Layered Cake! Long Distance, old flames & current situations

[RGBA]

Hi Everyone - this is my first post, I think I have put in the correct category even though it spans many. If i've posted incorrectly I apologise.

 

Ok [Deep breath] please no condescending, or scathing comments, because this has turned a stable 31yo guy into vulnerable confused being. This forum, which I thankfully found this afternoon, I am using as a hope, or a reach out. At the moment my internal dialogue is so scattered and so fast I can not think clearly. What if? Why don't? Why now? Is it just another test? etc etc

 

Where to start - Ok Me! I am currently in a long distance relationship with a lovely girl. In this relationship I have spent more time apart from her than with her. We committed after meeting in the workplace in the UK, and I am now living in Australia due to the global crisis a renewed work permit is not on the cards for - I dont know how long, so even though I can visit, I am unable to work in the UK. We dated for 4 months (one of which she was in the USA for), and in January I met her in Thailand and spent 11 days with her. The main reason I went to Thailand was because I wanted to see if I could get some closure, or a sign or anything that would inevitably help be to decide whether I was to peruse this or if it would be more sensible to decide to go separate ways. I had a wonderful time in Thailand - but I did not get closure. I was provided with more questions, as during our time together we talked about families / futures and all that deep and meaningful stuff, and there were couple of important (hypothetical) topics we did not 100% agree on. (Ie: number of kids, she would love to have 4 or 5 when I would like to have 2, maybe 3....) So ....In summary, our physical experience of each other spans only 4 months of an 8 month relationship. She has a very different, almost timid personality which I love, but I also am a little afraid of as I need to talk, communicate and express in order to make a relationship decision, which is beneficial to both, if it effects both, and communication in a relationship is of upmost importance.

 

When I returned from the UK late last year I reconnected (out of pure chance) with a university friend, this is after 10 years not hearing from each other. Not just a uni friend, she was the 'it' girl on campus, one who I was thought was one of 'those' girls only celebrity men or the wealthy would have a chance with. At uni we were friends, but we were both dating other people at the time, and we did not know each other 'that' well. Since reconnecting we have been in contact via sms/text or email or phone call nearly everyday, and I get this amazing energy from her. Saying that I feel I have spent more time and conversation with this uni friend than with my long distance girlfriend. Its been reviled during conversation when I said I was keen on her at uni, that she had a somewhat small crush over me also. This ex-uni girl is stunning, but there is her personality which I think I have fallen for even more so. She makes me laugh, seeing her name on my phone and in emails gives me a physical, real, and genuine smile, and trying to describe to you what I am feeling and how she makes me feel, it virtually impossible to put into words. ( I have revised this paragraph for hours today and I still have not got it right for you to read )

 

So she is living in Melbourne, Victoria, and I live in South Australia, and we finally caught up in Adelaide for dinner and drinks. I was hoping I would do something wrong, or be turned off her in some way during the course of the night, so that way there would be closure, and we could go along with our 'normal' lives. That Friday night was one of the best nights (I would almost kill to make it my Groundhog day), and we both had so much fun chatting and the like. Seeing this, I made a conscious decision and effort to have a couple more drinks than I should have just so she may pick up on this and be turned off me. I was fairly drunk, (and she was a little, as far as I could tell) but .... still no closure. More to the point we are reminiscing now about what a great night, and I have even stronger feeling now than I did before .......and no we did NOT hook up.

 

So now for the catches. ...... In 2004 I was engaged to be married, only to find out 5 1/2 weeks before my wedding my fiance was cheating on me, and had been for many months before. Needless to say this changed me, and stole the last piece of my innocence which sent me into a depressive self destructive state for almost 18 months. I would not want to wish that uncontrollable emotional state on anyone.

 

Yup ...... She is engaged, and planning to be married at the end of this year. She is also engaged to a man some years her senior, who has two teenage daughters from a previous marriage. Although they all get along great. ..I did pick up on some body language friday night that portrayed that this scenario might have taken some time to adapt to; and (speculating here) but one which has (if not now, previously) left a small degree of uncertainty in her mind.

 

I am a guy of integrity, I have been all my life. I have had a few meaningless flings in-between relationships, but I have only had 4 serious relationships in my 31 years. I have never cheated on a girl or hit on a girl if they had a partner, I have been tested a couple of times but have always been honorable to myself, and I pride myself in that because ultimately (I feel) if you are not true to yourself you are a false person.

 

So I hear you say - yup you have a tough decision to make, and I have answered my question with my 2-cents about loyalty and oneself. But .... My questions, no my fears; is I will be forever comparing?

So, Do I:

1) Stay with my existing slow skype based relationship with a gorgeous, timid, very different girl, one who I have these little uncertainties about, ....and forever comparing.

2) Do I have a serious sit down and say, ok my feelings are uncontrollably strong for you, and I am willing to 'go through whatever' to have you, be with you, with the belief that I think you are the one, to get what I (we) want, knowing there will be some sacrifice?

3) Do I do sever both and hope that some divine fate will intervene and provide me with what I am looking for in a life partner. Bearing in mind I do not consider myself to be a 'head turner'. Even then, being lucky enough to find another attracted female sure, there is risk in that alone, fine. But to find another attractive personality ....

 

This; 'This' has been effecting my daily functionality with in the world for the last 'x' months, and after last friday, I feel like I am a 15yo kid, waiting by the phone, wanting that next email or sms. Its almost like this is feeding me, fueling me and consuming me. ... and I know the ramifications of any decision I have listed, but that is not helping this 'break up' feeling im dealing with now.

 

My uni friend has now returned to her home and her life, and we today have talked about (almost) everything I have listed above several times over the course of today.

 

I have tried to talk myself straight, but feelings and emotions can not easily be fooled or changed so hence the reason I am opening up here ...

 

Little help....

[RGBA]

So it is like I have finally found what I am looking for, but I'm and not sure I can have it.

[Kaii]

Well, what does your "uni" friend have to say about all this? You went into a lot of detail to explain your own feelings but left out the part about how she feels. Does she reciprocate, or is this a one sided unrequited love type situation?

 

If she does feel the same way, do you really feel that you can trust her? She IS engaged to be married. What does that say about her character for her to be emailing/phoning/meeting up for drinks with another man (ie YOU) while she is supposedly in love and soon to be married to someone else. Does her future husband know about you? If the answer is no, then I would tread carefully because then you know what she is capable, and completely willing to do...lie and deceive her partner.

 

Regardless, I think you should do the honourable thing and break up with your first girlfriend. I think long distance relationships are incredibly difficult to maintain and from what you've said in your post, you just don't seem that "into" her. As a point of reference, 2/3 of your post was about this other woman and not about her.

 

Good luck to you

[RGBA]

Well, what does your "uni" friend have to say about all this? You went into a lot of detail to explain your own feelings but left out the part about how she feels. Does she reciprocate, or is this a one sided unrequited love type situation?

 

If she does feel the same way, do you really feel that you can trust her? She IS engaged to be married. What does that say about her character for her to be emailing/phoning/meeting up for drinks with another man (ie YOU) while she is supposedly in love and soon to be married to someone else.

 

Unfortunately yes there are feelings from both sides which has lead me here searching for answers.

 

Does her future husband know about you? If the answer is no, then I would tread carefully because then you know what she is capable, and completely willing to do...lie and deceive her partner.

 

Does the husband know. I dont think so, but I also want to re-iterate I am not a dirty little secret. And we are friends who have done nothing more than what friends do. I do know that they do have very separate lives and have their own friends groups and nights out separately.

 

Thank you Kaii - you have some good points

[Kaii]

Unfortunately yes there are feelings from both sides which has lead me here searching for answers.

 

 

 

Does the husband know. I dont think so, but I also want to re-iterate I am not a dirty little secret. And we are friends who have done nothing more than what friends do. I do know that they do have very separate lives and have their own friends groups and nights out separately.

 

Thank you Kaii - you have some good points

 

I don't want to roast you by any means, but by stating that "YES, there feelings from both sides" and then going on to say that her fiance does not know about you but that you two are "doing nothing more than what friends do" is incredibly delusional on your part.

 

Platonic "friends" do not have feelings for one another. Period. What you are doing with this woman has moved beyond the platonic "friend" realm. You text, email, phone, meet up...sure this is what friends do. BUT you also, confide, express romantic feelings, long for, etc....and this is not what friends do.

 

Call it what you want, but to me, it sounds like you are having an emotional affair with her. And the fact that she is engaged to someone else does not bode well for anyone involved.

[RGBA]

You are 100% correct - as soon as one confides in, receives and express' romantic feelings, etc....it is an emotional affair. I now feel sick being so blind, and knowing what I have to do.

[JooLee]

i have to stay your style of writing is very entertaining. i was reading every word with intensity.

[RGBA]

i have to stay your style of writing is very entertaining. i was reading every word with intensity.

 

Thank you. Unfortunately entertaining you will come at quite an emotional toll. Simply, it's another episode in my life which could be titled pulp fiction, and I mean that in the literal sense, not the hollywood movie sense.

[goldencloud]

Hey,

Firstly let me say I LOVED your post. And yes yes, it may have been written under a 'veil of turmoil' but regardless it was great!

ANYWAYS, flattery aside, sometimes things happen in life when we least expect them.

Okay to better explain myself, I'll take an instance from my life. I'm not sure if you have read my past few posts( if not, don't worry, just some maudlin pieces droning on and on about some man).

ANYWAYS, everyone on this forum gave me fantastic advice(things I kind of knew but had to have blatantly said to me)...and I cut him out...

Whilst all this was happening, me and an old high school friend started chatting. Bear in mind we had NOT seen eachother in about six years. ALOT has changed in six years but anyways I told him that back in the day I had a huge crush on me, SO huge that it turned me into a mute dumpling whenever he was around...rendering me utterly INCAPABLE of speech because I just darnit liked him THAT MUCH. He was in utter and complete shock because he felt that I couldn't have liked him. He thought I would have never gone for me, and thus he never made a move whilst the whole time I was pining away for for him with the zest of a thousand seas rushing forth.

ANYWAYS it might have had a happy ending, and perhaps this evening we could have gone for drinks/dinner who knows...BUT just as he moved back to our hometown...I MOVED ACROSS THE OCEAN and now we live practically a million hours away(feels like it anyways) but then he mentioned who knows what could happen...and how odd it is that for six years we kept in contact, and how inspite of us pretty much saying in touch through impersonal methods like email, how we each dated gosh knows how many people, there has ALWAYS been something between us.

anyways the point of all this isn't to draw attention to my scenario but to show you that life sometimes works in mysterious ways, and people aren't always presented to us when 'circumstances are right'. As much as we'd life to control situations and have everything tidied up for us in advance, it's just not possible, because there are no instructions to existance.

It's quite apparent your feelings for this uni girl FAR SURPASS what you feel for the long distance girl, and perhaps you owe it to yourself to be honest.

She's engaged, alright. It's a dilemma. But at the same time she did all this when she was moving forth with her life, as you were with yours(very seperate from what you and her could potentially have)...but somehow by some random chance, you guys re-connected, who knows why and who knows the outcome.

I personally think if you really feel that there is something there from both sides, explore it...of course she is engaged and there are lines of decorum, but if she feels what you feel then I see no reason why it wouldn't somehow come up in conversation.

Another little story of hope. My mom prior to meeting my dad had been engaged for four years to an older man... a few weeks prior to the wedding, she broke it off because something in her heart of hearts told her it just wasn't right. She broke it off against all advice of everyone she knew, and run off to the state for a holiday to get away from it all. As she was standing by a museum, my dad spotted her and was just struck by her...he approached her, and asked her for coffee...they spent one week together, he went back to his country, she went back to hers...they kept in contact over the phone for 8 months(he finalised his divorce which was on going when they first met)...and got married...and they have been happily married for 26 years and to this day they look at each other as though they just met yesterday

so the point in all this , sometimes when we least expect it, in the worst situations, we can create the best situations.

Hope my novel helped.

[RGBA]

goldencloud - thank you for your feedback, and your praise. The very fact you mentioned of "life sometimes works in mysterious ways, and people aren't always presented to us when 'circumstances are right'." is what is eating at me.

 

As difficult as all this is, I am trying to following my heart, and ive bought a ticket back to England. As much as I dont want to, I think my girl there deserves a face to face explanation of my "whys" and "reasons". The long dist, and not growing as a couple is just to difficult. When Kaii mentioned the phrase "Emotion affair" that ate at me so badly; as I realised I have been naively, unintentionally, and blindly been breaking the ethics of what I pride myself on.

 

If anything my unifriend has shown me what I am looking for, and I see that now I was not getting all this from my partner and the long dist relationship just makes it worse.

 

I will tell my unifriend what my plans are, and I will also tell her I am not going to interfere any longer, I cant, and ultimately the decision is back with her. I 'feel that is the right thing to do....

 

Can I ask when you said

My mom prior to meeting my dad had been engaged for four years to an older man... a few weeks prior to the wedding, she broke it off because something in her heart of hearts told her it just wasn't right. She broke it off against all advice of everyone she knew, and run off to the state for a holiday to get away from it all.

How did your mums parents find this, was she treated like a bit of a black sheep after? Even if for a period?

 

Thank you again, it was nice to hear your thoughts.

[SoulSearch_CO]

I also enjoyed your post, RGBA. Riveting - you should be a writer...ever considered it?

 

Anyway - I think you're making a wise choice. Your most recent post was exactly what I was going to recommend to you - let the LDR go and tell your unifriend that you can't continue as you have been doing.

 

I think you knew the answers, you just needed to hear it.

[RGBA]

I also enjoyed your post, RGBA. Riveting - you should be a writer...ever considered it?

 

Anyway - I think you're making a wise choice. Your most recent post was exactly what I was going to recommend to you - let the LDR go and tell your unifriend that you can't continue as you have been doing.

 

Thank you SoulSearch_CO.

Have I considered it - not seriously, but you are not the first to ask. There have been more than enough events in my life where I have typed an extensive email and sent it to friends seeking their advice, only to have them more interested in the intricate details ive provided, than the advise I was seeking.

 

I think you knew the answers, you just needed to hear it.

 

....maybe, after my '04 breakup I then listened to what my heart was feeling and not what my head was telling me. At the present minute hearing it does not help, im sorry.

 

However dwelling on this single reply for quite a while now, has me thinking it was the fear of hearing it from someone else. The fear of having to put myself second (again), hurt and be hurt for the sake of "the greater good" and being left wondering, and in an adrift state of mind with less than what I started with.

 

For some people reading, they might be thinking whats the fuss! Being back on 'the market' there is nothing better, the excitement, the unknown, grasp it as an opportunity .... to me 'The Market' is a time consuming and increasingly difficult age defined sanctuary for wolves. A place where genuine people do not get to a fair go and this very notion is intensified by this progressively nervous, plummeting, selfish world.

 

Listening and talking to all above is much appreciated.

[SoulSearch_CO]

No, I can certainly understand not being interested in releasing the "safe" and "known" of your LDR for the uncertainty of the dating world. It can definitely be a strange place - just take a look around this forum. However, I do know that you make it basically impossible for the universe to hand you anything spectacular when you are willing to grasp so tightly to the mediocre. You have to make room in your life for something better if there's going to BE room for it. Which means letting go of "good enough."

 

As for your friend - you've stated already that you've never cheated. Would you really want to break that track record now? Would you like to feel responsible for them breaking up? I wouldn't just outright tell your friend that you don't want anything to do with her. Just tell her you've been feeling more than you should but out of respect for you and her, you're going to have to step back. She is not free to pursue a relationship with anybody else until she lets go of the mediocre, too. But she has to make that decision on her own. Just judging based on this thread alone, you seem like a decent guy. I don't imagine that breaking up a friend's engagement will weigh lightly on your conscience. She may or may not be 100% happy with her situation. But it's nobody's job to save her. Just tread very lightly and remember to keep things platonic. You're not currently doing that. If you feel romantic feelings when you're around her, then you need to not be around her. This is not about the greater good - it's about how you're going to feel when you look yourself in the mirror - can you be proud of what you've done that day?

 

Yeah, the dating world is uncertain and a little bit scary. But dating is not all there is to life. Get out there and do things for YOU...who knows, you could meet somebody that way. Generally when we stop looking is when it finds us. Or if you're that anxious to find somebody, try online dating.

[RGBA]

you've stated already that you've never cheated. Would you really want to break that track record now? Would you like to feel responsible for them breaking up?

Simply - no, and definitely not.

I do have an unforgiving conscious, which I am grateful for because that keeps me as one of the good guys. That and a lucky (sometimes spoilt) upbringing.

 

You have to make room in your life for something better if there's going to BE room for it. Which means letting go of "good enough."

I am devoted person who would shift mountains to be content, and letting go of good enough ...well I do. I have tried the internet and that provided me with one relationship I felt was worth committing to. Unfortunately the female in question after 6 months turned out to be a possessive jealous being. And stalked me! To the point where, when I left Australia and went to the UK, and had to tell all the people who know my UK address not to tell anyone else, because some of my friends heard she was (unknown to me) prepared to travel and follow. I can only imagine what some women have gone through.

 

But dating is not all there is to life. Get out there and do things for YOU...who knows, you could meet somebody that way. Generally when we stop looking is when it finds us.

I know that is not all to life - but I do think happiness is all there is to life and I am just in the pursuit of happiness. Your above "getting out there" and "as soon as you stop looking" are all to familiar...and I 100% agree. but I still can not stop thinking "I was not looking for what I have recently found" in this current case. Why now? What reasons? Are they reasons for me, or reasons for her? I guess that is a case of the head and heart dueling .....not helping is the fact ive recently been 'blessed' with an age increase and the mind wonders ..... and questions

 

hmph - speaking of which I am now being summoned to appear for a belated dinner.

[Island Girl]

Why now? What reasons? Are they reasons for me, or reasons for her? I guess that is a case of the head and heart dueling .....not helping is the fact ive recently been 'blessed' with an age increase and the mind wonders ..... and questions

 

You being how you are - never cheating or doing inappropriate things while with someone, well, you would never meet that 'spectacular girl' as long as you were with the LDR girl.

 

So the reason I would tell myself (and close the question book on) would be that this happened to show you what you were missing in the LDR you're in and allow yourself and that girl to stop wasting time and to move on to more.

 

Wherever and whenever that "more" happens is irrelevant. At least you won't waste any more time settling. It's better to be single than to settle.

[loveslife]

I think you've got your head on straight and have received some wonderful advice. There's just one more thing I'd like to add.

 

With the girl who's engaged, I would suggest not saying anything about her getting out of her present engaged situation in order to be with you. This is just my opinion and from my personal experience, but I don't believe it's ever a good idea for someone to leave the person they're with to be with me.

 

They should leave for themselves only, give themselves some time before being with someone else.

 

I don't ever want to be an escape hatch or an exit plan. And quite frankly, if someone does that WITH me, the chances are they'll do that TO me at some point.

 

When someone is in a relationship that makes them unhappy I feel they need time alone to figure out why they got in the relationship in the first place.

 

So, my suggestion (and take it or leave it) is to just tell the engaged girl that you don't feel right continuing. Period. Her response will tell you a lot about her character. If she doesn't understand, that will tell you worlds.

 

See?

 

As much as you feel she is everything you're looking for, you just don't know that until you get to know her. It is entirely possible she came along to spur you to move on from the girl in England. Who knows. But this is not a situation where it's advisable to rush.

 

Just my opinion.

[RGBA]

I think you've got your head on straight and have received some wonderful advice. There's just one more thing I'd like to add.

 

With the girl who's engaged, I would suggest not saying anything about her getting out of her present engaged situation in order to be with you. This is just my opinion and from my personal experience, but I don't believe it's ever a good idea for someone to leave the person they're with to be with me.

 

They should leave for themselves only, give themselves some time before being with someone else.

 

The views people have offered me here have been great 'thank you'! I appreciate all you time.

 

To respond to your remark "I could not, and I would not". The idea of me suggesting she leave her established relationship to be with me, is just not in my nature. Out of the question. I would not even hint she leave her partner - it is not for me to comment on it is none of my business.

 

As per Island Girl's statement, I guess this happened to show me what I am missing, whether its a reality check for only me, or me and my unifriend.

[goldencloud]

Hey,

Glad I was of some help. Anyways in response in your question, when news of my mom and dad came to light...well truth be told all s*it hit the roof!

Yes, my mom was a black sheep for several years if truth be told...in fact my aunt and my dad's ex conspired to break them up

It wasn't any better from the other side taking into context my mom's ex fiance was a real 'star'...a dazzling bachelor that ticked all the boxes and my mom's family positively adored(also his mom and my mom's mom were neighbours)

Yep, definately not the ideal situation

everyone went on and on about how 'it wouldn't last' and how 'it would all fall apart one day once the fools realise passion fades'

well it's been 26 years, and they're still waiting!

LOL

no but in all seriousness, after those first few hard years, people saw how strong they were, and eventually people just expected them

So yeah even in craptastic situations, there is light!

[RGBA]

Thanks for letting me know. That was a very big question I 'needed' to hear the outcome of.

So yeah even in craptastic situations, there is light!

hehe - laughing and feeling craptacular at that comment