...I found those actions to be so outside of what I will accept that I refused to continue the friendship.

 

Regardless of your view...the end result was the same.

 

If he decides at some later point that to stop those actions...we can see where the friendship is at that point and work it from there.

[NoIDidn't]

She does not see MM's W right now and while that may hurt you it is the only way she can block her recent change of behavior as the immoral label everyone including herself gives it. Usually the fog lifts and she becomes herself again and realizes she cannot have both innate personality and temporary behavior change colliding without it being terribly disruptive to her life. At this point, she WILL begin to see (and care) who this behavior hurts.

 

I was still generous and compassionate with all in my life during my A. Even toward the exMM's W. She'll never know it, but she did benefit from it in the end. I never took more out of his day than if he would have been where he said he was and I 'gave him back' even though I still loved him. I could have told the world, forced him to make a decision, and ruined everybody's life.

 

The two above quotes are from the same post. I find it interesting that the first paragraph basically states that the family of the MM is being hurt by the actions already undertaken whether they knew it or not. But the second paragraph somehow states that the family was actually helped by the affair that they didn't know about.

 

A paradox, no?