taylor Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 She's either "done"...in which case, booting her out and letting her start dealing with living life on her own without help from 5&10 is good for both of them........or.......she's not done, and it's a wake up call. You assume his wife is incapable or would have great difficulty surviving without him. If she moves out, BOTH OF THEM will have to start dealing with living life on their own without help from each other. It works both ways. And if it serves as a wake-up call, it's his wake-up call as well, to address problems in their marriage that have been neglected.
Meaplus3 Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Let me see if I have this straight. You admit to verbal abuse and you expect your wife to stay around? Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps your verbal abuse could have been a part of the reason she has strayed? IMO, You need to change your behavior towards your wife if you expect her to stay married to you. At this point you both should seek MC and as for you IC.. to figure out what makes you angry. NO one derserves to be put down with words. I lived it for 15 years and like a dummy I stayed and put up with it until I broke down hard and could NO longer take it. Please know, I am in NO way saying that your Wife is innocent here. There is no excuse for an affair and she need's to see that her bahavior was wrong. Good luck. Mea:)
taylor Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Something to consider...as a very real possibility...had your EA continued on unabated...you could well have been in the role you describe here. Had your husband discovered the affair first and busted you...you may well have been the one who initially wanted to leave, but later decided that it was a mistake. It's easy to say that "if he wanted out, I'd pack his bags"...I used to say something very similar about what would happen if my wife ever cheated on me...but you don't know until you get there. You are right, Owl, I never reached a point where I wanted to leave my marriage. I still saw alot of value in my husband and in my marriage. I missed him and I missed it...the way it was before it all started falling apart. But if I reached the point where I could utter those words..I want out...then, by golly, that's not a mistake. That's a decision. And if I said I wanted a separation or a divorce, that's not a mistake. That's a decision. I think it takes alot for a spouse to utter those words because they are words of total devastation, pain, hurt. No one says them lightly and no one takes them lightly. So if my husband met another woman and said he wanted out of the marriage..YES, I would pack his bags. I would have too much self-respect to fight for someone who wanted someone else. Another thought...my money is that very, VERY few WS's actually think through all the reasons that they decide to work on reconciling their marriage. And I'd bet that a very darned few of them were ENTIRELY, 100% based on utter and total feelings of love for their BS's at the time. With not one bit of "self-serving, looking out for myself, not losing my security-blanket" kind of feelings tucked in there...frankly...I'd say that some part of your choice to end your affair/and not escalate it was likely based off not wanting to lose what you had...not solely based off of your feelings of love for your husband. Again, you are right. Alot of reasons go into the decision to stay or return to a marriage. However, if my only reason for returning to my husband was his money or the material possessions he could offer me, I would have had enough love for him to let him go. It would have been cruel to stay with a man who loved me just so that I could "use" him for his money. That guilt would have eaten me up almost as much as the affair did. Have you ever considered what doubts your husband may still have about your reasons for staying in the marriage after your emotional affair? No, I don't wonder what doubts he has about my staying. I am more pre-occuppied with doubts as to why he chose to give me a second chance. My husband knows I stayed in this marriage...in fact, never considered leaving it...because I still do love him...despite the affair. And I love the life we created together..He also knows that life changed drastically over the last 3 years and we both know why. We are both working hard to get back what we had. He knows what I want...I want him and the life we had three years ago. He has no need to doubt it.
Owl Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 She's either "done"...in which case, booting her out and letting her start dealing with living life on her own without help from 5&10 is good for both of them........or.......she's not done, and it's a wake up call. You assume his wife is incapable or would have great difficulty surviving without him. If she moves out, BOTH OF THEM will have to start dealing with living life on their own without help from each other. It works both ways. And if it serves as a wake-up call, it's his wake-up call as well, to address problems in their marriage that have been neglected. Taylor...I think you and I are going to have to agree to disagree. I'll be honest...I used to agree with a lot of your posts, but in your posts I'm seeing less and less true regret over the affair, and more and more defense of the choice to cheat. Your posts are sounding a lot more like they did when you FIRST arrived here than they did shortly after you truly decided to end your affair and tell your husband the truth.
Dexter Morgan Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Seriously, you need to stop copying my style of posting. ahem, ....poser:p
Dexter Morgan Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Let me see if I have this straight. You admit to verbal abuse and you expect your wife to stay around? Well it seems that she just wanted to get off scott free with her EA and be able to continue to be around the OM on a daily basis. What is it about some WS's that think they should have the easy way to go with regards to their cheating? Fact of the matter here is, he found out about her EA, and there probably was even a PA for all he knew, she doesn't want to even try to find another job and thinks she should be able to be in the OM's presence and that her BS should be ok with it....all without suffering any consequences. The other alternative, rather than leaving her, would be for the OP to sit and take it. By her not having the fortitude to endure some words coming from 5&10 and him calling it like he sees it, shows that she wasn't too damn interested in making amends. he was in pain, she wasn't interested in doing right by him, so he lashed out...and understandably. And since her selfish ass couldn't handle him verbally expressing his frustration, she decided to leave...more than likely so she can pursue her OM and wasn't too damn interested in working on the marriage in the first place. or should a BS just keep their mouths shut and take it? Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps your verbal abuse could have been a part of the reason she has strayed? Have you ever stopped to think that the verbal abuse was only about her straying? Where did he say he "called a spade a spade" BEFORE the cheating? IMO, You need to change your behavior towards your wife if you expect her to stay married to you. Uh...ahem....she wasn't going to stay anyway. She refused to go NC with the other man. THAT is what he was so vocal about. At this point you both should seek MC and as for you IC.. to figure out what makes you angry. uh, her cheating and her unwillingness to change the situation with regards to seeing the OM on a daily basis..? maybe? NO one derserves to be put down with words. Ya, but he deserved to be cheated on didn't he? But out of curiosity, I wonder what "words" she had to endure? Was he calling her a cheater? If so, well hells bells...THAT is what she IS. Was he just very vocally announcing the truth? like the truth that she refuses to get away from the OM? 5&10...can you enlighten us? It would be really bad if you did call her names, such as "wh0re", or the C word...things like that. If you called her a cheater, well, you are simply stating a fact there. But really, was your verbal "abuse" in the form of flagrant name calling? Or were you just angry at her non-action and cussing alot? Please know, I am in NO way saying that your Wife is innocent here. There is no excuse for an affair and she need's to see that her bahavior was wrong. Good luck. So are you saying he had no right to express his anger at her unwillingness to make it right?
Author five&dime Posted May 11, 2009 Author Posted May 11, 2009 Mea - with regard to my admitted "verbal abuse," I am talking about the way I have responded to this situation AFTER D-Day and for the ten months I have endured her daily contact with OM. Our 20-year marriage was not one based on me verbally abusing her and her just taking it. She's too strong of a woman to have put up with such nonsense. Our situation is very cliche'. We were thick as thieves for the first 10 years of our marriage, living large on the beach in L.A. joined at the hip. We were best friends as well as spouses. We had fun together and were each other's best company. Then we moved to the midwest after the big earthquake in '94, two little kids came along, mortgage, jobs, bills, stress...just "life". Yes, I have not been pleasant after D-Day. I have not sat quietly by while she continued to work with OM. It hurt to see her leave everyday, so much so that I made a point to leave before her every morning and go to my "office" (Panera - I'm a working writer in the music biz and work at home.) I hated seeing her getting all prettied up for work and walking out the door because I knew she was going to be spending the next 8 hours with "him" just down the hall. It was just too painful just to watch her leave in the morning, so I made a habit of leaving the house for an hour before she left. Does that make sense? Yes, I told her I hated the situation. And, yes, angry words and emails and texts have flown. Call me a "verbal abuser" if you want to, and maybe the label is warranted to some degree. But this "verbal abuser" was responding to substantial long-term emotional abuse POST D-Day. Two wrongs don't make a right, I know. I also know that I did the best I could. Maybe it wasn't nearly good enough, but I did the best I could. IC since the beginning, 2 MC's, 15 books (my IC told me that I'd read so many "therapy" books in such a short time after D-Day that I needed to give the books a rest and that by this point I could probably write my own book.) I just wanted to clarify the "verbal abuser" tag. Thanks.
Dexter Morgan Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Mea - with regard to my admitted "verbal abuse," I am talking about the way I have responded to this situation AFTER D-Day and for the ten months I have endured her daily contact with OM. Our 20-year marriage was not one based on me verbally abusing her and her just taking it. She's too strong of a woman to have put up with such nonsense. Yes, I have not been pleasant after D-Day. I have not sat quietly by while she continued to work with OM. Yes, I told her I hated the situation. And, yes, angry words and emails and texts have flown. Call me a "verbal abuser" if you want to, and maybe the label is warranted to some degree. But this "verbal abuser" was responding to substantial long-term emotional abuse POST D-Day. well said 5&10. And also, as long as you weren't calling her some nasty names, your verbal expression of your anger at her laisez fairre attitude and unwillingness to do right by you is well justified. And if the worst name you called her was something on the lines of "cheater"...well too bad. It is a proper description of her character. But funny how she can't put up with some rough times and browbeating from you, but I bet she expected you to put up with her straying ways and piss poor attitude about what you should be able to endure and what she should be allowed to get away with.
Author five&dime Posted May 11, 2009 Author Posted May 11, 2009 Dexter - my verbal "abuse" has been of the "your so selfish"..."liar!"..."that's bulls**t!"..."you're talking out of both sides of your mouth!"...variety, with a few "F" bombs dropped along the way. You want more examples? "Say 'hi' to your boyfriend!" "Why should I believe a word you say?" "Your actions here are so self-serving!" "How do you think it "f"ing feels!" "How do you think your boss what feel about all of this?" (WS's response: "There you go with the threats again!") (Obviously, threatening to tell her boss or co-workers or friends = verbal abuse) "You'd feel the same "f"ing way if the tables were turned!"
Author five&dime Posted May 11, 2009 Author Posted May 11, 2009 Yes, my words have not been kind many times, and I suppose they've been pretty ugly at times. But they were borne out of pain from the situation I was forced to endure for the last 10 months: daily contact with OM and never an ounce of NC. And guess what? As I'm writing these words and processing her statement of three days ago that she "doesn't want to be married anymore" and "wants a separation," she's at the office with OM just steps away. Doesn't mean they're "doing it." Hell, maybe it's over between them. How would I know? I'm not down there with them. Can one just "turn it off" like that without separation? C'mon, ladies, can she do it? Is she that strong? He's a nice-looking chap, British accent and all! That accent's like catnip, right? And he's SO zen and mindful!
Dexter Morgan Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Dexter - my verbal "abuse" has been of the "your so selfish"..."liar!"..."that's bulls**t!"..."you're talking out of both sides of your mouth!"...variety, with a few "F" bombs dropped along the way. You want more examples? "Say 'hi' to your boyfriend!" "Why should I believe a word you say?" "Your actions here are so self-serving!" "How do you think it "f"ing feels!" "How do you think your boss what feel about all of this?" (WS's response: "There you go with the threats again!") (Obviously, threatening to tell her boss or co-workers or friends = verbal abuse) "You'd feel the same "f"ing way if the tables were turned!" thats not verbal abuse. Those are your feelings coming out in words. Funny how she can cheat, but your feelings are unbearable. If she can do this to you, but can't take well deserved heat for 10 months in her inability to do right by you, then she is even more selfish than with the cheating itself. consider yourself lucky that you are getting rid of her. get 1/2 her retirement and say adios.
Darth Vader Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 nothing here to "lose", but rather dispose of. I see your point! Good One!
Darth Vader Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 Mea - with regard to my admitted "verbal abuse," I am talking about the way I have responded to this situation AFTER D-Day and for the ten months I have endured her daily contact with OM. Our 20-year marriage was not one based on me verbally abusing her and her just taking it. She's too strong of a woman to have put up with such nonsense. Our situation is very cliche'. We were thick as thieves for the first 10 years of our marriage, living large on the beach in L.A. joined at the hip. We were best friends as well as spouses. We had fun together and were each other's best company. Then we moved to the midwest after the big earthquake in '94, two little kids came along, mortgage, jobs, bills, stress...just "life". Yes, I have not been pleasant after D-Day. I have not sat quietly by while she continued to work with OM. It hurt to see her leave everyday, so much so that I made a point to leave before her every morning and go to my "office" (Panera - I'm a working writer in the music biz and work at home.) I hated seeing her getting all prettied up for work and walking out the door because I knew she was going to be spending the next 8 hours with "him" just down the hall. It was just too painful just to watch her leave in the morning, so I made a habit of leaving the house for an hour before she left. Does that make sense? Yes, I told her I hated the situation. And, yes, angry words and emails and texts have flown. Call me a "verbal abuser" if you want to, and maybe the label is warranted to some degree. But this "verbal abuser" was responding to substantial long-term emotional abuse POST D-Day. Two wrongs don't make a right, I know. I also know that I did the best I could. Maybe it wasn't nearly good enough, but I did the best I could. IC since the beginning, 2 MC's, 15 books (my IC told me that I'd read so many "therapy" books in such a short time after D-Day that I needed to give the books a rest and that by this point I could probably write my own book.) I just wanted to clarify the "verbal abuser" tag. Thanks. You were just trying to do what's right, without being a "doormat" at the same time, that's my take!
Darth Vader Posted May 11, 2009 Posted May 11, 2009 thats not verbal abuse. Those are your feelings coming out in words. Funny how she can cheat, but your feelings are unbearable. If she can do this to you, but can't take well deserved heat for 10 months in her inability to do right by you, then she is even more selfish than with the cheating itself. consider yourself lucky that you are getting rid of her. get 1/2 her retirement and say adios. Word! I say go for it! It's so surprising to see many people in here wanting BS's to not stand up for themselves and just be a doormat, PLEASE!
Meaplus3 Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Mea - with regard to my admitted "verbal abuse," I am talking about the way I have responded to this situation AFTER D-Day and for the ten months I have endured her daily contact with OM. Our 20-year marriage was not one based on me verbally abusing her and her just taking it. She's too strong of a woman to have put up with such nonsense. Five, I must apologize to you as I have clearly read your post wrong. I was under the impression some how that the verabl abuse was going on long before the ea and d'ay.. sorry my mistake. I'm real sorry that your wife has cheated on you. I guess I my advice to you would be to seek marriage counseling. Do you want to save your marriage? Mea:)
tami-chan Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Stop hitting on me. LOL!!!! I was???? LOL!!! you can really be funny!:lmao:!
Windy27 Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Yes, my words have not been kind many times, and I suppose they've been pretty ugly at times. But they were borne out of pain from the situation I was forced to endure for the last 10 months: daily contact with OM and never an ounce of NC. And guess what? As I'm writing these words and processing her statement of three days ago that she "doesn't want to be married anymore" and "wants a separation," she's at the office with OM just steps away. Doesn't mean they're "doing it." Hell, maybe it's over between them. How would I know? I'm not down there with them. Can one just "turn it off" like that without separation? C'mon, ladies, can she do it? Is she that strong? He's a nice-looking chap, British accent and all! That accent's like catnip, right? And he's SO zen and mindful! You do know that affairs live off on secretcy, right? Once it's exposed, it's no longer romantic and fun, but something bad and shameful. My question for you is, WHY have you NOT exposed her affair to her work and her family and and friends?
Author five&dime Posted May 12, 2009 Author Posted May 12, 2009 Her relationship has been exposed to all family and friends. I've even written to OM, just recently. I needed to get it off of my chest, let him see his part in the destruction of a 20-year marriage and a cohesive family with two small children. I just wanted him to sit in the s**t for a while, not that he gives a s**t. The only real person of note who is not aware of this is her boss (well, and the people at her work). Remember, my wife is #2 at a 65-person multi-million dollar non-profit. I haven't exposed this to her boss because we depend on her income, especially in this horrible economy. It's been a real Catch-22. Neither of us earns enough to cover everything, her job has the medical benefits, yet she refused to change her job. On some level I've been hamstrung by that, and it's frustrating beyond words. Still, I gave her the latitude to try to change her job, but she never put her heart into doing it. Not by a long shot. 7-8 resumes in 10 months? 10 months! And nothing for the last couple of months. She stopped even pretending to try. Remember what she told me just a day ago: "I like my job! I'm good at it! I've been there for 11 years!" Yeah, and Zen master Dharma McDreamy (OM) has been there for the last 7.
Reggie Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Well, your WW is just an a-hole. How's that for profound?
Windy27 Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Her relationship has been exposed to all family and friends. I've even written to OM, just recently. I needed to get it off of my chest, let him see his part in the destruction of a 20-year marriage and a cohesive family with two small children. I just wanted him to sit in the s**t for a while, not that he gives a s**t. You wrote him? Like a letter or email? Why didn't you talk to him in PERSON? What exactly did you say in that letter and what was his response/excuse?
Chrome Barracuda Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 All this is madness five, just divorce the woman and wipe your hands clean of her. you dont deserve this. get a lawyer and go for 50/50 custody. Why are you putting up with this!?
LifesontheUp Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Money can't buy you happiness five&dime. I really do think she is past the point of no return. If I were you I would start the ball rolling, pack her some bags and tell her go find a place of her own. I'd rather be poor and happy than put up with what you have the last 10 months. She is cruel and manipulative and doesn't give a sh!% about you. Start the healing process, get her out of the house. Let that wound heal up instead of it being picked open each day she leaves for work to see the OM. I know how hard it is believe me, my xH, his OW and myself worked in the same office. I'd see them day in day out.
jwi71 Posted May 12, 2009 Posted May 12, 2009 Her relationship has been exposed to all family and friends. I've even written to OM, just recently. I needed to get it off of my chest, let him see his part in the destruction of a 20-year marriage and a cohesive family with two small children. I just wanted him to sit in the s**t for a while, not that he gives a s**t. The only real person of note who is not aware of this is her boss (well, and the people at her work). Remember, my wife is #2 at a 65-person multi-million dollar non-profit. I haven't exposed this to her boss because we depend on her income, especially in this horrible economy. It's been a real Catch-22. Neither of us earns enough to cover everything, her job has the medical benefits, yet she refused to change her job. On some level I've been hamstrung by that, and it's frustrating beyond words. Still, I gave her the latitude to try to change her job, but she never put her heart into doing it. Not by a long shot. 7-8 resumes in 10 months? 10 months! And nothing for the last couple of months. She stopped even pretending to try. Remember what she told me just a day ago: "I like my job! I'm good at it! I've been there for 11 years!" Yeah, and Zen master Dharma McDreamy (OM) has been there for the last 7. You have to change your thinking. STOP trying to have everything. You can't. You either have the house and all but lose your sanity/dignity. Or you lose the house and all but keep your sanity/dignity. Do you make enough money to survive? I mean can you afford a small place of your own, pay the bills and live. Nothing more than - can you survive?
Recommended Posts