Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Well, of course one can draw the inference that someone attempting to cheat with one's spouse is not going to play by the rules. It's just common sense. Is it realistic to expect that someone plotting like this is going to be honorable. In dealing with dishonest people, one often has to lie out of self preservation. You need to know your audience and folks that cheat are a real threat to others.
desertmoon Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 I'd say it would. But, then you should go ahead and divorce him, so he can find someone that will be faithful to him. Maybe, but that was not part of the question. I like this kind of black and white-since mitigating and aggravating circumstances are considered. E.g. manslaughter vs. murder one. So really, sans the semantics, everything is gray. Otherwise, there won't be such a thing as less wrong....or more right. It would just be right or wrong.
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Yep, I do. If Nazi storm troopers are looking for little Anne Frank, I'd point them in the wrong direction. But, in this case the better analogy would be you pointed them to another family. Lying to save from imminent harm? Is her husband such a weak man that he would've succumbed to this other woman's flirtations so easily?
Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Maybe, but that was not part of the question. I like this kind of black and white-since mitigating and aggravating circumstances are considered. E.g. manslaughter vs. murder one. So really, sans the semantics, everything is gray. Otherwise, there won't be such a thing as less wrong....or more right. It would just be right or wrong. Of course, factors need to be considered. If someone had one of your kids held hostage and was extorting you to cheat, that would be considered. And , in this situation described by 2sure, one must consider her state of mind and her motives. I'd suggest that one faced with someone attempting to destroy a marriage should be cut a load of slack in her response to this threat.
Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 But, in this case the better analogy would be you pointed them to another family. Lying to save from imminent harm? Is her husband such a weak man that he would've succumbed to this other woman's flirtations so easily? Who knows. Apparently he has cheated in the past, so I suspect that may be the case. Or, at least she had a reasonable basis to suspect as much. As for the analogy, I think a better one would be if I gave them directions into an ambush by resistance fighters. She did this husband a favor, IMO. He got to see his wife for who she is.
Land Shark Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 It was wrong to lie to her out of spite. What she did was wrong. And what you did was wrong, too. So you're not so much even as you are equal.
Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Of course! the end justifies the means.... Tis True, in some situations.
tami-chan Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Tis True, in some situations. My kind of black and white thinking...LOL:p
Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Mine, too. I think one has to analyze the situation and consider all the factors. That is why, in this case, it really doesn't bother me at allthat she gave this woman some payback, if that was her motivation. This woman was an interloper, cruel and without empathy. If her marriage crumbled as the result of her attempted cheating and 2 sure's response, she deserved it, IMO.
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 It has been said that the lie was justified because this woman was trying to destroy 2sure's marriage. But what seems to be overlooked is the possibility that 2sure may have had a hand in destroying this woman's marriage. Oh, but her marriage must not have been in that good of shape since she was attempting to cheat. The rationalization. As I recall from the OP the lie was made at a time when 2sure's marriage was not in such great shape either, due to her husband's infidelity. Yes this woman was cruel and without empathy. That's why she apologized and never contacted 2sure's husband again. Clearly heartless. She did this husband a favor, IMO. He got to see his wife for who she is. How can you be sure? Perhaps what he saw was a paranoid, insecure woman constantly berating him about his supposed cheating. Perhaps 2sure should tell this woman that she'll talk to her husband. Tell him of her lie. But make it clear that when he asks why, he will, 2sure will tell about her attempt at flirting/cheating with 2sure's husband.
tami-chan Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 It has been said that the lie was justified because this woman was trying to destroy 2sure's marriage. But what seems to be overlooked is the possibility that 2sure may have had a hand in destroying this woman's marriage. Oh, but her marriage must not have been in that good of shape since she was attempting to cheat. The rationalization. As I recall from the OP the lie was made at a time when 2sure's marriage was not in such great shape either, due to her husband's infidelity. Yes this woman was cruel and without empathy. That's why she apologized and never contacted 2sure's husband again. Clearly heartless. How can you be sure? Perhaps what he saw was a paranoid, insecure woman constantly berating him about his supposed cheating. Perhaps 2sure should tell this woman that she'll talk to her husband. Tell him of her lie. But make it clear that when he asks why, he will, 2sure will tell about her attempt at flirting/cheating with 2sure's husband. Perhaps 2sure should also tell the H how her husband is a big flirt and uses inappropriate language in addressing females and that perhaps his wife responded to that or misconstrued it as an invitation.... lol...i think 2sure should just forget the whole thing...and hope karma is kind to her...
Reggie Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 I have no sympathy for this woman if her marriage was affected. It is the direct result of her having launched an attack on 2sure's marriage. It is the risk she took when she decided to try to destroy a family. If that isn't cruel and shows a lack of concern for others, what does?
tami-chan Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 I have no sympathy for this woman if her marriage was affected. It is the direct result of her having launched an attack on 2sure's marriage. It is the risk she took when she decided to try to destroy a family. If that isn't cruel and shows a lack of concern for others, what does? yes, your feelings for this woman has long been established. We know.
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 I have no sympathy for this woman if her marriage was affected. It is the direct result of her having launched an attack on 2sure's marriage. It is the risk she took when she decided to try to destroy a family. If that isn't cruel and shows a lack of concern for others, what does? No sympathy for this woman? O.K. But let's remember that this woman was responding to 2sure's husbands inappropriate flirtations as well. So she responds with inappropriate flirtations. Somehow this is defined as an attack on 2sure's marriage. It seems that some here are demonizing this woman. As though she has done this before. None of us here know anything of her. For all we know this was her first attempt at straying outside of her marriage. But this qualifies the destruction of her marriage? You know what is also cruel and showing lack of concern for others? Issuing a malicious lie. It plants a seed of paranoia. Regardless of intent of saving one's own marriage. I'm not much on religious sayings but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Actually the way I heard it it was paved with the bones of nuns and priests. But that seemed inappropriate.
Owl Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Are you a mind reader? Do you have a crystal ball? How do you know this to be true? And don't say because she was trying to seduce 2sure's husband. Why SHOULDN'T I point this out as a perfect example of how I know this to be true? It is. Attempting to sleep with someone else's husband ISN'T "playing by the rules". In fact, it clearly demonstrates that this OW had no respect for 2sure, her marriage, or for "the rules" in general.
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 "Playing by the rules" As I mentioned before, none of us know if this was her first attempt at "breaking the rules". It's not a perfect example. It's a general example based on general patterns. A perfect example is one that always behaves as predicted. Respect for marriage? Where was 2sure's respect for this woman's marriage when she lied about her husband's infidelities. Oh that's right I forgot. It's o.k. to disrespect another's marriage when it's obviously already in trouble. If we are to respect all marriages we have to respect the one that is being disrespected from within as well.
Author 2sure Posted May 5, 2009 Author Posted May 5, 2009 Just wanted to add that when the woman sent the email, I looked at all the previous correspondence between them. Nothing from my H that would raise a flag...She emailed him quite often and her messages had started to take on that "personal" touch - like, "I saw your photos and you looked sooo handsome" My H's response: "Hey, thank you so much for all the work you did at the fund raiser! You are a real doll to volunteer your time. I look forward to seeing you at the next event. " Thats how he talks, especially to people he hardly knows. Its generic blather. She took that as flirting with her. She was "crushing" on him, which is fine by me...but she took friendliness as flirting because she wanted to.
Owl Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 "Playing by the rules" As I mentioned before, none of us know if this was her first attempt at "breaking the rules". It's not a perfect example. It's a general example based on general patterns. A perfect example is one that always behaves as predicted. Respect for marriage? Where was 2sure's respect for this woman's marriage when she lied about her husband's infidelities. Oh that's right I forgot. It's o.k. to disrespect another's marriage when it's obviously already in trouble. If we are to respect all marriages we have to respect the one that is being disrespected from within as well. How was 2sure's lie disrespectful to the potential OW's marriage? What does it matter if it was her first attempt to cheat, or her 17th? Regardless of how often it happened, even a single "attempt" is still wrong. Again...I'm not saying that 2sure was right for lying...and even she regrets that happening. But what I AM saying is that taking an active measure to get a potential "OW" to back the heck off is the right move to make...and that this "OW" clearly had no respect for anyone else when she began pursuing a man she knew to be married. How is that hard to understand?
Author 2sure Posted May 5, 2009 Author Posted May 5, 2009 If I was so angry I wanted to "get back at her" or damage her marriage...I would have done both the right thing and the MOST damaging: Sent the email to her Husband. I chose I course less harsh. My lie, my remark was a knee jerk reaction a sarcastic comment said in anger .
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 How was 2sure's lie disrespectful to the potential OW's marriage? It was disrespectful to the potential OW's husband's marriage. Yes she disrespected her husband by attempting to cheat. Many on these boards say that doesn't give others the right to disrespect their marriage. Otherwise OW/OM would be justified in their choice. As to less harsh. That's debatable. Yea, it got her out of 2sure's marriage but added to the already present infection in her marriage. Sending the email to her husband would've been the less damaging in the long run. They would've been able to clean up their marriage or let it go. Just my opinion. EDIT: I do understand what you're saying. Just don't agree.
bentnotbroken Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 Seems to me the ow infected her own marriage by flirting with another woman's husband. Seems also that she not only had little respect for 2sure's marriage, but absolutely no respect for her own or her H. JMO.
Owl Posted May 5, 2009 Posted May 5, 2009 It was disrespectful to the potential OW's husband's marriage. Yes she disrespected her husband by attempting to cheat. Many on these boards say that doesn't give others the right to disrespect their marriage. Otherwise OW/OM would be justified in their choice. As to less harsh. That's debatable. Yea, it got her out of 2sure's marriage but added to the already present infection in her marriage. Sending the email to her husband would've been the less damaging in the long run. They would've been able to clean up their marriage or let it go. Just my opinion. EDIT: I do understand what you're saying. Just don't agree. Howso??? I asked the question before, but you just restated that it was disrespectful to the OW's marriage...but I don't understand how, nor have you explained that. You stated that it got the OW out of 2sure's marriage, but that it added to the already present infection in {her} marriage...who's marriage? 2Sure's, or the OW's? And HOW did it add to the infection? All it did was tell the OW that 2sure's husband wasn't affair material. What other impacts do you see, and how/why?
Hi.P.O'Crit Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 Seems to me the ow infected her own marriage by flirting with another woman's husband. Seems also that she not only had little respect for 2sure's marriage, but absolutely no respect for her own or her H. JMO. With the exception of the source of infection, I think the flirting was a symptom, we mostly agree. I asked the question before, but you just restated that it was disrespectful to the OW's marriage...but I don't understand how, nor have you explained that. If someone was going around telling people, lying, that *your* wife was whoring it up with many men would that not be disrespectful to you, your wife and your marriage? Assuming people believed the lie. You stated that it got the OW out of 2sure's marriage, but that it added to the already present infection in {her} marriage...who's marriage? 2Sure's, or the OW's? And HOW did it add to the infection? Went back reread my post and it was unclear. I meant this woman's marriage. To the rest post 140. All it did was tell the OW that 2sure's husband wasn't affair material. What other impacts do you see, and how/why? Yup, he's not affair material. He never once cheated on 2sure. How many other impacts do you need? From the OP. ...Her H left and she didn't know if it was really because of another W. .......I told her: "You know I made that up right? I don't even know your last name. I was just irritated. " ... She asked me if I would speak to her H and tell him . She feels her paranoia may have contributed to their marriage issues. She wants him back. Isn't the one impact, as minor as it may have been, enough?
tami-chan Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 If I was so angry I wanted to "get back at her" or damage her marriage...I would have done both the right thing and the MOST damaging: Sent the email to her Husband. I chose I course less harsh. My lie, my remark was a knee jerk reaction a sarcastic comment said in anger . Which of course, justified it.
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