Nikki Sahagin Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I personally think there is a fine line between creativity and insanity. By insanity, I don't 'necessarily' mean psychotic, mass-murdering types of craziness. More along the lines of depression, anxiety etc. I myself am a very creative person (writing, music and art) and I think there is definately a link between the artist who can create the most inspiring or emotive pieces of work and mental illness that they may suffer. Now not all creative people are 'mad' and not all uncreative people are 'sane' but do you think there may be a link between really creative minds and those who can go on to be 'mad' and 'insane'? (not necessarily the scarily insane....but 'not entirely normal) Discuss?
Trialbyfire Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 Creativity and emotion go hand-in-hand, especially when coupled with a lack of boundaries. The stronger the emotion, the more this translates into art form with the ability to solicit an emotional response from second parties.
kizik Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 This is the way I see it. The creative mind IS creative because it needs to do something with all the incredibly painful thoughts that occur. Why do these painful thoughts occur? Who knows? There may have been a traumatic childhood, or a history of depression. In any case, those who are in a lot of pain turn to creativity as a literal escape from, and physical manifestation, of that pain. As a musician, I know that almost all my material comes from pain, heartbreak, torture, envy, hatred, sadness, desperation and loneliness. (Wanna hang out? ) Sure, I write some happy songs, but they're never as good. Which is why I almost don't wanna get happy, b/c then my music will suck. And yeah, Elliott Smith is my favorite singer-songwriter. Go figure.
Author Nikki Sahagin Posted March 28, 2009 Author Posted March 28, 2009 This is the way I see it. The creative mind IS creative because it needs to do something with all the incredibly painful thoughts that occur. Why do these painful thoughts occur? Who knows? There may have been a traumatic childhood, or a history of depression. In any case, those who are in a lot of pain turn to creativity as a literal escape from, and physical manifestation, of that pain. As a musician, I know that almost all my material comes from pain, heartbreak, torture, envy, hatred, sadness, desperation and loneliness. (Wanna hang out? ) Sure, I write some happy songs, but they're never as good. Which is why I almost don't wanna get happy, b/c then my music will suck. And yeah, Elliott Smith is my favorite singer-songwriter. Go figure. haha well actually I am very similar. Mine comes out more in writing. I write a lot of poetry/stories that always when I read them back terrify me. Mine too come from pain, heartbreak, torture, envy, hatred, sadness, desperation and loneliness. I've also always had really graphic, crazy dreams. I guess everyones dreams are crazy, but I have a crazy dream nearly every night. I rarely 'don't dream' and can never relax. I think creativity is in part an incredible gift, but also a kind of curse, seeing as I think the nature of creativity is the CONSTANT need to express a need or want or fear that is constantly being re-filled. I forget who said it, but someone said, they 'constantly express because they constantly feel', so supposedly those that don't feel or don't really feel very strongly that often, don't need to really create, but those who are always thinking, always feeling (for whatever reason) naturally turn to art as a release. Though there is the difference between those who feel/think extremely for periods of time i.e. during a break-up/transition and those that just CONSTANTLY feel this way and are constantly creating.
Ross PK Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I wouldn't say depression and anxiety = insanity.
Author Nikki Sahagin Posted March 28, 2009 Author Posted March 28, 2009 I wouldn't say depression and anxiety = insanity. True! I guess I mean insanity as a general term, probably the wrong word. But I think definately in the throngs of depression and anxiety you can at times feel insane, even though the truly insane wouldn't recognise it. I suppose then, to rephrase, does mental illness link to creativity?
Ross PK Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 True! I guess I mean insanity as a general term, probably the wrong word. But I think definately in the throngs of depression and anxiety you can at times feel insane, even though the truly insane wouldn't recognise it. I suppose then, to rephrase, does mental illness link to creativity? Maybe. I suffer from depression and anxiety myself and I sometimes enjoy being creative. I do think though, when you're finding it really hard to cope, because of an extremely uncomfortbale anxiety producing situation, it can feel as though you're almost losing it or having some sort of a breakdown.
Tony T Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 I personally think there is a fine line between creativity and insanity. By insanity, I don't 'necessarily' mean psychotic, mass-murdering types of craziness. More along the lines of depression, anxiety etc. I myself am a very creative person (writing, music and art) and I think there is definately a link between the artist who can create the most inspiring or emotive pieces of work and mental illness that they may suffer. Now not all creative people are 'mad' and not all uncreative people are 'sane' but do you think there may be a link between really creative minds and those who can go on to be 'mad' and 'insane'? (not necessarily the scarily insane....but 'not entirely normal) Discuss? You have touched on nothing new. Throughout history there have been many great artists and musicians who have suffered incredible mental anguish in their lives, many resultant disabilities, many personality disorders resulting in few positive relationships, etc. Many had phobias, many were schizophrenic, etc. For a list of famous people with disabilities, many of them mental disorders and learning disabilities, go here: http://www.tampagov.net/dept_Mayor/Mayors_Alliance/famous_persons/people_A_thru_E.asp For another resource, go here: http://www.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/conditions/10/07/creativity.depression/index.html This topic has been discussed thousands of times in research and academic circles. Insanity and creativity go hand in hand quite often.
Isolde Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 Conversely, though, people with quiet, uneventful lives can also develop an ability to live vicariously, thus gaining subtler but important insights on the human condition. Like Jane Austen. I'd also like to note that while having a melancholy side to your personality is almost essential to being a good writer, being unstable certainly isn't. Sometimes people are unable to differentiate between being melancholy and being depressed.
robaday Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 I find this really interesting. In therapy I mentioned how i used to idolize Kurt cobain, Ian Curtis, Jim Morrision, Nietzsche, sartre, dostoyevski. I've recently recovered from a severe breakdown, related to grief and a failed relationship. I am a journalist, and write a lot in my spare time as well. I've found as I've recovered I have a vast vast body of writing that just pours out, I don't even need to think. Much of depression is existential angst, who are we, what is our place in the world. By contemplating this many of these artists had varied sources of information to draw on. Alienation, a sense of dissafection, poverty, isolation are all strong sources of inspiration. Nietzsche was classified insane when he saw someone flogging a horse and broke down. he'd spent years in isolation, years of self contemplation. Poverty is also a strong source of both depression and creativity. Look at the output of music from Manchester in the 1980's and early 90's when it was in the midst of mass unemployment and recession-Happy Mondays, Stone Roses, Oasis, Inspiral Carpets, Joy Division, New Order, A guy called Gerald, and others. Illegal raves and clubbing were the creative reaction against the status quo, just like punk was in the 70's. That is not to say that these bands and dj's were insane but they were certainly inspired by the situation they were living in. This is a personal opinion, but Definitely Maybe is still Oasis's best album, singing about being on the doll, drinking and smoking and generally being bored. Their output since has consistently dimished in quality as they have become wealthier and have become more displaced from their origins.
underpants Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 Personally I think the work should stand on it's own. When you try to disect the motives of the artist then you are removing yourself from the experience of the piece. Or as the artist,trying to promote yourself by injecting your 'persona' be it insane or not into the finished product, or people's perception of it. It is a fine line and fame is often the desire and demise of many who tread the path.
Storyrider Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 Being very creative can sometimes cause people to treat you like you're crazy. I used to get carried away with my imagination as a kid, and teachers and classmates, and even my parents thought I was strange because of it at times. Especially before I learned to hide it.
Tony T Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 ...even my parents thought I was strange ... Perhaps they were right. Of course, you wouldn't really know yourself since that was the way you were used to being.
Storyrider Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 Perhaps they were right. Of course, you wouldn't really know yourself. :lmao: Oh, they were definitely right!
RecordProducer Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 I might be a black sheep here, but I don't see creativity as a state of mind. I see it as talent. We were born with these talents. We may choose to act upon them or not, but usually any talented creature will be drawn to using his or her talent to create something. It's proven that creative people are more emotional, but I don't know if "creative" refers to art only. I think scientists, engineers, doctors, etc. can also be very creative in their domains. I personally haven't noticed increase in creativity depending on my mood. I think when the artist's expression reaches the point of maturity, it's more a matter of motivation than inspiration. By maturity I mean the point when the artist's delight with his own talent fades out and he accepts it as a normal part of him. I don't think that the desire to create has to do with mental or emotional conditions. I think it's a relationship between the artist and the talent. Much like a relationship between people. First, they are madly in love and want to be together all the time. Especially if the love is forbidden. Then their love reaches maturity, they've explored one another back and forth and they become bored with each other. So they need external novelties to keep their love fresh. In a similar way, every artist needs external inspiration after she's exhausted her internal sources. And this external novelty then might come from new situations in life and new feelings. I think the artists ponders her own feelings when she needs to create, rather than the other way round - the feelings reaching out the artist. This is just feeling about it, of course. Please don't take my thoughts as an attempt to deny what the others said. This is true about my own artistic expression and it might not be true for any other artist.
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