axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Hi. I'd like a variety of opinions on this. I've managed to get myself romantically entangled with two women. Both entanglements started within the same week although I've known one longer than the other. They don't know each other. Neither knows about the other. My situation doesn't matter so much though because I'm confident that I'll do the right thing when it comes to a place where a decision must be made. I'm just wondering where the other posters here would draw the line. I'm a very rational person -in my head, there can be no cheating unless there is a set of rules agreed upon by both participants (an agreement to be monogamous or whatever). But everyone views stuff like this differently from the next person and I don't want anyone to end up feeling hurt because I assumed that their preconceptions were similar to mine. Anyway, what do you think? Come one, come all! I'll even wax poetic about those who give the best responses (I know I don't know any of you personally but I'll make something up that amuses you.) axis
EllieBean Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 If you are sexually involved with one or both of them, that's cheating, and you need to make a choice. The same applies if one or both of them becomes emotionally attached to you or believes that you have an exclusive relationship. If you're dating around, you should be honest about that, and don't let these girls think you're having an exclusive relationship.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 If you are sexually involved with one or both of them, that's cheating, and you need to make a choice. The same applies if one or both of them becomes emotionally attached to you or believes that you have an exclusive relationship. If you're dating around, you should be honest about that, and don't let these girls think you're having an exclusive relationship. I totally understand and agree fully with the idea that I shouldn't lead either of them on emotionally. I would also not allow anyone to believe that we're exclusive until it was discussed openly and a decision is made (ie -if somebody refers to themself as my 'girlfriend' I'll tell them that that isn't the case.) But the sex thing? really? what does sex have to do with it?
samspade Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 If you are sexually involved with one or both of them, that's cheating, and you need to make a choice. This is incorrect. If you're dating around, you should be honest about that, and don't let these girls think you're having an exclusive relationship. This is correct. I'm a very rational person -in my head, there can be no cheating unless there is a set of rules agreed upon by both participants (an agreement to be monogamous or whatever). This is correct.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 This is correct. Samspade has always been a special person to me. If it wasn't that samspade had discovered the cure for cancer, saved the babyseals of the arctic from sport clubbing or single-handedly brought down the military-industrial complex, samspade made an incredible impact on my life with their infinite wisdom on the division among sex and emotion in my dating life. For this I am eternally grateful.
boldjack Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 I agree with Ellie, up to a point. If you are having casual sex with both, it may or may not be cheating, but it is unsafe. Sleeping around in the age of STD's is a recipe for disaster. The main problem is one of communication. Have you told either one that you were exclusive? In any way, have you hinted, intimated, or promised this? If so then you are cheating, by my definition. The trouble is, that these ladies may have very different ideas on the subject. What it all comes down to, is how they react to your relationship with the other person. Finally you must tell each about the other. These ladies deserve basic human respect, AND a say in the inevitable choices, that you(plural) will need to make.
CharismaCoach Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Many people aren't used to dating someone who is dating others also. The fact is it is not cheating. Unless you have had the "We are exclusive BF/GF" talk you aren't doing anything wrong. However if you are dating either of them more than once a week it may be unclear you are dating other people. The hard part is talking to them about it. I date more than one person at a time regularly. However I am very honest with everyone. I don't slap them in the face with honesty either though. To be honest with the women you are dating is making sure they know you are dating in a tactful way. If you just met them both it is much easier than if you have been dating for a while. I usually tell a woman up front when I meet her when we talk about whether she is single or not, "I am dating a couple people, nothing serious." If I wait till the second or third date or even worse after we sleep together it is almost too late. The best I can hope for now is to bring up the "relationship talk" and tell her about my personal rule that I don't do an exclusive relationship with women I date until I have dated them for 2 months. This helps me not jump into a relationship and smother them. Good luck on this one. Just don't act like you have done anything wrong. Dating is dating until you are in a relationship. Unless one of them is calling you their boyfriend you are not exclusive. Hiding it from them though and actively lying will get you in trouble.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 Have you told either one that you were exclusive? In any way, have you hinted, intimated, or promised this? Absolutely not. All I've told either of them is that I like them very much. These ladies deserve basic human respect, AND a say in the inevitable choices, that you(plural) will need to make. This is exactly why I'm mining for opinions. Thank you, boldjack.
samspade Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Samspade has always been a special person to me. If it wasn't that samspade had discovered the cure for cancer, saved the babyseals of the arctic from sport clubbing or single-handedly brought down the military-industrial complex, samspade made an incredible impact on my life with their infinite wisdom on the division among sex and emotion in my dating life. For this I am eternally grateful. Hahah. Just trying to keep it simple. Actually, I had to do something other than this, so I just clicked "submit" without elaborating. I think you have the right idea, though. For all you know, they are dating/sleeping with others, too. That's fair as long as no one is lying to anyone. I don't agree that it's presumed exclusive once you've had sex. And when I say "not lying" that includes not omitting information, if asked. The best response is "I am dating other people" and leave it at that.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 Many people aren't used to dating someone who is dating others also. . . . I usually tell a woman up front when I meet her when we talk about whether she is single or not, "I am dating a couple people, nothing serious." If I wait till the second or third date or even worse after we sleep together it is almost too late. The best I can hope for now is to bring up the "relationship talk" and tell her about my personal rule that I don't do an exclusive relationship with women I date until I have dated them for 2 months. This helps me not jump into a relationship and smother them. This is good food for though. I hadn't even considered the idea that it can't go on for too long yet. I've just been having non-committal fun without regard to the idea that somebody may eventually want a relationship. Indeed, I'll need to remain aware of that. Unless one of them is calling you their boyfriend you are not exclusive. This thread might get interesting. I'm also a woman.
Trialbyfire Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 This thread is the reason why women who are looking for relationships, shouldn't sleep with anyone until they're in an exclusive relationship.
Trimmer Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 This thread might get interesting. Heh heh... I think it just did.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 This thread is the reason why women who are looking for relationships, shouldn't sleep with anyone until they're in an exclusive relationship. Trialbyfire is an odd sort. Even in this day of age where sex does not necessarily preclude agreements upon exclusivity, Trialbyfire holds fast to the traditional values that have made the institution of marriage so sacred to so many. For this steadfast and unwavering approach, Trialbyfire deserves mad respect. Props!
fishtaco Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 This thread might get interesting. I'm also a woman. Doesn't matter, rules are the same. But good thing you're also a woman, so this won't turn into some sort of gender war. Even girlfriend/girlfriend (in your case) terms can be "dodged". Because you can still argue what it means. However, "exclusive" is absolute. It means just that, exclusive, you can't argue your way out of it. Everything before both sides agree to exclusive - do whatever you want. After agreeing to exclusivity, then it would be considered cheating. Cheating is not sex. Cheating is broken promise.
samspade Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 This thread might get interesting. I'm also a woman. This makes no difference. As long as you are not deceiving anyone, and they haven't broached the "exclusive" subject with you, you are within bounds in my book.
Author axisdenied Posted April 7, 2009 Author Posted April 7, 2009 Doesn't matter, rules are the same. But good thing you're also a woman, so this won't turn into some sort of gender war. I'm aware of that. Just trying to emphasize the degree of personal transparency with which I intend to handle the situation. Cheating is not sex. Cheating is broken promise. I remember the first time I saw fishtaco. It was right here, behind my computer screen, as I read the astounding input they offered on the boards of loveshack. I was so taken with their thoughtful use of the english language that, quite honestly, I had to deter my eyes away from the screen to keep myself from becoming swept away in their brilliance.
fishtaco Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 I remember the first time I saw fishtaco. It was right here, behind my computer screen, as I read the astounding input they offered on the boards of loveshack. I was so taken with their thoughtful use of the english language that, quite honestly, I had to deter my eyes away from the screen to keep myself from becoming swept away in their brilliance. If you thought my posts were brilliant you might want to turn down your monitor a bit, but I do appreciate the compliment that I'm not sure I deserve. I can tell you from personal experience that the hard part is when you make a decision who you're going to go with, and having to tell the other one, sry ur sol kthxbai. Although having options is never a bad thing.
mr.dream merchant Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 If neither of them are mentioning being exclusive then maybe they're seeing others as well? I say keep doing what you do until one of them wants to get exclusive.
Trialbyfire Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Trialbyfire is an odd sort. Even in this day of age where sex does not necessarily preclude agreements upon exclusivity, Trialbyfire holds fast to the traditional values that have made the institution of marriage so sacred to so many. For this steadfast and unwavering approach, Trialbyfire deserves mad respect. Props! Haha... I'm unrepentently old fashioned when it comes to sex! Only with someone I care about, trust, respect and like. Whether that leads to marriage is another story. As for the props, undeserved but hilarious. :laugh:
Isolde Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 It becomes cheating if and only if there has been a discussion of exclusivity with one or both women. Seriously, multi-dating is fine but not when it drags on and on, creating all this drama. If you like both people equally, chances are you don't like either of them all that much?
boldjack Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Sounds to me , Axis, that you've got a pretty good handle on the method, but not so good, on the choice. You could always form a commune and live with both. After all ,it's not about the gender, it's about the people.
EllieBean Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 I think both women should be fully aware of each other - no room for assumptions about exclusivity. You must feel that either one or both would be unhappy with a revelation of non-exclusivity, otherwise you would be up-front with them. I would tend to think that if you're dating me, you're only dating me, until such time as we give up and decide that we don't want a relationship, be that 5 dates or 5 years. Why do you feel the need to date multiple women anyway - what's the rush? Can't you wait until you suss out one girl before you make a decision and move on to the next one? In my opinion, if you're dating other women you're clearly not committed to seeing what might happen between us, so if someone told me on a first date that he was dating a few women, I simply wouldn't bother seeing him again. I have never had the exclusivity conversation with anyone, and nobody has ever mentioned it to me, even in relationships that have lasted 2-3 years. I hate this American style multiple-dating thing that is increasingly becoming the norm Even if I knew that multiple-dating was going on, I would certainly assume that sexual intimacy means we are having a relationship - I, and many other women, do not separate sex and emotion - if I have sex with you then we are really close emotionally and I probably think of you as my bf. If I found out after sex that you were seeing other girls, I would class you as a cheater and break off all contact immediately.
BubblyPopcorn Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 I totally understand and agree fully with the idea that I shouldn't lead either of them on emotionally. I would also not allow anyone to believe that we're exclusive until it was discussed openly and a decision is made (ie -if somebody refers to themself as my 'girlfriend' I'll tell them that that isn't the case.) But the sex thing? really? what does sex have to do with it? But you are risking leading them on emotionally, you do know that don't you? Especially if you are physically intimate with them. Being involved in two romantic relationships at the same time, is a far stretch from going on 1-2 dates with someone. It may not be considered “cheating” per se, because the exclusive discussion hasn’t been broached by any of you and you are not in a committed realtionship, but you can’t argue that you are risking a level of trust to be broken if you continue with both relationships and one or both finds out. So, why not just be upfront about it and tell each of them that you are dating other people since that is what you are doing? Furthermore, what if you had developed feelings for one of them but discovered that she was dating and/or sleeping with someone else too and chose not to tell you?
samspade Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 So, why not just be upfront about it and tell each of them that you are dating other people since that is what you are doing? I think you should only do this if asked. Otherwise you are being presumptuous. You don't necessarily know that either party is interested in being serious.
BubblyPopcorn Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 I think you should only do this if asked. Otherwise you are being presumptuous. You don't necessarily know that either party is interested in being serious. So if he's not serious, then why not tell her.....
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