LisaUk Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Hi all, having been reading all the threads on here for a couple of days I would like to ask the following question. Why do the dumpers give up so quickly on working things out with the dumpees before breaking up? It seems that the dumpers have no commitment to making a relationship work with someone who clearly is willing to try. Yet, the dumpees on here are in pieces, yet some must have been dumpers themselves at some point, so logically dumpers must have been dumpees at some point. If you follow me? Why do they just bail? It seems crazy to me! If finding a relationship is so difficult why would someone choose to just walk away without trying? I'm not talking about the cases where the two people have really had terrible problems and have tried to work it through first, I mean all the cases on here where the dumpee hasn't even known anything was wrong and has just been left, with no opportunity to resolve anything. I know there probably isn't an answer, was more of a philosopical wondering really. Have people in general just come to regard other people as disposable and replacable?
Exit Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Funny that you say that about dumpers must have been dumpees at some point, not in the case of my ex gf! She has had three major BFs in her life including me, and never been the one to get dumped. I told her she can't help but lack perspective on what it's like to be in this position. Maybe one day she will experience it. I think you tend to get "spoiled" over time if you are always the one breaking hearts and never getting your heart broken. Her own mother said to me "I think she needs to have her heart broken" because even her mom feels so bad for the guys she leaves behind. Why do they give up? I don't know. Lack of commitment. Lack of caring. My GF claims I already had multiple chances, that I already offered to make some of these changes, but I don't think we ever addressed most of the problems before. And even so, in the previous times, she would leave for 3 days and come back. This time I willingly sat here for 2 months examining myself and the relationship, thinking that if I showed faith to wait that long it would mean something. My real question is why do they find more value in starting over with someone new, rather than someone who is willing to try harder? Sure maybe she can find someone who can do everything right from day 1 effortlessly, but what about the person who stuck around for a year and a half and was STILL willing to make adjustments and try to make things the best they could be. For instance I have a bit of social anxiety, maybe she can find someone who is perfectly happy going out to dinner and a movie twice a week, but if it's effortless for that person whereas for me I would really have to struggle and force my mind to calm down in order to be out in public... why is there more value in the other person? I on the other hand have NEVER dumped someone. Maybe it's a flaw. Maybe I stay with people just because I find it better than being alone. Or maybe I just really have more faith in people. I have never ever left someone behind in tears while I carry on with my life. I have always been the one getting dumped. She is crazy... she goes from all relationship-long accusing me that I have 10 other girlfriends, to now accusing me that I only want this so badly because I'm scared to be alone. Why would I be scared of being alone if I had all these girls waiting to be with me...
skreen23 Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 To be honest, if somebody found out the reason they would make a fortune. But sometimes, i reckon, people just drift apart. I remember friendships which at the time seemed very important but they eventually fizzled out. I think its the same with love. Both people in the relationship must be willing to work on it and compromise and change. Unfortunately not all people realise or are capable of that. My other theory is that everyone is crazy except me.
guitarplayer1234 Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 The day my ex broke up with me he didn't plan on doing it that day but he could see how I was getting closer to him and he was afraid of leading me on more incase he didn't get his issues worked out. I wish he tried more and didn't give up but I know he does have commitment issues so maybe that was also a factor..
Ronni_W Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Why do the dumpers give up so quickly on working things out with the dumpees Sometimes it is that dumpers do not have the self-awareness and/or the skills to "work things out" -- assuming that they do is a mental error, really. Sometimes dumpers don't know how to express their dislikes, upset, frustration, etc., so they lack any means of trying to compromise on, negotiate for, resolve what isn't working for them in the relationship. It could be due to fear of conflict, fear of rejection (afraid that if they express "negative" stuff, their partner will leave them), even fear of facing their own negative feelings. When that is the case, it can feel "easier/safer" to just leave than to have to look at their own fears, shortcomings, lack of skills, etc. It doesn't mean that leaving their partner doesn't come with a whole lot of pain and suffering. It just means that they were MORE AFRAID of looking at their own crap (and facing the pain that it might bring up) than facing the pain of leaving the relationship.
Exit Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 It just means that they were MORE AFRAID of looking at their own crap (and facing the pain that it might bring up) than facing the pain of leaving the relationship. Pretty powerful statement. I don't think I fall 100% in that category, but maybe part of me does want her back so bad because I would rather have that comfort back in my life instead of having the face the huge uphill battle that's looming in front of me in all other aspects of my life. I have to accept that to win her back now would throw me off track from so many other things. I need to get back on track and conquer some of my other fears instead of craving the person who made me forget all my troubles. It's scary, I feel like she knows me too well. She most know a lot of this stuff before I even realize it. She knows exactly why she can't come back. She's knows I am trying to hide from other issues by trying to recapture what we had. Crap... =\
guitarplayer1234 Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Sometimes dumpers don't know how to express their dislikes, upset, frustration, etc., so they lack any means of trying to compromise on, negotiate for, resolve what isn't working for them in the relationship. It could be due to fear of conflict, fear of rejection (afraid that if they express "negative" stuff, their partner will leave them), even fear of facing their own negative feelings. There's definitely alot of truth in this. I remember my ex was telling me he had a hard time talking to me this one time about certain issues because he was afraid of what he might say and he didn't know how I would react to it. I guess he was afraid of me seeing something negative.
Author LisaUk Posted June 17, 2009 Author Posted June 17, 2009 Thanks for the replies. Ronni W I think you have hit the nail on the head! What you are talking about is involved in commitment phobia and it is resonates with me as I think my ex may suffer with it! (check out my thread below if you want more info). Exit, Ronni W said the dumpers not the dumpees! Also, will reply to you on your thread. Cheers Lisa.
boogieboy Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Theres no commitment phobia... theres no issues dumpees have to work out. All the stories Ive read on this board are ones that the dumpers told the dumpees. Theyre always lame excuses but they are never the real and only reason. The dumpers lost interest. Simple as that. They started losing interest at some time, and started looking elsewhere, and found someone. Theres no pain, theres no real long lasting guilt. Once you lose interest in someone, you generally dont get it back...mostly because the dumpees hound you about it and drive you further away. The dumpers want to move on and forward, most of the time moving forward with someone new and exciting. Reading all the stories on here, you'd think it would be more complicated, but all the stories have made it easier to narrow it down to the same basic thing.
adamt Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Hi all, having been reading all the threads on here for a couple of days I would like to ask the following question. Why do the dumpers give up so quickly on working things out with the dumpees before breaking up? It seems that the dumpers have no commitment to making a relationship work with someone who clearly is willing to try. i'm guessing that the dumper has been thinking for a while that they are having doubts and thinking of splitting up, but manage to keep it to themselves upto a certain point while they analyse the relationship. then by the time they want to break up they are emotionally detached and ready to move on. then they find it hard to announce they want to break up.vmeanwhile the dumpee is 2 months behind and starts at the bottom when the split up happens. How many times do you see the dumper break up and already have their new life in place.just getting their exit ready so they are not left lonely. eg got back intouch with old friends. My ex bottled things up and by the time it came out she was moving on.
Ronni_W Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Lisa, On a deeper level, "commitment phobia" stems from the double-whammy combo of fear of abandonment and fear of engulfment, and lack of self-awareness and emotional intelligence add to the issues that are brought to the table. IMO, we ALL suffer from all these things, to various degrees -- that's why deeper emotional healing work is so important...so that we can ALL start contributing to, and thus having, happier and more successful relationships. You're right, I was talking in terms of those who initiate the break, but Exit helped me to realize that it can be the same reason that those who are left sometimes have such a difficult time moving on -- they can ALSO afraid of being alone and having to look at their crap, so they keep hurting, grieving, obsessing, etc., over the ex as a way to avoid themselves. In fact, I really liked how Exit took a piece of information and applied it to himself -- that is always more insightful/enlightening than trying to figure out other people's issues and why they do what they do -- why do WE do what WE do?
Ronni_W Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 My ex bottled things up and by the time it came out she was moving on. Yes, exactly! Bottling things up is an unhealthy way of trying to deal with one's own upsets, frustrations, disappointments, etc. -- lack of self-awareness and positive communication skills. It IS that people who do this have been distancing themselves prior to announcing that they are unhappy/leaving. But that period in which they had to admit to themselves that it wasn't working and they didn't know how to resolve it was still painful for them.
Exit Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 Well my reply was mistaken (misread dumper/dumpee) but I'm glad people are still finding something useful in what I said. Back to correctly talking about the dumpER, yes bottling things up is awful. My girlfriend blamed her lack of communcation of me, saying she was "Scared to tell me things", not wanting me to get mad. Well how silly is it to want to avoid making someone mad so instead you break their heart. I did admit to her that sometimes I do overreact and I probably DO make people hesitate to tell me the truth about certain things, but the rest of the time it was simply her choice not to communicate. It really is bizarre that they seal themselves off inside their own minds and start making the decision on their own, while you still think the relationship is going strong. My ex tells me I only offered to change now that she left, because I'm scared to be alone. I told her that is NOT my only motivation. Instead of coming to me with her mind already made up and saying "I'm leaving and this is why", if she had come to me sooner, before deciding on her own, and said "I am GOING to leave if this/that doesn't change soon", I would have been just as motivated to make the adjustements and try to save the relationship. HER behavior is the reason it seems like all the effort is being made "after the fact". I would have gladly participated in the decision-making process about our future together, instead of her deciding she would figure it out without my input.
Ronni_W Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 sometimes I do overreact and I probably DO make people hesitate to tell me the truth about certain things I'm like you, when it comes to over-reacting during "difficult conversations", especially when it is about hearing about MY shortcomings and crap. Given how WE impact others with our dysfunctional and off-putting behaviour, it is not at all "bizarre" that they withdraw and go into their own heads. They are not obligated to put themselves, or stay, in situations that they don't want to be in. That is US, btw, making them feel uncomfortable, upset, crappy, etc.! For us, the important piece is: What are WE doing to permanently change our tendency to over-react, and learn how to listen to others' cares and concerns without going all drama on them? Happy to continue the conversation, if you want...but we pro'ly ought to do it in your thread. Lisa, sorry to 'jack yours
Exit Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 i'm guessing that the dumper has been thinking for a while that they are having doubts and thinking of splitting up, but manage to keep it to themselves upto a certain point while they analyse the relationship. then by the time they want to break up they are emotionally detached and ready to move on. then they find it hard to announce they want to break up.vmeanwhile the dumpee is 2 months behind and starts at the bottom when the split up happens. How many times do you see the dumper break up and already have their new life in place.just getting their exit ready so they are not left lonely. eg got back intouch with old friends. My ex bottled things up and by the time it came out she was moving on. This is one of the most intelligent things I have read here so far. We as the dumpees are made to feel so bad (called "psychos" and whatever other labels are thrown at us) when we have a hard time letting go. It's not our fault that we are months behind in the process. The Dumper didn't get over it any faster than we do, they just started earlier. GREAT post.
adamt Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 This is one of the most intelligent things I have read here so far. We as the dumpees are made to feel so bad (called "psychos" and whatever other labels are thrown at us) when we have a hard time letting go. It's not our fault that we are months behind in the process. The Dumper didn't get over it any faster than we do, they just started earlier. GREAT post. Thanks for the compliment:) it must show that on reflection i am learning from my last relationship. I guess the dumper has had time to prepare for the split up and come to terms with it. my ex g/f stopped wanting sex and went quiet on me sometimes. when i asked whats up she said she felt sad but never spat out it was us(lots of external things going on for her as a distraction) looking back she was probably confused that she was having doubts about us and hadnt yet come to terms with it or figured it out. months down the line we split up and it feels like she is now relieved to be out of the relationship. as a dumpee i just thought she was having a difficult time outside the relationship and this was just a phase that will blow over. i mean not long ago she said she loved me and was making long term plans. even in the times of her doubts she still wanted to make long term plans. looking back there were other signs like starting to nit pick over trivial things and not laughing at my jokes as much. towards the end i asked why she was nit picking and trying to put me down, she didnt know why she was doing it and didnt mean to do it. basically she was just losing interest for whatever reason and she hadnt realised this herself. the situation for the dumpee is that you get mixed signals and just focus on the bits where she seems into you. put the rest down to a bad day at the office or just being moody. in the end she wanted a break to sort her head out. so even then she was still confused. she then took a step back and realised it wasnt working and let go of me. I was hoping it would make her realise she wanted me. when we split up i looked in her eyes and there seemed no emotion in them anymore. she is months ahead of me in getting over the relationship. I suppose when the dumpee is not doing anything particularly wrong for the dumper to lose interest, for a while it is hard for the dumper to see they are losing interest. I think dumpee and dumper find it hard to understand that you can lose interest without any major disagreements or incidents. most of us expect something big to happen to make us change or feelings. if the relationship was going along fine then why would either of you be thinking that someone might be about to lose interest. the dumper might not prepared for it either and bottling it up is a way to contain it and try to protect the relationship. At least now i will be more prepared in my next relationship.
Exit Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 Yeah I was the same way, there WERE signs, less sex, loss of interest, half the time she'd come over and just fall asleep, but I did the exact same thing, I attributed it to outside stresses, instead of to our relationship. She was going through the last few stressful months of school, working 2 jobs, and I just thought that's what the problem was. Now I know something else was wrong. I also just tried to leave her alone at first, I let her finish her last month of school without much contact from me, figuring she would change her mind once that was all over with. But I called her the week she was going to graduate and she didn't have anything different to say. I'd like to say "now I know for my next relationship" but I don't even want to think about that right now.
Author LisaUk Posted June 18, 2009 Author Posted June 18, 2009 See for me, there seriously were no signs, he had sex with me 10 days before he dumped me swearing on his own brothers life he was going to marry me in order to do it! In the weeks leading up to him leaving, when he had called a halt to the wedding plans (see my other thread commitment phobe, if you want more background), he was more no different, said he liked it when I went to bed with him at the same time, instaed of following him up later, as it made him feel happy and secure, even starting watching Lost with me instaed of going on the computer upstairs.
Marina09 Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 There were a lot of signs before he broke up with me. He was always serious, he didn't wanna come over to my house, he would fall asleep if I went to his, he didn't say I love you to me, he only replied "me too" when I said it, he seemed bored all the time, the last parties that we attended as a couple he would be with some people and I would be with some other people, I would go where he was, but he seemed so tense I just left. I remember the last time we had sex, 3 days before the break up. After we finished I hugged him but he just stayed there, not a kiss, not a little bit of affection. I knew it, the break up was imminent, but I wanted to try, I sent him and email with all the reasons why I thought our love was worth it. When he didn't mention anything about it on the next 2 days that we saw each other, then I knew for sure we had no chance, yet I stood there, with hope, waiting for him to realize he loved me... but he didn't, and there's nothing I could have done. LOVE WAS GONE!!! What I want to say, is that even if you see the signs, if you love someone, you will always try, and always HOPE. They didn't love us, and that's so sad to admit. He didn't love me, but now he loves a new girl that I'm sure doesn't love him as I do!
Author LisaUk Posted June 18, 2009 Author Posted June 18, 2009 Had to rush off for driving lesson, so wanted to elaborate on my reply above. What I meant was, he was no different before he called a halt to the wedding plans, I know many will say he just wanted sex, but those times he said he liked me going to bed, he wasn't after sex, we just cuddled and went to sleep. I really didn't see the break up coming at all, even now looking back on it, he was affectionate to the end.
adamt Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 See for me, there seriously were no signs, he had sex with me 10 days before he dumped me swearing on his own brothers life he was going to marry me in order to do it! I think men can still have sex when the are coming out of the relationship. but with women the sex is more emotional. Remember men think with their dicks sometimes:eek: In my case the ex stopped wanting sex, so then it caused me to back away. then it started to snowball and we both got i wires crossed. when we split up i said what i thought of her and she said she wished we had talked more often and sooner about how we felt. maybe she thought i wasnt into her, and then i thought she wasnt into me and then it went down hill.
Author LisaUk Posted June 18, 2009 Author Posted June 18, 2009 I know men can do that, it was probably a bad example of what I meant. I meant that right up until the end there were no signs that he was unhappy or that his feelings had changed. Seriously, no signs, how could there have been when he walked me round four wedding reception venues, laughing, smiling saying stuff like "your the bride" and hugging me. He arranged for the Vicar (minister of church) to come to our house to book the date, discussed finances with his parents and mine and wedding plans with my bridesmaid and her husband over dinner, then took me to a church service and walked round the church with me and the vicar discussing where to hold the ceremony (big church), which vows to have, then taking me round another church in a nearby village ( as we both found the vicar in our parish church a bit traditional and were considering this other one instaed). He even (after he had called a halt to things, see my commitment phobe thread if you like to have background), this one day we out shopping, the church bells were ringing. I said "oh someones just got married" he said "lets go and watch", I couldn't belive it so I walked round with him. We stood outside this church and watched this couple having photos taken etc. As we walked away I said "Don't you think that was a bit insensitive, seeing as how you have called a halt to our wedding" he said "no why, I haven't called a halt to our wedding, I'm definately going to marry you" Seriously, he dropped me from a great height with no warning or explanation or oppurtunity to try and work things out or even ask for an explanation after 18 years together. When I did call to sort out legal stuff to do with our house and took the chance to ask why he would get annoyed at my constant questions. What the hell did he expect, he just walked away from 18 years and our wedding, we had been getting on fine, no arguments, no problems (he never mentionned them before and has even admitted to lying and decieving me for years).
scienceguy Posted June 19, 2009 Posted June 19, 2009 Why do the dumpers give up so quickly on working things out with the dumpees before breaking up? It seems that the dumpers have no commitment to making a relationship work with someone who clearly is willing to try. Yet, the dumpees on here are in pieces, yet some must have been dumpers themselves at some point, so logically dumpers must have been dumpees at some point. If you follow me? [....] I'm not talking about the cases where the two people have really had terrible problems and have tried to work it through first, I mean all the cases on here where the dumpee hasn't even known anything was wrong and has just been left, with no opportunity to resolve anything. Usually the dumper does not move on quickly; some do, and they're typically narcissists and weirdos. But, as adamt pointed out, the dumper deals with the break up problems in the last several months of the relationship itself. That way, they've prepared for the break up as good as they can. A lot of threads, mine included, basically revolve around the "dumper" trashing the "dumpee" in the last several months and promptly moving into a new relationship. It's not totally uncommon. As for why people end relationships? There are a myriad of reasons, and it depends on each person. Usually the dumper ends the relationship because he/she wants to pursue somebody else, has realized the relationship has fizzled out (before the dumpee has realized this too), or is plain unhappy with the way things are. The fact is, breaking up is the last thing anybody wants to do, but sometimes it has to happen. Certain relationships have run their course and are no longer worth keeping. Ideally, two people reach the conclusion around the same time, but oftentimes, it doesn't pan out like that. Naturally, being a dumpee, all of this looks pretty cruel, but that's the risk we all take in forming an emotional connection with someone out there. The person who can make you feel like the happiest person in the world can also crush you like nothing else. Why do they just bail? It seems crazy to me! If finding a relationship is so difficult why would someone choose to just walk away without trying? The thing is, most dumpers will try, but you can't "try" to love or care for somebody. It's either there or isn't. Sometimes the feelings just fade. I know that sounds very cruel. I've certain been in that state myself, and I know how painful it can be to hear that, but that's all there is to it. LISAUK, I've read your post about your ex-fiance, and I'm really sorry that he broke up with you like that. I think there are several reasons why your break up seems so abrupt and out of the blue. First off, I think your ex-fiance treated you poorly. Break ups stink, but the dumper is, in my opinion, obligated, to give some explanation and closure to the dumpee so he/she can move on and close those wounds without big problems. It sounds like he can't do that, and that's pretty lousy on his part, to say the least. Second, you said you two have been together from 15 to 33? That's an awfully long time for a couple to be together, but crucially, I think neither one of you really learned to grow up. Lemme explain. One of the few benefits of break ups is that the force you to re-examine your values, to deal with loss, and to eventually develop some sort of framework of what a good relationship is supposed to look like. Personally, what I valued and sought in a relationship when I was 15 or 17 is a lot different from what I think is important now, in my twenties. Moreover, I have a much better radar on picking out incompatible gfs. I have a lot more self-esteem for myself and have worked out a lot of insecurities. All of this came from my relationships. I'm a better person for those experience. And I think that everybody goes through these experience too. They're painful as hell, but they're a part of life. Now in your case, you and this guy have been together since you were 15. Neither one of you ever had to rebuild your life after some sort of traumatic loss or been forced to re-evaluate a lot of things in your life. And neither of you have developed any sort of idea of what a good relationship is, outside of the one the two of you had. I think that one reason you feel this break up is out of the blue is that you just haven't had these types of life experiences (other relationships) to give you a better understanding of what's good and bad in a relationship. If so, you probably would've realized that your relationship wasn't going so well for a long time. Now you might ask why he would go ahead and continue to plan all these things: wedding, churches, etc. And the unpleasant answer is that he probably wasn't totally sure what he wanted as well. For example, my ex-gf talked to me about taking a trip about three days before she broke up with me. Sometimes people do that because they're insensitve and callous towards other people's feelings, and developing that sort of sensitivity is something that a lot of us have to learn. Ultimately, I can't tell you with 100% what happened with your ex-fiance--only he can. But that's my take on it. I seriously think there were lots of signs, probably very gradual, but neither of you could really detect it since you didn't have anything else to judge it against.
adamt Posted June 19, 2009 Posted June 19, 2009 last september my ex started going to the gym after she said she thought her thighs looked fat in a photo. i said she looked great as she was..etc she then became quite focused on herself. so maybe the seeds were being sown back then. by the time we split up in april she was trim and toned and like a new person. she was always one who had lower energy,liked early nights and prefered night in. now she seems to have found extra energy and likes going out and staying up later. it is like a new person. i didnt have a problem but unfortunately she didnt open up to me and let me know that she was changing. the sex had stopped a few months earlier. so maybe subconciously she was starting to detach months earlier without realising herself. the dumper then becomes bitter, frustrated and resentfull that you seem to be holding them back and getting in the way. they then say things to provoke a reaction and probably trying to encourage you to make it easier by breaking up with them. things like saying the might be going on holiday with their friends but no mention of where you and the ex will be going on holiday. despite there being issues in the relationship, i didnt think we would actually split up and thought it was something we could work through. but when we did it was clear the dumper (ex g/f) was prepared and left herself high and dry. its sad that by the time we split up you feel that the dumper is relieved it is finally over and feels a huge weight off their shoulders.i mean it is not as if i was giving her hassle and not letting her have space to do things she liked doing.then the huge weight ends up on the dumpee and they are left to recover from the fall out. she pulled the line that she felt we didnt have much in common anymore. but we had a lot in common and had the same morales and ideas. but once the dumper becomes emotionally detached they lose all energy and passion for the relationship. they probably feel it is becoming hard work to talk to you. you notice the dumper rarely wants to talk about what you are upto in the build up to the split. they appear to become selfish. they start going back out with old friends. Its like as if a statue is being chipped away slowly each day without anyone noticing until it breaks in half. day by day a little bit of dumpers passion for the relationship disappear. then bang ..the relationship is over and beyond repair. you then realise how much you miss them but its too late to get them back. some months later you look back and reflect and wonder how you managed to miss all the warning signs. But when you are into someone, you find love is blind and you dont see the signs until it becomes too late and the dumpers mind has been made up. you are left scratching your head when you see that the ex hasnt been in contact since the split. you cant believe that your relationship can just be binned just like that. sometimes i think it is all just a bad dream and she is going to call me anyminute and it will be back to what it was.
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