What happened and is happening?

[paperchase]

What happened to a long thread about fending off the manipulator? It's nowhere to be found. Could a moderator explain? I'm not mad...just wondering.

 

For those that know my story, this is an update. I've been spending lots of time with my ex and things have been pleasant. She definitely broke up with the man she left me for and she's agreed to couples counseling, my two prerequisites for exploring reconciliation.

 

In many ways things are moving too fast. It's like we've fallen in love again overnight. We're planning a vacation and talking about living together. She seems so sincere but I'm just really gun shy. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop.

 

Does anyone have any advice how to proceed...other than with caution? We had a brief second chance before which lasted about a month but the feelings weren't as intense as this time around.

[Blah Toolz]

Hey PC, good to hear from you again.

 

I think I can relate some advice to you in the simplest way possible, as I'm looking at this from the outside and could quite possibly be going through the same thing soon:

 

Don't talk about moving in together. Don't talk about going on vacation yet either. She'll have to prove herself to you. Give it at least 60 days of dating. It's like you're dating a brand new girl. Would you move in with a girl you just met a month ago or have dated for a few weeks? I hope the answer is hell no.

 

I think it's good that she's agreed to couples counseling and everything else though. I think that shows she's committed, or at least desirous of taking it seriously, but women do work in mysterious ways.

[CaliGuy]

Yeah I was looking for the thread too, PC.

 

All I can say is that if she has truly broken off the relationship with the other guy AND she has agreed to couples counseling then that's really all you can ask. Wait until after you've been through enough counseling sessions to find out what her real hesitations are (and to the advice of the counselor) before you make a final decision on where to go.

 

If I were you, I'd just enjoy the time you have together now and try not to get too far ahead of yourself. Don't dwell on the past but DO keep in mind the things that led you to where you were and where you are now so that you don't repeat the mistakes of the past. That's really all you can do.

 

Many things are out of your control, including her. So trying to let go of the things you don't control and DO control the things you can (yourself).

 

Best of luck, bro. I'm pulling for you.

 

As for me, ex from work has gone stone cold again, haha. She's all talk and no action so that tells me that the only reason she contacted me the last time was the same reason she did the first time: Just to affirm that I am available if she decided to walk (which she hasn't and, as her actions prove, she won't).

[samspade]

I was wondering where that went, myself. I actually typed a long diatribe telling you to cut her off and work on you, etc. right before it disappeared. I don't think I said anything offensive in it, so I hope I wasn't the reason.

 

In any case, to echo CG, just take it easy. I DO think you need to work on yourself and take time for yourself. I wouldn't spend money on vacations or living quarters with her if I were you. You will probably regret it.

 

I also don't believe in the counseling. Not that I don't think counseling works - it probably does for some people. But I don't believe, contrary to what Dr Phil and the Oprah Army say, that relationships should be THAT much work. Yes, take care of it and let it grow, but overall you two should be having fun, and if you're putting in so much damn effort setting things right, what's the point?

 

Glad things have been pleasant, but given her track record, it's probably the calm before the storm. Protect yourself.

[paperchase]

I was wondering where that went, myself. I actually typed a long diatribe telling you to cut her off and work on you, etc. right before it disappeared. I don't think I said anything offensive in it, so I hope I wasn't the reason.

 

In any case, to echo CG, just take it easy. I DO think you need to work on yourself and take time for yourself. I wouldn't spend money on vacations or living quarters with her if I were you. You will probably regret it.

 

I also don't believe in the counseling. Not that I don't think counseling works - it probably does for some people. But I don't believe, contrary to what Dr Phil and the Oprah Army say, that relationships should be THAT much work. Yes, take care of it and let it grow, but overall you two should be having fun, and if you're putting in so much damn effort setting things right, what's the point?

 

Glad things have been pleasant, but given her track record, it's probably the calm before the storm. Protect yourself.

 

I believe individual counseling works. My ex wife and I spent a lot of money on couples counseling and it worked while we were in front of the therapist, but it wasn't sustainable. I wanted to do counseling this time to get to the heart of what went wrong, try to rebuild the trust and see if we are compatible. We can talk about a lot, but my ex and I don't seem to be able to really discuss the past and understand each other. I feel like she betrayed me and she feels like I made her do it.

 

The way she's acting right now is like she's getting infatuated all over again with the ideal...her vision of a future with me. She wants to get there quickly. It's just how we started and it lasted for a magical year before it fizzled. I get the sense it could happen that way again and that's why I refuse to get too caught up. But it's hard. She's now back to monopolizing my time, calling and texting me constantly and I really don't have the breathing room to see anyone else...which is a constant fear of hers.

 

I guess without a fully understanding of how I got here I just feel uneasy. I mean she loved me like crazy, then turned off the love and broke my heart and now loves me like crazy again. I need answers before I jump back in the way she wants.

[paperchase]

Yeah I was looking for the thread too, PC.

 

All I can say is that if she has truly broken off the relationship with the other guy AND she has agreed to couples counseling then that's really all you can ask. Wait until after you've been through enough counseling sessions to find out what her real hesitations are (and to the advice of the counselor) before you make a final decision on where to go.

 

If I were you, I'd just enjoy the time you have together now and try not to get too far ahead of yourself. Don't dwell on the past but DO keep in mind the things that led you to where you were and where you are now so that you don't repeat the mistakes of the past. That's really all you can do.

 

Many things are out of your control, including her. So trying to let go of the things you don't control and DO control the things you can (yourself).

 

Best of luck, bro. I'm pulling for you.

 

As for me, ex from work has gone stone cold again, haha. She's all talk and no action so that tells me that the only reason she contacted me the last time was the same reason she did the first time: Just to affirm that I am available if she decided to walk (which she hasn't and, as her actions prove, she won't).

 

Thanks for the advice. I am enjoying the time we are spending but it's restrained joy. When she sleeps with her head on my chest I fight the urge to get too comfortable with how it feels. I remind myself it could change at a moment's notice. I do dwell on the past because it's unresolved in my book. When she pushes the issue about why I can't be the way she wants me to be I sometimes remind her of things she did at certain times. I remember how she shut me out and I recall when she first went out with him and the status of our relationship at that time. I get angry because I have now put together the puzzle of what was really going on. Anyway...

 

I'm sorry about your manipulative ex, but it's no surprise. The more I read about your situation the more wedded I become to my opinion that you'll never get a second chance as long as you work at the same job. I'm not saying that absent that, a second chance is forthcoming, I'm just saying that it's impossible to create the physical and emotional space necessary to see how she really feels without you in her life. You can be distant or nonchalant until the cows come home, but it's nothing compared to being truly out of sight and mind. There's no need to beat down your door when you walk through hers every morning.

 

The fact that she likes to see if you're still available says there is still some interest even if it's based in ego. But honestly you don't know what it's based in due to the circumstances. It could be insecurity or a host of other things. I liken it to when a small child runs ahead of their parents but keeps looking back to make sure they are there. Everything is cool as long as they can see them, but if they look back and don't see them all heck breaks loose. When the see them again, they will hold on to their hand desperately. I think this is called object permanancy or something like that.

 

Honestly, the only way to see her daily and convince her that you aren't there for her is to date another hot woman at your place of employ and walk around on cloud nine all day. Other than that, she gets what she wants from you even if you aren't giving it too her. Just my two cents.

[paperchase]

Hey PC, good to hear from you again.

 

I think I can relate some advice to you in the simplest way possible, as I'm looking at this from the outside and could quite possibly be going through the same thing soon:

 

Don't talk about moving in together. Don't talk about going on vacation yet either. She'll have to prove herself to you. Give it at least 60 days of dating. It's like you're dating a brand new girl. Would you move in with a girl you just met a month ago or have dated for a few weeks? I hope the answer is hell no.

 

I think it's good that she's agreed to couples counseling and everything else though. I think that shows she's committed, or at least desirous of taking it seriously, but women do work in mysterious ways.

 

The problem is that I was planning a vaca before we got to this point and I was thinking about taking a woman with me. I raised the issue in passing as to whether she might be interested and she took it and has not let go, so I pretty much am locked in. She's super excited and it's something we have never done despite her urging throughout the relationship. She thinks it's a way to reacquaint ourselves without all the outside pressures and she may be right. Life can be a pressure cooker.

 

Moving in is a separate issue. I just can't do that given her emotional instability and fickleness. I'd need some reassurances that she just can't give me right now.

[PinkRibbon]

If my ex was willing to go on vacation with me and to talk about moving in together. I would if that is what I want. Either you do or you don't??? Just think about what it would feel like if she left again.

[CaliGuy]

I believe individual counseling works. My ex wife and I spent a lot of money on couples counseling and it worked while we were in front of the therapist, but it wasn't sustainable. I wanted to do counseling this time to get to the heart of what went wrong, try to rebuild the trust and see if we are compatible. We can talk about a lot, but my ex and I don't seem to be able to really discuss the past and understand each other. I feel like she betrayed me and she feels like I made her do it.

 

The way she's acting right now is like she's getting infatuated all over again with the ideal...her vision of a future with me. She wants to get there quickly. It's just how we started and it lasted for a magical year before it fizzled. I get the sense it could happen that way again and that's why I refuse to get too caught up. But it's hard. She's now back to monopolizing my time, calling and texting me constantly and I really don't have the breathing room to see anyone else...which is a constant fear of hers.

 

I guess without a fully understanding of how I got here I just feel uneasy. I mean she loved me like crazy, then turned off the love and broke my heart and now loves me like crazy again. I need answers before I jump back in the way she wants.

 

PC, she has an obsessive personality. Lots of women are like that. Mostly it stems from their own insecurities. They are deeply insecure and when they meet someone that meets their "ideal" of what they believe a partner should be, they throw everything and the kitchen sink it to try and "win" that person over.

 

The problems both start and end with their insecurity. Her insecurity causes her to be obsessive and jealous and then, if she suspects something isn't right, those insecurities will cause her to do an about-face and go the other direction. Most of it can stem from the fact that she may believe, deep down, that she is not worthy of you.

 

Such is the case with you and her. It's not YOU that is the problem here as far as I can see. She is really the one that needs Counseling to learn to deal with those insecurities.

 

Not to get off track but this is exactly how my ex from work acted. She has told me several times that she did not believe that I loved her, that she felt she was unworthy, that I was too perfect, etc. Her own insecurities is what lead her to someone else. I'm not going to say that I am "better" than her current B/F, but we don't share the same qualities. The qualities she wants in her life, I possess. The qualities that he has makes him, in her eyes, not perfect. But that's ok because she believes that his imperfections make him OK for someone like her.

 

I think your ex/current (whatever you want to call her) is the same kind of person. They are so insecure in themselves that when presented with someone who is ideal in their mind, all of their insecurities are brought to the surface (the calls, the texts, the monopolizing of your time, etc). My ex would rather be with someone who doesn't bring out her insecurities than one who does. And in a way, I understand.

 

I don't want to be with someone who is insecure. It will drive me nuts. I'll stop answering the calls and text so I can have some space. I'll simply find them less attractive. I didn't push my ex away, she simply was too insecure to get comfortable in the relationship.

 

Not my fault and it's better I know now than marry someone like that and have to deal with all the drama that comes with it.

 

That's what you need to think about. You can't fix this girl. Only she can do that and the best way is not drugs, but solid, weekly counseling. When you talk to the counselor, explain to him/her in private your ex's insecurities. Hopefully they'll be able to get her on the right track. It won't be overnight change but if you both stick with it, you'll be glad you did.