spackler Posted May 3, 2009 Posted May 3, 2009 Hi all, I've been married for almost 16 years now. Have a 7 and 10 year old with my wife who I love very much. I am a passionate, loving person. I feel that because I am this way and express myself this way that I also need to feel that from my wife. I hug my kids every day at least 3 or 4 times. I hug my wife just as much and kiss her as well. I, however, do not receive this from my wife. I literally 'receive' about 2 or 3 hugs per month that are initiated by her out of the blue. It's hard to remember 16 years ago and if she was just like this then, but I don't think she was. She has been this way for as long as I can remember though and I am now feeling like it is leaving me with a huge gap in my life that I need. I want my wife to show me that she loves me and is passionate and in love with me. I've talked to her about it what seems like every 3 months over the past 10 years. After the pep talk she seems to be better for about a week, then drops back into her normal self. It seems like she's running a business with our relationship and I'm sure having kids is a factor, but she is over the top with it. She has been a stay at home mom since 2000 as this is what she wanted. We don't see eye to eye in how we raise our kids but we try to work through it. I feel like I understand that relationships have ups and downs but you shouldn't let it affect how you show your spouse that you love them. I just get this feeling that she hates me more and more after every single disagreement we have ... and doesn't recover from it. She says she doesn't hate me and loves me, but I feel actions speak louder than words. She says she's just not a touchy, feely type person. That just makes me sad because I need that in my life. It's almost a lifeblood to me. Lacking this over the past 10 years has made a part of me very sad and upset. I get bummed out whenever I see any woman giving their man affection. The affection I get from my wife is like a friend patting you on the back and saying 'love ya'. And yes, that's how she says she loves me. We had major downs when we were first married in the 90's, but that was eons ago and I felt we were both past it. Hers was infidelity and mine was saying she was fat. I was dead wrong though and must have been under some kind of alien spell to be thinking that. We forgave each other and agreed to move on. So i don't know what to think about my whole situation. I'm sure I'll hear people say to seek counseling...and I plan on that. But I'd like to get some personal opinions on this issue from anonymous internet strangers first. Thanks for reading.
lkjh Posted May 3, 2009 Posted May 3, 2009 So she isn't that loving towards you? Have you gone to MC or tried communicating better? Also, if she cheated before it may be possible that she is doing it again.
taylor Posted May 3, 2009 Posted May 3, 2009 Some questions... Is your wife affectionate with the children? Does she hug them..but not you? Or is she as stand-offish with the kids as she is to you? How long ago was the infidelity? Did this get addressed in counseling? What defining issues were there in your marriage prior to the infidelity? Did those get resolved since then? What does your wife tell you when you tell her you need affection?
Lucky_One Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Some people just aren't that hug-gy. If she has been this way for as long as you remember, then it's likely that she has always been that way. I don't actually want to be hugged 3-4 times a day. That would end up driving me nuts. I like a little touch when we pass, or holding hands when we walk, or laying on the couch together with my head on his chest, but to me, hugs would occur when I am standing up and probably busy.
Stung Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 have to agree with bent on the touching issue. nobody can say for sure if this is the case with your wife, of course. however, i am currently a stay-at-home mom, and i find i am MUCH less physically affectionate than i was before my son was born. i love my partner very much, still love sex and the occasional cuddle and want him to know i feel affection for him, but...i have a baby crawling on me all day long, always needing touch, nursing, my physical self. my partner works long hours, and frequently by the time he gets home my nerves are really jangled and i just need time to myself with nobody demanding all over me, or handling my body as if it belonged to them. obviously i love my son, and it's hopefully just a stage. personally, i find i am much more amenable to touch and sex if my partner comes home a little earlier than usual and takes the baby into an entirely different part of the house, giving me at least an hour to myself every evening so i can hear myself think and feel like my body belongs to me again.
Mr. Lucky Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 personally, i find i am much more amenable to touch and sex if my partner comes home a little earlier than usual and takes the baby into an entirely different part of the house, giving me at least an hour to myself every evening so i can hear myself think and feel like my body belongs to me again. Have you expressed this to him? I used to really enjoy and look forward to one-on-one time with my kids when they were small. Perhaps your H would feel the same way... Mr. Lucky
Stung Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Have you expressed this to him? I used to really enjoy and look forward to one-on-one time with my kids when they were small. Perhaps your H would feel the same way... Mr. Lucky thanks for your concern, mr. lucky. i have expressed this to him, and he was totally understanding once i explained to him how it's kind of a constant sensory overload, esp. when our son is colicky. he's a good dad, and happy to take the baby when he can, but because of the nature of his work, it's inevitable that i am alone with the baby for most of his waking hours. the kid's only five months old so we are still hitting our stride with figuring out how to make it work. my partner tries to arrange at least one, sometimes two days per week when he gets home a couple of hours earlier and takes the baby, giving me time to write, take a bath, go to the cafe, etc. he also takes the baby for the majority of one day per weekend, except for feedings...handles all the diaper changes and gives him his bath, etc. it really does help rejuvenate me and on those days i usually find myself cuddling with my partner more, relaxing into him more like i used to, and initiating sex. we still have sex 3, sometimes 4x per week, so...that's less frequently than we used to, but not too bad for a couple with a nursing baby who still doesn't sleep through the night, i think.
Author spackler Posted May 4, 2009 Author Posted May 4, 2009 Thanks for the responses. I'll try to hit on everything here. We have gone to MC in the past on a couple of occasions. She is always defensive at MC. It just becomes unproductive. She would better benefit from IC but she wouldn't go because she doesn't think there's anything wrong. Our kids are 7 and 10. They are in school all day long so she doesn't have them climbing all over her. She hugs the kids. The big joke I lay on her is how much affection she gives the cat over me. I've told her if she pet me like that I'd purr too. Infidelity occurred right out of the box in our first year of marriage. Lasted over a span of 3 years. Then I found out and it was over. The defining issue was what I mentioned above. I had conversations with her about fat. I was wrong, I have been the polar opposite of that person since then. Back then, the fat on an anorexic person would have bothered me. But I am not that person anymore. I compliment my wife a lot. So I feel I resolved my issues. I can't speak for my wife though. She says she's fine. It seems like every 3 months that we get into a discussion about this. She always says she'll try to do better and it lasts about a week. Then we have a small disagreement...which happens between couples...and that's pretty much the end of it. She is never the aggressor for anything physical. She enjoys sex when we do have it and she does orgasm. I feel I'm there for her for anything yet she is not so open about it. Maybe there are pent up intimacy issues with her. It seems like she won't let me 'have' all of her emotionally. Lucky One, what you describe about not wanting to be hugged 3-4 times a day is fine. But you do the other stuff. My wife isn't like that. There is no touching on her part when we pass. It's more like I'm in the way. I believe she tries hard to avoid getting too near me sometimes. I would say though that she's not a huggy type of person but in a marriage that can be a death sentence. If you can't show you're partner you love them, then the love may go away. Thanks for the book recommendation...I'll look it up. I will say though that it will still be difficult for me. If that's the way she is, then I will be missing someone who is passionate towards me. I feel I need that and have been missing that for too long. Sex 3x per week???? Your husband is a lucky man. Do you initiate this or is it always him? In my relationship we are at about one time per week and I always initiate it. It almost seems like she feels it's wrong for a woman to initiate any kind of sexual activity. Makes me feel like I'm forcing myself upon her. It would be nice to be pursued just once.
voldigicam Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Perhaps there's too much family time and too little couple time. Might either propose or simply start setting up couples times. Outside of the house. Get to know each other again, with no expectations. A cabin in the mountains is really nice. Or whatever. Even just a date once a week works wonders. My wife and I used to spend lots of time cycling together, which was our special bonding time and made a tremendous difference. Now we're substituting an evening or two a week in our bedroom away from the kids. I still go stir crazy, so I go out with a friend once a week or so. Usually walking, but sometimes doing something else. Gives that outside perspective. I suspect these functions are important in relationships. Family time, relationship time, outside friend time, and solo time. If it's all family time, things get really difficult! Your kids are pretty close to leave alone age. I have a teen and a 10, so we can leave them for evenings.
Admiral Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 She isn't sexually attracted to you. This happens all the time in long term relationships. It's far easier to prevent than cure, and far easier to fix early than it is to fix it when it's late. You need to build up her attraction again. You are the man, you should be in charge of the relationship - but she is, and has been for a long time. If you don't know how to build attraction, you need to learn. If you can't get her attracted to you again, you have two choices: 1. Live in a sexless marriage for the rest of your life. 2. Divorce her. After the pep talk she seems to be better for about a week, then drops back into her normal self. Duh. She is controlling you with infrequent, mediocre sex. She isn't doing it out of attraction for you, she is doing it out of what she feels is obligation. Hers was infidelity and mine was saying she was fat When you stay with a cheater, they lose their respect and attraction for you. She says she doesn't hate me and loves me, but I feel actions speak louder than words. She says she's just not a touchy, feely type person If you was attracted to you, she'd be touchy feely. Lacking this over the past 10 years has made a part of me very sad and upset. This relationship is miserable. Relationships are about FUN. They are NOT about, "work", or "commitment", or "compromise", or "obligation". It's almost a lifeblood to me You've spend the past decade compromising on one of the most important aspects of you life.
Jersey Shortie Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Talking to your wife about what you need is great. But you might have a better chance of getting what you want on a more regular basis if you court her again and play on her emotions. Alot of men wonder why their partner stops having sex with them. Sometimes the guys stop doing those things in the beginning of the relationship that made you feel that spark. make her feel excited again.
carhill Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Whatever is within her which caused her to be unfaithful in the first year of your marriage is still there. She's not feeling your M, she's thinking it. Bad news. Sorry. IMO, there is nothing you can do to change that. She hasn't believed in you for a long time
manugeorge Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 OR just consider that she is naturally not a touchy feely kind of person. She is your wife of 16 years, you SHOULD know a thing or two about her. So is she or is she not? Try hard to think back to when you first met, was she affectionate? I mean when the initial buzz wore off? It shouldn't be that hard to remember. If she changed along the way somewhere, then you should know. If she never has been affectionate and you are thinking--hey, how hard could it be for her to give the occasional hug, since that's all I really need?. I would say you are barking up the wrong tree. Consider it impossible--for her. Assume she will never be more affectionate than she is now, and then decide if you can be happy with her as she is. I will tell your first hand if someone is not the type to be physically affectionate, faking it just to please a partner is draining and exhausting. Not to mention uncomfortable. While compromise is good in any relationship, you also have to leave plenty of room for people to be who they are. Afterall, you marrying them was esentially proclaiming that you will accept them AS THEY ARE.
Nikki Sahagin Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 How is your sex life? Do you think the physical withdrawal is something to do with the fact that she cheated? Guilt? Is she doing it again? Pressures at home? Do you communicate well?
Author spackler Posted May 5, 2009 Author Posted May 5, 2009 I totally agree that she's not sexually attracted to me. I've told her that I think this may be the case as well. She always seems to be angry...and at the drop of a hat too. I wonder if some if this may be menopause? I've asked her why she hates me so much and she says she doesn't. But her actions don't represent that. This morning she said I should call the school principal regarding an issue in school (in front of the kids) and I said we could talk about it after they left for school (not in front of the ids). She gave me an evil sneer and gritted her teeth. I didn't think it was appropriate to make a big deal of the phone call in front of the kids and didn't want to discuss the issue. Just weird stuff like that. I just wish she had some passion in her for her marriage. It's more like a business to her. Sex life is once a week. That's not the big deal to me though. I want daily affirmations. Hugs, touches, kisses, etc. Mix it up. Goota run...wifey.
Stung Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 it sounds to me like she is repressing a lot of emotions. if she's not expressing how she feels, it's getting bottled up inside, making her temper more volatile and throttling her affectionate feelings. could she resent you for something? i'm not excusing her prior infidelity, but it sounds like it didn't come out of a vacuum, you have admitted that you were unreasonably, unwarrantedly critical and made her feel bad about herself. is this a pattern with you, maybe one you're not aware of? it definitely sounds like both of you are unhappy, for whatever reasons, and that should be addressed. i'd try going into MC again, and maybe IC for BOTH of you. why is she so defensive? is it because she just naturally has a hard time opening up, dealing with her emotions? or could it also be that your criticism puts her on the defensive?
Author spackler Posted May 5, 2009 Author Posted May 5, 2009 it sounds to me like she is repressing a lot of emotions. if she's not expressing how she feels, it's getting bottled up inside, making her temper more volatile and throttling her affectionate feelings. could she resent you for something? i'm not excusing her prior infidelity, but it sounds like it didn't come out of a vacuum, you have admitted that you were unreasonably, unwarrantedly critical and made her feel bad about herself. is this a pattern with you, maybe one you're not aware of? it definitely sounds like both of you are unhappy, for whatever reasons, and that should be addressed. i'd try going into MC again, and maybe IC for BOTH of you. why is she so defensive? is it because she just naturally has a hard time opening up, dealing with her emotions? or could it also be that your criticism puts her on the defensive? I think she has a hard time handling her emotions AND some of my criticism puts her on the defensive. I believe I am only really upset with her lack of passion for me. That's the bottom line to me. Everything else I can handle and expect in a relationship. I'd love to have some type of affection daily whether it be a brushing, kiss, hug, whatever. I told her tonight that she walks by me like two strangers would walk by each other on a sidewalk. I asked her tonight if she has any resentment towards me about something I did or said and she said no. We were talking about her lack of passion for me. She just came up to me and kissed me. Anytime we have to talk about it like we did tonight, she frees herself up for a week and shows some interest...then she drops back down to her normal cold self. ???
quankanne Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 spack, not to be the harbinger of doom ... but it sounds like your wife has given up on the marriage and is only sticking around because it's not really *that* horrible and to divorce would remove the safety net you've provided all these years. Does she feel she's settled after having the affair, or does she still blame you for not loving her as she is (i.e. the fat comments)? Basically, she's existing within the framework of your marriage, the perk is that you want her enough to pursue her, that you're not going to leave, etc. time to get back into marriage counseling and get down to the roots of what it is she's blaming you for. Because believe me, she blames you and disconnecting is her way of coping with the situation. And she'd much rather do that than attempt to reconnect because she's possibly afraid that you're going to say something else to make her feel bad about herself.
carhill Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Give her some stuff and get out. Nothing worse than a soul-sucking woman and that's what you have. I flagellate myself for a good cause
carhill Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Sex drive has nothing to do with expressing love and affection non-sexually. My drive has been in the toilet for a few years and I still can and desire intimate non-sexual contact. I'm hearing the OP talking about some hugs and physical touching, not BJ's... Unless you've been with a woman who seldom or never is proactively affectionate, you have no clue what that does to the psyche, IMO.
carhill Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 There's a big difference. A "similar" man would be affectionate but have no interest in sex nor make you feel sexy nor desirable. Try that on for size That's what I became after years of dealing with my wife.
Gamine Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 I'm married 13 1/2 years and consider myself to be a very sensuous woman. I'm getting that out there before I let it fly... I totally 'get' that sex is a priority for men in a marriage but come on... There is nothing that will turn a woman off more than a man simply having sexual needs.... A woman needs to feel that he has sexual needs that arise because of them... not just a biological function. When a guy starts to relate to women in a way that suggests they are entitled to be taken care of sexually that will breed resentment. Part of what made things super exciting for me when I first got together with my husband was the intensity... this was created by the two of us having sexual tension. If he had shown up to my front door for a meal and to be sexually serviced I would have slammed the door in his face. Often men (and women too) have this attitude that marriage entitles them to unlimited passes to fun town. The operative word here is entitled. If you want to turn a woman off, act like you are entitled to sex because you married her. If you want to turn a woman on, let her know that she is being courted by you... and no, I don't mean by the 'going through the motions' manufactured DATE NIGHT. Pursue her because you lust after her. Don't approach her expecting her to service you... or expecting routine sexual activity because you are entitled to it. As a woman I can think of almost nothing more annoying or de-womanizing than that. It is a female lust killer.
carhill Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 Finished with the past too. Now are we done, can we get back to offering the OP advice:pOK, sure. MC will clarify things for him, if they choose to go. I know our MC questioned my wife about medical issues as part of the process and encouraged her to take steps and try things to feel "better". She had taken Prozac and other AD drugs in the past, both prior to and after our M, though did not as part of the therapy process. So, perhaps, the OP can push angles and maybe that will help. It didn't help us. At the risk of repeating myself, it is my firm opinion that the OP's W is "thinking" the M rather than "feeling" it. If correct, doing so creates a totally different dynamic, complete with different signals and actions/words. I sense that he feels this, just by how he describes their interaction. MC will help him define it specifically and understand his emotions better. Many men would've enjoyed the FWB-type marriage my wife and I have had. I do not. Incompatibility. I hope the OP finds his truth
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