I want to scream and shout, but is it better to swallow the hurt with dignity?

May 2, 2009

Background: Good male friend, I wanted more, he didn't, instead of saying 'no, I want more' when I got the I don't want a relationship spiel and walking away, I agreed to be his friend, we grew very close, spent a lot of time together.

After a few months of this I told him that I didn't think our friendship was healthy for me, that he was preventing me from meeting someone who did want me and I'd need to create a gap there to allow someone else in, and he said that he'd have to sort out his relationship issues, but didn't, nor did he allow me to have the space from him I said I needed, phonecalls increased, time spent together increased and things kind of went on as they had been and I allowed them to, because it's flattering to have someone pay you that much attention and even if you know it's not good for you, when you've fallen for someone it's very hard to voluntarily push them out of your life.

Now, he's back with his ex-wife, who he wants me to be bosom buddies with, but who has done everything in her power to get rid of me from his life. I wasn't asking for much, just maybe the odd drink once every few weeks to catch up and laugh and talk like we used to. I never, ever made a move on him or would give either him or her any concern that I was going to take him from her (even though she was his ex...so none of that should have been an issue), but I'm not the type of girl who would ignore someone when they say they don't want a relationship with me. I took him at his word and didn't try to seduce him or whatever.

Also I knew his ex was determined to get him back, so I kept myself firmly in the friendzone even though it made me very sad that he didn't want more from me and made me feel very unsexy and unattractive thus, again, preventing me from meeting someone who did want me - who wants a miserable woman who feels unworthy, unloved and undeserving of more than friendship from a man she's attracted to?

Anyway, the problem now is, I'm f*****g lonely, he was a very big part of my life, when most of my friends are coupled up and I'm single, he was someone, in fact the only friend who was also single, who was my age that I could go out and have fun with, someone to talk on the phone with, someone to confide in while all my coupled up friends were staying in together watching dvds on a Saturday night. So, he certainly filled a gap for me, and likewise for him.

Now that I've basically been dumped there is a big hole there in my life, sure he still talks to me, briefly, about inconsequential stuff, and guaranteed if I see him even for 5 minutes, his former ex will call him and demand he returns to her - this has happened not just with me, but with his male friends as well, I think she's afraid that if she allows him any kind of life outside of her that she'll lose him - this was going on while they were ex's, she simply wouldn't accept it was over and has finally got him back, so she's not only alientated me, but everyone else other than her from his life too.

So, I'm lonely, I'm really really hurt that I've been dropped like that, I feel utterly used, as a stop-gap between his last ex and now his ex-wife getting him back. I've totally pulled back from him, try not to speak with him any more than necessary while still keeping a friendly facade (me him and his former ex all have contact with each other most days due to the situation I'm in, so I can't simply never see either of them ever again, which makes things even more difficult for me).

The thing is. I'm so hurt and angry I want to scream at him and tell him that he's really, really hurt me, that I don't appreciate being used and then dropped in favour of a woman who treats him like s**t, treats me like s**t, who's ruined what once was a good friendship between me and him and yadda yadda yadda.

I want to get the anger out and yet it's not going to change anything, he's with her now, she is now his best friend and I am not, he's made his choice and yet it really annoying not to let him know that he's made my life an utter misery and has hurt me.

So, should I simply keep avoiding him (and her) and let actions speak louder than words and let him lie in the bed that he's made? Or should I let the anger out and have done with it...I want to follow the road that will get me over this hurt period in the swiftest way possible and holding on to all this anger is stopping me sleeping, taking up most of my thoughts every day and so on.

And yet, I feel the dignified thing to do is to simply absent myself from the situation and somehow quash all the swirling emotions going on inside my head without saying anything. Any suggestions as what way is better? Bearing in mind that until my financial situation improves that I have to see these two people on a regular basis. Anger out once and for all and thereafter keep my distance, or keep schtum and keep my distance?

May 2, 2009

Background: Good male friend, I wanted more, he didn't, instead of saying 'no, I want more' when I got the I don't want a relationship spiel and walking away, I agreed to be his friend, we grew very close, spent a lot of time together.

After a few months of this I told him that I didn't think our friendship was healthy for me, that he was preventing me from meeting someone who did want me and I'd need to create a gap there to allow someone else in, and he said that he'd have to sort out his relationship issues, but didn't, nor did he allow me to have the space from him I said I needed, phonecalls increased, time spent together increased and things kind of went on as they had been and I allowed them to, because it's flattering to have someone pay you that much attention and even if you know it's not good for you, when you've fallen for someone it's very hard to voluntarily push them out of your life.

Now, he's back with his ex-wife, who he wants me to be bosom buddies with, but who has done everything in her power to get rid of me from his life. I wasn't asking for much, just maybe the odd drink once every few weeks to catch up and laugh and talk like we used to. I never, ever made a move on him or would give either him or her any concern that I was going to take him from her (even though she was his ex...so none of that should have been an issue), but I'm not the type of girl who would ignore someone when they say they don't want a relationship with me. I took him at his word and didn't try to seduce him or whatever.

Also I knew his ex was determined to get him back, so I kept myself firmly in the friendzone even though it made me very sad that he didn't want more from me and made me feel very unsexy and unattractive thus, again, preventing me from meeting someone who did want me - who wants a miserable woman who feels unworthy, unloved and undeserving of more than friendship from a man she's attracted to?

Anyway, the problem now is, I'm f*****g lonely, he was a very big part of my life, when most of my friends are coupled up and I'm single, he was someone, in fact the only friend who was also single, who was my age that I could go out and have fun with, someone to talk on the phone with, someone to confide in while all my coupled up friends were staying in together watching dvds on a Saturday night. So, he certainly filled a gap for me, and likewise for him.

Now that I've basically been dumped there is a big hole there in my life, sure he still talks to me, briefly, about inconsequential stuff, and guaranteed if I see him even for 5 minutes, his former ex will call him and demand he returns to her - this has happened not just with me, but with his male friends as well, I think she's afraid that if she allows him any kind of life outside of her that she'll lose him - this was going on while they were ex's, she simply wouldn't accept it was over and has finally got him back, so she's not only alientated me, but everyone else other than her from his life too.

So, I'm lonely, I'm really really hurt that I've been dropped like that, I feel utterly used, as a stop-gap between his last ex and now his ex-wife getting him back. I've totally pulled back from him, try not to speak with him any more than necessary while still keeping a friendly facade (me him and his former ex all have contact with each other most days due to the situation I'm in, so I can't simply never see either of them ever again, which makes things even more difficult for me).

The thing is. I'm so hurt and angry I want to scream at him and tell him that he's really, really hurt me, that I don't appreciate being used and then dropped in favour of a woman who treats him like s**t, treats me like s**t, who's ruined what once was a good friendship between me and him and yadda yadda yadda.

I want to get the anger out and yet it's not going to change anything, he's with her now, she is now his best friend and I am not, he's made his choice and yet it really annoying not to let him know that he's made my life an utter misery and has hurt me.

So, should I simply keep avoiding him (and her) and let actions speak louder than words and let him lie in the bed that he's made? Or should I let the anger out and have done with it...I want to follow the road that will get me over this hurt period in the swiftest way possible and holding on to all this anger is stopping me sleeping, taking up most of my thoughts every day and so on.

And yet, I feel the dignified thing to do is to simply absent myself from the situation and somehow quash all the swirling emotions going on inside my head without saying anything. Any suggestions as what way is better? Bearing in mind that until my financial situation improves that I have to see these two people on a regular basis. Anger out once and for all and thereafter keep my distance, or keep schtum and keep my distance?

Make him realize what he's done to you.

This anger will eat you up like a festering wound and will do you harm the longer it is bottled up.

May 2, 2009

I know how you feel. I vote for scream and shout. Otherwise he will think you are a complete doormat that he can throw away. Honestly, for years I have been holding my emotions in, always doing what I thought others wanted me to do, never unpleasant, always swallowed the hurt and pretend that it didn't matter.

In the last year or so I have made progress in letting people know when they have hurt me. I would tell them almost exactly what's on my mind and if that means losing them then so be it.

And you know what? People actually repsect me more now than when I was a doormat. I have not lost one friend by being outspoken about my anger/hurt etc.

So go for it and let him have it. He deserves it and you will feel better about yourself.

May 2, 2009

@paddington,

Being a doormat (pardon the term) lowers your self esteem. It's best to stand up for yourself, and earn respect. It does you good in the long run.

May 2, 2009

Thanks guys...I have to say I'm surprised, I thought I'd get the keep your mouth shut and your dignity answer.

Interesting BlueEyed Girl that you've reversed that pattern and that it worked out - guess I should be doing the same, not be a people pleaser and risk losing people rather than letting them walk all over me. Glad you've been through that experiment, you're never sure how these things work out, so am unsure what the outcome will be.

I should mention at this point that there was already an almighty row when his ex was trying to force me into something I didn't want to do in order that she gets money (I barely knew her at the time). I refused and she got angry with me. I then got angry with her in return and I rang my friend and told him that I didn't want to see or have anything to do with his ex ever again, that I wouldn't be used and abused and walked all over like that...and you know what? He defended her up to the hilt, she then waded in and made me out to be some kind of horrible person for refusing to partake in fraudulent activity to benefit her financially.

So, in a way I have already lost the head with him and it served no purpose, he is under her thrall completely, sure he said he didn't want to lose me and no matter what, we'd always be friends, right? and so on. Nevertheless, actions speak louder than words, nothing's changed and I'm still angry with him and haven't told him what I think of his behaviour towards me in all of this.

May 2, 2009

Thanks guys...I have to say I'm surprised, I thought I'd get the keep your mouth shut and your dignity answer.

Interesting BlueEyed Girl that you've reversed that pattern and that it worked out - guess I should be doing the same, not be a people pleaser and risk losing people rather than letting them walk all over me. Glad you've been through that experiment, you're never sure how these things work out, so am unsure what the outcome will be.

I should mention at this point that there was already an almighty row when his ex was trying to force me into something I didn't want to do in order that she gets money (I barely knew her at the time). I refused and she got angry with me. I then got angry with her in return and I rang my friend and told him that I didn't want to see or have anything to do with his ex ever again, that I wouldn't be used and abused and walked all over like that...and you know what? He defended her up to the hilt, she then waded in and made me out to be some kind of horrible person for refusing to partake in fraudulent activity to benefit her financially.

So, in a way I have already lost the head with him and it served no purpose, he is under her thrall completely, sure he said he didn't want to lose me and no matter what, we'd always be friends, right? and so on. Nevertheless, actions speak louder than words, nothing's changed and I'm still angry with him and haven't told him what I think of his behaviour towards me in all of this.

Just don't keep it bottled up for too long though.

May 2, 2009

paddington bear, I like your posts. I enjoy hearing from a woman who holds that mirror up and examines the reflection.

I'm curious, with this guy, if you knew he was not attracted to you romantically even prior to the spiel. I remember a post by you about that dynamic and how you feel your brain muddles things up when you are attracted to a man.

Topically, these words stand out:

if I see him even for 5 minutes, his former ex will call him and demand he returns to her - this has happened not just with me, but with his male friends as well, I think she's afraid that if she allows him any kind of life outside of her that she'll lose him

Was this a surprise to you? Not the -ex situation, but that his psychology impels him to accept this kind of behavior.... and, if not, and if you feel this psychology is incompatible, what about yourself allowed you to bond emotionally with this man so you now feel like there's a hole in yourself.

I ponder these questions, as recently as last night. How do we allow one person in such a circumstance to take on a role of marked importance in our lives? What is it about our psychology which allows that?

My best advice is to take some time away from this friend to allow yourself to heal, accept the hurt and speak about it in terms of what you see in that mirror; what it says about you and how you can grow as a person. Take those feelings of love and project them outward and be watchful for a compatible and available man. He will recognize, if he's ready for a loving relationship, those aspects of you which were lost upon this "friend". He'll see your essence.

Best wishes to you and thanks again for your insights.

May 2, 2009

I wish there were a group called "Ex's Anonymous". EA, for short. People who are trying to get emotionally regroup from ex-boyfriends, husbands, feck-buddies, friend crushes, all may join. It would be a safe place to vent about your addiction to said person. The key is that you cannot go back. You cannot have one "sip". One phone call, one visit, one text or email. NO CONTACT.

This sounds like a huge emotional mess for you. There is a lot going on here. You have lost a very good friend. There aren't many other friends so you are lonely for any type of companionship. You feel rejected, and you've been passed over by the object of your affection. Yikes!! Emotional IV, stat!

I would tell him how you feel. If you were that close, then you should be able to tell him. He probably knows, and he probably feels a little guilty about that. Get it out, girl.

After you do that, NO CONTACT. At all. And it's time to start finding some new friends. Find a passion, join a group, get out there.

May 2, 2009

paddington bear, I like your posts. I enjoy hearing from a woman who holds that mirror up and examines the reflection.

I'm curious, with this guy, if you knew he was not attracted to you romantically even prior to the spiel. I remember a post by you about that dynamic and how you feel your brain muddles things up when you are attracted to a man.

Topically, these words stand out:

Was this a surprise to you? Not the -ex situation, but that his psychology impels him to accept this kind of behavior.... and, if not, and if you feel this psychology is incompatible, what about yourself allowed you to bond emotionally with this man so you now feel like there's a hole in yourself.

I ponder these questions, as recently as last night. How do we allow one person in such a circumstance to take on a role of marked importance in our lives? What is it about our psychology which allows that?

My best advice is to take some time away from this friend to allow yourself to heal, accept the hurt and speak about it in terms of what you see in that mirror; what it says about you and how you can grow as a person. Take those feelings of love and project them outward and be watchful for a compatible and available man. He will recognize, if he's ready for a loving relationship, those aspects of you which were lost upon this "friend". He'll see your essence.

Best wishes to you and thanks again for your insights.

Hi Carhill, and thanks, I might say the same for your posts, always insightful and well thought out.

Ok, to answer some of your questions. I didn't know he wasn't attracted to me before the spiel. When a guy asks you out on what I suppose would normally be considered dates, just me and him, going for drinks or going dancing and lots of long phone calls always initiated by him in the times in between.

Around the time of the spiel, I was trying to build up the courage to ask him whether this was going anywhere romantically because I was confused and just wanted to know either way. He seemed to want to be with me, take me out, buy me drinks, but didn't make any kind of a move on me so my head was a mess.

He saved me the trouble with the 'My life is complicated enough, I'm not ready for a relationship right now speech'...which actually, as it turns out, is true, he's not ready for a relationship because he was still emotionally connected very much so to his ex wife. In the period where I met him, she was his 'ex', he felt a responsibility to her, and guilt about whatever things went on in their relationship, wanted to cut her from his life, but felt that he couldn't do that either.

Regarding your point: "Was this a surprise to you? Not the -ex situation, but that his psychology impels him to accept this kind of behavior.... and, if not, and if you feel this psychology is incompatible, what about yourself allowed you to bond emotionally with this man so you now feel like there's a hole in yourself."

He had distanced himself from his ex during our time of being close friends, the way I saw him was as a strong, independent man, who I really respected, his opinions, his talents etc. I've watched as his ex has emotionally manipulated him slowly over the months until he's transformed into well, basically a doormat, a dog on a leash that she yanks and he comes running. And so, I've now lost whatever respect I had for him, he is not the man I thought he was, or the same person that I knew. However, despite everything, he was one of the good 'uns, obviously not destined for me, but I hate seeing a good man allow himself be treated so badly (there is a lot more about being treated badly...very very bad things, put it this way, his former ex will stop at nothing, and I mean nothing, to get what she wants.)

And yeah I know damn well why I allowed myself to get so close to him. I'm an attractive, intelligent woman, who has lots of friends, has a very supportive family, has been described at times as beautiful and stunning and funny and wonderful and all of that...and yet, I've been single for years and years, which I find absolutely mystifying. Sure there was the odd fling and one night stand peppering years of being without a man. So when this man came along and said he wanted only friendship I thought, well, something is better than nothing, it's not like anyone wants me anyway - I know that sounds terribly defeatist, but the reality is, that I never get asked out on dates, I am surrounded by couples with no means to meet other singles of my age (36 in case you're wondering), so having some kind of male presence in my life, taking the crumbs instead of the whole cake seemed to make some sort of twisted sense at the time.

I tried really hard to do the friendship thing and not allow him into my heart, but he didn't act like a normal guy who was trying to keep a healthy distance from a girl he knew liked him romantically. He called me on the phone constantly, invited me out constantly just him and me. When I was in trouble financially and thought I'd have to leave the country I now live in and was terribly worried, depressed and miserable, he found me work. But that work involved working with him, abroad so that we lived together and worked together for months.

I had, at the time been thinking, great, he'll be working abroad, I won't see him, that will naturally create some distance, and really, believe me, I wouldn't have taken on that job if there had been any other way. And that put the nail in the coffin for me, spending all that time together, him cooking me meals in the evenings and so on. So while I can examine my actions within the whole situation, he also made it very difficult for me to keep him at a distance, saying things like 'I don't want to lose you' 'I'm not letting you leave' and so on, while not ever taking things any further, and sure there was jealousy on his part when any other man came near me, he would immediately come over and scare them away (he's a big, serious looking guy who looks like he could snap you in two), so that was also really confusing for me. I guess the confusion has ended now though Got the message loud and clear, finally. I guess mixed signals are exactly that, because the guy's mind is all mixed and muddled up regarding their emotions and intentions towards you...however, funnily enough when someone else who they do want comes along all those mixed signals disappear abruptly.

Cherry Blossom, God I wish there was an ex's anonymous too! Maybe I'll set one up! The no contact thing is difficult, as I said, I basically will automatically see him and his wife most days of the week, which is hard for me. I also don't want to piss her off because she's a mentally unstable woman who is capable of anything when crossed - I should feel sorry for her, but I don't - I'm the one who's ended up in therapy over all of this, when in fact that messed up girl is the one who really needs some help. Anyway, I digress. You're right - I like the way you say, not one 'sip'! It's not totally possible right now for me to do absolute no contact, but I can get as close as possible...I'm trying right now to figure out a way to remove myself from both of them permanently, but that requires a lot of other things to change too, which is going to take time.

Sorry...my apologies for another long post...it helps to just write it all down and get it out of my head. Back to Carhill, yes, your advice is spot on, he didn't see my worth, someone else will (or maybe not...judging by my disastrous lack of love life), but at least I won't feel so utterly miserable with him gone out of my life.

May 2, 2009

I've learned to be careful about approaching women whom have just gotten out of marriages - there's alot of things they need to deal with.

May 2, 2009

Their marriage 'ended' (if you can call it that) 3 - 4 years ago...

I think there is a lesson to us all here about being in imaginary relationships. I was in an imaginary relationship with him, you get all the hurt and pain without the actual relationship.

She had an imaginary husband, who she continued to treat like a husband, ignoring the fact that they were no longer together until he became her husband again.

He was an imaginary single man pretending he was free and independent, when in fact was not.

What a bunch of idiots (myself included!)

May 2, 2009

Their marriage 'ended' (if you can call it that) 3 - 4 years ago...

I think there is a lesson to us all here about being in imaginary relationships. I was in an imaginary relationship with him, you get all the hurt and pain without the actual relationship.

She had an imaginary husband, who she continued to treat like a husband, ignoring the fact that they were no longer together until he became her husband again.

He was an imaginary single man pretending he was free and independent, when in fact was not.

What a bunch of idiots (myself included!)

Sorry to hear about your experience.

Again, I can't emphasize how important it is to know how long its been since the person is married, for how long and if that person is still in their life (and to what extent).

May 2, 2009

Also, good indicators are level of contact and emotional detachment from the marital partner. Sometimes, and IMO often times, paperwork takes awhile to catch up with emotions and the attendant perspectives. IMO, a person who has little to no contact with a marital partner and can talk about the M and D in a matter-of-fact way has moved on. I'm leery of women who still talk about exes in emotionally charged terms, even after they are divorced. IMO, they really haven't moved on. The same would hold true for men.

May 2, 2009

I'm leery of women who still talk about exes in emotionally charged terms, even after they are divorced. IMO, they really haven't moved on. The same would hold true for men.

I agree with this.

Some women are matter-of-fact, very brief about it and its never an issue or a topic of conversation between the two of you thereafter.

Others still bring it up and its usually a sign to tread lightly or move on.

May 3, 2009

I agree with this.

Some women are matter-of-fact, very brief about it and its never an issue or a topic of conversation between the two of you thereafter.

Others still bring it up and its usually a sign to tread lightly or move on.

Men and women who do this clearly have dependency issues.

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I want to scream and shout, but is it better to swallow the hurt with dignity?

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