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To AGreatWife re: "Responsibility, blame and outcome"


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Posted

Tell me Dexter if I am making my wife HAPPY what problems are there that I caused????

 

I did everything you BS claim that a WS NEVER DOES to try and fix the marriage before cheating. Oh the broad brush is not working now is it.

 

Cheating was my way of coping with a situation that I did not like but saw no way of leaving. So I took the cheap and easy way to make myself happy.

 

By your thinking though I guess I should've just divorced my wife (that did not understand there were problems), destroyed my child's life and become poor. Oh but wait I would have my morals still right, yeah that sure buys you food.

 

No sorry my wife and I are adults and we suck it up to let our child have a good life (as well as ourselves). Now my wife has to suck it up just like I did for years, KNOWING things are not great but staying married anyway.

 

Oh and as far as my entitlement attitude, I see it as now getting back what have given in.

Posted
He didn't tell her that he isn't staying with her because he wants her...he could care less. He is staying with her out of convenience. She doesn't know that, and if she did, she'd have to be screwed in the head not to want to hire an attorney.

 

He is letting her think he wants this marriage, letting her make all the changes, all the while he is keeping his sh#tty attitude and contempt for her and not really wanting to work on the marriage. He is playing her.

 

Oh how WRONG you are. LOL!!!!!

 

I have told her why I have stayed.

 

How do you know I don't want the marriage to work out?? Oh that's right because I don't play the WS game that you feel I should be.

 

Actually I am changing in my attitude of staying in the marriage, but it will be on my terms. NOT what I did before where I did "go along to get along".

Posted
but oh so well worth it and even more so would it be for your wife.

 

best money I ever spent hands down:cool:

 

Oh now at last we are getting somewhere.

 

Divorce is your only answer.

 

Like I said before you have your views I have mine.

Posted
Don't let him push your buttons, pkn. The ignore feature works GREAT! ;)

 

No Dexter has his views, actually his are very clear. You have to admire someone that is that black and white.

 

Actually going back and forth with him is rather cleansing.

Posted
Oh the victim card and explore the love behind that hurt, how touching.

 

News for you my wife did NOT KNOW I was in an affair. Because she was HAPPY, which when I told her what I had done surprised her.

 

The OW oh she liked me well enough to be involved for 3+ years. Because I treated her way better than her husband did.

 

Don't worry I rely on NO ONE anymore to meet my needs. I do that just fine by myself.

 

Tell me where do people get told the fairy tail of marriage is incorrect??? Oh no you are told how great it is and how wonderful life will be married. For a few years it is, NO ONE is ever honest and tells you what it will be like years down the road, once everyone is settled in.

 

Sorry you don't like my opinion. I've not read your whole story, so I am only going by the attitude that you are displaying here and its not giving a warm fuzzy. :rolleyes:

 

I totally disagree with your continued desire to hold on to the fairy tales told to CHILDREN. Once you became an adult, I do hope that you realized that NO ONE lives happily ever after. That no one told you, doesn't negate the fact that it NEVER was true.

 

Glad to see that you have finally realized that its up to YOU to be happy and no one else can do that for you. Having needs is never a good enough excuse to cause harm to TWO relationships. And, for the record, I didn't ever say your W didn't have responsibilities for her own actions. I'm speaking to/with you. Stay in this conversation instead of trying to say "but what about her". Your choice to cheat, says tons about you. Her willingness to ignore your needs says something about her too, but we are here in the Infidelity Board talking about YOUR cheating, not her ignorance.

 

I hope the two of you are actively working on your marriage. It is VERY true that an affair can be a wake up call to a BS if they were suffering from marital apathy. But it can also be a wake up call for the WS concerning what they were going to lose. Marriage is a two way street. If she wasn't meeting your needs, I can't imagine that you were meeting hers as well.

Posted
And so can discussion of divorce. ;)

 

The thing is, although IMO pkn screwed up via cheating, at least he came clean with his W and let her have her informed options.

 

I don't disagree with you there. Too bad he cheated for THREE years before deciding to come clean though.

Posted
Tell me Dexter if I am making my wife HAPPY what problems are there that I caused????

Though she knows that you cheated, is she aware of the fact that you are now staying with her only for financial reasons. That you do not love her (if that is indeed the case - it sounds like it is, but maybe it's not?)

 

I did everything you BS claim that a WS NEVER DOES to try and fix the marriage before cheating. Oh the broad brush is not working now is it.

 

I (personally) think that most WS do at some level try to address the issues in the marriage, the problem is (as always) communication. I'll give you my example... I was unhappy. I told my husband I was unhappy. He was unhappy as well, so didn't really think he needed to address my unhappiness, because after all, he was unhappy too. I begged him to go to marriage counseling. He refused. He told me he was unhappy, but it was always immediately after I told him I was unhappy. I didn't really think I needed to address his issues, because he refused to address mine.... (BTW, this is all information based on years of conversation after the fact..) This state of affairs went on for awhile. Out health suffered. Finally, I could no longer live in that state of affairs and left. Note - I left. I did not have an affair.

 

Since my communication skills can leave a lot to be desired at times, though, I didn't let him know how very much I loved him. He wanted me to come back, but also was extremely angry with me. He began seeing someone else. For over a year he was attempting to get me to come back while at the same time "hedging his bets". After I decided to come home - he told me what he had been doing. (though interestingly enough, he never told her that he was separated. Instead told her he was married and led her to think that he may leave me for her... )

 

We learned through our mutual pain the value of complete and honest communication. It's not enough to say "I'm not happy". It's vitally important to work together to resolve the unhappiness, and to make it crystal clear what the repercussions will be if the unhappiness is not resolved.. That's where most WS falldown. They want the other person to take responsibility and fix the situation --- BTW, that was also my problem. I wanted my husband to fix the situation.

 

The difference is in how it's dealt with.

 

So... IMO, if a person decides to have an affair because of "problems in the relationship" - and that's the usual excuse, both the affair and the problems at that point become the complete responsibility of the WS. Not because they are the sole cause of the problems, but because they choose unilaterally to not work on the problems.

Posted
I (personally) think that most WS do at some level try to address the issues in the marriage, the problem is (as always) communication. I'll give you my example... I was unhappy. I told my husband I was unhappy. He was unhappy as well, so didn't really think he needed to address my unhappiness, because after all, he was unhappy too. I begged him to go to marriage counseling. He refused. He told me he was unhappy, but it was always immediately after I told him I was unhappy. I didn't really think I needed to address his issues, because he refused to address mine.... (BTW, this is all information based on years of conversation after the fact..)

 

We learned through our mutual pain the value of complete and honest communication. It's not enough to say "I'm not happy". It's vitally important to work together to resolve the unhappiness, and to make it crystal clear what the repercussions will be if the unhappiness is not resolved.. That's where most WS falldown. They want the other person to take responsibility and fix the situation --- BTW, that was also my problem. I wanted my husband to fix the situation.

 

The difference is in how it's dealt with.

 

Ain't this the truth?! Been there, done that. We both wanted the other to *fix* it, to *fix* themselves so that we could then be happy.

 

It took seeing that we both had responsibilities to do this FOR each other, that led to healing in our marriage.

Posted
Tell me Dexter if I am making my wife HAPPY what problems are there that I caused????

 

Happy to some people is a status quo...doesn't mean you had to do much at all.

 

You were the one that said the problems in a marriage are shared equally.....so which is it? You were the perfect husband that was justified in sticking it to another woman or not?

 

 

I did everything you BS claim that a WS NEVER DOES to try and fix the marriage before cheating.

 

I never said anything of the sort. "you BS"?....gee...you sure do have alot of contempt for people betrayed.

 

Oh the broad brush is not working now is it.

 

Its working just fine. Your excuses and justification for you putting your penis into another woman are proving my point.

 

And if that wasn't bad enough, you have no sympathy for your wife and say her pain is not your problem even though it was your cheating that caused it.

 

Not all cheaters I suppose can be painted with that broad brush....but YOU certainly can be.

 

 

Cheating was my way of coping with a situation that I did not like but saw no way of leaving. So I took the cheap and easy way to make myself happy.

 

Ok...point taken. Although I don't agree with it...what really concerns me is your contempt for your wife while she has made these changes...and you are doing nothing for her in return but allowing her to think the marriage is better....when its not.

 

 

By your thinking though I guess I should've just divorced my wife (that did not understand there were problems), destroyed my child's life and become poor.

 

Dude, I am far from rich, but my children's lives will be only as destroyed as I make it. I know that if anything ever happens, they always have me to come to. As far as being poor.....sorry....being comfortable financially is not more important to me. I am not going to be miserable for what little time I have on this planet so I can keep just a little bit more of my money.

 

got a newsflash for ya. Nobody will end up poor. I make a middle class income and we both are doing fine.....she more than me, but I'm just fine..so are my kids.

 

 

Oh but wait I would have my morals still right, yeah that sure buys you food.

 

again, my kids and I eat well. Sure I don't have money to go on expense vacations at any whim, but far from poor.

 

This is just a lame excuse on your part.

 

 

Oh and as far as my entitlement attitude, I see it as now getting back what have given in.

 

ah...so this is all about revenge for you? you aren't giving her any reason to change, but she is anyway. Even after you have proven yourself to be a cheater. She sounds like a good woman....she definitely deserves better.

Posted
It took seeing that we both had responsibilities to do this FOR each other' date=' that led to healing in our marriage.[/quote']

 

:bunny::) Us too.

Posted
Oh how WRONG you are. LOL!!!!!

 

I have told her why I have stayed.

 

I don't believe you.

 

Because if you told her you are only staying out of convenience...then there is absolutely NO reason for her to change. None whatsoever.

 

 

How do you know I don't want the marriage to work out??

 

because of your contempt for your wife and your attitude that you aren't going to be putting in any work towards the marriage under the premise that you were just the perfect husband and all of this was her fault...therefore you are just getting revenge on her. again....abuse.

 

 

Oh that's right because I don't play the WS game that you feel I should be.

 

There is nothing even remotely resembling a "game" with regards to trying to be a good and decent husband.

 

Nothing wrong with making an effort to get a marriage that is mutually satisfying.....regardless of whether I think the M should end.

 

Nothing demeaning or pride swallowing for trying to become a better husband....even though I know you thought you were Mr. Perfect to begin with.

 

 

Actually I am changing in my attitude of staying in the marriage, but it will be on my terms. NOT what I did before where I did "go along to get along".

 

So, does this mean you want a loving relationship with your wife and you will drop your attitude of contempt for her?

Posted
Oh now at last we are getting somewhere.

 

Divorce is your only answer.

 

not the only answer, but in my opinion, the best one.

 

what good reason is there to stay with a cheater?

Posted
Don't let him push your buttons, pkn. The ignore feature works GREAT! ;)

 

Ya, too bad you slipped up and responded to a post of mine after saying you ignored me. chalk being a liar to your list of undesirable attributes.

 

As far as you telling me you had me on ignore...its because I asked you to back up your asinine assertions in the political forum with fact.

 

And since you couldn't because you talked out of your arse, you decide to tell people in the forum you had me on ignore....LMFAO!:lmao:

 

When one gets caught lying and can't provide proof......choose ignore:o

Posted
Actually I am changing in my attitude of staying in the marriage, but it will be on my terms. NOT what I did before where I did "go along to get along".

 

It's no wonder the marriage didn't work for you the way it was. This is no way to have a relationship. If you don't really communicate the issues, but instead "go along to get along", you are basically living a lie. That's a lousy way to live.

 

I hope both you and your wife can work to a happy and satisfying relationship in the future - for both of you, not just one.

Posted
It's no wonder the marriage didn't work for you the way it was. This is no way to have a relationship. If you don't really communicate the issues, but instead "go along to get along", you are basically living a lie. That's a lousy way to live.

 

I hope both you and your wife can work to a happy and satisfying relationship in the future - for both of you, not just one.

 

This is the attitude that I was responding to.

 

Its sad, really. Limiting the both of them to only HIS perspective.

 

Taking the time to actually listen to my H and attempt to understand his POV helped my marriage. Demanding that the marriage be conducted on his terms, is only going to lead to more unhappiness on his part.

 

I hope his W wakes up and realizes this, so she can make her own needs known and they can actually have equal footing.

 

I wonder who makes the most money, considering PNK said he was staying for it at one point?

Posted
This is the attitude that I was responding to.

 

Its sad, really. Limiting the both of them to only HIS perspective.

 

well something tells me it was his way or the highway before he cheated.

 

since NOBODY will ever meet a spouses "needs" 100%, there is always something, that she probably was a much better wife than many men have had...hence the 95%. If that is his idea of 5% not being met, then that would mean I had about only 60% of my needs met.

 

 

Taking the time to actually listen to my H and attempt to understand his POV helped my marriage. Demanding that the marriage be conducted on his terms, is only going to lead to more unhappiness on his part.

 

I don't know your story noididnt, but in the case of someone that hasn't cheated, your argument there is certainly well taken.

 

but a WS has no business making demands on his/her terms....they already got their gratification out of the affair.

 

 

I hope his W wakes up and realizes this, so she can make her own needs known and they can actually have equal footing.

 

doesn't matter. no matter how much she cowtows to her cheating husband....he won't care. he is all about control....not love or committment.

 

I wonder who makes the most money, considering PNK said he was staying for it at one point?

 

my guess is she has alot to gain, and he has alot to lose. if that is true, then she must be busting her ass to change for an unappreciative husband.

 

maybe she'll wake up and realize that she will be better off...and so will her child. because there is nothing happy about a home with the environment pkn is setting up with his my way or the highway entitlement

Posted
You must have missed this just above your post: "Of course there is responsibility at all levels, but Americans, at least, have this weird dichotomy of blaming some people (BS) for their own pain, while at the same time relieving others (WS and OP) of responsibility for theirs."

 

Dexter Morgan, you must've missed this from Silktricks:

 

Of course there are some BS who are complete A-wipes, but I was giving you the benefit of the doubt that you weren't discussing the unusual cases, but were rather talking about the ordinary run of the mill affairs that are "caused" by "problems in the marriage".
Posted

I think pkn's wife was really unwilling or cared enough to work on the issues in the marriage post D-day. Correct me if I am wrong, pkn? but that was what I got from your previous posts( your thread). I can totally understand this. I never did anything to make my marriage better or understand my WS's issues post D-day. I guess it is a way of reclaiming control over my emotional state. My attitude is: Indifference ( tough to learn but very doable) to the WS and the marriage-the Ws to stay or leave, it doesn't matter.:p My H would probably say 'I have tried to reach out to her (me) but she is unwilling to fix the marriage"-guess what? that statement would be true.

Posted
Ya, too bad you slipped up and responded to a post of mine after saying you ignored me. chalk being a liar to your list of undesirable attributes.

 

As far as you telling me you had me on ignore...its because I asked you to back up your asinine assertions in the political forum with fact.

 

And since you couldn't because you talked out of your arse, you decide to tell people in the forum you had me on ignore....LMFAO!:lmao:

 

When one gets caught lying and can't provide proof......choose ignore:o

 

 

lol...funny:lmao:

Posted
Dexter Morgan, you must've missed this from Silktricks:

 

ya, and your point is?

Posted
I think pkn's wife was really unwilling or cared enough to work on the issues in the marriage post D-day. Correct me if I am wrong, pkn? but that was what I got from your previous posts( your thread). I can totally understand this. I never did anything to make my marriage better or understand my WS's issues post D-day. I guess it is a way of reclaiming control over my emotional state. My attitude is: Indifference ( tough to learn but very doable) to the WS and the marriage-the Ws to stay or leave, it doesn't matter.:p My H would probably say 'I have tried to reach out to her (me) but she is unwilling to fix the marriage"-guess what? that statement would be true.

 

regardless, he says she is changing her ways now. All the drivel from WS's I have heard said that if they can improve the situation in the marriage, they would welcome it. Oh, but not pkn...he is out for revenge. She will change for him, and he sees this as his opportunity to get back at her....as if cheating wasn't enough. he said this himself.

Posted
ya, and your point is?

 

LOL...:p Well, the point is, you said to PKN he must have missed the point stating responsibility being at all level...no he didnt.. he was responding to silktricks' not wanting or at least, disagreeing to discuss or maybe focus on the "some" (BS) who have contributed to the issues of their marriage leading to the cheating... she said it was misleading. So no, he didn't miss the point.

Posted
LOL...:p Well, the point is, you said to PKN he must have missed the point stating responsibility being at all level...no he didnt..

 

uh read again. Show me where he took ANY responsibility for the state of his marriage. He blames his wife COMPLETELY. If he agrees that the state of a marriage is the responsibility of both parties, then where is his admission of his part in it?

 

So again, show me where he took any responsibility for the state of his marriage.

 

I'll wait........:o

Posted

Who came up with the idea that "issues in the marriage" lead to cheating. It's pretty clear to me that it's the brokeness of the cheater, exclusively, that is the cause of cheating. Otherwise, all the BSs here would have cheated as well.

I feel a more accurate way of looking at what leads to cheating is to say that folks with a proclivity for cheating are way less capable of dealing with the expected issues that arise in all marriages and thier incapacity to deal with normal stuff is what leads them to cheat.

Look at Pkn's case. Guy gets frustrated because his wife won't conform to his view. So, for him , the way to solve this is to cheat. He lies, breaks his vows, depletes family resources, hurts his kid, all because he cannot figure out what else to do. That is just so messed up.

Posted
Who came up with the idea that "issues in the marriage" lead to cheating. It's pretty clear to me that it's the brokeness of the cheater, exclusively, that is the cause of cheating. Otherwise, all the BSs here would have cheated as well.

 

Eggs-fuggin-zactly!!!

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