Ok, need some guidance

[Have to Wonder]

 

Then why post it on a public forum?

 

And just why does he need to understand WHY you acted the way you did?

Let say the "why" is because you just wanted to be with an attractive man? Why would it be important for him to "understand" that?

 

 

Again, what is there to understand? What IS IT that he understands?

Why can't you answer that question?

 

Because I am simply real curious what there IS to understand about why you cheated if the marriage was happy as admitted by you.

 

In response to "why post it on a public forum?," I was following up with those who'd advised me to come clean & letting them know how that conversation went.

 

In response to what I put in bold in your quote...H understands the why of my behavior...no, it wasn't just that I wanted to be with an attractive man...it's part & parcel tied into who I am and he wanted to understand the why of it. That IS answering your question; maybe not to YOUR satisfaction but that is the answer.

 

I'm not sure why you're continuing to attempt to condemn me when I've admitted all - to the one who matters - and am taking every step I can take to fix our marriage. Would you simply be happier if I said that he kicked me out of house & his life? I get the feeling that you are imposing your own story on mine & you just don't like the fact that both H & I are wanting to work things out and move on in our marriage.

 

Are you sure you're not Troubadour in disguise??

[Dexter Morgan]

In response to what I put in bold in your quote...H understands the why of my behavior...no, it wasn't just that I wanted to be with an attractive man...it's part & parcel tied into who I am and he wanted to understand the why of it. That IS answering your question; maybe not to YOUR satisfaction but that is the answer.

 

Uh, whatever you say..

 

 

I'm not sure why you're continuing to attempt to condemn me when I've admitted all

 

And for that, kudos to you. You did the right thing.

 

But i didn't know trying to "understand" what there was to "understand" was condeming you. Again, a big

 

 

- to the one who matters - and am taking every step I can take to fix our marriage. Would you simply be happier if I said that he kicked me out of house & his life?

 

Don't get me confused with troubadour. And sure, its no secret that I am an advocate of BS's getting rid of their cheaters. But I made no such mention about it to you in this post.

 

I asked you what there was to understand? Your answer was a non-answer. How do you get me wanting him to kick you out by asking you that question?

 

he understood what? he understood you couldn't help yourself? he understood that he pushed you to this somehow? he understood that you have a chemical imbalance that alcohol causes cheating in you? What?

 

 

I get the feeling that you are imposing your own story on mine & you just don't like the fact that both H & I are wanting to work things out and move on in our marriage.

 

Not at all. I am glad he was told the truth and that he has the information to decide for himself how he wants to proceed. It is his choice and I will not look down upon a betrayed spouse for deciding to stay with a cheater even if I don't agree. I always hope they can deal with it and take steps to eradicate the pain.

 

 

Are you sure you're not Troubadour in disguise??

 

LOL, when I said don't confuse me with troubadour, I didn't even read this last line yet:p

[Have to Wonder]

But i didn't know trying to "understand" what there was to "understand" was condeming you. Again, a big

 

I asked you what there was to understand? Your answer was a non-answer. How do you get me wanting him to kick you out by asking you that question?

 

he understood what? he understood you couldn't help yourself? he understood that he pushed you to this somehow? he understood that you have a chemical imbalance that alcohol causes cheating in you? What?

 

 

LOL, when I said don't confuse me with troubadour, I didn't even read this last line yet:p

 

Does it really matter so deeply to you what H understands, why he understands "it" and so forth? As I said earlier, there are things about me that I've not disclosed (and don't need or want to) on a public forum but they have helped formed who I am and to an extent, why I do the things I do (good, bad or indifferent). It seems to me it should be enough for me to tell you that H feels like he understands the why of what I did & that should be all that matters, not whether I can make it clear to another poster on this thread...am I wrong there? I mean, yes, I reached out for advice in this public arena & expected questions, etc. But, I still don't think it makes a difference in my M whether you understand "what there is to understand" - after all (and for this, I'm sure you'd be ETERNALLY grateful), you don't have to live with me!

 

Glad to know you're not really Troubadour in disguise...

[Athena]

Reading the last several posts reminded me of something... I wish to advise you that whenever your husband asks you a question about Why or How (such as "Why did you do that", or "How are you going to avoid this again") PLEASE answer him CLEARLY in full sentences every single time.

 

What I am saying is he needs to hear the answers again and again, NOT, "Well, as I have told you before - no, I'm not gonna do it again" or, "Look, I have already answered that question, so I am not going to say it again"

I am not talking about you and Dexter, I am talking about you and your husband.... it is SO very important to a betrayed spouse to have their concerns dealt with every time... please show patience with him, even if you have answered the same question several times before... he needs the repetitiveness to 'believe' you and to begin to trust you once again. He also needs to see you are willing to do this. That you are willing to commit verbally to becoming transparent and trustworthy.

 

Be patient. Repeat any answer he needs to hear. He also asks it several different ways to 'see' if you have the same answer... to make sure you are telling the truth, to be able to believe you and to begin to trust you.

Its like hearing the same answer is stable, believable and comforting. In my experience the worst answers you can give are: "I already told you this before, so I am not saying it again" or "Well clearly you don't listen to me, so why should I repeat myself?!" or "I have already stated this before so what is the point?" or "Well anything out of my mouth is a lie and you don't want to believe me so I am not going to say it again."

[Reggie]

That's good advice by Athena. I don't think some Wss appreciate the extent of the damage and how it is neccessary to be very patient and consistent.

[Have to Wonder]

I am not talking about you and Dexter, I am talking about you and your husband.... it is SO very important to a betrayed spouse to have their concerns dealt with every time... please show patience with him, even if you have answered the same question several times before... he needs the repetitiveness to 'believe' you and to begin to trust you once again. He also needs to see you are willing to do this. That you are willing to commit verbally to becoming transparent and trustworthy.

 

Be patient. Repeat any answer he needs to hear. He also asks it several different ways to 'see' if you have the same answer... to make sure you are telling the truth, to be able to believe you and to begin to trust you.

Its like hearing the same answer is stable, believable and comforting. In my experience the worst answers you can give are: "I already told you this before, so I am not saying it again" or "Well clearly you don't listen to me, so why should I repeat myself?!" or "I have already stated this before so what is the point?" or "Well anything out of my mouth is a lie and you don't want to believe me so I am not going to say it again."

 

Hi Athena,

 

I have absolutely no issue whatsoever with answering the same question(s) over & over to my H for precisely the reasons you've stated above. I do indeed realize that he will need patience and constant reassurance, and I am willing to do whatever I have to do to provide that, even if (ESPECIALLY if) he asks the same questions again & again. H is the one who deserves all he can get in the way of reassurance and reasons and proof of my commitment to heal this marriage to begin to trust me again. My point with Dexter was that I didn't feel like I should have to keep answering HIS questions again & again...that whatever questions as to "why" should be addressed between H & me.

 

Thanks, as always, for your advice - know that I take it to heart and am doing all I can to start the uphill climb toward regaining his trust.

[Dexter Morgan]

Does it really matter so deeply to you what H understands, why he understands "it" and so forth?

 

actually yes, because if everything was happy in the marriage, I am having trouble understanding just what there IS to understand?

 

i can see him forgiving you, but not understanding why you cheated.

 

 

As I said earlier, there are things about me that I've not disclosed (and don't need or want to) on a public forum but they have helped formed who I am and to an extent, why I do the things I do (good, bad or indifferent). It seems to me it should be enough for me to tell you that H feels like he understands the why of what I did

 

well I'm sure its enough for you....but again, the "why" of what you did?

 

so here is what I'm thinking....a list of possible "whys" and what there is to understand about them.

 

1) the marriage was rocky, you weren't getting from him what you need and he admits neglect......but you already said that pretty much isn't the case and your husband does enough validating that you are attractive....so #1 must be out.

 

2) you have a problem with drinking and maybe he thinks drinking is an excuse....but you already said you rarely drink...but maybe he thinks he understands giving in to temptation while intoxicated.

 

3) he understands that it may be hard for some people to not resist temptation from someone they are attracted to and doesn't blame you for giving in to this guy....if so, gotta scratch my head on that one.

 

4).....well hell, I can't think of anything beyond that. thats why I'm having such a hard time wondering what there is about your cheating that he understands given that you say your marriage is wonderful.

 

does he think he did something to cause you to stray? did you have the type of personality that he can see where you might have gotten caught up in a moment? Its just mind boggling to me....thats all.

 

But, I still don't think it makes a difference in my M whether you understand "what there is to understand"

 

I think it makes a difference in that what it is he is understanding may explain why he can forgive you.

 

Other than that, it is a matter of curiosity for me. If you don't want to answer the question, then just say so. Obviously it would be something, I would guess, that hardly anyone would understand...otherwise, what is the big deal in saying so?

 

 

- after all (and for this, I'm sure you'd be ETERNALLY grateful), you don't have to live with me!

 

You are correct, I am grateful for that;)

[Dexter Morgan]

My point with Dexter was that I didn't feel like I should have to keep answering HIS questions again & again...that whatever questions as to "why" should be addressed between H & me. .

 

you didn't answer the question in the first place.

 

And I know its because there is a big reason you don't want to answer the question. Otherwise, whats the big deal.

[Have to Wonder]

you didn't answer the question in the first place.

 

And I know its because there is a big reason you don't want to answer the question. Otherwise, whats the big deal.

 

So, ok, Dexter, while I believe you're not Troubadour in disguise, you are a pit bull when you think you deserve answers. Yes, he sees that drinking DID indeed affect what I did (that's why when I DO occasionally drink, up til now, it's always been with im). Yes, I have been known in the past to "get caught up in the moment." And yes, there is definitely more to the story of why he feels he can forgive me. Did I not want to answer your question? Not necessarily - just felt like your "curiosity" called for more details than you needed.

 

By the way, the gratitude most assuredly goes both ways!

[Dexter Morgan]

So, ok, Dexter, while I believe you're not Troubadour in disguise, you are a pit bull when you think you deserve answers.

 

I don't deserve answers, but it is common courtesy on a board to answer a simple question.

 

I could see if you wouldn't want to answer a question like, "how long is your husband's penis":p

 

 

Yes, he sees that drinking DID indeed affect what I did (that's why when I DO occasionally drink, up til now, it's always been with im). Yes, I have been known in the past to "get caught up in the moment."

 

Meaning you have done this before and he knows about it? So this isn't the first time he has had to forgive you?

 

 

And yes, there is definitely more to the story of why he feels he can forgive me. Did I not want to answer your question? Not necessarily - just felt like your "curiosity" called for more details than you needed.

 

Fair enough.

 

 

By the way, the gratitude most assuredly goes both ways!

 

I bet. You are lucky to have a husband that can forgive repeat offenses.

 

I don't like to assume, but going by your "I have been known in the past to get caught up in the moment" comment

[Have to Wonder]

I could see if you wouldn't want to answer a question like, "how long is your husband's penis":p

 

 

 

 

Meaning you have done this before and he knows about it? So this isn't the first time he has had to forgive you?

 

 

I bet. You are lucky to have a husband that can forgive repeat offenses.

 

I don't like to assume, but going by your "I have been known in the past to get caught up in the moment" comment

 

 

On your first comment, point taken!

 

NO - I have never before done anything remotely like this...when I say I've gotten caught up in the moment in the past, it's always been with HIM (hence the majority of my drinking only with him) - it has led to many a pleasant evening. He has never had to forgive any offenses, because this was the first & only time I've done anything to need forgiveness for. Maybe that's why he's more willing to be forgiving, because in all the time we've been together, I have done absolutely nothing to betray him, UNTIL NOW. When I said that yes, I have been known in the past to get caught up in the moment, I never meant to infer that it had happened with someone other than my H. I apologize for that miscommunication...usually the 'caught up in the moment' things have led to stuff like getting up & singing karoake in a club (where we are there together) or something otherwise innocuous.

[Dexter Morgan]

Ok, glad to hear this isn't a repeat offense. And your husband "understands"...while I don't understand it and don't have a clear picture of what there is to understand...I'll leave it at that.

 

So now the question is, which I didn't see a specific answer to, what will happen the next time on a business trip and the group wants to go out and party?

 

I know, you could always say you can go with them and refrain from drinking and not let yourself get caught up with another man, but honestly, the only way to make sure you don't do this again is remove yourself completely from those types of social interactions without your husband around.

[pparrott]

Dex...You seem to me to not be very forgiving. Do You believe her when she says it won't happen again? I know she's not your wife, but your line of questioning leads me to believe you don't believe her. That's all I'm asking........Is it at all possible that people just falter ONCE in life? Realize their mistakes & not let it happen again? Or is everything always gloom & doom.....No one gets better, No one is happy, No one can change? Just observing after reading some of your posts in other places too.

Are you in a happily committed relationship? Just curious. Didn't read far enough to gain that info.

[Have to Wonder]

So now the question is, which I didn't see a specific answer to, what will happen the next time on a business trip and the group wants to go out and party?

 

I know, you could always say you can go with them and refrain from drinking and not let yourself get caught up with another man, but honestly, the only way to make sure you don't do this again is remove yourself completely from those types of social interactions without your husband around.

 

And that was precisely my answer when Mark asked the question a number of posts again...I will not allow myself to put myself in any kind of situation which could possibly be construed as destructive. Additionally, as Athena suggested, I will remain in contact with my husband letting him know where I am at all times, with whom, etc.

[Have to Wonder]

Dex...You seem to me to not be very forgiving. Do You believe her when she says it won't happen again? I know she's not your wife, but your line of questioning leads me to believe you don't believe her. That's all I'm asking........Is it at all possible that people just falter ONCE in life? Realize their mistakes & not let it happen again? Or is everything always gloom & doom.....No one gets better, No one is happy, No one can change? Just observing after reading some of your posts in other places too.

Are you in a happily committed relationship? Just curious. Didn't read far enough to gain that info.

 

Pparrott - I've wondered the same thing myself and have basically said so to Dexter. I believe, and will continue to believe, that people CAN falter once in life, realize their mistakes & not allow it to happen again. I plan to be living proof of that.

[Have to Wonder]

And that was precisely my answer when Mark asked the question a number of posts again...I will not allow myself to put myself in any kind of situation which could possibly be construed as destructive. Additionally, as Athena suggested, I will remain in contact with my husband letting him know where I am at all times, with whom, etc.

 

Oops - meant to say "when Mark asked that question a number of posts earlier" not "again"

[Reggie]

It's true, IMO. Folks can learn from their mistakes and you have done no justifying or blameshifting.So, I think there is a very good chance you won't go this route, again.

The folks that are at risk seem to be the ones pointing fingers at the BS as justification for cheating. None of that here.

[pparrott]

Have to Wonder: I know there are people on here that think what you did was horrible & unforgiving. As well as people who think your husband is an idiot for not leaving you. I say.....Poo Foo to all of them!! I think what you did was pretty innocent - It happens! Not a make or break thing!

We are human afterall. Not perfect. Good for you for telling him & good for him for understanding!!! (not a choice I would have made - I would have been too chicken) As long as he doesn't throw it in your face (he sounds like a good guy & won't) ....time will help for you to not remember the incident. Good Luck to you.

P.S.....don't let anyone here bully you around to thinking you should walk around with a Scarlet A on your shirt every day!

[Have to Wonder]

Have to Wonder: I know there are people on here that think what you did was horrible & unforgiving. As well as people who think your husband is an idiot for not leaving you. I say.....Poo Foo to all of them!! I think what you did was pretty innocent - It happens! Not a make or break thing!

We are human afterall. Not perfect. Good for you for telling him & good for him for understanding!!! (not a choice I would have made - I would have been too chicken) As long as he doesn't throw it in your face (he sounds like a good guy & won't) ....time will help for you to not remember the incident. Good Luck to you.

P.S.....don't let anyone here bully you around to thinking you should walk around with a Scarlet A on your shirt every day!

 

Pparrott - thank you for your kind words - encouragement (especially at this point) means a great deal to me. I read in one thread where a poster said to take what's meaningful to my specific situation and disregard the rest. That's what I've tried to do - have begun IC & my husband and I are talking a lot about everything. Love the P.S.! I won't walk around feeling that way, because I truly believe that things do eventually work out the way they're supposed to. Again - thanks!

[HappyAtLast]

P.S.....don't let anyone here bully you around to thinking you should walk around with a Scarlet A on your shirt every day!

 

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that she do so. However, as a former cheater, I can tell you that it is important never to forget what transpired and how it made you (and in Have to Wonder's case her husband) feel. This is how we keep history from repeating itself.

[confusedinkansas]

AMEN! Sista!

I was the cheater in our relationship......Never Ever Ever Again!

[Have to Wonder]

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that she do so. However, as a former cheater, I can tell you that it is important never to forget what transpired and how it made you (and in Have to Wonder's case her husband) feel. This is how we keep history from repeating itself.

 

I don't intend (nor do I WANT to) to forget...that would defeat the purpose of all the hard work to rebuild...and I totally agree, this is how we keep it from happening again. Remember the pain caused to both the BS and the M and learn from it.

[Dexter Morgan]

Dex...You seem to me to not be very forgiving.

 

I admit it...I'm not when it comes to cheating. Not saying I wouldn't forgive, but even if I did....I still wouldn't stay in the relationship. I could forgive...then leave.

 

 

Do You believe her when she says it won't happen again?

 

Whats to believe? If she did it once, she can do it again. i believe that she THINKS she will never do it again...but unless she removes herself from the situations that are more conducive to her cheating, it will happen again.

 

 

 

Is it at all possible that people just falter ONCE in life?

 

as far as I'm concerned, no...not with regards to cheating. Its like this....the betrayed now knows that their spouse lusts for other people and can act on it. The WS can probably make good on the promise to never let it happen again...but the fact above remains.

 

 

 

Realize their mistakes & not let it happen again?

 

Cheating isn't a mistake. People do it because they want to do it.

 

Call it a piss poor decision...but a mistake? No.

 

 

Or is everything always gloom & doom.....No one gets better, No one is happy, No one can change?

 

she even said herself she can't get the fondness of her encounter with the other guy out of her head. Can she change her behaviors to not put herself in those positions? Sure...but she will never change her desires...and her desires were made known when she cheated.

 

now its moot....lucky for her, her husband forgave her....but he needs to not forgive blindly. I think he needs to realize that it CAN happen again and take steps to make sure she doesn't put herself in those positions again....but going to be tough to do if she is away on business where he doesn't know whats going on.

 

 

Just observing after reading some of your posts in other places too.

Are you in a happily committed relationship?

 

Was, until a comment from her turned me off. I am happily single.

[Dexter Morgan]

I think what you did was pretty innocent - It happens!

 

Is this a joke? Her making out with another man and feeling each other up when she is a married woman is innocent?

 

making out with someone else, or even having an emotional affair is anything BUT innocent.

 

Innocent is not engaging in cheating or an affair at all.

[Have to Wonder]

Is this a joke? Her making out with another man and feeling each other up when she is a married woman is innocent?

 

 

But Dexter, I didn't feel him up at all - it was all one-sided...THAT'S A JOKE!! (Taking small amounts of humor where I can find them these days) I understand exactly what you're saying & while I will admit that some of your posts have really riled me up, I actually agree 100% with what you said in response to it being in any way, shape or form innocent. It was anything but.

 

And the bottom line here is that, honestly, it doesn't matter one whit to me whether you believe I can/will do it again, it matters to me what H believes, and what I can do with my words/actions/deeds to prove to him that I won't.

 

she even said herself she can't get the fondness of her encounter with the other guy out of her head. Can she change her behaviors to not put herself in those positions? Sure...but she will never change her desires...and her desires were made known when she cheated.

 

When I first posted, yes I did indeed state that I couldn't get the "fondness," as you refer to it, out of my head. I'll tell you this, though, 'fond' is not at all the adjective that comes to mind after all the pain I've caused. I don't believe it's my desires that need to change - it's where they're aimed & that should/will be solely at my H.