2drinksbehind Posted June 25, 2009 Posted June 25, 2009 Hello all... I'm new here, so please forgive me if I've posted this in the wrong section. Where to begin? I guess I should apologize in advance for the length of this and thank anyone who takes the time to read and respond to me. So, my apologies and thank you!! I'm nearly 29 years old and will "celebrate" my 6th wedding anniversary this year with my husband. I "quote" celebrate because for several years now we've not been able to do much actual celebration at all, but I digress. I met my husband when I was not quite 21; he was 32 at the time. Yes, a pretty decent age difference, but that's never been a problem or hindrance in our relationship. Due to my childhood, I guess you could say that I was a very emotionally (and psychologically) mature 20 year old. Anyhow, at the time, my husband had been a single father of four boys for the better part of 6 years or so. He and his first wife dated in high school, she got pregnant and they got married type thing. The "gist" of their break-up was that she was a lying cheat and is the type of woman who thinks the world revolves around her and even puts herself before her children. When I met hubby everything happened rather naturally... our relationship progressed pretty quickly but it was nothing forced or contrived on either of our parts. With the boys mother all but completely vanished from their lives they took to me pretty quickly. I moved in from out-of-state (it was only supposed to be temporary until I found a roommate) with hubby (John), the boys and MIL. Yes, John lived with his his mother (she has medical issues) - he moved back in with her after he separated from his ex. One thing lead to the next and we were getting married 2.5 years later. Of course, like any couple, we had a bad days here and there but they were very few and far between. I became a permanent and stable "mother" figure to the boys. I also worked hard with John to get his debt worked down so we could get married and buy a home together. Love the MIL but it's never fun living in another woman's home. Anyhow, we did just that - got married, saved some money, paid off his bills and got financial things cleaned up and bought a home together 5 years ago this month. We both work for the federal government and bring home a pretty decent income (by most standards, I would assume) but we've unfortunately, been dealing with financial issues regarding his ex. Battling her in court trying to get back child support that she is far behind on. Then we also help support his mother still - who did not move with us (her choice). So all that, and with a house full of children, we pretty much live paycheck-to-paycheck. We had another baby (my first and only) boy 2 years ago this past May. I've since had my tubes tied - so there isn't likely to be anymore. So that's the background. The reason I'm writing is because for awhile now I've been feeling like our marriage is headed down a road that has a not-so-happy-ending. More and more, I feel like we're growing apart. We don't talk much about anything anymore. Unless it's bills or the kids - the only real conversation we have is usually casual dinner conversation... usually regarding current events, music or sports as those are typical conversations of choice with the older boys. Nothing wrong with that - just pretty "trivial" and insignificant in the grand scheme of things. We don't fight or argue often - maybe once every one or two months. But when we do argue it seems to always be the same thing.... round and round again. John just shuts down usually and doesn't say anything at all or he'll give the "we'll not matter what I say it's going to be wrong.." or "I'm just a horrible husband so it doesn't matter..." answer. UGH. It drives me berserk!! Trying to get him to talk about his feelings or be open and honest and have a real dialogue with me is like trying to pull teeth. He always seems angry at the world... will comment on no matter how hard he works none of it matters because he has nothing to show for it. I understand where he's coming from because it does often feel like we're digging out of a black hole - but really? We have nothing with a home we can call our own and a great family? We live in a typical middle-America neighborhood, with middle-America type cars. I always try to be more optimistic and be thankful for what we do have - but I find myself getting so annoyed and bitter with his attitude of "what's the use" all of the time. When I gently remind him that he is to blame for a good part of his "have nothingness" because he had four children at such a young age. Granted, we don't get the financial support we should be getting from the boys' mother - but still... that's unfortunate, but it's his reality and he can't (or rather, shouldn't) be bitter at the rest of the world for his entire life. Then there's the sex. We're not very active in that department these days. I take part of the blame for that because I have little motivation when I'm so exhausted. Since my son was three months old (he's now almost 26 months old) I've been getting up at 4:30 every morning to get ready for work and get him to daycare so I can be to work by 7am. My commute time is about 1 hour, 45 minutes each way to and from work. On a VERY good day I can get home in 1.5 hours but it's rare and more often it leans towards 2 hours. I don't get home until about 6:15/6:30ish. Some days it's not too bad because I guess I've just gotten numb to it. Other days it's all I can to not cry all the way to work. To make things worse I have a ruptured disc (and two additional degenerating discs) in my lower lumbar spine that causes me great pain because it's pressing against my sciatic nerve. For anyone who knows about sciatica, sitting is the worst possible position for the pain and discomfort. Anyhow, most days I just grit my teeth and bear it - I have a pretty high tolerance for pain. You do what you have to do, right! I don't think my husband truly understands the physical pain that I'm in with this because he often brushes it off (at least, that's how it seems) - yet the minute he has a headache or is sore - he's hemming and hawing like he's nearly dying. Anyhow - back to the topic of sex. I'm just tired often... and in the beginning after I had baby, that's pretty much the only excuse I had. But as time goes on I'm just not all that interested. Not sure if that's because of the environment or because I feel a little less than desirable these days - probably a combination of both, I assume. For a long time, hubby used to push the whole "swinging" thing... more specifically, he wants me to be with other men. He seems to think I should like it and wants me to feel like I can just be wild and crazy. I just don't think I'm *that* girl. Part of it, I'm sure has to do with my childhood with being sexually abused... and part of it is just that I've never been one to just have sex. Meaning, there has to be some sort of connection there for me. But, I try to be open to trying things because I know it makes him happy and feel good. I've told him before that if it weren't for him, I'd never do some of the things we've done... meaning, I wouldn't go out there and seek those things on my own for my own pleasure or excitement. So I think that's part of my "issue" with sex also. I feel like I can't deliver what he wants. He's told me several times - you should try to hook up with so-and-so (three different male friends or co-workers) - which is just weird and skeevy to me... one of these guys is like my brother. He says he'd let me do anything I wanted as long as I told him but then turns around and will, in a round about way, accuse me of sneaking around and cheating on him with one of these guys - which, I swear on my son's life is not the truth at all. But I just don't understand how you can go from one day saying I should proposition the guy to sleep with me and then the next get all crazy weird insinuating that I've lied or cheated with said guy. He'll make me feel bad for going to see my family up in New England once (maybe twice a year). Makes out like it's a vacation... and while I enjoy seeing my family it's never a vacation away like I'm lying on the beach somewhere sipping margaritas. I've asked him to come and he never seems interested. But then we help his mother out, financially, every single month by paying her home equity loan. We see his dysfunctional family all year round and do things with/for them and he doesn't even participate half the time cause he doesn't like them anymore than I do. I want my son to know my family and he always makes me feel like a criminal for spending the money and taking the time to go visit them - which is an average of once a year. But then he goes and gets $500 in tattoo work done (he did ask me first) and I don't make him feel grief over it because the money could've been better spent wherever. We both work hard and deserve things which we usually forgo to pay bills and support five boys. For the last several years we've not celebrated our anniversary or birthday's because money is just so tight. We almost never have dates - which is only complicated by the fact that we don't really have any reliable people that we trust to watch the baby even just to get out for a few hours by ourselves. Until recently, I had literally no friends in the state we reside in. I mean, I have co-workers that I chat with, but no real friends. So, I decided that I was going to join a mothers group (mostly and online group) with intentions of making some connections and finding a couple of girl-friends I could chat with now and again. And now he'll make comments like... "well you've got your friends you can talk to... I don't have anyone to talk to but you..." It breaks my heart that he doesn't take the initiative and makes me angry that he's not supportive and gets resentful. I've suggested that he could take some initiative and find some friends and his exact words were "all my old friend forgot about me when I had the kids" and "friends are overrated". So sad. I have no clue how to get through to him. And I'm starting to feel smothered. I don't want to be the 40 year old woman married to a man she doesn't even like "just for the kids" and be miserable for the rest of my life because my husband is always miserable. I think he has some deep rooted and unresolved issues with his ex. It's just so frustrating... someone, anyone with insight - please help!! I should add - that I do love my husband to no end. He's a great father and a good man, at heart. He works hard and has been given more than his share of band hands. I'm certainly not perfect - I have high expectations of everyone, even more so of myself. But I can say with complete honesty that I really do try have given him (and the boys) so much of me and never asked for anything in return... but their love and acceptance. It's been hard many times (dealing with his ex, especially) but worth it... Only within the last couple of years have I started to doubt and question if it is worth it.
giotto Posted June 25, 2009 Posted June 25, 2009 sounds to me you should go to MC (marital counseling) before it's too late...
2sure Posted June 25, 2009 Posted June 25, 2009 I sounds like its "All about him" That doesn't make him a bad person, a bad husband , or a bad father. It doesn't even have to mean he is selfish. But read your post. Sure, you are questioning, complaining, and asking for advice....but yet , it isn't about you. Its all about him. Like, you and he getting HIS debt in order. You and he taking care of HIS mother. You and he parenting HIS 4 kids. HE wants you to bang other guys so much, he likes accusing you of it. You see HIS family regularly, he doesn't. You see your family yearly and HE complains that you do and also feels no obligation to see them. Normally, I would say he may be a good guy with skewed perception. My own H can be that way. He just doesn't see himself sometimes. But in this case, and I know you love him...your perception is also skewed. First, take notice here of all this sacrifice for HIM. Sacrifice is part of love and part of marriage of course. But this is a LOT. All about him.
Author 2drinksbehind Posted June 25, 2009 Author Posted June 25, 2009 sounds to me you should go to MC (marital counseling) before it's too late... I've suggested counseling... he hasn't outright objected to it but doesn't seem too fond of the idea. I think he has that stereotypical idea about "shrinks" being for "crazy" people. Then his other excuse is when will we have the time? It's true - we don't have a lot of time and any time he takes off = no overtime, which can hurt. But as I've told him before - our marriage is more important than the money and I'm certain that I could temporarily switch my AWS day (I get every other Friday off) to his regularly scheduled Tuesday off and then we don't even have to worry about using up leave - which isn't such an issue for him, he's got loads of it but I used quite a bit up when I was out on maternity leave and it's hard building that back up when I'm pretty much always the one doing doctors appointments and such with the kids. Earlier he did send me a text to apologize. I know he's sincere and then sent me another one shortly after and said he loves me very, much. I didn't respond right away because I was sleeping in my car (after a rough night and being up since 1:15 am - sleep was more important than lunch). When I did respond he responded back saying that he was afraid that I didn't want to reply. I sounds like its "All about him" That doesn't make him a bad person, a bad husband , or a bad father. It doesn't even have to mean he is selfish. But read your post. Sure, you are questioning, complaining, and asking for advice....but yet , it isn't about you. Its all about him. Like, you and he getting HIS debt in order. You and he taking care of HIS mother. You and he parenting HIS 4 kids. HE wants you to bang other guys so much, he likes accusing you of it. You see HIS family regularly, he doesn't. You see your family yearly and HE complains that you do and also feels no obligation to see them. Normally, I would say he may be a good guy with skewed perception. My own H can be that way. He just doesn't see himself sometimes. But in this case, and I know you love him...your perception is also skewed. First, take notice here of all this sacrifice for HIM. Sacrifice is part of love and part of marriage of course. But this is a LOT. All about him. His perception is skewed, a bit I think. Perhaps mine is a bit also too... but I knew about his kids (obviously), his mother and his debt and accepted them all willingly. Some would argue bad choice on my part, but I did, and do love him (as I also love the boys) so a little bit of debt wasn't going to make me write him off. He is a good father - just a little bitter sometimes regarding his ex. Completely understandable, but I've tried to tell him before you can't let that consume you - it's not healthy. He does stuff around the house... cooks every day now that I have my long commute. He also does 90% of the laundry. Not saying that makes him super-man at all - but I have plenty of friends with husbands who don't lift a finger. But at the same regard, in our most recent argument her brings that up like he wants a medal for it or something. I had to remind him that I did ALL of that (with a bit of his help here and there) for the first three years we lived in the house and I never once asked for special recognition because of it and I certainly never threw it in his face - because, at the time HE was the one with the very long hours and long commute. Now he's much closer to home and doesn't work nearly the amount of hours he used to. He acts like it's a bigger deal when he does all the same crap I had been doing for years. I told him, we're supposed to be a team... no "well, I do this... and that". I know that he probably just gets frustrated and gets sick of the monotony of it all (I do also) but he needs to not lash out at me because it's certainly not my fault. As you've pointed out - I've got a laundry list of things I can say that *I* do that he doesn't... not to mention that I take care of the baby 90% of the time he's home too. I find myself getting resentful because I'm the communicator of the two of us. I feel like more often than not I'm the one who really has to work at those things and I really do almost have to pull things out of him. It's just so exhausting sometimes...
Author 2drinksbehind Posted June 25, 2009 Author Posted June 25, 2009 And you're right... it is A LOT! Sometimes I wonder if I would do it again if I had the foresight to really *know* all of the baggage. The ex did a lot of damage and she alone would be reason enough to make me think twice again. The poor boys... it kills me because I'll never be "mommy" to them no matter how much I do for them. Yet their mother who pretty much abandoned them and continues to abuse them mentally, she will always have that title. They've grown up to really dislike a good part of her... they love her, of course - but don't like her on many levels. They're not even my kids and I think about how much their lives would be turned upside down if I left. I'd worry about them... John couldn't keep the house on his income alone. I will NOT spend my life living in a miserable state... I spent the first 18 years of my life being used and abused and I can't, I won't do it. I just want my husband to be happy - so we can be happy but I don't think I can "give" that to him. Think I'm going to write him a nice long letter...
quankanne Posted June 25, 2009 Posted June 25, 2009 I think you can ... understand that with the big family and demanding jobs (meaning you put in a full work week on top of home/family responsibilities), you're gonna get tossed into a pressure-cooker situation a bit more quickly than average ... which hits about year seven of marriage. So you're not experiencing anything out of the ordinary when you consider it this way. your biggest problem? You've lost the ability to communicate effectively. He is skittish about counselling (man thing! man thing!) but happily, there are other options that will give you the same tools you need to learn to communicate well again. For me and DH, it was a Marriage Encounter weekend offered by our church; for some others, its programs like Marriage Builders; I've seen something sponsored by one of the local counties called "we vow now" that is very similar to the two I mentioned earlier. There are a lot of different options, it's just a matter of finding one that appeals to y'all and can be worked into a schedule. between kids and work, you've not really had the ability to hone yourselves as a couple – as working parents trying to stay three steps ahead of life, yes, but it sounds like there's never really a good time for just YOU & HIM, right? I guarantee that if you invest a weekend or a month or whatever a particular program proposes, you're going to start seeing a difference in your marriage. for us, it meant that my husband understand where I came from and why I view marriage the way I do, that I wasn't going to shxtcan him like the first two wives did when something "better" came along; for me, I learned to be more patient and understanding of where HE was coming from. And those things we learned on our retreat have been priceless. I believe there's hope for your marriage, you just need to focus on the two of you so that the other stuff can fall into place more easily. If your husband continues to balk at the idea of counseling or outside help, please tell him that I said it's not about pointing fingers or blaming each other, but about getting the tools you need to communicate better. And that he may feel that it's the best thing y'all have done for your marriage once he goes through hte program ... best of luck to you, and don't give up, kiddo!
Author 2drinksbehind Posted June 25, 2009 Author Posted June 25, 2009 quankanne - Thanks for the words of encouragement and support. That's part of our problem too, I think. Neither of us have much support around us. We don't really deal with the majority of his family (brother, sister-in-law and mother aside)... I'm talking, there really are some Jerry Springer type stories going on here. No thanks! My family... well, that's very complicated. I was adopted but then later removed from the care of my adoptive mother as a result of abuse and neglect. I've since met and "built" somewhat of a "relationship" with my biological mother but she's no support either - off in her own little world and still has yet to meet her grandson (and he turned 2 this past May). Since I was removed from my adoptive family - there's a lot of holes in those relationships too. There was a lot of hurt for a very long time, but I worked to forgive and come to terms with my life and I wanted my son to know his aunts and uncles so I've been working on rebuilding those relationships that I was removed from for many years. The point is, it's kind of just us floating along together. We don't get time together alone - ever! Luckily I am starting to build upon a couple of friendships locally, so there might be home for a date night sometime in the near future.
giotto Posted June 26, 2009 Posted June 26, 2009 yes, we got "lost" in our family duties (4 kids) and full time jobs... we failed to look after our relationship, we didn't talk, we got resentful. We went to MC, but it was too late. I still believe you should find the time to go now, before things get irreparable. I've been there. Don't let it slip through your fingers, act now.
1Angel Posted June 26, 2009 Posted June 26, 2009 I wonder if you could find marriage counseling on a weekend or do a telephone conference by speakerphone? Just throwing out ideas. I know you mentioned he doesn't want to but ask him to maybe compromise: try it for x amount of sessions and if still doesn't like it stop going. He may find it helpful and keep going. You've dealt with a lot from this story it's very commendable you are a stable person in the lives of your stepsons. Give yourself time to heal from the physical problems, and also for your hormones to adjust to having had a baby. Take care of you is important before you give to others.
2sure Posted June 26, 2009 Posted June 26, 2009 I dont have anything more to offer really - although I get the sense that more than anything you are trying to identify the problem and then take a step. Maybe I can offer some perspective on that. During the low times, and during crisis in a marriage, and even sometimes when the "I love you but am not IN love with you" times - what keeps us together are the responsibilities, the obligations, and the loyalties. And its a good thing too, because those things motivate a couple to stick around, wait it out, or do something different until things are back on track. Between jobs, kids, mortgages, etc - these periods can last years so you have to find a way to keep it from slipping further. It seems like your marriage of 6 years is just about on track for the time frame of these feelings. But realizing that the responsibilities, obligations, and loyalties are a good thing to work for - doesnt erase the fact that during a low time - those are the exact things we come to resent. "I'm stuck, I'm not living my life, etc" Like I said, I have nothing to offer except maybe some perspective.
quankanne Posted June 26, 2009 Posted June 26, 2009 2, look to your "family" comprised of close friends and even people you meet through your job as sources of encouragement. You'll be surprised just how big that family is! because you are aware of the issues that are affecting the quality of your relationship, you're more than halfway there, kiddo – I have every bit of faith that you two are going to figure out a good, mutually satisfying gameplan to improve the relationship, just don't give up from frustration ...
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