retiredguy Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Men: Have you had a LTR with a woman who is a feminist, and also one with a woman who is not? Do you feel up to making some comparisons? If you are, which of the following three factors do you think had a greater influence on the relationship (including the quantity/quality of the sex): her feminism, her self-esteem, or the openness of communication?
Els Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Well, there are several different definitions of what a 'feminist' is and what the intent and goal of 'feminism' is; and most of them aren't even remotely close to the original intention. Your answer would be different depending on which type of 'feminism' you're thinking about. So, define 'feminism'?
Author retiredguy Posted May 31, 2009 Author Posted May 31, 2009 Elswyth, I agree that feminism has a number of levels to it. What I meant was the belief that women are unfairly disadvantaged in the working world, that men exclude women largely because it preserves their hold on social and economic power, that a woman's career is just as important as that of her spouse, that parenting/housekeeping duties should be shared between spouses equally, and that a marriage is a partnership of equals. Hope this helps.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Avoid feminists like the plague. They're easy to spot since they have bigger fore-arms than the average man. They also have pecs and lats to die for. They won't cook or clean for any man and insist that their kept man does all the domestic duties, while they pump iron or sit on the couch drinking beer and burping out the alphabet! Frightening!
sally4sara Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 I am a feminist. I do believe those things the OP listed. I still cook well and clean and other "domestic type things. I am small boned and short but not helpless considering I have fended off a would be mugger. I can hunt and fish for my own food. I am active. I feel a job is as important as it needs to be, but usually just a means to and end. Unless you work for yourself, the goal and gain are never really that of the employee. This applies to all regardless of gender. I believe in equality for all. Think of what we could accomplish if everyone was expected to at least try reach for the full potential of what capabilities they were incline! I am a mother. I still like dresses and will follow on the dance floor if he is good enough to lead. I asked for a crockpot for xmas and was happy to get it. I am interested in what "level" of feminism I am. I haven't been pigeon-holed yet today.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 I am interested in what "level" of feminism I am. I haven't been pigeon-holed yet today. Where I'm 6'8" tall and weigh 300 lbs. I'm the bone and tone kind of feminist. I keep my little man down!
Woggle Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Getting involved with a feminist is a ticket to never ending drama. Nothing you ever do will be good enough and sooner or later she will stop seeing you as one of the good ones. You will be another no good male scumbag just like the rest of them according to her and that will be her justification for treating you like garbage. It is an utter nightmare to be involved with a woman like this. Feminists claim to want equality but what they really want is revenge against the entire male gender.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Getting involved with a feminist is a ticket to never ending drama. Nothing you ever do will be good enough and sooner or later she will stop seeing you as one of the good ones. You will be another no good male scumbag just like the rest of them according to her and that will be her justification for treating you like garbage. It is an utter nightmare to be involved with a woman like this. Feminists claim to want equality but what they really want is revenge against the entire male gender.You're so right Woggle. Feminists like me want to keep all you good men down. We're here to punish... I mean seriously, if I don't have to cook or do any domestic duties, and have a man as my slave, why not?
Woggle Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 You're so right Woggle. Feminists like me want to keep all you good men down. We're here to punish... I mean seriously, if I don't have to cook or do any domestic duties, and have a man as my slave, why not? I know you are just joking but this is how most feminists feel and I see right through them.
sally4sara Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Where I'm 6'8" tall and weigh 300 lbs. I'm the bone and tone kind of feminist. I keep my little man down! I'm under 5'4" and under 125lbs. I have no such attitude toward my partner and did not say otherwise. At 6'8", I'd be, by far the tallest family member I have; even compared to the males!
sally4sara Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Where I'm 6'8" tall and weigh 300 lbs. I'm the bone and tone kind of feminist. I keep my little man down! Wait.........there. I think it was foolin from go.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Wait.........there. I think it was foolin from go. I likes me a haunch of man, for Sunday dinner!
alphamale Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 Men: Have you had a LTR with a woman who is a feminist, and also one with a woman who is not? Do you feel up to making some comparisons? If you are, which of the following three factors do you think had a greater influence on the relationship (including the quantity/quality of the sex): her feminism, her self-esteem, or the openness of communication? i don't like feminists. they always think they are better than men. personally i think they are full of it. i go for the more traditional female. luckily they are the majority
norajane Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 which of the following three factors do you think had a greater influence on the relationship (including the quantity/quality of the sex): her feminism, her self-esteem, or the openness of communication? I guess no one has really answered your question, and to be honest, I'm not really sure there is an answer. Communication can make or break a relationship, regardless if one is a feminist or has high or low self-esteem. So if there isn't open communication between you, the relationship will not do well. Many men aren't great at communicating anyway, so even if she is very open to it, it still might not go well. That would be my pick for what would affect the relationship the most, all other things equal. Lack of self-esteem is also a relationship killer. It breeds insecurity, jealousy, and self-destructive or passive-aggressive behavior. Too much self-esteem, and she can thinks she deserves better than you! Feminism will most likely affect the roles you both have in the relationship. The way you described it what you can expect - shared roles in the household, her job will be as important to her as yours is to you, her political beliefs will cause her to support candidates and issues to create a level playing field for men and women in employment and society. If you disagree with these views, then you two will have many clashes. As to sex, I don't think feminism will really affect it one way or another. Sex is about interpersonal relationships - if you don't have an emotional and intellectual intimacy, the sex will dwindle. Perhaps you could be more specific about what your concerns are. It's a difficult question to answer in general terms, particularly when there are so many variables involved relating to communication and self-esteem.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 It's no use trying to fight the stereotype, when someone has made up their minds, locked in la-la land of ignorance and denial. Feminism isn't for every woman, as feminists aren't for every man. It's reliant on what your value system is. If you don't believe in gender equality, it doesn't matter what anyone says, as to what quality is more important.
alphamale Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 If you don't believe in gender equality, it doesn't matter what anyone says, as to what quality is more important. i think the genders are equal in some respects and inequal in other respects. thats just the way it is. you're really comparing apples and orangutans here. this whole feminist idea that women are equal to or better than men in every respect is a bunch of hog wash. as is vice versa. the sexes are inherently different and meant to be that way.
Trialbyfire Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 i think the genders are equal in some respects and inequal in other respects. thats just the way it is. you're really comparing apples and orangutans here. this whole feminist idea that women are equal to or better than men in every respect is a bunch of hog wash. as is vice versa. the sexes are inherently different and meant to be that way.As previously stated, if your mind is made up, then I'm not going to try to change it. It's your life to believe what you choose, as it's my life to live it the way I want to and believe. I won't deny that there are differences between sexes. This doesn't make the genders unequal.
westernxer Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 I imagine that dating a feminist would be like dating someone of a different religion, although some forms of modern feminism are more in tune with mainstream values than the '60s prototype. Still, anyone who can't be open-minded because of a creed is not on my short list. I've never dated a feminist, but I would love to be with someone who likes to talk about ideas and what have you, otherwise I might grow bored. Maybe I should date a feminist. LOL
alphamale Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 I imagine that dating a feminist would be like dating someone of a different religion, ... i would say its more like dating someone from a different planet
westernxer Posted May 31, 2009 Posted May 31, 2009 i would say its more like dating someone from a different planet Yeah, one that doesn't sell razors. LOL
Author retiredguy Posted June 1, 2009 Author Posted June 1, 2009 Thank you for your insightful thoughts, norajane. But as I originally stated, I am looking for men who have had relationships with both feminists and traditionalists (for want of a better term) who could perhaps make some comparisons. Obviously it would be premature to draw any conclusions from a small sample size. So far, plenty of rhetoric but no serious respondents. C'mon, men, I know you are out there!
norajane Posted June 1, 2009 Posted June 1, 2009 I imagine that dating a feminist would be like dating someone of a different religion, although some forms of modern feminism are more in tune with mainstream values than the '60s prototype. Still, anyone who can't be open-minded because of a creed is not on my short list. I've never dated a feminist, but I would love to be with someone who likes to talk about ideas and what have you, otherwise I might grow bored. Maybe I should date a feminist. LOL Jeez, it's 2009. Do you really think that the women of today would have the same views on feminism as the women of the 60's?? How do you know you've never dated a feminist? It's a dirty word, so many don't identify as such, but they embrace the principles. And some don't even realize they embrace the principles, but they certainly have benefited from them and would scream bloody murder if the rights they enjoy were suddenly taken away. Have you ever dated a woman who believes she should be paid on the same pay scale as the guy in the cubicle next to hers doing the same job? Have you ever dated a woman who has a job in what used to be traditionally male-dominated fields such as banking, IT, accounting, consulting, sales, science, medicine, or owns her own business? Someone who doesn't feel she should be solely responsible for all the laundry, cooking, cleaning, grocery shopping, and other household chores - someone who feels those should be shared between the two of you? Someone who takes responsibility for her own income, checkbook, credit cards, loans, and investments? Someone who has bought her own car, condo or home, or is planning to without the requirement of daddy or hubby co-signing or buying it for her? Someone who supports sexual harassment laws and non-discrimination in the workplace laws? Someone who uses birth control, travels alone, or pays her own rent and lives where she wants without daddy or hubby? If so, then you've dated a feminist. She may not be abandoning razors, burning bras, or slamming men, but that hardly identifies a feminist in 2009.
kizik Posted June 1, 2009 Posted June 1, 2009 The word "feminist" has gained a pretty bad stigma. Most guys imagine a beefy, butchy, mean b*tch. But in reality it's just a woman who believes in, and strives for, equality. Unfortunately, a few angry apples out there have man-hated the entire movement into the ground.
sally4sara Posted June 1, 2009 Posted June 1, 2009 Well, The guy I dated seriously before my fiance was a traditional sort even without comparing him to my non-traditional fiance. He was a surface kind of nice guy; responsible job, christian upbringing, republican. I do believe he would have been a faithful partner. But he was very stiff and resistant to new experiences. He often seemed to have no compassion for other humans. He was comfortable with stereotypes until an individual had "proven themselves". I could see myself with all the material crap I'm told I am suppose to want, but he was not a passionate person in life or the sheets. My mostly non-traditional fiance ignores stereotypes and is a free thinker. I know I can count on him to be supportive of me without being asked. I've never had to talk him into it or remind him we are a team. We just are. He is reliable without being stiff. I have the material stuff I decided I did want, but more importantly I feel loved emotionally rather than just feeling financially secure. So non-traditional won out in my experience. I hope that was more what you were asking.
Woggle Posted June 1, 2009 Posted June 1, 2009 A man dating a feminist would be similiar to a black or jewish person dating a white supremacist. You would be involved with somebody that despises you for how you were born.
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