dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 gack. spent last night w a girlfriend i hadn't talked to in a long time, told her the whole long bloody story of the A, ended up with us both sloshed and sobbing about being lonely and abandoned and generally messed up in the head. the broken little abandoned toddler in the darkness of my head is still devastated, will never understand, says "how could he see me and love me and then walk away?" when she would poke her head out, in anger or jealousy or some kind of non-grown-up temper tantrum emotion, i'd try to push her back in and he'd say "no, let me see her. i love that little girl." there is still this horrible tight little ball of pain in the center of my belly with his name on it, and it's all about that toddler. woke up this morning feeling not only physically but emotionally hung over. no great question or epiphany to this post, just needed to let a little weight off that pain. will go take a walk, maybe do some cleaning. worst morning in almost a month. thanks for the space to get that out.
White Flower Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 gack. spent last night w a girlfriend i hadn't talked to in a long time, told her the whole long bloody story of the A, ended up with us both sloshed and sobbing about being lonely and abandoned and generally messed up in the head. the broken little abandoned toddler in the darkness of my head is still devastated, will never understand, says "how could he see me and love me and then walk away?" when she would poke her head out, in anger or jealousy or some kind of non-grown-up temper tantrum emotion, i'd try to push her back in and he'd say "no, let me see her. i love that little girl." there is still this horrible tight little ball of pain in the center of my belly with his name on it, and it's all about that toddler. woke up this morning feeling not only physically but emotionally hung over. no great question or epiphany to this post, just needed to let a little weight off that pain. will go take a walk, maybe do some cleaning. worst morning in almost a month. thanks for the space to get that out. Dobler33 you have such a graphic mind! No wonder you went into psychology. This is how most of us feel yet have a hard time expressing. MM saw something in us that no one else did and this is the very reason we caved into having an A. (Maybe I am speaking for those APs that were M like myself even though I was on the threshhold of D at the time the A started , and then again maybe not.) For those with huge imaginations we wonder why other men such as our husbands can't go inside the head of the wandering MM and see us their his eyes. If only. I'm cleaning, paying bills, and baking a birthday cake today. Hope it keeps my mind off things. You're not alone sister.
Author dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Author Posted June 6, 2009 Dobler33 you have such a graphic mind! No wonder you went into psychology. This is how most of us feel yet have a hard time expressing. MM saw something in us that no one else did and this is the very reason we caved into having an A. (Maybe I am speaking for those APs that were M like myself even though I was on the threshhold of D at the time the A started , and then again maybe not.) For those with huge imaginations we wonder why other men such as our husbands can't go inside the head of the wandering MM and see us their his eyes. If only. I'm cleaning, paying bills, and baking a birthday cake today. Hope it keeps my mind off things. You're not alone sister. thanks, cookie. interestingly enough my H must have picked up on that sadness this morning, cause we just had another really great conversation in which he cried and told me he knew he hadn't been treating me well and that he understood and didn't blame me for wanting to be with someone who saw me like that. which just reminds me how lucky i am that he wants to stay and work through this with me, and gives me hope that somewhere under all the brittle defended walls we've set up between us he still sees me, maybe even sees and loves that little girl too. the day is improving, for sure. who's birthday, btw?
jj33 Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 Dobler your post really touched me. So much its made me cry. Thats what is so upsetting about what happened with xMM. He was one of the few people who really knew me and he has used it against me now saying I knew you were broken, and I tried to help you, what you didnt know is everyone else knew too and they dont like you and I always defended you. Its like I thought he knew me and liked me flaws and all and now hes saying not only does he think Im psycho but everyone else does too... Its so hard to have let someone so close to you and for them to then use it against you
boldjack Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 Sorry you're in the dumps, Dob:eek:. But things could be a whole, f*ck of a bunch worse. You COULD have met someone like me, then your day would REALLY be in the crapper.
Author dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Author Posted June 6, 2009 Dobler your post really touched me. So much its made me cry. Thats what is so upsetting about what happened with xMM. He was one of the few people who really knew me and he has used it against me now saying I knew you were broken, and I tried to help you, what you didnt know is everyone else knew too and they dont like you and I always defended you. Its like I thought he knew me and liked me flaws and all and now hes saying not only does he think Im psycho but everyone else does too... Its so hard to have let someone so close to you and for them to then use it against you i'm sorry that bunghole is using your vulnerable exposures against you. what a sh*t. i'd say the best thing to do is to never speak to him again, because he derives power from seeing what he does to you. kick him to the curb, kitten. easier said than done, i know. remember that the bad moments pass, even when you're by yourself. made me feel hugely better to send that shout out this morning; getting a little support turned the day around for me. so shout out and hang on. boldjack, thank goodness it wasn't you i met. i expect you and i would have either ruled the world or burnt it to the ground.
jj33 Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 Thanks Dobler. If you see my thread below. I did. 2 years after the affair ended. Who would think now he would pull this. At this point I thought we had really managed to be friends... its hideous.
Author dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Author Posted June 6, 2009 Thanks Dobler. If you see my thread below. I did. 2 years after the affair ended. Who would think now he would pull this. At this point I thought we had really managed to be friends... its hideous. oh, that's right, i remember now. he's pulling some kind of bs w/ your work colleagues, right? i'll go back and read that post. still shout out and hang on, though.
jj33 Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 Thanks I' ve decided that some people are more prone to behave and apologize when there is a BJ at the end of the rainbow.... Once that possibility is gone, there is a lot less incentive to play nice....
Author dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Author Posted June 6, 2009 Thanks I' ve decided that some people are more prone to behave and apologize when there is a BJ at the end of the rainbow.... Once that possibility is gone, there is a lot less incentive to play nice.... you are killing me. seriously. that's hilarious. an entire theory of psychology compressed into on sentence. you oughta write a book.
norajane Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 thanks, cookie. interestingly enough my H must have picked up on that sadness this morning, cause we just had another really great conversation in which he cried and told me he knew he hadn't been treating me well and that he understood and didn't blame me for wanting to be with someone who saw me like that. which just reminds me how lucky i am that he wants to stay and work through this with me, and gives me hope that somewhere under all the brittle defended walls we've set up between us he still sees me, maybe even sees and loves that little girl too. the day is improving, for sure. who's birthday, btw? Nurture that hope and your relationship with your husband. That will get you through this better than anything. Having something in your life that you can look forward to will make you feel less lonely. Do something nice for him today. It usually makes us feel good to do nice things for people, and it will likely help things between the two of you. Maybe bake a cake for the two of you to enjoy together as a special treat.
Author dobler33 Posted June 6, 2009 Author Posted June 6, 2009 Nurture that hope and your relationship with your husband. That will get you through this better than anything. Having something in your life that you can look forward to will make you feel less lonely. Do something nice for him today. It usually makes us feel good to do nice things for people, and it will likely help things between the two of you. Maybe bake a cake for the two of you to enjoy together as a special treat. actually, i make ginormous fancy ellaborate meals every night, cause i like to cook for him. tonight he's going to do something nice for me - he's taking me out to ice cream as a reward for getting into the choir i auditioned for this week. so i guess that little girl is getting what she wants afterall.
White Flower Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 thanks, cookie. interestingly enough my H must have picked up on that sadness this morning, cause we just had another really great conversation in which he cried and told me he knew he hadn't been treating me well and that he understood and didn't blame me for wanting to be with someone who saw me like that. which just reminds me how lucky i am that he wants to stay and work through this with me, and gives me hope that somewhere under all the brittle defended walls we've set up between us he still sees me, maybe even sees and loves that little girl too. the day is improving, for sure. who's birthday, btw? Wow, what a lucky lady you are that your H still loves you, cries for you, and wants to repair the M with you. He really values you, dob. It is my youngest daughter's birthday. I am also cleaning her bedroom while she visits her daddy so when she comes home she'll find it nice and tidy with fresh cut roses on her bedside table from my garden.
lovekillsslowly Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Dobler33 you have such a graphic mind! No wonder you went into psychology. This is how most of us feel yet have a hard time expressing. MM saw something in us that no one else did and this is the very reason we caved into having an A. (Maybe I am speaking for those APs that were M like myself even though I was on the threshhold of D at the time the A started , and then again maybe not.) For those with huge imaginations we wonder why other men such as our husbands can't go inside the head of the wandering MM and see us their his eyes. If only. I'm cleaning, paying bills, and baking a birthday cake today. Hope it keeps my mind off things. You're not alone sister. Hi WF. Just a thought...do you really feel that MM saw something in us that no one else did OR do you think that we caved into having an affair because we FINALLY found someone that we could be our TRUE selves with and they accepted us for who we really were? I know that's how it was for me. It was so "freeing" (if that's a word) to be able to let my guard down, be my true self with him and not have to live a facade for just a few hours out of the day. It's like my life is a continual performance going on and the times I got to spend with him was the "intermission" where I got to relax and just be myself for a few brief moments of the day.
White Flower Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Sorry you're in the dumps, Dob:eek:. But things could be a whole, f*ck of a bunch worse. You COULD have met someone like me, then your day would REALLY be in the crapper. I'm glad I met ya now instead of then;)
White Flower Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Hi WF. Just a thought...do you really feel that MM saw something in us that no one else did OR do you think that we caved into having an affair because we FINALLY found someone that we could be our TRUE selves with and they accepted us for who we really were? I know that's how it was for me. It was so "freeing" (if that's a word) to be able to let my guard down, be my true self with him and not have to live a facade for just a few hours out of the day. It's like my life is a continual performance going on and the times I got to spend with him was the "intermission" where I got to relax and just be myself for a few brief moments of the day. I think we're on the same page here. Definitely in the beginning he recognized my intelligence whereas my then STBXH believed a W's place was in the kitchen, not a college classroom. MM also recognized all the dutiful things I did for family and friends whereas my exH would simply dismiss those things because they were epected. For example, I would take my mother-in-law to her doctor appointment because my ex couldn't leave work and exH wouldn't even think to thank me for it even if it disruted his own children's schedule or his W's. MM saw my eyes sparkle and loved my giggle whereas my H made fun of my laugh (but I didn't care, I love my laugh:cool:). MM saw me for who I was and yes, accepted me that way, which in turn allowed me to be fully myself. I actually liked my life more because I wasn't trying to fit into the little box my H wanted me in. I can't tell you how I grew freer in every aspect, especially in the bedroom. MM used to say that he woke a sleeping giant (in reference to the bombing of Pearl Harbor and Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto 's response http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoroku_Yamamoto's_sleeping_giant_quote to the US attack). He did wake a sleeping giant because I became myself once he recognized me for who I was. My exH never respected who I was; he tried to force me to be who he wanted me to be. Looking back, can you see where your MM prompted you to be yourself? Or did you feel that you naturally became more yourself in his presence without him prompting it?
White Flower Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 actually, i make ginormous fancy ellaborate meals every night, cause i like to cook for him. tonight he's going to do something nice for me - he's taking me out to ice cream as a reward for getting into the choir i auditioned for this week. so i guess that little girl is getting what she wants afterall. Congrats on getting into the choir! And wow, you got ice cream as a treat with your hubby, how wonderful.
lovekillsslowly Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 I think we're on the same page here. Definitely in the beginning he recognized my intelligence whereas my then STBXH believed a W's place was in the kitchen, not a college classroom. MM also recognized all the dutiful things I did for family and friends whereas my exH would simply dismiss those things because they were epected. For example, I would take my mother-in-law to her doctor appointment because my ex couldn't leave work and exH wouldn't even think to thank me for it even if it disruted his own children's schedule or his W's. MM saw my eyes sparkle and loved my giggle whereas my H made fun of my laugh (but I didn't care, I love my laugh:cool:). MM saw me for who I was and yes, accepted me that way, which in turn allowed me to be fully myself. I actually liked my life more because I wasn't trying to fit into the little box my H wanted me in. I can't tell you how I grew freer in every aspect, especially in the bedroom. MM used to say that he woke a sleeping giant (in reference to the bombing of Pearl Harbor and Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto 's response http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoroku_Yamamoto's_sleeping_giant_quote to the US attack). He did wake a sleeping giant because I became myself once he recognized me for who I was. My exH never respected who I was; he tried to force me to be who he wanted me to be. Looking back, can you see where your MM prompted you to be yourself? Or did you feel that you naturally became more yourself in his presence without him prompting it? My xMM would always tell me "I want to know what you're feeling." "I want to know what you're thinking." So in regards to that, yes, he prompted me to be myself. But as for the person I really am...I just knew that I could be my true self in his presence and he wouldn't abandon me or run the other direction. He and I live in a small town. He knows a lot of people. I know a lot of people. A lot of people know him, me, his wife and my husband. The majority of those people are very judgemental. Those people look at our professional lives and our home lives with our spouses and expect and assume those lives to be a certain way. And we do our best to let those people believe that our lives are the way they assume they are. You know...the all American family image. Having to perform to make outward appearance be something they are not gets very exhausting. When we were together we were an escape for each other and were able to reveal our true selves and be our true selves and not have to put on an act anymore. Does that make sense to you? I hope so.
delirious Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 You know I believe we are with people for not just who they are, but who we are when we are with them. I mean how they make US feel. For instance, I had a photo taken when with my H and then I had a passport photo taken after meeting MM, you would not believe it was the same person. People, partners make us feel different about ourselves. That may be something to do with what they add to our life, or it may be because they get the best of part of our lives, who would know until they are both on a level playing field. Dobie, just to let you know, I cried with you today. Better to cry, than to feel nothing.
Author dobler33 Posted June 7, 2009 Author Posted June 7, 2009 You know I believe we are with people for not just who they are, but who we are when we are with them. I mean how they make US feel. For instance, I had a photo taken when with my H and then I had a passport photo taken after meeting MM, you would not believe it was the same person. People, partners make us feel different about ourselves. That may be something to do with what they add to our life, or it may be because they get the best of part of our lives, who would know until they are both on a level playing field. Dobie, just to let you know, I cried with you today. Better to cry, than to feel nothing. thanks, delirious. chin up, doll. both of us.
StoptheDrama Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 "Neurosis is the inability to tolerate ambiguity." - Sigmund Freud ... If that is true, Dobler, then I am the textbook definition of neurotic...Like so many, my xMM also appreciated me for the woman I really am. There was no pretense or hiding or trying to fit into a little box with him. I never realized how liberating and amazing that feeling was and the emotional devastation it could cause...
Author dobler33 Posted June 7, 2009 Author Posted June 7, 2009 "Neurosis is the inability to tolerate ambiguity." - Sigmund Freud ... If that is true, Dobler, then I am the textbook definition of neurotic...Like so many, my xMM also appreciated me for the woman I really am. There was no pretense or hiding or trying to fit into a little box with him. I never realized how liberating and amazing that feeling was and the emotional devastation it could cause... devastation because you opened yourself up and let him into all your truest deepest stuff and then it ended?
StoptheDrama Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Yes and more...because the emotions he displayed weren't true. The 'safe' environment was nothing more than a figment of my imagination fueled by his needs and desires. Now I question whether he really ever did truly appreciate me or was it all part of the seduction? The romance, the affection weren't real so why would that be?
Author dobler33 Posted June 7, 2009 Author Posted June 7, 2009 Yes and more...because the emotions he displayed weren't true. The 'safe' environment was nothing more than a figment of my imagination fueled by his needs and desires. Now I question whether he really ever did truly appreciate me or was it all part of the seduction? The romance, the affection weren't real so why would that be? i know almost exactly how you feel. that was the most destructively painful and unbearable part of it - that i had torn down every last wall at his request, given him every access, and then when it ended i was just naked as hell, wandering in a cold, cold place. it still feels like that some days, like yesterday when i posted this thread. but here's kind of a different view, and of course i don't know your situation or experience so it could be totally unusable for you, but i'll throw it out there just in case. at first it was easier for me to think that he'd never loved me, that it was all fake if he didn't want to leave for me. after thinking about it for the last 6 weeks or so, i think that his emotions were real, but that it went against how he wanted to see himself to walk out on his marriage. (i've heard it said here that the ones who stay are the hardest ones to get over, because the fact that they're trying to rebuild things with the spouse they committed to in marriage suggests that they're probably not irredeemably horrible people.) i think that invalidating and minimizing that love was a way for me to survive the loss of it. that inability to tolerate the ambiguity of these two things - that someone could love you and not ultimately be with you - is part of the healing process. when we are injured this way, particularly when we've really exposed our oldest, darkest stuff to someone, we naturally revert to the defenses we used in childhood to deal with difficult emotions: either i am good and he is bad, or he is good and i am bad. if he loved me he would have left for me. because he didn't he must never have loved me. that kind of black and white thinking is a way of giving ourselves enough time and room to recover enough to sit with that ambiguity, which takes awhile. i lashed out at him after it ended, before we went NC, and threw all kinds of horribly injured invective about how he'd never loved me and had used me as a midlife crisis object. after that i had some brief communication with his wife (who had been a close friend - i know, you don't even have to start;)) and she actually chastised me for accusing him of not loving me. she said she'd seen how destroyed he was after ending it, how devastating it was to lose me, and said it was cruel and unfair of me to say that he'd never loved me. it was a big chunk of perspective that didn't immediately help (cause there was still some "if he loved me then why the hell isn't he with me" to get through) but eventually allowed me to see him as a whole and integrated person, a decent person who had done something that hurt me deeply. holding onto anger and hatred takes up SO much energy - i've found it far easier to move on if i can hang out in that ambiguity. it's a leap, but once you get there the water's fine. now it's entirely possible that your MM really was an evil conniving bastard - i have no way of knowing. but if not, if he was a decent person who hurt you deeply, you might be able to wrap your arms around that ambiguity at some point and let it heal you a little. in the meantime, i am with you in that pain, know just what it feels like, continue to struggle with it and have bad days where it overwhelms me. i send you tons and tons of love and support in recovering from it.
StoptheDrama Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Thanks for the support and sentiment, Dobler. I give it right back to you! I don't want to think he is an evil conniving bastard but right now I also still wish he had been real and really did love me. I feel that he does have feelings for me but right now I wonder if that is just wishful thinking on my part. I don't know if it's more my wounded pride than actual emotion, though. I guess it's still so raw and I'm a bit confused ... I know it will get better, though, as I know your situation will too... As long as we stay strong and hang tough, we'll find ourselves on the upswing. I for one can't wait for that!
Recommended Posts