sally4sara Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I sometimes wonder about womens' 'rape' fantasies and I think the reason why I stop at a certain point and don't even try to figure out whether I would have that fantasy is the fear of trivialising real rape. For example what happens to women during war or in numerous countries in Africa where men use rape as a weapon. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=99838343 When I read something like this the idea of fantasizing about some handsome stranger having his wicked ways with me seems just pathetic. I understand what you mean. This is a fine example of the difference between a "rape" fantasy and actual rape. Some fantasy guy who looks like a guy you might choose to have sex doing things you'd enjoy doing, is way different than actual rape. But rape is such an ugly thing that STILL happens. After all our advancement, it makes one feel like making light of it in anyway means we will never see it go away. I think this is why some men look for reasons to not believe a victim. It is such an ugly crime that they want to distance themselves from it by making it seem unlikely to have happened. A subconscious thought: "I prefer to think this victim caused it to happen rather than think this guy who seems as normal as myself actually did something that ugly." This is a much easier way to get rid of rape. Explaining it out of existence is easier than actually making it stop happening.
sally4sara Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 In some African nations rape is legal, and that is an entirely different story. If I had to guess, I would use this analogy.. A female is at a bar, and some creepy guy makes a joke.. "Ewww, how creepy to say something like that" Another guy whom is fit, sexy, and handsome, says the exact same thing.. "Wow he is hot" I think if women fantasize they sometimes fantasize about a really good looking strong guy, whom she would be VERY attracted to who has his way with her. He cannot control himself, and she does not consent, but this is a guy she wants to have sex with. He also can never view her as easy, as he just took it. I can see women fantasizing over that as opposed to a meek guy asking for sex. I think its best you stop concerning yourself with women's motives for everything they do and just listen when they tell YOU "no". It doesn't matter if they would say yes to some other guy or why they would say yes to some other guy.
loser101 Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I understand what you mean. This is a fine example of the difference between a "rape" fantasy and actual rape. Some fantasy guy who looks like a guy you might choose to have sex doing things you'd enjoy doing, is way different than actual rape. But rape is such an ugly thing that STILL happens. After all our advancement, it makes one feel like making light of it in anyway means we will never see it go away. I think this is why some men look for reasons to not believe a victim. It is such an ugly crime that they want to distance themselves from it by making it seem unlikely to have happened. A subconscious thought: "I prefer to think this victim caused it to happen rather than think this guy who seems as normal as myself actually did something that ugly." This is a much easier way to get rid of rape. Explaining it out of existence is easier than actually making it stop happening. A man asked me once (just someone I was chatting to, not a date or anything) why women had a thing about rape. he asked me why it was such a big deal for us when we were used to having sex. so I explained to him that he should imagine himself pushed to the ground face down, held down by someone and raped by one or several men. I asked him what else he would feel apart from physical pain. I asked him whether he would feel humiliation and anger for being violated. At that point he got the message.
sally4sara Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 A man asked me once (just someone I was chatting to, not a date or anything) why women had a thing about rape. he asked me why it was such a big deal for us when we were used to having sex. so I explained to him that he should imagine himself pushed to the ground face down, held down by someone and raped by one or several men. I asked him what else he would feel apart from physical pain. I asked him whether he would feel humiliation and anger for being violated. At that point he got the message. I'm glad you mention this because it shows how some men don't even know how our insides work. What feels good to a consenting woman can be very painful to an unwilling woman. Our insides change when we are aroused. They become more accommodating when we are turned on. Funny how that guy wanted an explanation about women psychologically without educating himself on how we work physically.
loser101 Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I'm glad you mention this because it shows how some men don't even know how our insides work. What feels good to a consenting woman can be very painful to an unwilling woman. Our insides change when we are aroused. They become more accommodating when we are turned on. Funny how that guy wanted an explanation about women psychologically without educating himself on how we work physically. I think he thought we would be a little sore but that we should get over it. From time to time I am astonished how people have no ability to imagine how someone else would feel about something. Their inability to put themselves in someone else's shoes. But that's for a different thread.
kdark Posted March 28, 2009 Posted March 28, 2009 I'm glad you mention this because it shows how some men don't even know how our insides work. What feels good to a consenting woman can be very painful to an unwilling woman. Our insides change when we are aroused. They become more accommodating when we are turned on. Funny how that guy wanted an explanation about women psychologically without educating himself on how we work physically. This is a very good point. Every girl I've ever had sex with, at one point I've gotten into positions that were painful/uncomfortable. And that's between consenting partners.
Tony Posted March 29, 2009 Senior Moderators Posted March 29, 2009 How about everybody reading the first post in this thread so you are capable of being ON TOPIC rather than responding to the immediate previous posts which are most often OFF TOPIC! Many thanks for your cooperation
sally4sara Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 How about everybody reading the first post in this thread so you are capable of being ON TOPIC rather than responding to the immediate previous posts which are most often OFF TOPIC! Many thanks for your cooperation Oh, I don't know why we do that Tony. Could it be that that's the only way we can deal with the offensive people on this site. Its not like you police them. You'd rather wait around to flag people who get fed up with it. Why does it bother you so much when posters try to take an offensive thread and turn it into something positive and/or informative? As if the OP is doing anything to further this thread in a helpful way. No, he is just waiting for some female to say the magic phrase he needs to use for his own amusement. THAT doesn't bother you at all. Oh wait! That's not being on topic! NO I would not date a former rapist.
Taramere Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 How about everybody reading the first post in this thread so you are capable of being ON TOPIC rather than responding to the immediate previous posts which are most often OFF TOPIC! Many thanks for your cooperation What's the topic, Tony? Women here were asked a question. Would we or would we not date a man who had committed a rape. I'm presuming that because this is a discussion board, something more than a simple "yes" or "no" is required. The OP has indicated that he has some agenda in asking this question, but refuses to clarify it. So people are speculating on what that agenda might be, and are also having a general discussion about rape - a subject the opening post explicitly refers to. So why are recent posts off topic? They do deal with the subject of rape, after all. Exploring that subject in some depth and from different perspectives doesn't automatically equate with going off topic, does it? Why not either close the thread on the basis that the OP refuses to clarify exactly what it is he wants to discuss here, or just let people continue exploring this topic as they see fit? I don't see that the recent posts you referred to are trollish or offensive....so what's the problem?
SpanksTheMonkey Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 Were do I get in line for my slap on the LS hand sorry Tony but I agree with the last 2 posters rape is a important subject with a wide impact on sociality. To force people to narrow their mindsets on such a topic to a simple yes or no is offensive in itself. I shared my experiences mind you some what painfully to show the impact rape can have and that it dose exist. If that is off topic then I'm sorry but frankly I don't give a hoot... And now to be on topic NO I wouldn't date a rapist... I do hope the OP dose come back at some point this bait and wait is getting boring.
Jersey Shortie Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 In some African nations rape is legal, and that is an entirely different story. Then what is it's point in this conversation? That we should make rape legal here or that it is somehow less offensive when rape is legal somewhere else in the world? I think if women fantasize they sometimes fantasize about a really good looking strong guy, whom she would be VERY attracted to who has his way with her. He cannot control himself, and she does not consent, but this is a guy she wants to have sex with. He also can never view her as easy, as he just took it. I can see women fantasizing over that as opposed to a meek guy asking for sex. What you describe are two extremes and you rather tell women what you think is going on in their heads then listen to what they are telling you. Most women here have illustrated that fantasies of rape aren't about really getting raped. It might be about having rough sex where you are "taken", but never take in a way for you to be abused and hurt. Of course women don't want a meek guy asking for sex like some little boy asking for a cookie. that doesn't mean we want to be raped. What is wrong with you, seriously.
Author mr.dream merchant Posted March 29, 2009 Author Posted March 29, 2009 The only reason why I choose not to disclose my purpose yet is because I do not want any skewed or warped answers out of protection of one's character. I want the most honest answers with no inhibitions. I'm going to make my statement today. No reason to get upset about not knowing why you were asked the question, in fact I did tell you why. Why get upset? I'm not using any of this information to attack you.
kdark Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 The only reason why I choose not to disclose my purpose yet is because I do not want any skewed or warped answers out of protection of one's character. I want the most honest answers with no inhibitions. I'm going to make my statement today. No reason to get upset about not knowing why you were asked the question, in fact I did tell you why. Why get upset? I'm not using any of this information to attack you. The anticipation is overwhelming. I'm getting hard just thinking about it...
Taramere Posted March 29, 2009 Posted March 29, 2009 The only reason why I choose not to disclose my purpose yet is because I do not want any skewed or warped answers out of protection of one's character. Why would any of us need to protect our characters here? Are you and some of the guys planning to cyber-gang-rape us then tell some cyber-court that we were cyber-hos with questionable cyber-pasts who were cyber-asking for it?
Author mr.dream merchant Posted March 29, 2009 Author Posted March 29, 2009 Why would any of us need to protect our characters here? Are you and some of the guys planning to cyber-gang-rape us then tell some cyber-court that we were cyber-hos with questionable cyber-pasts who were cyber-asking for it? Nope not at all.
MindoverMatter Posted March 30, 2009 Posted March 30, 2009 The only reason why I choose not to disclose my purpose yet is because I do not want any skewed or warped answers out of protection of one's character. I want the most honest answers with no inhibitions. I'm going to make my statement today. No reason to get upset about not knowing why you were asked the question, in fact I did tell you why. Why get upset? I'm not using any of this information to attack you. So?
era Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 I'm going to make my statement today. *taps foot*....waiting
Lindarose84 Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 I wouldn't hold my breath waiting. He's been posting on other threads and has decided to abandon the one he started with his secret agenda. At this point, I think the thread has run its course and should be closed.
Cherished Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 He's trying to say that women who dress up for a date and look beautiful are like rapists because we are saying "look, we dressed up for you,that means we want to have sex with you" Then, when we don't want to have sex just because we went out with them, then it's as bad as us being rapists because we "tricked" them, and rapists "trick' women into having sex (except they do it by force.) OK, MEN...just because we put on lip gloss and look pretty doesn't mean we want to have sex. We might actually want to go on SEVERAL dates and get to know you and GASP begin a relationship before having intimate relations. WE ARE NOT TRICKING YOU, WE ARE WOMEN, AND IN ORDER TO ATTRACT YOU FOR A POSSIBLE RELATIONSHIP, THEN WE WILL ATTEMPT TO LOOK ATTRACTIVE...BUT SEX MAY NOT BE FOR A WHILE UNTIL WE REALIZE THAT YOU ARE ACTUALLY A DECENT GUY AND NOT A PSYCHO WEIRDO. SOMETIMES IT TAKES A MONTH OR SO BEFORE WE REALIZE YOU MIGHT REALLY BE FALLING IN LOVE WITH US AND HAVE SOME INTEGRITY. SO MY ADVICE TO MEN... NO, WE ARE NOT LIKE RAPISTS TRYING TO 'TRICK' YOU. WE ARE JUST WOMEN.....YOU MIGHT HAVE TO WAIT FOR MORE GOOD THINGS TO COME....BUT THAT DOES NOT PUT US ON THE BASE LEVEL AS RAPISTS. YES, YOU AS MEN, USUALLY CAN PHYSICALLY OVERPOWER US IF YOU WANTED TO...DOES THAT MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER AND GIVE YOU POWER? BECAUSE THIS ATTITUDE WILL KEEP YOU DATELESS FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIVES AND POSSIBLY IMPRISONED. NOW IT'S TIME TO PUT THIS TOPIC TO BED.
era Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 I wouldn't hold my breath waiting. He's been posting on other threads and has decided to abandon the one he started with his secret agenda. Really? He's ruined his chances of being taken seriously in his future threads then.
Lindarose84 Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 Really? He's ruined his chances of being taken seriously in his future threads then. Oh that was just my guess since he's been M.I.A.
Author mr.dream merchant Posted March 31, 2009 Author Posted March 31, 2009 If someone does not accept someone else because of their past behavior, or doesn't approve of their past behavior, whatever it may be, and decides to not give that person a chance or views that person as not fit for a relationship with them, why shame them for passing judgement? Everyone has preferences for what they want in a potential SO and anyone can disregard a person for whatever small preference is not met. In this case, it was rape. Something huge and disgusting. I agree. If I were a female I'd shun that mother ****er to hell and back. But that's not the point of this thread. It wasn't to compare rape with promiscuity. Not at all. It was to show you all that everyone passes judgement. It could be about sex with animals, with trees, it could be about eating fecal matter, it could be about having a phobia for gnats. Everyone has a set of preferences that they want or would like to see met in a potential SO. So before you shame a girl for wanting to be pampered like a princess, or shame a guy because he would rather not make eye contact with a female who was/is fairly promiscuous, just think about what it would take for you to shun someone else. Everybody places judgement when they see fit. Nobody is perfect. Stop the shaming. And yes, I will try to.
Taramere Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 It was to show you all that everyone passes judgement....Everybody places judgement when they see fit. Nobody is perfect. Stop the shaming. And yes, I will try to. Sure everyone passes judgement. As far as making people question or examine their own judgement goes, shaming isn't a very effective method. I think that generally shaming people by - or for - making judgements is more often a group bonding exercise. A way for people to identify others who share their values. Pit the judgers and the judged against eachother and everyone can have fun making friends and enemies....with various degrees of anger and excitement involved. It's stimulating. Personally I never post more on LS than when there's a good old bit of shaming and conflict on the go - and I bet lots of others feel likewise.. It's only when things settle back down into that monotonous whine after the storm (and it stops being interesting) that we generally start collecting ourselves together and vowing that we're done with the thread. I do believe that if someone can make you question your own thinking by some method other than the shaming device, that's a worthwhile exercise. It stimulates the brain into thinking laterally - which is probably beneficial both intellectually and also in terms of not getting overly upset about a disagreement (ie because you're looking at both sides).
Kamille Posted March 31, 2009 Posted March 31, 2009 Agreed. It would also be nice if people could stop shaming women and accusing them of having unrealistic expectations. How about we all shake hands and stop working so hard to impose our own views on others? ps: this thread did make me feel nauseous.
Author mr.dream merchant Posted March 31, 2009 Author Posted March 31, 2009 Agreed. It would also be nice if people could stop shaming women and accusing them of having unrealistic expectations. How about we all shake hands and stop working so hard to impose our own views on others? ps: this thread did make me feel nauseous. I knew it would. That's why I picked the topic. Kind of mean yeah but it was only to get a point across. Before you shame someone for judging think about what it would take for you to judge or deny someone a relationship. I think when it comes to relationships, judgement stems from one's personal preferences. But its so frequent on these forums, when one posts his/her preferences, they're hounded for being judgemental. How does that work? Nobody should be forced to accept anything about a person they don't like, nor should they be hounded for it. I've seen it alot with men who don't appreciate how promiscuous their GF is/was. I've seen it with women who have entitlement complexes. ****, I've been one of the guys who were angered by women with entitlement complexes. The point of this post was to only point out that if you're going to shame someone for being judgemental, then look in the mirror. Chances are you've got that word written on your own forehead. Its not a good or bad thing. Its just a mechanism a person uses to weed out the incompatibilities so they can find that person who's right for them. The whole rape thing was an extremity that I thought would work because it would most likely bring out a high percentage of definite no's, and in my eyes, for good reason. But there are some people out there who will look past that scenario and enjoy that person for who they are now and how they treat them. Not me, not alot of people that responded to the thread, but there are some. And it just goes to show you that being judgemental is only about personal likes/dislikes and nobody should be shamed for either of the two.
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