MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 My boyfriend told me that he feels immasculated if he can't be "in control" in the relationship and as the man that is his job to be "in control". What does this mean? To me it means that he wants to control me, but he said it doesn't, but was unable to claify what he was talking about. I've been with him for four years, but now the way he talks sounds so 1950s, and I've never let a man tell me what to do. I'm a very independent person, and I've made it clear that if he is thinking about trying to control me I will bounce. Then he gives me the "I guess you don't care about this relationship" crap. I do care about him and love him very much, but I don't believe in men controlling men. He tells me his need to be "in control" isn't the same as wanting to be controlling but I don't see how it can be differnet. My best friend just got divorced from a man who started out fine and then had to be "in control" and then became controlling and abusive, and she left. He knows this, and he knows I'm very strong willed in this aspect. What do you think? What should I do?
anne1707 Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 I would be worried if my H said this to me. Is he showing any changes in behaviour or suggesting that you don't do things that you have done in the past?. Is there anything else that makes you question his feelings?
Ronni_W Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 My boyfriend told me that he feels immasculated if he can't be "in control" ... Then he gives me the "I guess you don't care about this relationship" crap. Guilting is quintessential manipulative/controlling behaviour. I strongly suspect that he knows exactly what he means, but is afraid that you WILL bounce when he spells it out for you. Unfortunately, I also suspect that you have a good idea what he means, but are afraid to find out for sure because it means that you will have to bounce once it is spelled out for you. I get that 4 years is a fairly hefty investment. How is anybody going to suggest, recommend or encourage you to walk away from that? All I can offer is to trust your intuition, trust it and listen to it and do what your own intuition tells you will be for your long-term highest good. Hugs and good luck.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Posted June 21, 2009 I would be worried if my H said this to me. Is he showing any changes in behaviour or suggesting that you don't do things that you have done in the past?. Is there anything else that makes you question his feelings? He has become very condescending on me. Everything I do is wrong lately. Which of course he would deny if he was here. When we argue he will say the littliest things that hurt me and have nothing to do with anything: For example: Me: Why won't you talk to me? Him: I hope you know that you can't drive worth a sh*t. He's not like this all the time, but this is his worst. He's always been the kind of person who can not admit when he has made a mistake which bothers me. He tells me the only reason I have a problem with him being "in control" is because I want to control him. I don't consider myself a controlling person, and infact I'm very laid back. He's never been this bad before. He tells me things like calling him or asking him where he's going is controlling when I think of it as just a question or a way to make conversation. In all the time we've been together...he's never been this bad. Today was father's day and all I asked him was if we were doing anything with his dad and he said no he didn't want me to come see his family today, and wouldn't say why or what was wrong. We are supposed to be going to the beach with his family this Thur-Sun and I'm beginning to get worried with his attitude what kind of stuff he could start at the beach in front of his family.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Posted June 21, 2009 Guilting is quintessential manipulative/controlling behaviour. I strongly suspect that he knows exactly what he means, but is afraid that you WILL bounce when he spells it out for you. Unfortunately, I also suspect that you have a good idea what he means, but are afraid to find out for sure because it means that you will have to bounce once it is spelled out for you. I get that 4 years is a fairly hefty investment. How is anybody going to suggest, recommend or encourage you to walk away from that? All I can offer is to trust your intuition, trust it and listen to it and do what your own intuition tells you will be for your long-term highest good. Hugs and good luck. Like I told him. I believe that "in control" means controlling and I'm not up for that. I love the boy to death but that is a complete deal breaker nomatter what. But he keeps insisting it's not the same thing and I don't know how because when I ask him what he means he says he doesn't have an example and he'll have to think about it. What is there to think about?
carhill Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 Think of it as a fear. He fears being 'out of control'. When a man gives himself emotionally to a woman, it's a quantum shift of his focus from inward to beyond. He wants to give himself but still feel 'in control'. It's akin to the discharge of semen; the taking of his strength and power. Controlling behaviors surely can trend to the abusive; that said, each partner should play to and respect the other's strengths and accept that leadership quality. In some areas, that's the woman, in others, the man. It's a fluid dynamic. If one person strives to lead all the time, oblivious to the other's strengths, then interdependence and the glue of the relationship is weakened. If your man can share his emotions with you, ask him what his biggest fear is, moving forward with you. Listen and validate. You might learn a lot.
anne1707 Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 I think you know what I and others are going to say. I'm sorry but you need to decide where the line has to be drawn between what is and is not acceptable (to me his behaviour would not be acceptable). If you want to try and make it work then you are going to have to confront him and make it clear that he needs to change. If he is not prepared to do that then really I see no chance for you two working. A relationship is an equal partnership and not about one being on the control (whichever partner).
Ronni_W Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 What is there to think about? Nothing, MC. You're right that there is nothing for him to think about. There's a LOT for you to think about, though. It sucks...the situation, and the choices that you are facing, and the way he has started to treat you. It all sucks.
carhill Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 Now that I see more information added, I will opine he is emotionally immature. Tread carefully
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Posted June 21, 2009 Nothing, MC. You're right that there is nothing for him to think about. There's a LOT for you to think about, though. It sucks...the situation, and the choices that you are facing, and the way he has started to treat you. It all sucks. Yes, it does suck very much. He never wants to talk about anything he believes that ignoring it will make it go away. I'm so different. Not long ago we were talking about getting engaged, but now between him and the personal things in my life going on with my family I don't know what I think about this idea anymore.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Posted June 21, 2009 Now that I see more information added, I will opine he is emotionally immature. Tread carefully I am very much more emotionally mature than he. Mostly because I have been in previous relationships and he has not.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Posted June 21, 2009 I think you know what I and others are going to say. I'm sorry but you need to decide where the line has to be drawn between what is and is not acceptable (to me his behaviour would not be acceptable). If you want to try and make it work then you are going to have to confront him and make it clear that he needs to change. If he is not prepared to do that then really I see no chance for you two working. A relationship is an equal partnership and not about one being on the control (whichever partner). I agree. I do find this unacceptable, and I'm also very dumbfounded by this behavior. I have never been treated this way by ANYONE. He said we would talk later after he got back from dinner...I don't even know what I want to say to him. I've pretty much said everything. I told him that I wouldn't accept this nor allow any man to believe they can control me...I'm dumbfounded at why he thinks that if he can't be "in control" I don't care about us. He's never acted like a man who was controlling before. I guess I want to see what he has to say about this before I make a decision. I have made it clear to him that I am serious. I've been stepped on in the past and I'm not going there again.
Ronni_W Posted June 21, 2009 Posted June 21, 2009 When a man gives himself emotionally to a woman, it's a quantum shift of his focus from inward to beyond. He wants to give himself but still feel 'in control'. It's akin to the discharge of semen; the taking of his strength and power. Except for the stuff about semen, it is EXACTLY the same for a woman. We do appreciate being able to self-determine and choose for ourselves, too; and we must also go beyond our Self if we want to include our partner. Unless it is rape, discharging semen is a GIVING of semen. And I'm pretty sure my beloved does not think all his "strength and power" is in his semen!
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 22, 2009 Author Posted June 22, 2009 Except for the stuff about semen, it is EXACTLY the same for a woman. We do appreciate being able to self-determine and choose for ourselves, too; and we must also go beyond our Self if we want to include our partner. Unless it is rape, discharging semen is a GIVING of semen. And I'm pretty sure my beloved does not think all his "strength and power" is in his semen! I understand this. I also understood Carhill's description however until today my bf and I were talking about "the future". We have never slept together because he wants to wait until he can provide an engagement ring and a new title. I stopped talking about "the future" because my brother is getting a divorce right now from a cheating whore. It really put a down on my views of marriage, not to mention I have divorced parents. Anyways, I digress, could this control have anything to do with the fact that we aren't really...moving anywhere. I just finished ready Steve Harvey's book "Act like a lady, think like a man" I don't know if anyone has read it. He too says that men have a need to feel like they are the "head of the household" so to speak. But I just don't know how I feel about this. He hasn't been like this until recently. That's what throws me.
Trialbyfire Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 I'd be watching this change, closely. If he shows any signs of being unable to give or compromise, you've got a problem!
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 22, 2009 Author Posted June 22, 2009 I'd be watching this change, closely. If he shows any signs of being unable to give or compromise, you've got a problem! Lately (within the past few months) he's been very apt to working on our relationship, talking about the future and doing whatever possible to make things amazing. He was not like this in the past. He used to be very "I'm right and you're wrong", but now when I disagree with him for example on this controlling thing I don't understand he says, "Clearly you don't care about us." I don't get it!
carhill Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 Except for the stuff about semen, it is EXACTLY the same for a woman. Of course, but we're talking about a man here. A completely different genetic being, physically, emotionally and mentally, and socialized completely differently. I understand how different women are from myself, which is generally why IRL I relate to them so well. I'm trying to give the OP a man's perspective on how he feels, something the OP's man may never do. I'm not in any way advocating his feelings or promoting his perspective. He was not like this in the past. He used to be very "I'm right and you're wrong", but now when I disagree with him for example on this controlling thing I don't understand he says, "Clearly you don't care about us." I don't get it! OP, both are signs of immaturity, IMO, or he's genuinely afraid of intimacy and interdependence and is progressing towards an exit. I've been pushed away this way by women. You'll note how he clearly sees the dynamic as your responsibility and he accepts none (or little). Very familiar territory. No effort by you will be enough, I fear, nor will communicating help because he runs away. Let him
Trialbyfire Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 Lately (within the past few months) he's been very apt to working on our relationship, talking about the future and doing whatever possible to make things amazing. He was not like this in the past. He used to be very "I'm right and you're wrong", but now when I disagree with him for example on this controlling thing I don't understand he says, "Clearly you don't care about us." I don't get it!The bolded words are Clearly Manipulation! So, he's learned to manipulate instead of being more blunt. I'm not seeing someone who wants to work on your relationship.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 22, 2009 Author Posted June 22, 2009 The bolded words are Clearly Manipulation! So, he's learned to manipulate instead of being more blunt. I'm not seeing someone who wants to work on your relationship. Me either. He gets all his relationship advice from a girl who can't stay in a relationship. Sounds like a good source don't it? LOL
Trialbyfire Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 Me either. He gets all his relationship advice from a girl who can't stay in a relationship. Sounds like a good source don't it? LOLWho's this girl? I always question consistent advice from opposite gender friends. Don't get me wrong because I strongly believe that men and women can be friends but when it comes to continuous advice, of which most of it is negative from opposite gender friends, you have to question their agenda.
collegekid491 Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 Wow... who knew a few simple words could cause such a up roar :s. It seems like most people here are assuming that when he says in control that he means control of SO. From reading this I would assume he means its a frustration of repeatedly being emasculated several times or just simply not being acknowledged as having a valid opinion. Maybe he feels like he is being controlled and wants some freedom but simply used the wrong phrasing. I mean, everyone here keeps painting an extreme picture, but the fact of the matter he is asking for 'control' shows he isn't very controlling. I mean he's asking her permission, its oxymoronic, if anything its showing music is the... supreme overlord lol. Not to say its anyones fault, but has there been anything as of late (or things) that hes wanted to do that you discouraged him from doing? And despite what's been said, I don't see it as immaturity. Everyone wants to be appreciated, I'm assuming thats what much of the uproar is for. I could be completely wrong, but I think he used a bad phrasing or mean't it in a more... sarcastic way.
Author MusicChick24 Posted June 22, 2009 Author Posted June 22, 2009 Wow... who knew a few simple words could cause such a up roar :s. It seems like most people here are assuming that when he says in control that he means control of SO. From reading this I would assume he means its a frustration of repeatedly being emasculated several times or just simply not being acknowledged as having a valid opinion. Maybe he feels like he is being controlled and wants some freedom but simply used the wrong phrasing. I mean, everyone here keeps painting an extreme picture, but the fact of the matter he is asking for 'control' shows he isn't very controlling. I mean he's asking her permission, its oxymoronic, if anything its showing music is the... supreme overlord lol. Not to say its anyones fault, but has there been anything as of late (or things) that hes wanted to do that you discouraged him from doing? And despite what's been said, I don't see it as immaturity. Everyone wants to be appreciated, I'm assuming thats what much of the uproar is for. I could be completely wrong, but I think he used a bad phrasing and mean't it in a more... sarcastic way. This is a man that I do EVERYTHING for. I mean he has a job and his own money/car etc but I treat him like a King. So he has an opinion. He tells me I'm controlling to upset me, because if you knew me in person you would see that I'm the most laid back person in the world. He tells me his friends talk about me behind my back to bother me, and says that his mom says I'm controlling...but he's a mommas boy. I have asked him that if I'm controlling I would like him to give me an example of what he considers controlling but he has not once example. Personally if he doesn't have an example he has nothing.
collegekid491 Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 This is a man that I do EVERYTHING for. I mean he has a job and his own money/car etc but I treat him like a King. So he has an opinion. He tells me I'm controlling to upset me, because if you knew me in person you would see that I'm the most laid back person in the world. He tells me his friends talk about me behind my back to bother me, and says that his mom says I'm controlling...but he's a mommas boy. I have asked him that if I'm controlling I would like him to give me an example of what he considers controlling but he has not once example. Personally if he doesn't have an example he has nothing. fair enough, I can be wrong, is it to late to trade my rant in for immaturity vote then? lol
Kamille Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 I've been doing a lot of soul-searching on this topic, more specifically today. Control was an issue in my last two relationships and both my exes said a lot of the choice pieces that your bf is saying: "you don't care about us" and "you're the one who has an issue with control". And the senseless criticism over ridiculous details (driving being one of them too of course). I congratulate you for realizing it is a problem and for adressing it. I wish I had words of advice on how to work on it while maintaining the relationship but I don't. Control issues caused so much strife in my past relationships. We fought a lot and I realize now that it made every issue a tug of war. It eroded any trust I had believing my exes wanted what was best for me in the relationship, and so I did end up having to constantly stand my ground. It was exhausting. You seem to realize that not all relationships are like this. I admit I probably ended up into two similar relationships because I hadn't dealt with the abusive side of the first one. And so, the second guy seemed like an angel compared to the first one. All that being said, I do believe men like to feel like you trust them - just like you want to feel that your partner trusts you. Deep down, you both want to feel that you're taken into account in the relationship. So I think that fundamentally, control issues are trust issues. Here's a stupid example: I have a very good sense of orientation. So I have a tendency, when travelling with my (ex) or current bfs, to lead the way. Come to realize, they react way better if I consult them, or even follow them - even when I feel it's a detour. I had to learn to let things go and that getting lost isn't the end of the world. Trust is also about letting the other lead even when you don't agree it's the best way to proceed. That goes both ways and for both partners.
Kamille Posted June 22, 2009 Posted June 22, 2009 This is a man that I do EVERYTHING for. I mean he has a job and his own money/car etc but I treat him like a King. So he has an opinion. He tells me I'm controlling to upset me, because if you knew me in person you would see that I'm the most laid back person in the world. He tells me his friends talk about me behind my back to bother me, and says that his mom says I'm controlling...but he's a mommas boy. I have asked him that if I'm controlling I would like him to give me an example of what he considers controlling but he has not once example. Personally if he doesn't have an example he has nothing. Was posting while the thread evolved to this. I vote immaturity also. You say this has only been going on for four months?
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